# I want to breed!



## BettaMiah (Sep 12, 2011)

How can I convince my parents to let me breed? Let me get more tanks? 

My parents do not want any more pets, fish or not. So I don't think they'll let me breed Bettas. I just want to do it to try to make some beautiful Bettas, and sell them to good owners. And i'll problably con my way out out of keeping some. 

How can I convince them? Tell them its only for the money? Can you tell me how many tanks and how many gallons I would need each? Or if I could use bins? (I have some very large bins....)


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Hi Miah it would be hard to convince it is for money, but yes you can use bins, shallow buckets... Just remember to get microworms or other live foods, and even some almond or oak leaves (dried). Ebay has awesome prices for the leaves as I got some for under two dollars using a vanilla mastercard (prepaid card  ) so yeah. Make sure to get the set up first, hae back up plans and look for jars when you need to jar any fry! Use the bins as long as you can heat them with a heater and keep cyran wrap with some holes, to keep it humid for growing fry.

Good luck.


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## BettaMiah (Sep 12, 2011)

I can manage all of that, I heat my tanks (Well the betta ones and the Shrimp one) with a very strong light, plus my room gets real hot. 

How much would this all cost?


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## Kytkattin (May 15, 2011)

Breeding bettas doesn't make money if you do it right. You stand to loose money. Many of the breeders on this site will tell you they have put a minimum of $500 into breeding just one spawn (for all the equipment). 

Instead of breeding you should just focus on caring for the pets you have now. When you have your own home then you can decide if breeding bettas is something you want to do, but if your parents are not interested, it would be disrespectful to ask them to house such a great responsibility. Factor in space, heating, water, pumps, electricity, etc. And what if no one buys them? What are you going to do with 100+ fish in little jars that need to be changed every day (because there is no way 100 fish are each getting even a gallon!)?
Love the pets you have now.


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## Luimeril (Dec 29, 2010)

it can cost HUNDREDS to set up everything you'd need. breeding bettas isn't easy, nor is it very cheap. i've been wanting to breed for months now, but haven't had the space, nor money.


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## ksage505 (Sep 19, 2011)

As much as it costs to breed in the first place, you're going to have a difficult time convincing your parents this is going to make you money. You'll need a grow out tank of at least 20 gallons, fry food, foods to condition your pair, tons or jars, heat and filtration for the fry, meds if they become sick, etc.. There's also all the supplies you'll need to ship the actual fish, boxes, foam, bags for the fish, heating pads. There's also the chance you'll end up buying all the fry supplies and something will go wrong and you'll lose all your fry. I don't mean to be negative here but I think you'll have to take another approach than making money when it comes to breeding. Its very likely you'll spend more than you make.

Maybe if you can save up your money and afford all the supplies you need without your parents chipping in, they'll be ok with it. Show them your responsible enough and its something you really want to do.


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## BettaMiah (Sep 12, 2011)

Yeah, this sounds difficult. Could I get a 20G grow out bin? Or do I need a legit 20 gallon tank? 

I know, I love my pets, absolutely, but I always have time, room, and the money for more.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Trust me you definitely need time for the fry for at least their first week  lots of feeding! I would know lol. 
Preferably for a grow out tank get an actual tank... Because then it can hold a healthy cycle.

Also if you still want to breed I strongly suggest getting a sponge filter ready which includes cycling... This will keep your breeding tank from ending up like mine which went into a mini cycle! Otherwise you will need to keep aj eye on it more often.


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## bahamut285 (Dec 10, 2010)

Okay, please don't take this the wrong way because I am definitely not intentionally trying to be mean or rude... 

I personally think that breeding is awesome, I want to try it myself one day, but as everybody pointed out, including Sena, that it is both time consuming and expensive.

If I were in your position, I would be currently spending your time, resources and parent-convincing energy into finding a larger tank for Beau and Echo :/

However if you insist on breeding then I wish you the best of luck and hope to see a spawn log, I'd be interested to see how it turns out.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Very consuming  trust me you will want to have medications on hand (I have yet to need some but ordered it recently for a second eventual spawn as a just in case), live foods, containers, baster, sponge filter, tanks (plural because you can have 7 fry or 200 fry!)... It's exhausting lol  do lots of research. I mean I had pages and pages of research plus looking on here and I didn't know everything.

But, if you do decide to spawn you can always ask for help.


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## TonyK (Apr 4, 2011)

I would like to breed and have the equipment and space for it but, I keep thinking how am I going to move a whole batch of babies. Knowing that most people think its ok to keep them in vases and jars just doesn't sit right with me.

One more thing you can't look at it as a way to make money. You will spend more on care of fish then you will ever take in.

Good Luck on your project if you decide to start.


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

Miah, breeding is a BIG responsibility as well as expensive. It takes time to prepare. You have to condition your pair for 2 weeks, you have to buy and prepare the food for the fry (micro worm and other cultures. You also have to keep an eye on the pair during spawning to make sure they're not killing each other. Things don't always work out for experienced breeders. Things can happen. If you don't do water changes religiously then your fry will get sick and die. If you start skipping feeding because you forgot or were hanging out with friends then your fry won't grow properly. There are so many things to consider before breeding. Do your research and prepare yourself with as much knowledge as you can fit in your brain. lol Remember, you are responsible for the lives you would bring into the world and it would be totally up to you to give them the best of everything.


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## Luimeril (Dec 29, 2010)

raising live food's hard. i had to prepare a new batch of Baby Brine Shrimp every other day for ONE fry. just little Chappy. she lived in a 3 gallon, and had to have daily water changes. i had to keep an eye on the heat in her tank, too. it wasn't easy to do, and that was just for ONE fry. i can't imagine taking care of dozens, if not hundreds of fry right now. :/ no space. no time. no money.


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## trilobite (May 18, 2011)

Just make sure you can place every single male in its own heated jar. and that you have enough time to feed the babies more than once a day and keep up with daily water changes. You might as well say goodbye to your social life for a while. 
Remember you have the potential for 100s of babies. The sex ratio is not always going to be 50/50. you can expect more males than females or vice versa.
Try and make sure you are not breeding a mess, otherwise you will not be able to sell many (if money is what you are after...you wont make a profit though).
Think carefully about your fish you choose and what they might produce.

But at the end of the day if you are not allowed anymore tanks I dont know how you can sneak them in...
What I would do is tell them you are very interested in genetics and you are trying to see first hand the effects of dominant and recessive etc genes, trying to expand your knowledge on the keeping and behavior of bettas and that you will give them half of what you make from selling your fry haha...
If that fails you have to wait until you move out


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

There is no way to hide 100 plus fry. lol


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## trilobite (May 18, 2011)

dramaqueen said:


> There is no way to hide 100 plus fry. lol


:lol::lol:


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## purplemuffin (Aug 12, 2010)

I'm interested in breeding one day as well, but I know even now at 20 I am not yet in a place where I could do it properly. Meanwhile I know others who are 13-14 who have the time, money, and experience to do it right.

I live at home where my parents are trying to move, they aren't interested in new pets and I don't have a job--so all the money spent would be theirs or christmas money. Christmas money runs out eventually though, so though I might be able to grab some cheap tubs, a pair on aquabid, and maybe scrounge for heaters and jars on the cheap, I might just barely have enough...Now what happens..if the fry get velvet? If the male beats up the female? If I barely had enough to start the program up, it means there is no room for error. I don't like the sound of panicking over having enough to save baby fish who I brought into the world. I might be able to handle it, I could even raise them all into adult hood. But it would not be a fun experience right now. I'm just not financially ready for that, nor do I have the time honestly with my other pets and school work.

However, others the same age, older, younger, who happen to be in a better situation than me.. Can easily make it work. They can dedicate the time and money into doing it right and having the whole breeding process a rewarding and enjoyable experience!

I don't want to ruin breeding for me by having a horrible time by not being prepared, so I'm willing to wait. That might mean next year, or it could mean five years from now. :-D I'd still rather wait personally, until I know I can really handle it, no matter how much I really really want to. I just know I won't be able to give the project my time and devotion right now. 

But if you think you can handle the responsibility and the time and money and all that comes with breeding, than you can do your best. Just make sure you can handle it all three months down the road  

And sneaking pets(especially when they are for breeding) never works out... Just puts the animals in harms way!


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## Pitluvs (Jun 22, 2011)

I have everything set up for breeding (literally have my second bathroom set up with everything) and I have fry foods, money, space, live on my own and pay my own bills plus I have all my fish in suitable tanks. And I'm still scared whitless to try and breed a spawn! It must be the fact that I'm getting old, but breeding (to me) is such a big responsibility. You're bringing living things into this world that would normally NOT be here. I mean, if Bettas bred in the wild here I would love to grab a batch and raise, but to actually make my fish breed? It's scary. And then think, what if something goes horribly wrong and one of your fish dies while mating and you get no fry. What was it all for? Right? I'm so scared to breed Spidey, especially since I am so attached to him now. Pleaseeee... if this mature 27 yr old with kid and a home is iffy on breeding, think about it ok? 

Give your babies what they need first, then look into breeding. I know it's hard cause everyone is on here posting spawns and showing pictures, it's hard for me. Why not get a 20g tank, and house the tropicals you have properly with the right numbers in groups first? I see you still have only one Cory


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## Curlyfatbottom (Sep 29, 2011)

Breeding for money....
Don't expect to much out of it...
If your just breeding pet shop Betta vt....
You will b lucky if u can move then for a dollor each(average price)....
All the time n effort to raise them will coast u more then what u make....
What about the fancy....
Will the price on a decent pair will run u 30-100(before shipping)....
Trying to sell it at the same price as u got them for will b hard near impossible...
Even cutting the price in half will b hard to move...
Since your not a known breeder....
Plus this is the wrong time of the year to b breeding....
It will cost more to feed n house the fish.....
Since it getting cold.....
If your truly going to breed no matter what....
Wait till late spring....
Where u can grow your own fish food....
Infusion will bloom quicker....
Room temp should keep the Mircoworm to produce daily feed...
Get a bucket that hold about a 100+ gallon just for daphnia n mosquito larvae( if your living with your parents.... They will hate u on this)....
A few bucket that hold 20 gallon plus(depending on your size of spawn)
Heater( for each tank)
spong filter( for each tank)
Lot of jar(100+)....
Lot of live plants....
Do massive research on breeding....
Trust me on this...
Don't expect a big profits out of breeding....
Even if u can move a few fish for 10$-30$....
With 200+ fish....
Only a hand full will b bought....
Female r really hard to move.....
Pet store will give u $.60 a fish( most pet store don't accept local breeder fish)....
It hard to give away a fish that u took all your time n money to raise it for $.60.....
When it coast u $40 for the parent..



They only take male....
B lucky if they take a few female....


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Oh I forgot to mention - if you see on here lots of spawns, ones like mine are really not in expectation of money (although it'd be nice in the future to get spawn pairs which I have seen for 100.00 which does not include shipping and handling) and you gotta make sure if you can find homes... If not you will have to commit to having lots of bettas!

I was lucky to have zero illnesses in my fry. Will I risk it again? No.  read up on stuff like velvet, ich... Maks sure you know why the fish could get it, how to keep it away or get rid of it. That way you'll be even more prepared!


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## youlovegnats (Feb 23, 2011)

The $100+ is usually for giant plakats of exceptional quality. The most expensive I've ever seen on AB was for $120. 
I've spent over $300 for breeding so far, and I have to agree with Bahamut. You should take care of the ones you have now, and then maybe in the future you can breed. 
But if you go against everyone's advice, there's nothing we can do about it. Just be sure to have everything you need before you breed them. 
Look forward to seeing a spawn log.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

If you do lots of research, willing to permanently or long-time house fry, have your meds ready, tank(s) set up, and all the supplies, and still want tk breed we'll help you. 

Hmm I did not know that about pricing lol. Although I have seen some for 30-50 range per fish or a pair.


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

And another thing... I would definitely NOT go against my parents if they said no more fish. You're living under their roof, do as they say.


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## cajunamy (Apr 28, 2011)

You need the time for more like the first 3 months, not the first week. You need to to daily to every other day water changes. You need to feed around 4x a day, in small quantities. The water needs to be pristine for them to grow well and not be stunted by the growh hormones. You need several hundred dollars at least for the proper equipment, including at least 50 jars. You'll need all the food from fry to adulthood, all the heaters, all the jars, all the tanks. You'll need good stock that you know the genetics of so that you don't pass on anything undesirable.

And most of all, you need your parents support since you still live in their home. If they say no, going behind their backs will not be a good idea. It will just land you in a bunch of trouble. I am a parent, so trust me on this.

And do you really have around $300-800 that you will need to do this? Plus all the time that is needed apart from school, homework, extracurricular activities, and housework? Along with keeping your other animals well? You will need time to not only tend to the fry, but to their food. They do best on live foods, and the time that that takes alone is alot.

You can't breed for money, esp if you're just going to try it. And think how mad your parents might be if you spent all this money on the proper equipment, food, pair, etc and you only do it once. You will be losing money.

Also you should focus on housing your current fish properly instead of jumping into new endeavors. When all that is straight, then you can look into doing more.\

Miah, my advice to you is this: research. Not for a day, a week or a month. Research for at least a year. Find out everything you can about bettas, from conditioning the pair to spawning, to hatching, to adulthood. Find out about their foods, about all the diseases that can come up and what to look for to dx it, and how to treat it. Find out if you're willing to cull deformities or fish you can't house and can't rehome. Find a way that you are comfy with for culling. Gather up supplies slowly, so the price isn't such a huge impact all at once for you. This is after you are sure you have proper homes for your current animals of course. Then in a year or two, when you know pretty much everything, (but you'll never know everything, b/c new info is always coming up) if you still want to do it, then work on your parents. You are young, you have your whole life to decide on this. Don't rush into this rashly, as this is not something to be taken lightly. You will be responsible for bringing lives into the world, you will be responsible for everything b/c they can't tend to themselves.


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## MrVampire181 (May 12, 2009)

Even cutting corners on breeding supplies is expensive. My parents are pretty supportive. But you can't breed and grow fish easily...I may get them so spawn but out of my spawns I only get a few to grow. I need to use lots of food, huge tanks, and lots of time. Its not a good idea to jump into breeding ...focus on your current fish.


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## CodeRed (Jun 11, 2009)

dramaqueen said:


> And another thing... I would definitely NOT go against my parents if they said no more fish. You're living under their roof, do as they say.


+1 to this. Your parents don't have to let you have any pets at all. Going behind their backs to do all of this could be very, very bad. If you sincerely, sincerely feel that you want to breed, and believe you had the time and money to do so... sit down with them and be honest. Tell them it WILL cost potentially hundreds of dollars, could result in 100s in bettas, and will be quite the effort and hassle. If you don't, you could end up losing not just your fry, but they could revoke your rights to having any pets at all. And that, to me, is not worth the possibility of breeding. They've supported you thus far, is it really fair to them for you to scheme to try to force more on them? Think of this from their perspective. In the years it takes you to move out you could research and prepare yourself extensively, and have a very successful spawn when everything is taken care of by you.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

MrVampire181 said:


> Even cutting corners on breeding supplies is expensive. My parents are pretty supportive. But you can't breed and grow fish easily...I may get them so spawn but out of my spawns I only get a few to grow. I need to use lots of food, huge tanks, and lots of time. Its not a good idea to jump into breeding ...focus on your current fish.


That is true. I've got shipments of shipments coming in. Do not forget about hatching certain live foods! That has a whole new level added to breeding too!


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

Live foods is enough to turn me off of breeding. I'm squeamish when it comes to bugs and worms. Eeeww. lol


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Oh trust me lol I got microworms shipping to me because I do not haeto cut suff up x.x so I agree haha. 

Trust me Miah I have 15 fry, and only 7 are growing big. There is one who is still in the first week size - although does look like the others. There's ALOT involved >< lol


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

Obviously Miah has decided not to respond to this thread.


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## BettaMiah (Sep 12, 2011)

Wow, lots of comments. 

I think i'll prepare for the next five years until i'm out of the house... Should give me enough time, right? :3


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## youlovegnats (Feb 23, 2011)

That sounds like a very wise decision.


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## BettaMiah (Sep 12, 2011)

Yeah. 

I'm not even going to ask mah parents. *Shudders*


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## youlovegnats (Feb 23, 2011)

I do have to agree with everyone though... you should try to get your goldfish/pleco/cory a proper set-up before trying anything new or getting any more pets.


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## BettaMiah (Sep 12, 2011)

Oh I know. But my parents said he _has _to grow some before he gets his 55G. And Kia will just stay in the 10G, and get 3 friends and possibly a Betta or 4. (females)


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## bahamut285 (Dec 10, 2010)

I'm glad about your mature decision to wait a few years before breeding, 

I doubt your goldfish will grow anymore than his current size. Goldfish excrete a hormone into the water that purposely stunts their growth, that's why people believe that they will only grow to their environment. Smaller tanks means it will build up in concentration very quickly which signals their body to stop growing.


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## cajunamy (Apr 28, 2011)

But remember just b/c the outside stops, doesn't mean the organs do. This is where fish become deformed and die too soon. Have you explained that to your parents? I would research it and print the facts out about the fish size vs tank size bit and show it to them.

I think you've made an excellent choice Miah, I'm very proud to see you say that


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Agree with Cajun. 

And yes 5 years is enough xD even during, accumulate in a bin labeled "bettas" some of what you need that doesn't expire, like baster, punp, hose... All that. That way it isn't expensive all at once to get all supplies when you do get around to doing it.


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## Lighterman (Oct 6, 2011)

Hey BettaMiah, if you want to breed bettas, the perfect time will come to you, trust me.  I'm planning on breeding next month and believe it or not, culling is gonna be the main factor during the process. So yup, if you breed, consider looking at betta standards for a while and start your culling. Taking out bettas even with a bent pectoral fin can save you so much money, and time to jar them if it becomes a male.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

I agree with Lighterman  plus, one thing, if you have growth runts (rather than deformed runts which most usually die off anyways) you'll have to separate them from their larger siblings, like I did, to ensure you'll have a larger surviving batch. Plus you never know the smallest could be the prettiest :lol:


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## youlovegnats (Feb 23, 2011)

Sena Hansler said:


> I agree with Lighterman  plus, one thing, if you have growth runts (rather than deformed runts which most usually die off anyways) you'll have to separate them from their larger siblings, like I did, to ensure you'll have a larger surviving batch. Plus you never know the smallest could be the prettiest :lol:


The runt from my 1st spawn turned out to be all cellophane with blue/green iridescence all over. He's so pretty!~


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Exactly  Which is why, even though some people feel they should be culled I say hold onto them and give them the time they need to be pretty! Because for instance... In a spawn where most of the fry end up dark blue, you might just get the runt who turns into the dark blue with metallics, or something. Or might have the best finnage. You never know - which is why research is where it's at  asking questions on here too!


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## youlovegnats (Feb 23, 2011)

Sena Hansler said:


> Exactly  Which is why, even though some people feel they should be culled I say hold onto them and give them the time they need to be pretty! Because for instance... In a spawn where most of the fry end up dark blue, you might just get the runt who turns into the dark blue with metallics, or something. Or might have the best finnage. You never know - which is why research is where it's at  asking questions on here too!


I'm not sure why anyone would cull a runt...breeders (including myself) usually just cull the ones that are deformed or have SBD. :/ Just because they are small doesn't mean that they won't turn out beautiful.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

I've heard of it >< But exactly, why bother  Just 'cause they are slower doesn't mean you have to leave them behind. Still a responsibility. I also found out a side note... separate bigger babies from the small (like I did using large bins), and do more water changes, like 50% daily and this drops the hormones they give out that slows growth. I'm trying it. See? I did not know that even after breeding o.o You always learn :-D


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## tpocicat (Aug 8, 2011)

Not to mention (the hardest or me) you need major patience! It takes weeks before any color begins to show, and months before you know how or what type of fins you have!


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Agreed!! My fry only has the usual offwhite-ish color, or an odd orangey color (hmm interesting), but in a couple months they all should be showing signs of color and...well gender :lol: I mixed PK with VT, which reminds me... I do not have the link but someone on here does, about betta genetics and determining what most you'd get. Like, VT is dominant, for instance - so expect VT if that is what you have. Same goes with colors, and even patterns - like butterfly being dominant, and black is recessive though royale blue is dominant... there is so much! ><


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## youlovegnats (Feb 23, 2011)

It's easy to do a basic hybrid cross or dihybrid cross- punnett square. The hard thing is figuring out the variables. ><' Cuz you're not always going to get exactly what the square came out to be. You'll have co-dominance in some genes as well. Plus there can be more than one allele for each gene. 8C


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Yup. And if you get a pet store betta you may even have a "who in the world gave me a somethingorotherinthemix??!!!!!" xDD If I get that, I am totally keeping him/her hehe :3 For instance, take two pet store VT, you may even have a PK in the mix  you never know.


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