# Fraying/Curling Fins



## Haleigh (Jan 24, 2013)

First off, let me start by saying that I worry...a lot! There probably isn't anything wrong, but I figured I'd post just to make sure. I have owned my betta fish, Emperor Catullus, for nearly two weeks now. He is a rose tail, and I just recently noticed that the ends of his tail are beginning to fray just a tad. Could this be an on-start of fin rot, or perhaps my high pH? The plants in his tank are silk and the decor isn't rough, so I doubt his fins got snagged. Is there any way to treat this? I just want him to be healthy.

Here are some pictures:






































Housing 
What size is your tank? *5.5 gallons*
What temperature is your tank? *80.2*
Does your tank have a filter? *Yes*
Does your tank have an air stone or other type of aeration? *No*
Is your tank heated? *Yes*
What tank mates does your betta fish live with? *None*

Food
What type of food do you feed your betta fish? *New Life Spectrum Pellets and Omega One Freeze Dried Blood Worms*
How often do you feed your betta fish? *Once a day, six pellets*

Maintenance 
How often do you perform a water change? *Once a week with gravel vacuum*
What percentage of the water do you change when you perform a water change? *50%*
What type of additives do you add to the water when you perform a water change? *Stress Coat + water conditioner*

Water Parameters:
Have you tested your water? If so, what are the following parameters? *Yes*

Ammonia: *0*
Nitrite: *0*
Nitrate: *0*
pH: *7.6*
Hardness: *n/a*
Alkalinity: *n/a*

Symptoms and Treatment
How has your betta fish's appearance changed? *Fraying fins. My other betta fish, Pontus Rex, also had this problem. Could it be the high pH?*
How has your betta fish's behavior changed? *No*
When did you start noticing the symptoms? *Tonight*
Have you started treating your fish? If so, how? *No*
Does your fish have any history of being ill? *No*
How old is your fish (approximately)?*3.5 months*


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## darkangel (Jun 11, 2013)

I read curling is from hard basic water but its suppose to be harmless. I think he looks healthy so probably not a big deal?


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## Narny105 (Jun 6, 2013)

Your pH is completely fine, so don't even worry about that. Bettas will be fine with a pH from 7.0 up to 8.2. The main thing is that it's stable. And if it is stable, I wouldn't mess with it at all

HM's are definitely culprits of nipping, and every HM I have ever owned has nipped at some point, whether only once, or prolonged over a period of time. My red HM is currently a full time nipper, and has always been, although he has settled down now.

That being said, assess the tank set up, make sure it is nice and planted for him- this will provide a sense of security, and help improve mental stimulation, and see how he goes.

You can also increase water changes to a few times a week if there is a little infection going on, although to me it just seems like a good pair of healing fins that he has nipped a bit. It takes only a few seconds to a minute for a betta to do some terrible damage to their fins, which is often why we never see it.

Hard water doesn't cause curling, though. That's just something thrown around online- my water is quite hard 

All the best


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## Haleigh (Jan 24, 2013)

I have four plants in there now, but I'll add two more to see if that helps. I have a hard time thinking it's nipping. The fins seem to be fraying quite lightly; if he was nipping wouldn't there be chunks missing?

I didn't cycle the tank before I got him. I just added API Quickstart. This week, I noticed a bacteria bloom in the tank. Could that be irritating his fins a tad?


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## Narny105 (Jun 6, 2013)

Nipping can really look like anything, from chunks, to fraying. My betta frays his fins when he nips. 

In terms of cycling, if you have a tank with some cycled media in it already, just transfer some over  It might be irritating his fins a little, so I'd just keep the water nice and clean for him.


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## Haleigh (Jan 24, 2013)

Ok great! Thanks for your help. I'm doing a 50% water change tomorrow and adding two more plants for him.


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## Narny105 (Jun 6, 2013)

No problem! Good luck


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## lilnaugrim (Mar 27, 2013)

I actually have to disagree with Narny for once about nipping. Nipping will always have a U shape to it, sometimes smaller than other's but it will be there.

Since he is a FT his fins will always look a bit raggedy like that, but I actually see white at the edges of his fins which indicates new growth so it's due to his fins growing. And yes you are right, sometimes fins grow unevenly, even on the same fin and because he is so young, he still has about 3 or so months of growing left to do  Now if you start seeing chunks of U shapes being taken out, that is fin nipping. Or if you see black edging where the white edges are right now, that would be fin rot which I know you've experienced before 

As to the pH level, I have to disagree with Narny once again, sorry hun. Betta's are naturally in soft acidic water right down to 5.5 pH so naturally they tolorate anything from 5.5 to 7.5 but can survive in higher pH levels.

And again with the hard water, it is not all about the hard water but it is more likely to happen in hard water. I had a betta in 6.0 water and his fins curled and nothing I could do about it. Also high ammonia content will cause fin curling as well. CT's are most prone to fin curling though, HM's usually aren't as much with their caudal. Also you can have hard water and not have a high pH level so those two as I commonly see people say (including myself at some points) do not go hand in hand. Usually it is said that the high pH level causes curling, it may not help much but it's certainly not the culprit.

Anyway, yes, keep the water fresh. You can do twice a week changes at 25-50% and he'll be fine since it's all new growth. FT's look like that all the time though, they'll never have clean edging and if you find an FT that has clean edging I'll quit the Betta trade lol


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## Haleigh (Jan 24, 2013)

I am so relieved to hear it is from new fin growth. I have no problem with his fins looking a tad ragged as long as he is healthy! I'll be sure to watch out for his ammonia levels and start doing water changes twice a week. Thanks to both of you for your advice!


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## Narny105 (Jun 6, 2013)

lilnaugrim said:


> I actually have to disagree with Narny for once about nipping. Nipping will always have a U shape to it, sometimes smaller than other's but it will be there.
> 
> Since he is a FT his fins will always look a bit raggedy like that, but I actually see white at the edges of his fins which indicates new growth so it's due to his fins growing. And yes you are right, sometimes fins grow unevenly, even on the same fin and because he is so young, he still has about 3 or so months of growing left to do  Now if you start seeing chunks of U shapes being taken out, that is fin nipping. Or if you see black edging where the white edges are right now, that would be fin rot which I know you've experienced before
> 
> ...


No need to apologise  I keep mine at 8.0 just because it's stable, and they do quite well, but I'm sure they'd prefer a much lower pH. I just can't provide it without having fluctuations.

In terms of the curling in CT's with a hard pH, mine would curl from occasions, and I once also assumed that it was due to my high pH, although my water hardness was pretty mild, and his fins would sort themselves out. The mineral content of the wate is also something people will factor in, but I don't really know how that could be measured. I tried tropical salts (those blue ones sold by aqua something?) and my CT would still curl from time to time. It's a hard call to make, but with delicate fins like they have, who knows! They must have bad fin days from time to time lol


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## lilnaugrim (Mar 27, 2013)

Narny105 said:


> No need to apologise  I keep mine at 8.0 just because it's stable, and they do quite well, but I'm sure they'd prefer a much lower pH. I just can't provide it without having fluctuations.
> 
> In terms of the curling in CT's with a hard pH, mine would curl from occasions, and I once also assumed that it was due to my high pH, although my water hardness was pretty mild, and his fins would sort themselves out. The mineral content of the wate is also something people will factor in, but I don't really know how that could be measured. I tried tropical salts (those blue ones sold by aqua something?) and my CT would still curl from time to time. It's a hard call to make, but with delicate fins like they have, who knows! They must have bad fin days from time to time lol


Oh yes, stable is much better than fluctuations at any time!! they can tolerate 8.0 just fine  

I'm sure there are much more factors than just hard water vs. soft and high pH vs. lower but it is and has been observed much more frequently in those water types. Whether it is indeed the hard water, the mineral content or lack of, the nutrient/vitamin content as well or lack of or pH level, it is very difficult to say and hard to measure, you are right in that ^_^ but thus far fin curling has been observed in places with mostly hard water, the harder it is the worse it is for fins and then pH just kind of tags along with it. It would be very unusual to have a low pH and very hard water although I'm sure there are places with such parameters! :-D


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## Coppermoon (May 8, 2012)

Natural sunlight will help that. He is more of a feather tail than a rose tail. He is a beauty though!!!

My pH is the same as yours, but I use a daylight bulb on all my tanks (5600-6500K).


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## Haleigh (Jan 24, 2013)

Grr. This is very frustrating. Before I got Catullus, I bought him a 5.5 gallon tank. The tank is heated, filtered, and has silk plants for his delicate fins. I have a stocking covering the filter so his fins won't get torn. He has a betta log to sleep in and play in. He also has a little tiki hut where he can hide. Still, I can't get this right! I checked on him today and his fins look like they've gotten worse!

Now, if this is still just fin growth and normal, that's perfectly fine. I just want to make sure this isn't fin rot. I'm really worried about him.

***He looks slightly pale in these pictures because I just did a 50% water change with the gravel vacuum and that always makes him a tad nervous.


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## lilnaugrim (Mar 27, 2013)

Okay, yeah that's not healthy growth. He's torn them against something, I seriously doubt he would be biting them since they look more frayed than U shapes and he would really have to stretch to reach his tail. I also see there is a scrape on his head there, small yellowish patch which is common when they bump or scrape against something.

Are there any possibilities there are other things that can scratch him. Does the plant have any plastic at all on it? Have you looked on the insides of the hides? I'd like to see a picture of them all if you can to see if there's something else he's hitting against. You have a foam baffle for him right?

Water changes and stress coat will help. How often are you doing water changes right now?


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## Haleigh (Jan 24, 2013)

I'm doing water changes once a week now. 50% with a gravel vacuum. I'll increase that to two changes. I think the stems of the silk plants have plastic on them. I see him swimming in those most. I also see him in his betta log quite a bit. I've never seen him swim around his tiki hut or columns, but that doesn't mean he doesn't play near them when I'm not looking. The tiki hut is technically for hermit crabs, but it is quite soft. The colums may be a bit rough.

Here are some pictures of the tank set up and the decorations.


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## lilnaugrim (Mar 27, 2013)

I actually have the same columns and the same plants too. I know the columns are fine as they've been in with Rembrandt and he was totally fine. But the plants, there is the stem in the middle that is rather pointy, I cut mine and then sealed it with silicone so that it doesn't rust the metal inside but that's just me.

Likewise he could be taking tiny chunks out of his tail for some odd reason, sometimes they have a tick, sometimes they're frustrated especially if in view of another Betta for long periods of time. Can he see Agrippa or the other male (I think you have three? can't remember lol).

If it's due to a tick, you'd have to observe him for a while to see what makes him want to bite his fins. Could be the light of the heater coming on at a certain time or coming on at night, or maybe he can see his reflection or doesn't like that you've moved a plant or something, sometimes they can be really finicky for no reasons or at least none that we can see.

Yeah, go to twice a week changes for now, both at 50% if you can to keep his water clean and then Stress Coat will help to. Monitor his progress of course and check back when you've got questions or whatever ^_^


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## Haleigh (Jan 24, 2013)

He and Agrippa are in two different rooms. I'll see what I can do about the center of those plants. I'll keep an eye on him and see if I catch him nipping his fins, though I try to spend 15 minutes a day talking with him (I read that that would help us bond). During all that time, I've never seen him nip his fins. This just popped up with the bacteria bloom. Could that have irritated his fins? Also, Coppermoon mentioned sunlight. He is in direct sunlight and I do have his light on during the day. Maybe I'll try turning his light off for a few days to see if that makes a difference.


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## lilnaugrim (Mar 27, 2013)

Yeah that might help. I really don't think it has anything to do with the bacterial bloom though unless he got annoyed by it or something silly.


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## Haleigh (Jan 24, 2013)

I'm also going to try feeding him twice a day now. Perhaps he was getting annoyed at having to wait for his food. I'll be feeding him three pellets for breakfast and four for dinner.

Also, can fin-nipping cause permanent damage, or is it just an aesthetic issue? I have no problem with his fins not looking their best, as long as he is healthy and not in pain.


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## lilnaugrim (Mar 27, 2013)

It's more for aesthetics. They will grow back given time and care of course. But as with many other things it's difficult to measure "pain" in animals unless they make certain sounds and whatnot, but with fish it's even more so since all we can see is their frantic swimming or lethargic-ness. But no, as far as I am aware, ripping, nipping, biting don't hurt for a period of time. I have a feeling it probably doesn't feel good when it actually rips but then after that it's like a healing wound, it's kind of irritating but for the most part it probably doesn't hurt much.

The food idea is a good trick to see if he'll respond to it for sure! But the most important thing right now is to just keep his water clean with the twice weekly changes and using stress coat  If he does happen to have a tick, he'll bite again when that tick comes around.

Also on heavier finned fish like yours and mine, sometimes they like to gett themselves a "hair cut" because their fins slow them down or drag them down. This is more prominent on heavy finned HM's, rose tails (RT) and feather tails (FT) so while I'm not surprised if he does bite, it still is questionable since his tail doesn't seem that long is all.


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## Haleigh (Jan 24, 2013)

Thanks for the information. I've been keeping an eye on him and haven't noticed any change today. It wouldn't surprise me if he was biting his fins to make himself faster. He loves to swim as fast as possible! Hopefully the clean water will help.


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