# 40G Breeder Suggestions?



## Chevko (Nov 15, 2012)

So, my boyfriend has officially gotten interested in fish now because of our guppies. He's curious about the following for our new 40 Breeder:


Non-aggressive
Active
Singular
Freshwater
Semi-tropical

I personally want shoaling or schooling, but if so they need to be distinguishable like guppies. He doesn't really like uniform with schools/shoals - wants to be able to tell this one from that one. And I don't care for angelfish that much, personally.


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## thekoimaiden (Oct 19, 2011)

GOLDFISH! Lol! They do fit all of your requirements, and you could have 2-3 in that tank. Only thing is they like to be in groups instead of a single fish. 

If you're looking for fish that are distinguishable you're really going to be looking for things like livebearers or other fish with captive bred morphs. You can get a couple different color varieties of platies or swordtails. Some livebearers you can't keep together, but I don't remember which ones. And most livebearers can be kept at cooler than tropical temperatures (below 75F).


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## Chevko (Nov 15, 2012)

lol, I heard that goldfish are more cool water, 60's area. But yeah, no goldfish personally. We're wanting to get several fish as well with the 40.


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## Crowntails (Feb 12, 2013)

A trio of Swordtails, a school of Halequin Rasboras, and a school of Panda cories would look so nice.


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## Chevko (Nov 15, 2012)

Bringing back my thread... I meant semi aggressive in the first post there (I think), but oh well.

So. Boyfriend wants a semi aggressive tank for the 40. What if I did a sorority with about 6-8 (betta) girls and a ghost knife? The knife doesn't have very good eyesight and thus is rather unlikely to eat the girls.

6-8 girls.
3 nerites? Maybe move Honey over to it entirely.
Ghost Knife

Prolly a standing, in-tank filter on a ramp of sorts to create a small current, sparse plants if doing them (with MTS to stir the sand).

Reason I'm thinking 6-8 girls is because we got our (first) betta last night and there was a CT female, red/white that I found to be rather attractive. (And I'm addicted to fish and they would easily obtained, though expensive unless Petco offers discounts on "bulk" purchases.)


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## ZombieKeepr (Mar 6, 2013)

Definitely no girls in with the knife. They're pretty good at what they do despite bad eyesight and girls really don't move that fast[especially not when they're comfortable]. Past that, the knife will need atleast a 100+gal tank when it's full grown.


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## Chevko (Nov 15, 2012)

Ghost Knives don't get more than 10 inches. What I've read was that they need a minimum of about 50 but with enough filtration they could do a 40, especially with the width. Brown knives I would expect need a bit bigger than ghosts. /headtilt


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## thekoimaiden (Oct 19, 2011)

Black Ghost Knifefish (_Apteronotus albifrons_) are most assuredly not suited for a tank of that size. They will grow to about a foot in captivity and have inflexible spines. They are a weakly electric fish (which is how they find prey) and produce electric currents using the muscles along the spine hence why it is inflexible. They need a tank that is at least double as wide as they are long to move around properly. A 40 is okay as a temporary grow-out, but is not suitable long-term. You are looking at a 100+ gal tank when it is fully grown. 

As for the female bettas, they will become a midnight snack. BGK are very adept predators and do not use their eyes to hunt; they use electrical impulses and hunt at night when the bettas are sleeping. 

If you are truly looking for a semi-aggressive community, look into cichlids. If you have soft water there are South American cichlids; for hard water there are the africans.


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## Chevko (Nov 15, 2012)

Ahhh, okay. I will definitely keep this in mind. I did let my boyfriend know so we definitely aren't getting a Knife. I'm trying to talk him into a sorority but it's not going so well... I know he's had his eye on some cichlids so we might go with them, but don't they get big? Or am I getting them mixed up with oscars? What about gouramis?


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## MattsBettas (Dec 18, 2012)

Oscars are cichlids... The name "cichlid" encompasses a ton of fish. Gouramis would work in a 40g but I don't know a ton about them.


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## Chevko (Nov 15, 2012)

Oohhh, okay. I didn't know/remember this. Primary thing I'm concerned about is how big they'll get and we want to get a number of them.


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## Riverotter (May 15, 2013)

Gouramis are anbenatoids like Bettas are, and many of them are also bubble nest breeders. There are many species that come in all different sizes.

For your 40 gallon, I think I'd recommend a small school of sailfin mollies. They come in several color varieties, so you can easily ell individuals apart, are livebearers, easy care, with intricate behavior patterns - the males dance and display for the females.
I'd go with 3 females and 2 males.

They'll want warm, slightly brackish water.
Then, to fill out the tank, I'd get a glassfish and a couple of bumble bee gobies. The gobies will help keep your molly population under control.


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## djembekah (Feb 13, 2012)

Idk your water params (hardness and ph are particularly important for fish stocking). softer water is better for certain fish, and still harder for others. putting fish in the wrong type of water can severely shorten their life span
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Chevko (Nov 15, 2012)

@riverotter
I've read that several molly species actually prefer freshwater to brackish or otherwise live rather happily in fresh as they brackish - is this just certain species? I would love to get mollies but boyfriend is adamant about choosing the first five... I may be able to talk him into sailfins though  before the suggestion i've seen them before and love their look - I didn't know they came in different colors though, thought only black. mostly been trying to talk him into dalmatians but I think I could get him onto sailfins  might have to special order them from PetCo but I don't mind :3 

@dj
It's not set up. It has no params. We need a stand first and the equip for it.


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## djembekah (Feb 13, 2012)

No, sorry, not ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate. Water hardness (GH and KH) you can test from the tap, and it's really important to know, like i said. Certain fish shouldn't be stocked in hardwater, and certain fish shouldn't be stocked in softwater. knowing the GH and KH would really help in knowing what we can recommend


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## Chevko (Nov 15, 2012)

Ah, okay. Yeah, I see what you're saying now. All I can really tell you is that it's city chlorinated water (SoCo StL and enough of it smells like a damned pool) and I don't have a testing kit =\ I typically just put a touch of Prime in it and those freshwater I currently have are just fine with it, but then again the boys are pretty damn hardy.


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## Riverotter (May 15, 2013)

Sailfins are very happy in brackish water. I used to live by the Peace River in FL (part of their natural range) and you'd find them in the ocean near the river sometimes, perfectly happy. Also, way up the river where the water was 100% fresh - they are pretty tolerant as far as saline levels go.

And yes, they come in MANY colors, black, gold, white, dalmatian on either white or gold background, and the natural wild color is actually very striking in person. All the iridescence doesn't photgraph well but it really is lovely. They've got so much blue and green in the speckles that I'm surprised there are no blue or green varieties yet.


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## Agent13 (Apr 23, 2013)

djembekah said:


> No, sorry, not ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate. Water hardness (GH and KH) you can test from the tap, and it's really important to know, like i said. Certain fish shouldn't be stocked in hardwater, and certain fish shouldn't be stocked in softwater. knowing the GH and KH would really help in knowing what we can recommend


Isn't this stuff adjustabe to some degree?? I have 1 tank that HAS to be at 8-8.4 ph and hard water . And all the rest are better at 7 with softer nuetral water so I have adjusted with the substrate and rock and such on the one that stays high PH and hardness. I've had no problems keeping different perams. Sure it's important to know but I don't think that shouldmake you stear clear of certain fish. I think it's just important to put together fish who all require the same or very similar perams then figure out how to make them happy and how to adjust if need be safely.


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## djembekah (Feb 13, 2012)

Well yeah, its adjustable, and if you have the means you can change it, but its sooo much easier to stock fish that are more suited to the water one has.

I'm actually trying to harden my water for my rabbit snails and the plants I'm trying to grow. my tap water is just sooooo soft. It can change over time if you live in a city and use city water too. when i first started my water was pretty neutral, but after i spent a bunch of money on snails i noticed my pH was down at like 6.4. so I've been working on adjusting that and hardening. i would have waited on the snailsif i had realized it changed.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Backlash (Jan 9, 2012)

If he likes Cichlids, and wants a smaller variety then what about some Kribensis.. Another choice would be some Rams..


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## Chevko (Nov 15, 2012)

Ooh. Just did some looking at PetCo's website over fish and apparently Sailfins can get up to 6.5"?? Is this true? D:


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## Agent13 (Apr 23, 2013)

Backlash said:


> If he likes Cichlids, and wants a smaller variety then what about some Kribensis.. Another choice would be some Rams..


Hmmm. This isn't an easy fish type to keep. In general African cichlids have completely different needs then other fish. While I would say yes for cichlids because they are such AWESOME fish I would also say bigger tank and also look to cichlid forums to get better info because thats what I had to do. My two cichlids are surely the coolest fish I own but also the hardest to keep fish I own! Ypu actually have to create a hierarchy between the males and establishing a tank boss and overstocking the tank plus better filtration to deal with the overstocking. It's not simple in any play of words.


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## thekoimaiden (Oct 19, 2011)

Chevko said:


> Ooh. Just did some looking at PetCo's website over fish and apparently Sailfins can get up to 6.5"?? Is this true? D:


Sailfin plecos? They can get over a foot long. 






This is a video made by a member and a friend of mine. It's a sailfin pleco in his 150 gal.


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## Riverotter (May 15, 2013)

Chevko said:


> Ooh. Just did some looking at PetCo's website over fish and apparently Sailfins can get up to 6.5"?? Is this true? D:


Yes, they can! And humans can get up to 7 feet tall 

It depends mostly on species but also on age. Most mollies - even in the wild - are actually a cross of sub-species. I'd have to look it up to be sure but I think that it is the pure Yucatan molly that regularly gets so big. Most sailfins will max out at about 4 inches. 

But they do continue to grow slowly their entire lives. So if you had a 5 or 6 year old fish it may well get that big, but growth is very slow after the first year.


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## Chevko (Nov 15, 2012)

Ahhh, okay. I think we may truly stop at the 40 on size so I didn't want to get stuck with something I'd have to Upgrade with. Hoping the next apartment place we live will not mind a 10 and a 40.


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## Riverotter (May 15, 2013)

Five mollies can happily live their whole lives in a 40, even if they do get to the max in size. But again, unless you manage to get a pure strain, I wouldn't worry about it. The stocking rate given on my first post shouldn't outgrow a 40 gallon even if they all max out in size.


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## Chevko (Nov 15, 2012)

Alright, awesome!  Thanks! I was really concerned about that, lol.

Well, I'll prolly let this topic get buried until I get my stand built, let my boyfriend pick his choices and ask you guys what you think :3


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