# 1/2 gallon tanks? What? *rant*



## baylee767 (Nov 5, 2010)

When I first joined, it was very strict "2.5 gallon minimum, water quality is important as WELL as the actual COMFORT of the Betta, water changes twice a week." And I stand by this.

A few months later, "1 gallon is just fine, but absolutely NOTHING below it. Heating might be a bit difficult, but that's okay. water changes every other day."

Then very soon later, "One gallon tanks only need water changes one or two times a week."

VERY recently (today) "Half gallon tanks are just fine. So long as you do 100% water changes daily, it's okay." (These aren't EXACT quotes, just kind of examples of things I read)

I stand by the 2.5 gallon tank minimum. I mean, why are people starting to approve 1/2 gallon tanks? I think it is cruel to the Betta, unless you live somewhere tropical, there is no way to heat the poor thing. There isn't enough room for the Betta, and there is certainly no room for any type of plants. Sure, the water quality is important, but isn't the happiness of the Betta, too? And water quality isn't the only thing that means a happy Betta....

Sorry to rant. Just had to get that out. I mean, I think 1 gallon tanks are OKAY, but I feel they aren't good for more than a few months. The inch per gallon rule is great... I find my 10 gallon tank too small for Neon. I don't know how people can look at a Betta in a half gallon and think there is a very happy Betta in there.


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## Vocaloid (Mar 29, 2011)

I don't think that 1/2 gallon tanks should be approved for use. However, I believe that a 1 gallon tank is perfectly fine for a betta to live in. At the moment I have Miku in a 1 gallon tank and I plan on keeping her inside that tank until I believe that she's too big for a 1 gallon. The fish I've owned have never been too big for a 1 gallon. I don't know if it's because they're not bred properly or what, but they've never been too big for a 1 gallon tank. A 1 gallon tank should be the minimum size for a betta to live in.


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## Cassandra90 (Aug 16, 2010)

I agree with Vocaloid. A one gallon is the minimum for a betta as long as there is proper care of the one gallon which means the routine water changes and constant temperature. 

I understand that on this forum the members say 2.5 gallon or larger since it is easier to care for. Larger the tank smaller water changes and it is more easy to keep the parameters correct in a larger tank. 

Overall I believe a one gallong would be plenty enough for a betta for the dedicated owner who will do the daily water changes, checking water quality and so on.

Every one has their own opinions and also what ever is best for that owner of a betta.


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## Vocaloid (Mar 29, 2011)

Agreed.


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## 1fish2fish (Sep 10, 2009)

I think every non-breeding betta owner should strive to put their fish in something at least 2 gallons (I say two gallons because a 2.5 usually is only 2 gallons of water space after filling with accessories).

For breeders it's different because they have to house hundreds of fish. But I've always said that I would hope a breeder would try to give their personal fish at least 1 gallon of swimming room even if the fish they're growing out or holding to sell are kept in less than 1 gallon.


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## RiverStoneBetta (Feb 22, 2011)

For "household" bettas, strive for the 2.5 mark. With that size, the tank is a little more forgiving to jam-packed college life. (It's hard to think about a water change, when you have a test in 6 hours.) That said, if you have the time for the required care, then yes, a 1 gallon home can be suitable. I've never gone smaller that 1.5 gallons though.

For breeders, I've seen them use everything from giant mason jars under a drip system. to rubbermaid tubs. In that situations, a good spawn equals somewhere around 50+ non-cull fish. You have to keep them somewhere.


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## denaliwind (Feb 27, 2011)

It's seems there's so many opinions on this matter and what's actually correct is kinda blurry. I think whatever the size, the biggest importance is water quality, maintenance and swim space. I'd say a tall, narrow 1 gallon should be totally crossed of the list. No way, no how, don't use it! But, a 1 gallon with a lot of horizontal swim space, that's more the betta's style and I can accept that. However, I also feel that the smaller the space, the more experience and dedication it deserves. I'm fine with someone using a 1g when they're diligent and know how often to change the water, and monitor it closely. I cringe however when a newbie gets a 1g and doesn't know how to do any of the above, nor has any real interest to learn. Further more, I cringe when that inexperienced newbie goes out and purchases 20 bettas in their first week! I don't feel confident that they will give the care those bettas need in those small, rather unstable environments for the rest of the bettas lives. So unfortunately, my answer/opinion is not black and white. I can't just draw the line at a specific number. My opinion really comes down to, I suppose, the keeper and their dedication and knowledge to caring for their fish.


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## Luimeril (Dec 29, 2010)

i say this:

at least a gallon for females. they're often smaller than males, and have more room to swim in a gallon than a male would. there's always exceptions to that, though*looks at Lulu, who's nearly as big as Cup, only she has smaller fins*

at least 2 gallons for males. it gives them alot more swimming room than a gallon or two gallons, and i've seen how amazing they can grow in more swimming rooms*beams happily at Cup, who's fins grew massive after being housed in a 2 gallon*

for breeders, it's whatever they feel is cheapest. o.o if it's .5 gallon Kritter Keepers, or gallon mason jars. they have to house hundreds of fish, so they have to find something small, cheap, and easy to clean. i've noticed, though, that few go under .5 gallons, and they're cleaned daily, it seems.


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## AngelicScars (May 5, 2009)

baylee767 said:


> When I first joined, it was very strict "2.5 gallon minimum, water quality is important as WELL as the actual COMFORT of the Betta, water changes twice a week." And I stand by this.
> 
> A few months later, "1 gallon is just fine, but absolutely NOTHING below it. Heating might be a bit difficult, but that's okay. water changes every other day."
> 
> ...


I agree, I've been on this board for awhile and I just did not expect 1 gallon being a good enough home. It has changed a bit around here. I'm still sticking with the 2.5 gallon rule.


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## bettafish15 (Oct 3, 2010)

I'm sticking with the 2.5g rule also. A 1g is okay if you have no other choice I suppose, or if your betta genuinely likes the small space  A half gallon is in no ways acceptable, IMO. I cant think of anything in the world that is meant to stay barely moving all it's life, bettas included. xP


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## Luimeril (Dec 29, 2010)

here's pics of breeder Victoria, from Bettysplendens.com 's breeding setups, so you can get the general idea of how most breeders house their fish, and WHY it's said that .5 gallons is acceptable now:
http://bettysplendens.com/articles/page.imp?articleid=715

people are realizing, that not everyone can house their betta in a 2 gallon or larger. as long as the fish is healthy, heated, fed enough, and has daily water changes, .5 gallons is okay. mind you, most will get sick of daily water changes and upgrade them. that's why my smallest tank is a 1 gallon now. >3>


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## 1fish2fish (Sep 10, 2009)

I don't think people should strive to be like breeders though. I think people who just keep them as pets should strive to give them the best and biggest conditions possible. Just because that's how breeders do it doesn't make it right for everyone to do it that way.

Its sad to say but in the breeding world it's acceptable to keep fish in smaller containers because it makes them grow their fins better, even if its not necessarily whats best for the fish.


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## Here Fishy Fishy Fishy (Oct 29, 2010)

My personal thoughts on tank size:

**Heated 1/2 gallon and less:* Suitable for QT only. Change 100% water daily.

**Heated one gallon unfiltered:* Okay for baby females and QT, one 50% and one 100% water change per week. Minimal decoration (one small silk plant, maybe a couple stones) for ease of cleaning.

**Heated 2.5 gallon with filter:* Enough room for one adult betta only; no tankmates. 25-33% water change each week with vaccumm; 50% once a month with vaccumm. 

Decorations can include silk plants and caves. If using powerfilter, gravel is not needed. Add only enough gravel to cover the floor of the tank if you want it for looks. (If using an undergravel filter, you will need more gravel. Please study undergravel filters before using).

**Heated 2.5 gallon, no filter:* enough room for one adult betta only; no tankmates. Minimal deocorations for ease of cleaning; 25% water change 1st week; 50% second week; 25-50% third week; 100% fourth week with complete clean. Continue pattern.

**Heated 5 gallon with filter:* room for 1 adult betta and a snail, or two adult bettas (divided- 2.5 gallons each side). 25-33% water change each week with vaccumm.

Decorations can include silk plants and caves. If using powerfilter, gravel is not needed. Add only enough gravel to cover the floor of the tank if you want it for looks. (If using an undergravel filter, you will need more gravel. Please study undergravel filters before using).

**Heated 10 gallon with filter:* Large enough for three bettas (one betta per division). Undivided, large enough for one adult betta and some smaller tank mates (5 pygmy catfish, for example - adult size is 1.25" inches each). Research your tank mates carefully, to make sure they are not overly active or nippy, and won't grow too large. 25-33% water change each week with vaccumm.

**Heated 20L or 20H with filter:* Minimum size for a female betta sorority, IMHO. *PLEASE* read about the pros and cons of a female betta sororities before creating one. You'll want to be prepared/plan for dealing with injuries/overly aggressive tank mates, and other issues specific to this sort of tank!

25-33% water change each week with vaccumm.


**Heated and filtered, above 20:* Lucky you! You can have a tropical community, female betta sorority or larger species tank. 25-33% water change each week with vaccumm.

Make sure your floors can withstand all the weight you are putting on them and check your renter's/homeowner's policy and make sure you are covered for tank failure or other damage caused by a compromised tank.


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## Here Fishy Fishy Fishy (Oct 29, 2010)

Luimeril,

Checked out the bettyspledens link... very interesting!

On a side note, gravity-fed drip systems (on a much larger scale) are used to collect maple syrup on mountainous maple farms.

I know that's way OT, but I love maple syrup and that's what the pictured drip system reminded me of! (Yum!)


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## Luimeril (Dec 29, 2010)

i miss seeing her beautiful fish. D: i've heard rumors of her continuing her US line via a friend, but no word yet. i DO know, she's hoping to start a Europe line sometime this year though. lucky Europeans. xDc

my dream:

Two 20 gallon longs. divided 4 ways each. <3 that's four five gallons for my babies. <3 <3 <3 of course, that's pending. Lulu honestly didn't enjoy her 2 gallon, so she might not be included in that. D: poor baby. i've never had a fish who didn't enjoy an upgrade, but all she did was hide for days. no exploring. just hiding, in either the barrel, or her Giant Pink Plant(that is now Theo's Giant Pink Plant. and he loves it.).


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## Here Fishy Fishy Fishy (Oct 29, 2010)

Some bettas inexplicably like a small tank... others like or need to be housed alone... every betta is different. It's nice if we can accomodate bettas with 'special needs'. 

At the same time, it's important not to overwhelm one's self with too many tanks and fish...


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## LolaQuigs (Mar 28, 2010)

The only time I've ever given approval of .5 gallons is when the user says he/she is planning on upgrading soon. I'm not going to berate someone for a temporary tank as long as appropriate water changes are performed.


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## Here Fishy Fishy Fishy (Oct 29, 2010)

LolaQuigs,

Mmmm... a lot of new people start off the wrong way in this hobby (I did!). Often, new owners are horrified to find out what a friend or pet store told them was wrong, and their betta is suffering.

People come here because they truly care about their betta... so, I don't believe anyone posting for help and information here should be berated... just _educated._


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## iheartmybettas (Jan 31, 2011)

baylee767 said:


> When I first joined, it was very strict "2.5 gallon minimum, water quality is important as WELL as the actual COMFORT of the Betta, water changes twice a week." And I stand by this.


 Agreed

[/quote]A few months later, "1 gallon is just fine, but absolutely NOTHING below it. Heating might be a bit difficult, but that's okay. water changes every other day."

Then very soon later, "One gallon tanks only need water changes one or two times a week."[/quote]

Regarding this...I consider OFL to be an expert when it comes to fish keeping and she did a study at some point on how often a filter and unfiltered tank needs to be changed. So yes I will recommend 2 changes 50% each week for a 1-4 gallon with filter (1 time must use gravel vac) and 1 50% and 1 100% change for unfiltered) because I have faith in what she recommends. 

[/quote]VERY recently (today) "Half gallon tanks are just fine. So long as you do 100% water changes daily, it's okay." (These aren't EXACT quotes, just kind of examples of things I read) [/quote]

Haven't seen this that I can remember. Now I am going to have to find it!

I don't agree with people having a 0.5 gallon. Prefer not a 1 gal either even though that is what i started out with. I personally recommend 5 gallons or more because of being able to cycle. BUT I cannot take the OP to the store and force the money out of their hands to upgrade their tank so I will just say how often they should clean the current tank they have and recommend an upgrade in the future. I can only hope they will listen, be responsible and keep their bettas tank clean and warm. It is up to them and how they want to care for their fishie in the end.

Edit: I tried to be fancy and get the quote to split up. Fail!


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## LolaQuigs (Mar 28, 2010)

Here Fishy Fishy Fishy said:


> LolaQuigs,
> 
> Mmmm... a lot of new people start off the wrong way in this hobby (I did!). Often, new owners are horrified to find out what a friend or pet store told them was wrong, and their betta is suffering.
> 
> People come here because they truly care about their betta... so, I don't believe anyone posting for help and information here should be berated... just _educated._




Yeah berated was too strong of a word. I agree, I always recommend an upgrade when someone posts that their tank is less than a gallon. But if they say that they're working on upgrading or planning to do it soon, I let it slide and just let then know the appropriate maintenance to do in the meantime; better for then to keep their fish in a small clean container than a small dirty one.


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## Luimeril (Dec 29, 2010)

i go on Youtube alot, looking at the betta videos. if i see someoen with a betta in a half gallon, vase, bowl, ect, i shoot them a comment. i usually start with "he/she's beautiful! but..." then i kindly explain how being in a half gallon or less isn't that healthy for them, that they'd be happier in a larger tank, that you should do daily water changes, and explain how the ammonia builds up fast and burns their scales gills and fins. they usually are shocked by the info i share, and i'm often messaged or get a comment linking me to a new video, usually showing a bigger home and lots of thanks.


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## Sweeda88 (Dec 6, 2010)

My minimum is 2.5 gallons as well. I THOUGHT it was 1 gallon, but I find I can never keep a fish in something that small for more than a week before I'm trying to find something bigger for them. All of my fish LOVE their bigger tanks, and I would hate to deprive them of them.


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## shinybetta (Jul 3, 2010)

I give Pk's larger tanks. My male HM is in a 1 gallon and he is perfectly happy. I even have 1 boy in a .75 gallon. Not what I would prefer, but his plant has lots of exploring space. Another thing is that he is kept next to another male so he mostly just flares/builds bubblenests. I don't recommend this, but it is only temporary and he is perfectly fine.


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## PewPewPew (Nov 26, 2010)

Alright. Im gonna say this, and if some new members get offended, cry somewhere else.
*deep breath*

If you cant purchase an acceptable tank size, materials, conditioner and a heater for a fish, *YOU SHOULD NOT HAVE PURCHASED THE ANIMAL.*

You would not get a dog or a cat and not have room to house it. You wouldnt shove it in your fridge and say, "as long as I clean up its poo and feed it, its fine!" NO. _If you cant care for it, you shouldnt have gotten it._

I think the reason the 2.5-1-.5 gallon degradation has happened because new members have been crying so hard lately about BUT BUT BUT ITS ALL I GOT, YOURE SO MEAN.

Tough.

You wouldnt shove a horse in a closet and be like "Well its ok, its all I can do!"

No. Dont get it if you cant give it what it needs. 

Now, Im not saying you need to go get a 100 gallon tank per fish. No, dont be a fool. Im not even saying a 5 gallon. Not even a three.

*What Im saying is a half gallon is not a good place for any creature to live in. *They cant really move around. 
"OH BUT I CHANGE THE WATER EVERY DAY!"

Great. YOU SHOULD BE ANYWAY. *Dont use this as a cop out.*

"But I didnt know and cant afford anything new!" B'awwww. Too bad. That doesnt mean what you have is acceptable. No amount of your whining and crying over it will make it any better than what it is, which is unacceptable. Again. The horse in your closet. I cant tell you, that poor creature isnt happy.

I understand people get sizes of tanks then realize its not a good size, and cant afford anything else. But when you begin to use this as a scape goat and try to justify it and make it seem "okay", then frankly, you are *WRONG*.

I cant stand members, who think that bettas dont even need to be kept at a tropical temp, think that living in something so small is fine, and that we shouldnt discourage it. No. Just because you're wrong doesnt mean the standard is, it should stay at at least *1.5-2 gallons, filled. Period.*

/rant

>:S RAGE


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## bettafish15 (Oct 3, 2010)

PewPewPew said:


> Alright. Im gonna say this, and if some new members get offended, cry somewhere else.
> *deep breath*
> 
> If you cant purchase an acceptable tank size, materials, conditioner and a heater for a fish, *YOU SHOULD NOT HAVE PURCHASED THE ANIMAL.*
> ...


+1,000,000. Totally, completely, and utterly agree with you.


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## PewPewPew (Nov 26, 2010)

Thanks... I know its harsh (though bagh. I think we all know by now I dont give a rats behind about whining, lol), but its true. You wouldnt do that to a larger, furry animal. And you certainly wouldnt justify it.

Its recommended that for a reason, and all this cryin' and whining is just an attempt at validating something that isnt correct..

Hisssssssssss D:<


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## Luimeril (Dec 29, 2010)

*pokes at my tanks* i mostly have larger tanks. 1 gallon is my smallest, and that's honestly because Lulu hates bigger tanks. >.> tried it. she hid. for a week. put her back in her 1 gallon, and she's swimming around alot. :d Caroline's in 1.5 with a filter and a live plant. she's tiny, she has room to move about, and is very active, happy, healthy. if Lulu liked bigger tanks, than my smallest would be Carolines. it's not hat i can't upgrade them. .__o why stress them out with something they don't like? go on, with your "they can't not like things. they're fish". i've seen the difference in Lulu's behavior, and know she was stressed in the 2 gallon, but is happy, swimming, active in her 1. i'd not go smaller than one gallon if i could help it at all. ONLY time i'd go .5, is when i'm breeding and have a bajillion babies to house. .___o even with a job, i couldn't house 20+ fry in 2 gallon tanks. even buying cheap, that'd be 20+ times $10 for a KK. ._. that's alot of money. if it's gotta be mason jars, it'll be mason jars. luckily, that'll be very temp housing(>.> they're popular. and i haven't even started collecting what i need to do it. xD).


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## LittleBettaFish (Oct 2, 2010)

I totally agree with what you've posted PewPewPew. It makes me cringe when I see someone with a bunch of 1/2 gallon unheated bowls that are only 'temporary' that they vehemently defend as being better than the cups at Walmart, PetCo etc. And worse still, they go out and 'rescue' more and more fish, which sooner or later seem to end up in the memorial section of the forum. 

This is really common among the younger members that have no disposable income of their own. Their parents are more than happy to let them purchase several fish since _everyone_ knows bettas can live in a small jar. However, as soon as they are informed that these same fish are going to need a lot more than this, they suddenly clam up and refuse to spend anymore money. After all, the employee at the LFS told them it was okay, so obviously they know more than some faceless individuals off an internet forum. I see this happen a lot with common goldfish. Most people blanch when you mention how much space they require. They are instead content to wallow in their ignorance. Because you just know they had a goldfish in a bowl and it lived 2 years.

I think that in this day and age there is no excuse for ignorance. If you are old enough to be given access to the internet, you are old enough to at least know how to do a basic google search. I also think unless your parents are animal people, you should not buy a pet unless you have enough money of your own to support it.

To most people a fish is 'just' a fish. If it dies, it gets flushed and it's another trip to Walmart or PetCo to buy a replacement. Therefore, it's hard to get people concerned enough about their welfare that they would be willing to fork out additional funds to provide a suitable environment for what many consider a disposable pet. Even if these same people are you parents.

Bettas are like potato chips in that you can't just have one. But you also don't want to eat the whole bag while you're at it.


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## PewPewPew (Nov 26, 2010)

LittleBettaFish said:


> I totally agree with what you've posted PewPewPew. It makes me cringe when I see someone with a bunch of 1/2 gallon unheated bowls that are only 'temporary' that they vehemently defend as being better than the cups at Walmart, PetCo etc. And worse still, they go out and 'rescue' more and more fish, which sooner or later seem to end up in the memorial section of the forum.
> 
> This is really common among the younger members that have no disposable income of their own. Their parents are more than happy to let them purchase several fish since _everyone_ knows bettas can live in a small jar. However, as soon as they are informed that these same fish are going to need a lot more than this, they suddenly clam up and refuse to spend anymore money. After all, the employee at the LFS told them it was okay, so obviously they know more than some faceless individuals off an internet forum. I see this happen a lot with common goldfish. Most people blanch when you mention how much space they require. They are instead content to wallow in their ignorance. Because you just know they had a goldfish in a bowl and it lived 2 years.
> 
> ...


I agree.


And to others:

Okay. Cool. Your tanks are good. They like them...Cool. Great.

Cool story.

Stop pming me about it. You do what you do, dont complain via a pm, ha.
-__-U


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## baylee767 (Nov 5, 2010)

PewPewPew: People are PMing you because you oppose small .5 gallon tanks?

I agree, please stop (=

Luimeril: I'm just fine with Bettas in 1 gallon tanks who hate larger tanks. But most Bettas in small .5 gallon tanks are purely because "it was so expensive", "I didn't know" (With no mention of ever getting a bigger tank... never mentioning it again) OR "He seems okay. If he is just fine now, he'll be just fine forever" I don't care so long as PET owners try out larger tanks first (at least 2-2.5 gallons) before saying they are stressed by small tanks (I know you have (= )

I can't remember which thread I was reading where many, many people were chiming in about .5 gallons being fine, but it was out there. There were pages of people telling a new member .5 gallons is fine without even asking about heating, when finally someone who I greatly admire stood up and posted it isn't right. 

(also, yes I know OFL gives GREAT advice and the twice weekly thing works fine. I just like the most pristine possible water, and every other day water changes makes you go from just fine water quality to above all... just absolutely perfect water quality.)


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## Abby (Jan 13, 2011)

I live in eastern New South Wales Australia the climate here means i dont need a heater but i have them in all my tanks with low lighting (high lighting on the ladies tanks ensures the water stays nice and cosy)

But come winter i will need my heaters on i think as the temp gets down to the under 10 Celsius without heaters my tank are sitting around 25-28 degrees (77F - 82.4F)


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## Luimeril (Dec 29, 2010)

maybe i'm odd, but i adore the videos i get messaged and commented to me on youtube, of betta owners who upgrade their bettas after i suggest how much happier they'll be. i helped one guy out today. <3 he had the same 1.5 gallon as i do, and was wondering why his betta hides behind the filter. i suggested maybe the filter was too strong for him, and turned him here, to the baffle thread. he thanked me, and subscribed to me. :3 he's excited about my other videos, it seems. i gotta find the camera fast! Dx


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## baylee767 (Nov 5, 2010)

Wow, congrats! I wish people would listen to me when I explain their Betta problems on youtube x.x you are good at convincing people lol.


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## Luimeril (Dec 29, 2010)

nah. i'm just nice about it. explaining the fact that the smaller tanks can turn into acid baths usually helps convince them to get bigger tanks, too. >3>


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## baylee767 (Nov 5, 2010)

Lol, that's a great way to put it. The times I feel like being nice the video is at least 3 years old ^.^ Lol.


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## Luimeril (Dec 29, 2010)

i search for "Betta", then set the sorting to Upload Date. that way, the newest is up top. :d


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## Staciekarp (Apr 18, 2010)

I've been havin' a bad day so sorry if this post is a little herpaderp

I think being harsher on members with inadequate homes is both a good thing and a bad thing; There is a sense of urgency that comes with it but I see a lot of people misinterpret it as us just being mean or elitists.. I don't think we should have to baby them but chewing them out for it (in their perspective) doesn't sound so hot either; and of course we don't know how each individual will react to advice given to them.

I think our responses have started to lack the urgency and "harshness" because of that. It's a little bit like an easy way out of avoiding drama and loss of new members but who knows if they'll even listen to such soft responses anyways.

I dunno where I'm going with this I think I need to get a journal or something. Sorry guys. @[email protected]


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## JackisLost (Feb 26, 2011)

I like pewpewpew's views on this, entertaining and true.


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## Arashi Takamine (Mar 3, 2011)

The problem with 1/2 gallons is that companies are making them appealing like inserting family picture frames in the back or the Marina Zen 'starter kit'. I admit I was tempted to buy one myself until I saw a little female betta at Petland in one and she was dying there. I would never wish a 1/2 gallon on any fish unless it was seriously a temp home.

My dream is to when Akira grows a bit more until he's fully grown. (He's still really young.) To upgrade his tank to a planted 2.5 gallon tank with a filter and hiding places. Our tank is fine now but I hope to convince mom that when he grows more it would be our chance to create a bamboo forest themed tank like the one she loved on Youtube by upgrading to a thirteen buck tank. I mean we have everything else needed for it including his heater and plants he has now. 

But yes a half gallon is as far as I'm concerned unacceptable. I was probably the most annoying when choosing tanks because I had to make sure they'd be suitable for the fish. Now Akira loves it and he's just the right size at the moment. (Not even the full site of my pinky excluding his tail.) However I have plans for when he grows up some more.


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## TheCrysCat (Mar 14, 2011)

I agree with PewPewPew. I remember reading something about people being too harsh and I was like "What?" I've seen people on here be persistant about newbies and such doing the right thing for their fish, but the only time I've seen other members get irritated and annoyed is with people that argue back. Seriously, most of the information anyone here will give you is what most of the forum agrees with. There. is. no. point. in. arguing. And the argument that bigger tanks cost more than tiny ones is crap. You can get a .5 gallon for $15, and a 2.5 for $13. No one here is going to think less of you for improper care if you do your best to correct it, and I think that that is something that a lot of people should realize.


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## Luimeril (Dec 29, 2010)

i got another update on a betta owner i helped~ he had his betta in one of those .5 gallon cube things with the plant in the middle, and i suggested a larger tank, and he messaged me with the update~


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## TheCrysCat (Mar 14, 2011)

That's awesome, Luimeril!


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## Pekemom (Jan 27, 2011)

It's important for a newbie to understand that a larger tank is more forgiving of error. The smaller the tank, the more catastrophic it is when the water parameters are off. More water volume spreads the problem over a greater area which lessens the negative effect. I hope that made sense!!


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## TheCrysCat (Mar 14, 2011)

Hmm... maybe there should be a "things newbies should know" sticky...


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## bettafish15 (Oct 3, 2010)

Pekemom said:


> It's important for a newbie to understand that a larger tank is more forgiving of error. The smaller the tank, the more catastrophic it is when the water parameters are off. More water volume spreads the problem over a greater area which lessens the negative effect. I hope that made sense!!


Totally makes sense. When I got my betta, I had him by himself in a 14g, and because it was a larger tank, my newbie self didnt manage to kill him by not knowing about cycling.


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## bettaloverforever16 (Jan 14, 2011)

I believe that 1/2 gallon tanks are OK if you do daily water changes. My girl, Gia, is in one. She's happy, and not sick.


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## TheCrysCat (Mar 14, 2011)

And you've had her how long...? I used to keep bettas in .5 gallon bowls. I had one that lived 9 months, and the other two probably only lasted one or two. They're such a difference between them and the bettas I keep now, who have at least 2.5 gallons. Also, daily water changes long-term are going to stress your fish out. It's okay for a tempory tank, but not a long term one.

That having been said, this thread is crazy old. Let's allow it to die again.


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## Mew (Jul 31, 2011)

A 2.5 gallon tank should be the minimum because after adding plants and the other decorations you want to add to a 1 gallon there'll be barely any room for the fish to move. In a 2.5 there's at least a little more room to move around in. (A little advice, ignore the troll.)


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## TheCrysCat (Mar 14, 2011)




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## Mew (Jul 31, 2011)

SlipperySue said:


> 2.5 gallons??? I don't know what kind of whacky tobaccky you all smoke around here, but give me some! As I said before, 500 gallons or bust... listen to me... I'm the Betta G.O.A.T!


Log off and don't come back online. If you're going to be a troll then you aren't welcomed on this forum. Do I have to report you?


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## TheCrysCat (Mar 14, 2011)

Don't bother. She'll be getting banned as soon as a mod comes on, methinks.


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## Romad (Jun 28, 2009)

TheCrysCat said:


> Don't bother. She'll be getting banned as soon as a mod comes on, methinks.



Methinks you are correct :-D Thanks to anyone who reported this.

Have a great day.


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## 1fish2fish (Sep 10, 2009)

Zombie thread is back from the dead... Die thread die.


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## diablo13 (Jul 1, 2011)

You, Slippery Sue, if you can't avoid drug references or tobacco references or whatever, you shouldn't be on this forum. And Cryscat, what the heck is that goat?

Whoops, thought there was only 1 page. Ok, let it die


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## PewPewPew (Nov 26, 2010)

I am lolling at the fact that I more or less caused this and then didnt see any of it.

Its fine to have your own opinions, and its even better to cordially accept or deny other's opinions, but dont be a jerk.

This is not the place~ <3

Im sure ill get the lodown on what happened, lawl. GOGOGO ROMAD! <3


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## cajunamy (Apr 28, 2011)

1fish2fish said:


> I think every non-breeding betta owner should strive to put their fish in something at least 2 gallons (I say two gallons because a 2.5 usually is only 2 gallons of water space after filling with accessories).
> 
> For breeders it's different because they have to house hundreds of fish. But I've always said that I would hope a breeder would try to give their personal fish at least 1 gallon of swimming room even if the fish they're growing out or holding to sell are kept in less than 1 gallon.


+1 

*whoops, sorry! i never look at dates, just assume that everything new is on the first page lol


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## Abby (Jan 13, 2011)

iheartmybettas said:


> Edit:





iheartmybettas said:


> I tried to be fancy [/quote
> 
> 
> iheartmybettas said:
> ...


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## Abby (Jan 13, 2011)




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## Littlebittyfish (Jan 5, 2011)

Abby said:


>


_hahaha_
:lol:

I see 1.5 gallon as minimum tank size, as long as it is heated and cleaned properly.


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## Pitluvs (Jun 22, 2011)

My personal opinion is each Betta is different, each owner is as well. Have what you can care for properly and don't worry about the tank size. I do agree that anything under 1g should be for QT only. But 1g and over, I see no issue with it UNLESS the owner doesn't want to do the extra work that comes with a 1g. I have 1.5g tanks and I clean them 90% every second day. Unfortunately it's all I can afford here, if I were in USA I would have 3g for each of the boys lol But I knew this was what I could afford/house so I clean them as needed and I refuse to take home every needing case from the pet store. I have 3 boys, I could never afford the big numbers some people have unless I started dividing tanks LOL I really don't need more fish thank I have anyways.

Anyways, I don't think there are any set rules on size, but set rules on maintenance of the tanks in question. You're always going to have someone putting you down and thinking they are better, just prove them wrong. I have smaller tanks yes, no they are not the 2.5g and most think it's inhumane. But... I don't care, they're not cleaning them and they don't own my fish.


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## BETTA DET (Jul 29, 2011)

Most petstores have 10 Gallon kit tanks for 50 bucks or so. Because I had to get a new heater today I realized they cost 30 dollars for a 50 watt (enough for a 20 gallon). So I looked at how much the filter was and it would be 10 to 15 dollars to replace it, in case mine ever went down. Thats about 45 dollars plus tax for a filter and a heater alone. You get everything you need with the kit, and most will give you a coupon for fish, substate and the other things you need.

Why not just get a 10 gallon kit for all the money you are spending to heat and filter a 2.5 gallon?

Now Ive had bettas a few times in my life and in my experience they are happier with room to swim.

Ive learned the hard way that they need heat, fur coat is a nasty, ugly way to go and its not quick. In my old house it was always hot, the house I live in now is always cool, 95 today outside 73 inside with no AC.

I agree no one should keep a betta in less than 2.5 and Id rather say 5.


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## Pitluvs (Jun 22, 2011)

BETTA: My 1.5g was $25, plus $12 for the heater, filters included with tank. 5gal kits are $60 and tax plus a heater of $12. Just so you know. 

Also 2.65g are $64 plus heater and filter costs. This why I use 1.5g tanks.


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## BETTA DET (Jul 29, 2011)

I saw an 10 gallon Aqueon tank set for 54.99. I got my 14 gallon for like 65 plus tax. I think I saw it today for about the same price maybe a few bucks more. Why would you but a 5 gallon for 60 plus the heater, you can get a 10 gallon with everything for cheaper.


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## bettafish15 (Oct 3, 2010)

Prices differ for people in different areas. A 10g kit is 80 bucks plus tax in the nearest city, and I'm in Northern BC.


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## BETTA DET (Jul 29, 2011)

47 bucks, comes with everything you need, even the lid and the light. All you have to do is add substrate (optional but I advise it) decorations and water.

http://www.google.com/products/cata...a=X&ei=imY3TpbvKcfEgQfP58CbAg&ved=0CGUQ8wIwAA#


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## 1fish2fish (Sep 10, 2009)

Betta Det.. you don't seem to be realizing that this is an international forum and the same products you might get for that price are not the same in other countries.

That said can we PLEASE stop the necrobumping?


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## Pitluvs (Jun 22, 2011)

Taking this all out... 1fish2fish has it correct  5g tank kits are $50+ and you need to buy a heater for $30. 10g are $79 plus the above. Things are so so much more expensive here.

It just hurts when people say "You shouldn't use anything under 2.5g, or 5g for that matter". I need separate tanks, I am scared of putting my boys in one tank after loosing my first two. But I surely cannot afford the 5gal tanks for each Betta either  I'm not a bad owner, I try to give them everything I can, and they like the extra attention with water changes every second day.


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## bettafish15 (Oct 3, 2010)

But do they ship to Canada? Not everything is black and white :/


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## BETTA DET (Jul 29, 2011)

Please dont get me wrong Im not trying to be condescending or look down upon anyones situation. Im only trying to help out. I hate seeing people pay more for less and that is what businesses will always try and do. I do understand that shipping and costs are different from country to county. But I found this good deal and felt that I could share it with others.

Sorry if I offended anyone wasn't my intention.


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## PewPewPew (Nov 26, 2010)

1f2f, I think this is okay as per the rules since there is discussion and it's relevant. This is why I dont like opinion-based threads.

I agree, prices are very different just in the US and Canada. Nel and Pitluvs alerted me to the insane price difference in the past few days and Im shocked. Nel lives just over the border a ways from me and has to pay a ton more. I wish I could send you the cheaper tanks, bagh!

Typically, in the states, unless you buy a glass tank/hood combo, a 2.5 or less acrylic "designer" tank is more than a 5-10 gallon kit.

Tetra 1.5's are usually around $30 or so, give or take, and a petsmart 10g tetra glass is the same, give or take again.

But anyway, yeah. I agree, 1 gallon or less isnt great. Very personally, I dont like anything under 2 gallons, due to heating and cleaning issues.

If there is less and theyre cared for, I cant do anything about it. I would hope proper care is given, and if so, then that's all I can hope for.

I think threads like this have their day, get people buzzing, you know... But it also makes people angry and hurt. I think this thread may have become too confrontational for its own good, and less helpful than it needs to be.

I guess the troll got what she was after, but probably not in the way she'd thought.

I hope this thread dies again..


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## 1fish2fish (Sep 10, 2009)

If the discussion was new it'd be one thing but we're destined to repeat the same thing.

I like 5 gallons, No I like 1 gallon, No you should only keep them in 10 gallons, Well I keep mine in the toilet so there!

It will never go anywhere because everyone wants to believe that they are right and everyone else is wrong. Although I believe we have reached a consensus in that 2.5 gallons is recommended, 1.5 is acceptable, and anything under that really shouldn't be long term housing.


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## Pitluvs (Jun 22, 2011)

I have to say... if and when I can upgrade, you bet I will! My boys went from happy to overjoyed when they moved to the 1.5g (they were in QT 1g's) and I cannot imagine what they will go through when they get something bigger. I just can't do the dividing tanks thing after my personal experience. I'm not a scrooge with space, my rats are in a cage big enough for 12, there are 5. My lizard has a 45g to herself. But prices here are ridiculous. But all stores here push the 0.5 divided Betta tanks. People on my Facebook think I'm trying to prove how much money I have (or dont!) because my tanks are too flashy for Bettas. Although my Mother In Law scolded me for not having Twitch in a bigger tank like the other boys lol

Anyways... I would love nothing more than a divided 20g for all the boys, only one freaking socket needed. But like I said, I'm scared one will get sick and I'll loose them all like last time. 

This thread makes people like me feel horrible  But I have to agree, 0.5g or 0.8g's are NOT COOL GUYS! I use mine for QT cause I wasn't walking 40mins to WalMart to get a 1g for Hughie so I picked it up and Hughie for $17.


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## PewPewPew (Nov 26, 2010)

1fish2fish said:


> Well I keep mine in the toilet so there!
> .


Oh, giggles. Ohhh, giggles.

I agree. No one's really right, in a way, no one's really wrong.

Dont feel bad, Pitluvs. You care, and that's just fine.


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## TheCrysCat (Mar 14, 2011)

Pitluvs - I think you're fine. Your fish may not have a huge habitat to explore, but they're well cared for. I more have an issue with younger members who put the bettas in tiny tanks and think that it's okay, and that anyone who has the nerve to tell them otherwise is "jumping on them."


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## PhilipPhish (Mar 6, 2011)

I don't see the big deal. I have 2 betta fish both in. 5 gallon tanks... i get bubblenests on the regular. I have one in a pickle jar too... all happy.


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## Pitluvs (Jun 22, 2011)

PewPewPew said:


> Oh, giggles. Ohhh, giggles.
> 
> I agree. No one's really right, in a way, no one's really wrong.
> 
> Dont feel bad, Pitluvs. You care, and that's just fine.


Caring isn't the whole deal though! I could 'care' about a fish in a 0.5g right? I am doing the best with what's available to me, and once larger tanks come up for a suitable price, I plan to upgrade. 

The worst part is, I had 2.5g for each of my boys from the start and whatever happened to Venom ruined me lol I planned on upgrading to a 10g divided in 3. Blahhh.


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## PewPewPew (Nov 26, 2010)

Bubblenests are not a good way to determine the fish's health or happiness... Theyre great, but they are mostly instinctual to make.

If your tanks are clean, then as we said, we can do nothing to change what you do or what you have. All we can wish is that they are cleaned regularly to help your fish live good lives.


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## Pitluvs (Jun 22, 2011)

TheCrysCat said:


> Pitluvs - I think you're fine. Your fish may not have a huge habitat to explore, but they're well cared for. I more have an issue with younger members who put the bettas in tiny tanks and think that it's okay, *and that anyone who has the nerve to tell them otherwise is "jumping on them."*


I've actually ranted in 2 places today and removed one over this. This is URKING ME to no end!


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## PewPewPew (Nov 26, 2010)

Pitluvs said:


> Caring isn't the whole deal though! I could 'care' about a fish in a 0.5g right? I am doing the best with what's available to me, and once larger tanks come up for a suitable price, I plan to upgrade.
> 
> The worst part is, I had 2.5g for each of my boys from the start and whatever happened to Venom ruined me lol I planned on upgrading to a 10g divided in 3. Blahhh.



This is why I hate this thread.

Pitluvs, yes, you could care for them in that size. I'm saying you care and are doing all that you can, and will do what you can when you can, and that's what matters.

I'm not attacking you, nor saying anything is wrong with your tanks. I'm commending you for caring about your pets, which is what truly matters in the end. A 20g that never gets changed and sits idle will not fare well. A 1g that is cared for, will.


And thats when I unsub >_<


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## Pitluvs (Jun 22, 2011)

PewPewPew said:


> This is why I hate this thread.
> 
> Pitluvs, yes, you could care for them in that size. I'm saying you care and are doing all that you can, and will do what you can when you can, and that's what matters.
> 
> ...


No no! I'm conversing with you, not explaining myself because I feel your attacking haha I read in your first post that 1.5g was 'ok' with you. It's others that make me feel like crap when they say "Nothing under 5g" lol


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## BETTA DET (Jul 29, 2011)

BETTA DET said:


> Please dont get me wrong Im not trying to be condescending or look down upon anyones situation. Im only trying to help out. I hate seeing people pay more for less and that is what businesses will always try and do. I do understand that shipping and costs are different from country to county. But I found this good deal and felt that I could share it with others.
> 
> Sorry if I offended anyone wasn't my intention.


Ok I thought I apologized, I didnt realize things were so different in Canada. I only tried to offer a different solution. I see alot of people pay alot more money for things when they can get bigger and better for cheaper. Ive had fish tanks since I was a kid and have made tons of mistakes along the way, including keeping bettas in tanks way too small for them. I learned alot from this site and joined because I liked what I saw while I was researching to learn more. Because you never stop learning. Im sorry sharing my opinions have caused someone so much hurt, and even said I didnt mean to offend anyone. I also said 2.5 was acceptable but I would rather see 5 and that is my opinion. You know what they say about opinions, they are like *edit* everyone has them. Again I'm sorry if I caused anyone any grief.


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## diablo13 (Jul 1, 2011)

Come on guys, let the old thread DIE!!!!!


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## ilovekeetaujao (Aug 1, 2011)

When I first got my Betta, I kept him in a half gallon vase. And I COULD fit plants in there. But don't worry, he's been moved to a much larger container. You can see so much of a difference! He's bluer and brighter than ever and finally started eating!


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

I had my first 3 bettas in half gallon vases. 2 of them lived for 2.5 years.


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## Comet1993 (Jul 28, 2011)

I consider a one-gallon tank a bare minimum.. Like.. You have _no _other choice.. I think bigger is better for bettas. =] Plus, you can see them swim around more and enjoy their tank! Not much swimming can go on in a half-gallon tank... =/ Poor bettas...


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## krelda (Aug 10, 2011)

I just got my first Betta a little over a week ago, it was an impulse buy and I got a 1 gallon tank. I'm not really supposed to have pets in my place so I think until I move into a more pet friendly apartment I'm going to keep him in it because its small enough to hide if I need maintenance done and I don't mind changing his water every other day but the more I read and the more I see him play in his plant I want to get him a bigger tank so he can have more cool things lol


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## Pitluvs (Jun 22, 2011)

Friend of mine built a cage for her pet rats in a dresser. No joke. It was big enough for 8 rats, and the front snapped back on and made it look like a dresser when people came over. Genius. Although I would never suggest stumping your landlord like that............

Anyways... is there anyway for you to hide a bigger tank? Like a shelf and you could drop a piece of fabric over the front when people come over? hehe


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## krelda (Aug 10, 2011)

LOL thats a creative cage!

If the floor of my closet wasn't the trapdoor to the crawlspace under the apartment I'd consider putting a low dresser in there to put a larger tank on and then I could just close the closet door, but I don't want to have to move him and the dresser if we need to get down there. I wouldn't consider the landlord much of an issue if it weren't for the fact that we have 2 broken things already that need attention (stupid apartment)


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## Comet1993 (Jul 28, 2011)

I totally agree with you, PewPewPew!! :welldone:


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## elijahfeathers (Oct 15, 2010)

Skimming this thread... yeah. I've been less active here because my mom forced me to downsize some... but I've noticed a trend when I come on about smaller and smaller being okay. I think a 1 gallon or 1.5 is the bare minimum for a fish. From what I was taught here that's for temporary housing or emergencies only though.

2.5 is the smallest I'll use for my fish. I bought a 2.5 actually, a really lovely one. And while I really liked it at first (I wanted a 'pretty' tank, darn it! My 5 and 10 gallon are not so fun to look at!), it quickly became a pain. It's difficult to heat, to clean, and to arrange decor for. It's still gorgeous, of course. But it's way more fiddly than I like. Currently, since it's such a pain, it's being used to house Volker, since I'm suspecting he's ill. It keeps him out of the divided tanks and I still feel like he has enough space, so it's all good.


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