# large pieces of skin floating in water! help please :(



## Twilight Storm (Apr 14, 2011)

Housing 
What size is your tank? *1/2 gallon*
What temperature is your tank? *78oF*
Does your tank have a filter? *No*
Does your tank have an air stone or other type of aeration? *No*
Is your tank heated? *No, it's been in her kitchen for 3 years w/ no problems untill recently*
What tank mates does your betta fish live with? *None now she had gotten a live plant from petsupplies plus that is now taken out*

Food
What type of food do you feed your betta fish? *Betta bio gold-baby pellet*
How often do you feed your betta fish? *once a day*

Maintenance 
How often do you perform a water change? *every other day (until past three days now doing 100% water changes on her fish)*
What percentage of the water do you change when you perform a water change? *100% now daily*
What type of additives do you add to the water when you perform a water change? *some kind of grey bottle of declor with a koi on the front she always used*

Water Parameters:
Have you tested your water? If so, what are the following parameters?

Ammonia:
Nitrite:
Nitrate:
pH:
Hardness:
Alkalinity: 

Symptoms and Treatment
How has your betta fish's appearance changed? *looks like he has shed skin peeling off him and large flakes of it are floating in the water (skin shows scale outlines)* *also had dandilion growths of fungus looking stuff on the two long fins that hang down last night*
How has your betta fish's behavior changed? *loss of appitite, kind of just lays on the bottom of the tank, has a hard time coming to the top for air*
When did you start noticing the symptoms? *laying around and loss of appitite day before yesterday. last night:fungus looking growth on his two fins. This morning: large pieces of skin peeling off and floating in tank, lating at bottom, has a hard time coming to the top for air. Doesn't have much gill movement.*
Have you started treating your fish? If so, how? *API aquarium salt and hikari betta revive (it was the only thing I had that remotely said anything about treating fungus)that was started last night, and with a 100% bowl change about a half hour ago*
Does your fish have any history of being ill? *No*
How old is your fish (approximately)? *roughly 3 years maybe 2 1/2 fish is about the size of my thumb*.

Hi, i'm new here. I had problems logging in or I would have posted last night. I am not sure whats wrong with her fish but if anyone can help before he dies it would be appreciated. My mom is very upset. There were no problems with her fish until the live plant went into the bowl. which they said would "be good for the fish" it was one of those moss ball things.


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## Twilight Storm (Apr 14, 2011)

Also the water she uses is the kind from those water machines at the grocery store that she de-clors before putting the fish in.

BTW- Her fish is named Moose and I am pretty sure she used the same net she uses on her betta in another fish tank. If it's even remotely contagious how should I treat the tanks so all her other fish don't die


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## Oldfishlady (Mar 1, 2010)

Sadly this may be age related.....but I would go ahead and get her in a small QT container and start high dose aquarium salt 3tsp/gal along with 100% daily water changes with the salt water for 10 days.....

Good luck and keep us posted....and welcome to the forum.....


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## Twilight Storm (Apr 14, 2011)

Thank you for the reply oldfishlady. Should I keep up with the betta revive as well as the 3tsp salt per gallon? or will that much salt kill the dandelion fungus stuff?

The evil moss ball has it's own dollar store bowl it's living in (about a cup and a half of water) I am glad I didn't get one. The moss ball was bought the same place I got my little guy. It came out of an aquarium with other kinds of fish living in it. Live plants now scare the bejesus out of me.

Thank you for the welcome btw. I am trying to learn all I can so I can make my own little guy happy and comfortable.


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## Oldfishlady (Mar 1, 2010)

Personally, I wouldn't use the Betta revive along with the high dose of salt...

Don't be afraid of live plants-often they get a bad rap and blamed for things they had nothing to do with....

I don't know much about the moss balls since I have never personally kept one....I need to get one and check it out...lol....

With true aquatic plants they can often be helpful in our tanks with proper care....they can provide not just a place for the fish to rest, hide, graze..... also filtration when actively growing......


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## Pekemom (Jan 27, 2011)

Welcome, Twilight. We're glad you're here. I hope your Mom's fish recovers soon. I would make sure to wash that fish net in hot water...

Lots of good luck with your little betta boy.


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## LolaQuigs (Mar 28, 2010)

Yeah rinse the net really well in hot water and let it air dry; usually fish pathogens die once they're out of water. If you're really concerned, you could clean the net in a diluted bleach mixture (1 pt bleach to 10 pts water) and rinse it REALLY well afterward. Or you could get a new net. If you've already used the net-in-question on your tank, I'd just keep a close eye on the fish and watch for signs of illness; it's not worth it to treat a whole tank unless you know for sure there's something wrong...not all fish are as hardy as bettas.

I hope your mom's betta starts to feel better!


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## Luimeril (Dec 29, 2010)

aaww, don't blame the moss! i have Java moss in with four of my fish, and they adore the things. :d 

i sure hope your mom's fish gets better.


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## Twilight Storm (Apr 14, 2011)

Thank you all for the warm welcome, and all the well wishing for poor Moose.

He is alternately laying on his side or hanging from the top of the water this morning. He did poop overnight and a globe of the fungus? appears to have grown around it at the bottom of the bowl. The skin which I am guessing might be his slime coat? (since there are outlines of scales in it) is still working its way down his body and is still breaking off and floating in the tank. Patches of dandelion-like fuzz is much smaller but on his body still. I wish I could have supplied pictures. 4 other fish died suddenly overnight. Looked at them with a flashlight and they had it on their mouth and gill area. Whatever this is, it appears to spread FAST. Within 5 days it has wiped out all but moose (so far) and a rosey red minnow wintering over in the house.

I will still keep everyone updated, but it's looking pretty grim. I just hope I don't transfer this to my fish. He's my first Betta. I want to keep him healthy and happy for years, but it's scary with all this going on.

Do you think it's safe to put that moss ball out in the bird bath as soon as the weather warms up? or would we be risking birds? Is there any way to disinfect that thing? 

My mom is running around every chance she gets bad mouthing PetSupplies Plus. (who appeared to me, to have a VERY good fish section. Even the betta cups were kept high, away from kid-level and appeared to be very very clean, with beautiful doubletails and crowntails... it is why I bought my fish there.)


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## LolaQuigs (Mar 28, 2010)

Rereading everything, it sounds like this may be columnaris; symptoms include necrosis and the sloughing off of skin, and white fuzzy stuff that looks like fungus. Cottony growth around the mouth and gills is also a symptom, which fits the description of your other fish. Look up the disease online and see if the descriptions match what you've been seeing in your fish. It is an extremely contagious deadly bacteria that spreads very fast. I've never dealt with it, so unfortunately I don't have any advice on how to treat it. All I know is keep his temperature on the low side of the betta spectrum, as bacteria flourish at higher temperatures. Hopefully someone else with more experience will be able to help you out with an actual treatment plan.

I don't know how likely it is that something traveled in on the moss ball; I suppose it is possible that there was a columnaris outbreak in the tank that housed the ball, and some of the bacteria hitchhiked. I've read that you can soak a plant in a diluted bleach mixture in order to kill any nasties on it, so you may want to do that if you plan on keeping it. Just make sure you rinse it EXTREMELY well afterward.


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## FuulieQ (Jan 10, 2010)

It does sound like the 48 hour form of Columnaris to me. I'm not sure how to treat the fast-acting form.  I hope someone comes along that knows.

I soak all my new plants in the diluted bleach solution before adding them, then smother them with Prime to get rid of the bleach. It seems to work really well.


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## StarvingPoet (Dec 28, 2010)

We've had success treating Columnaris "The Fuzz" with API brand T.C. Tetracycline(though I'm sure any brand will work) when we had an outbreak in our tank. If he's having trouble getting to the surface for air lower the water level in his QT jar so he doesn't have to swim so far to the top -we had to do that for a few of ours. Also keeping the temp on the colder end of the betta scale will help slow its growth as well as keeping the light levels low (we covered our QT jars with towels). Keeping him in the dark will also reduce his stress because he'll feel safer hiding. I hope your little boy gets better.


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## Twilight Storm (Apr 14, 2011)

Moose has been on OldFishLady's 3tsp of salt with water changes for a few days now. The first salt treatment caused all the rest of the "skin" to finish peeling off him.

Second day he appeared to have some fuzz still on his body and was laying around the tank. Had to start helping him to the top to breath. He hasn't eaten.

third day about the same

Today is about the same but he comes up to the top now and sits for a while. He has a shiny white gloss on his stomach that goes up his chest under his gills. It is pretty round like he is bloated? 

After this he either falls backwards and floats down to the bottom of the cup again to lay there. He also kind of hangs like a day old fry baby kind of sitting on his back fins to breath. I know this sounds awful, and it is, but he is more active today then he was. 

He doesn't appear to have any fuzz on him now although the shiny stomach doesn't sound right.

(I tried to take pictures again but they came out black. My camera can't take pictures unless I have a TON of light. To make a picture come out dark and blurry I need 6 lamps with their shades removed aiming at what i'm taking a picture of.)

He IS old, like OFL said. maybe the stress of adding the moss ball lowered his immune system enough to let all this happen... The tank they took it out of DID have fish in it. Its painful to watch him like this, but he's fighting it it seems. 

I looked at a bunch of columnaris stuff and im not discounting it, but it doesn't totally fit comparing pictures on the internet either. The high salt treatments do seem to have helped? When all this started it looked like he was holding two BIG pom pom balls made out of dandelion fluff about a day after that ball was added. It wasn't gray, like the pictures of columanaris?

I don't know if another sudden chemical drug treatment will shock him enough to make him die either. He wasn't reacting well to the first salt treatment (gills darkened, but have sense gotten better, thought this was maybe because he never experienced salt in his whole life before, plus all the peeling.) Or to the initial first day of the betta revive treatment.

Didn't add to here daily because there really hasn't been a great improvement, and didn't want to keep bumping this without reason.


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## DarkMoon17 (Apr 16, 2011)

The symptoms do sound like columnaris... I've never had to fight it but people generally suggest using Maracyn-Two for treatment. Good luck with him!
-DM17


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## LolaQuigs (Mar 28, 2010)

I've been reading up, and if it is columnaris, the salt treatment should help. Most websites recommend some sort of medication as well, but you may be right, at his age medications could do more harm than good. If it seems like the salt treatments are helping, definitely continue with those.


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## Twilight Storm (Apr 14, 2011)

Update, since I found two other threads which it seems this mystery fungus has happened to.

Moose has been very weak and it has been very painful to watch him struggle through this. He still hasn't eaten.

Today he is staying at the top of his cup (about 18 oz of water, a little bigger then what they sell Betta's in in the store) He hasn't fallen at all to the bottom of the cup today but is still weak and slow, and I can't see any more of that garbage on him. He is staying horizontal in the water near the top without floating up on his side. He has even slowly started to watch what has been going on around him again.
His water has not been changed yet today, netting him and transfering him to the fresh water usually takes a lot out of him and will cause more stress,(and make him either fall, or float sideways at the top) but he seems to be getting a little stronger. The skin on his face is kind of milky and transparent now, where it was pastel pink before all this happened. It may be another part of his "skin" getting loose? She has him out of direct sunlight in a kind of dim, but indirectly lit part of the kitchen. He hasn't had lights on him at all except what might shine on his cup from having the light on when cooking.

I'm not sure how much the updates help. Would that Betta spa help anything? Or maybe the green tea? (I can't find the thread again I saw on how to use the tea bags though) and would the high salt be safe to use with the tea?

If OFL reads this, I can't thank you enough, Moose has been a fighter and we haven't given up.


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