# Fin Rot & Bloat issues - need encouragement



## skepkat (Aug 23, 2012)

I got Chuck (pictured left) a bit over a month ago. Decided to get another betta. Found a beautiful crowntail (not named yet but will call him ct1 for now). As I was leaving the store I spotted this little guy (ct2 for now). He looked so pathetic I made an impulsive decision to get both new crowntails. CT2 has fin rot - fins are really bad shape. And then yesterday he bloated. 

Info for CT2:

What size is your tank? 2.5 gal
What temperature is your tank? 78-80 degrees
Does your tank have a filter? yes
Does your tank have an air stone or other type of aeration? filter
Is your tank heated? I have one, but tank thermometer reads at 78-80
What tank mates does your betta fish live with? none

Food
What type of food do you feed your betta fish? pellets / flakes & treats
How often do you feed your betta fish? suspended feeding yesterday

Maintenance 
How often do you perform a water change? I've had him a week and done about 3 water changes (Sat & today)
What percentage of the water do you change when you perform a water change? usually 50% (sometimes 25% or 75%)
What type of additives do you add to the water when you perform a water change? Top Fin Water Conitioner

Water Parameters:
Have you tested your water? If so, what are the following parameters?

Ammonia: 1.0 (tap water reads .5 - 1.0 but conditioner says it neutralizes ammonia, chloramine & chlorine)
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: 0
pH: 7.0
Hardness: 50
Alkalinity: 100

Symptoms and Treatment
How has your betta fish's appearance changed? Bloated in the last 36 hours
How has your betta fish's behavior changed? First few days he was lethargic and floating near surface, he had spurts of activity where he seemed to be feeling better, since yesterday most times when I check on him, he's resting on the thermometer or inside his cave.
When did you start noticing the symptoms? fin rot from purchase / bloat yesterday
Have you started treating your fish? If so, how? Trying to keep water clean & added aq salt today (dissolved some in conditioned water, then added some of the water to his tank).
Does your fish have any history of being ill? from purchase
How old is your fish (approximately)? no idea

Is there anything else I can do for him?


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## Bettafish (Apr 20, 2009)

Bloated issues are hard to figure out. Atleast in my opinion.

He could have just eaten to much. 

Thats what i think. If he doesnt reduce in size then it could be a simple internal parasite. Which other members of the forum will tell you how to fix. I dont know what the best thing to do it.im just informing u of the posibilities i see right now 

If posible incluse pictures. they really do help! it just takes a few minutes and can help cure ur betta for years to come


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## skepkat (Aug 23, 2012)

If it helps. Here he is a few days ago and last night.

If it is internal parasites, what is the recommended treatment? Epson salt? Should I replace the aq salt with epson salt? I looked but didn't see it when I purchased the aq salt. I can try another pet store, I assume it would be near the fish meds. Should I go another route? Also, I really worry about him being so skinny. When should I resume feeding? 

He does seem more active this morning. Seems hungry. But still has a tummy bulge. Sometimes I think it is reducing, but on his tiny frame, it still seems way too big.


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## KevinPham123 (Jul 24, 2012)

Hello, I just want to say, don't feed him any more peas. 86 degrees isn't bad at all, ideal is about 84 + anyway. Look for white stringy poo in your tank to confirm that your betta may have internal parasites. DO a 100% water change and acclimate before you put him back in.

Anyone have any advice on the Epsom salt?


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## skepkat (Aug 23, 2012)

Never fed him peas. I don't even have any in my house. I haven't fed him anything since his belly bloated.


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## Alcemistnv (Jan 29, 2012)

For the bloat, I'd say stop feeding for a few days and add Epsom salt. The bulge will go down in a few days if it's bloat, but you want to make sure it doesn't get worse.

As for fin rot, I believe you use AQ salt and just give him clean water every day to every other day.

When he poops, see if you can find out the colorr


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## sunlight (Apr 24, 2012)

Make sure you vacuum the gravel when you do water changes. And you need to swish/wash filter media.
The first picture he is not bloated at all and second picture he is. How much did you feed him? I am personally don't feed with flakes, pellets preferable. And a lot of people on the forum saying it can be cause -bloating. So pellets are better.
Now if you can find frozen daphnia will help a lot if he is constipated.

So there is too reasons he can be bloated: internal parasites or constipation from overfeeding.
With internal parasites his poo will be white or clear stringy,wormy shape,sometimes gray belly. So watch for the poo .
If he is not better after you fast him you need Epsom salt. Also eposm salt will help with bloating and it antibacterial so it also help with fin rot. 

Now very important to find out if he has internal parasites so watch for the poo. If he didn't poo for a few days then it will answer the question. If he didn't poo for a few day then he can be bloated because he is constipated.

So if he is not better definitely start Epsom salt. Do you have hospital tank? Or you can lower the water level so it will be easier for you to treat him.

Pre mix 2 tsp/gall of the epsom salt. Make sure it disolved. You need to do daily 100% water changes. Epsom salt will help to clean out digestive system.
Also really good if he continue to eat. If it internal parasites it easier to get rid of them while fish eating so he can pass them with stool. 
How is your ct1?

Also i would not share anything between your fish just in case it something contagious.


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## skepkat (Aug 23, 2012)

Came home for lunch. He seems more active and his tummy seems less severe. Sucked some brown somewhat poo looking stuff from tank. Will have to wait until after work to search out Epsom salt.


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## sunlight (Apr 24, 2012)

we have Epsom salt at any pharmacy. Not in the pet store though.
brown poo is good. Hopefully he just constipated. Since you saying his tummy looks better.


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## sunlight (Apr 24, 2012)

Just watch and you i am really recommending pellets not flakes. I don't like flakes they also so messy and contaminate the water. And since he got bloated you need to be careful don't overfeed him since some bettas just prone to have this problem.
The more water changes the better


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## Alcemistnv (Jan 29, 2012)

sunlight said:


> Just watch and you i am really recommending pellets not flakes. I don't like flakes they also so messy and contaminate the water. And since he got bloated you need to be careful don't overfeed him since some bettas just prone to have this problem.
> The more water changes the better



Either is good, especially if you have a picky fish xD
As long as neither is filled with fillers, and it should have a high enough protein content


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## sunlight (Apr 24, 2012)

Yes you right, it just i don't like when i watch fish eating it half of the flakes sinking to the bottom of the tank. And if people don't do 100% water changes and it sit on the bottom of the tank, it will discompose in 72 hrs and can give infection. I don't know it just me lol. I am always super careful and always afraid them to get sick 
Also a lot of people on the forum i read saying that it can cause bloating, which i don't know because i don't feed with flakes.


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## sunlight (Apr 24, 2012)

skepkat if he is back to normal and not bloated you might hold on epsom salt. As for his fins if it has ragged edges,tail get shorter...if his behavior didn't change and he is active and eating like normal betta you can just increase water changes to help ...

If he will be bloated then you can use epsom salt and it will help with fins and bloating

Usually if it only fins issue aquarium salt recommended, but again if it mild extra water changes should help. 

It always good to have aquarium salt and epsom salt on hands.


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## skepkat (Aug 23, 2012)

Thanks everyone!! He is getting much better, but camera shy. Best I could do is a reflection. He does still have slight swelling, but not like Monday.

I'm continuing with daily water changes w/ addition of (very diluted) AQ salt. I bought some New Life pellets (which a lot of people on here say is the best).

CT1 is doing well. He often seems pissed, swimming like mad at the front of his tank. I imagine he's yelling at me to give him food. Always he wants more food. Since you asked. I'm attaching a pic of him as well.


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## sunlight (Apr 24, 2012)

I am glad he is better.
aquarium salt has antibacterial/fungal affect.
Also if you add aquarium salt never add non therapeutic dose. It doesn't prevent disease or parasites and long term use can cause resistant pathogens/parasites issues and kidney damage...and long term non-therapeutic dosage can limit it ability to work for treatment when needed. 
So if you think his behavior improve use at least minimum dose of aq salt 1tsp/gall pre mixed with daily 100% water changes. You can use aq salt only 10 days though. In some cases up to 13 days.

Watch his poo make if it still normal color then he don't have internal parasites.
And if his bloating will not go away then you need really Epsom salt. Epsom salt for buoyancy issues,swim bladder problem,constipation...and will help to clean his digestive system

Good luck give us update 

EDIT: his fins looks pretty good


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## Sceven (May 22, 2012)

KevinPham123 said:


> Hello, I just want to say, don't feed him any more peas. 86 degrees isn't bad at all, ideal is about 84 + anyway. Look for white stringy poo in your tank to confirm that your betta may have internal parasites. DO a 100% water change and acclimate before you put him back in.
> 
> Anyone have any advice on the Epsom salt?


I have used ES in a hospital tank (1g no filter heated to 82-85). Get unscented (I know duh but thought I would mention it) and I add about 1-2tsp. You may use ES indefinitely.

I have to remember its AS for outside and ES for inside. The fish that is.

EDIT: 1-2tsp per gallon


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## sareena79 (Sep 10, 2012)

ok question, Im new to all this so Im wondering what the difference is between the aquarium salt and NON-Iodized SEA salt? can it be used in my betta's tank and if so is it only good for filtered tanks or can it be used in an unfiltered one? will I need to change the water more frequently when the salts in there and what is the actual purpose of the salt b/c I hear people talk about it all the time


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## Sceven (May 22, 2012)

sareena79 said:


> ok question, Im new to all this so Im wondering what the difference is between the aquarium salt and NON-Iodized SEA salt? can it be used in my betta's tank and if so is it only good for filtered tanks or can it be used in an unfiltered one? will I need to change the water more frequently when the salts in there and what is the actual purpose of the salt b/c I hear people talk about it all the time


AQ Salt is used to treat external issues, like fungus. Epsom Salt (ES) is used for internal parasites and bloating. It won't filter out so you only add more salt if you change the water. But if you are medicating you should be changing the water A LOT. 

You can use AQ salt for 10 days only, for ES you can use it indefinitely (so sayith OFL)

I hope this helped, I myself am fairly new to medicating bettas.


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## sareena79 (Sep 10, 2012)

good to know...thank u. so basicly Id only need to salt if there were an issue??? my biggest question though is: is NON-iodized SEA salt ok to use or does it specifically have to be AQ or ES?


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## sunlight (Apr 24, 2012)

Aquarium salt (Sodium chloride) for injuries,wounds,external parasite,fin damage/rot (not plant tolerant)

Epsom salt (Magnesium sulfate) for buoyancy issues,swim bladder problems,constipation(plant tolerant)

Both have a antibacterial/fungal effect

Both can be use in doses of 1tsp/gall up to 3tsp/gall depending on what/why you treating. Need 100% daily water changes.
Aquarium salt use no longer then 10 days and epsom salt can be used indefinitely.
It better pre mix in 1gal jug to make correct daily dosage.
Fish better qt in a small container for treatment and maintain a water temp of 76-78F

Not sure about NON-IODIZED SEE salt though. I know rock salt,kosher salt ok NOT table salt though.
And Epsom salt it completely different from aq or rock salt, so if you need Epsom salt then you need to use EPSOM. 
Epsom salt you can find in any pharmacy not at the pet store.
Aquarium salt should be - pet store.


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## sareena79 (Sep 10, 2012)

ok good to know...thanks


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## skepkat (Aug 23, 2012)

Update: So much better. Thank you ALL!! Bloat resolved itself and hasn't returned. He's swimming normal and eats the New Life pellets. He only had about 4 days of aq salt treatment.

His fins seem to have healthy edges now & he's much more apt to spread them out. The fins were severely damaged when I got him - a big reason I rescued him. He is a crown tail. Or at least he was sold as a CT. I'm wondering. A ragged edge doesn't mean CT. Maybe his fins are just that damaged. But the only thing that matters is that he seems to be happy and healthier each day. 

Pictures aren't great, one shows his dorsal fin (makes me hurt every time I see it) and the other shows his tail & anal fin better.


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## sareena79 (Sep 10, 2012)

Im pretty sure u DO have a CT...good luck cant wait to see more updates.


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## sunlight (Apr 24, 2012)

oh good i am glad he is better! Just make sure you don't overfeed him, which is difficult because they always want to eat. And make sure you finish whole course of the salt treatment.
Also i am really recommending to do 1-50% and 1-100% water changes for the tank size he is in. Make sure to acclimate the betta.
Good luck. Give us more updates


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## skepkat (Aug 23, 2012)

Update:

Still a ways to go, but so far so good. Here's a recent pictures....


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## KevinPham123 (Jul 24, 2012)

Looking great!


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## sareena79 (Sep 10, 2012)

definitely looking MUCH better, keep up the good work


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## sunlight (Apr 24, 2012)

looks healthy!!! I love updates


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