# Please help pineconing, not bloated, dropsy????



## eaf2568 (Jul 9, 2015)

PLEASE HELP!!! I have had some recurring issues with my little guy, Paradise. He has gotten extremely pale and lethargic and just sits at the bottom of the tank. I am about to move him into a small 2.5 gal that is a little over half way full. I have an air stone in it and a betta hammock/leaf. I have noticed his scales are pine-coning a bit, but he doesn't appear bloated, so I am not sure if it is dropsy or not. I know dropsy is fatal, but has anyone had any luck in treating it? I don't want to say goodbye to my fishy I've had him for almost two years.
Here's an attached picture.
please help!


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## LittleMan (Jan 16, 2016)

Hello, sorry to hear your boy is ill.
Please fill out this form I have below. 
The moderators & experienced members need to see what your regular water parameters ect....are to help you.
Just copy/paste with your answers ok? 



Housing:
How many gallons is your tank?
Does it have a filter?
Does it have a heater?
What temperature is your tank?
Does your tank have an air stone or other type of aeration?
Does your Betta have tank mates? What kind?

Food:
What food brand do you use?
Do you feed flakes or pellets?
Freeze-dried?
How often do you feed your Betta? How much?

Maintenance:
Before your Betta became ill how often did you perform a water change?
What percentage of water did you change?
Do you vacuum the substrate or just dip out water?
What additives do you use? 

Water Parameters:
What are your water parameters? Please give exact numbers. If tested by pet store please get exact numbers. "Fine" or "Safe" won't help us help you.

Ammonia:
Nitrite:
Nitrate:
pH:
Hardness (GH):
Alkalinity (KH):

Symptoms and Treatment:
When did you first notice the symptoms?
How has your Betta’s appearance changed?
How has your Betta’s behavior changed?
Is your Betta still eating?
Have you started treating your Betta? If so, how?
Does your Betta have any history of being ill?
How long have you owned your Betta? Was he or she ill or suffering some sort of damage when purchased?

PLEASE PROVIDE CLEAR PHOTOS

NOTE: EMBED YOUR PHOTOS. PLEASE DO NOT LINK. Click on "Go Advanced" and then on the paper clip in the toolbar.


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## eaf2568 (Jul 9, 2015)

Housing: Just moved him to a Hospital Tank
How many gallons is your tank? 2.5 
Does it have a filter? no
Does it have a heater? No
What temperature is your tank? around room temperature, I was advised to not use a heater when he first showed signs of his illness to prevent the growth of a fungus or bacteria.
Does your tank have an air stone or other type of aeration? yes
Does your Betta have tank mates? What kind? no

Food:
What food brand do you use? 
Do you feed flakes or pellets? Pellets
Freeze-dried? Bloodworms as a treat
How often do you feed your Betta? How much? Once a day, sometimes every other. Around 3-4 pellets.

Maintenance:
Before your Betta became ill how often did you perform a water change? About once every 1 or two weeks, had a good filter in a 5.5 gallon.
What percentage of water did you change? usually all of it.
Do you vacuum the substrate or just dip out water? Did not have substrate
What additives do you use? BettaBowl, AquaSafe, PHBalance, AmmoniaSafe

Water Parameters:
What are your water parameters? Please give exact numbers. If tested by pet store please get exact numbers. "Fine" or "Safe" won't help us help you.

I have not tested the water yet, I was in a rush to get him into that new tank. I will test today.
Ammonia:
Nitrite:
Nitrate:
pH:
Hardness (GH):
Alkalinity (KH):

Symptoms and Treatment:
When did you first notice the symptoms? About 3 weeks ago
How has your Betta’s appearance changed? Very pale, slight raise to his scales
How has your Betta’s behavior changed? lethargic, still moves if i were to put my hand in the tank, mostly lays on the bottom, sometimes surfaces for air. Doesn't eat much.
Is your Betta still eating? Not really.
Have you started treating your Betta? If so, how? I moved him to a 2.5 gallon, he had trouble getting to the top, so now there is only about 3 inches of water in it. I am reluctant to use medication before I know exactly what is harming him. I have put bettafix in the tank, sadly, I don't think that will do much.
Does your Betta have any history of being ill? He has had his moments, but this is the most serious
How long have you owned your Betta? Was he or she ill or suffering some sort of damage when purchased? I have had him for about 2 years, no he was perfect when I bought him. 

PLEASE PROVIDE CLEAR PHOTOS

NOTE: EMBED YOUR PHOTOS. PLEASE DO NOT LINK. Click on "Go Advanced" and then on the paper clip in the toolbar.[/QUOTE]


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## LittleMan (Jan 16, 2016)

Any chance at any more pictures? Pictures from top looking down onto the body, sideways, the more pics the better.

I'm confused... his regular tank is what? a 5.5 or a 2.5? 

A hospital tank is usually one of those small bins, temporary housing for medicinal treatment. 
*Has he been in the hospital setting for 3 weeks?*

Did he came from a tank at with a filter & heater? 

I'm no expert but "room temperature" isn't a real tangible answer. They do best in a warm environment. Is it cold where you live? 

I'm confused as to why someone give you advice to remove a heater without knowing what could be wrong..... ? That can make them somewhat dormant if its too cold.

Wrap a couple towels around the hospital tank to try to keep some warm in it. 

How long has he been in 3" of water? How often are you changing it? 

Is there a chance you can put him back in his filtered/heated tank and use some decorations to prop him up closer to the surface.?

Did you turn off the filter in his regular tank? That's something no one should do unless the tank is not longer going to be used... it kills off any good bacteria in it.

It may be his "time" sadly, but for the comfort Id put him back in his tank, hopefully the filter & heater is still running in it..., prop up the area for him.
I turn all my decorations on their side so any of mine that are ill can still stay in their environment but closer to the top if they want to go up.

And water change, important to keep the water clean and warm when they are sickly or healthy. 
If you haven't been checking the water parameters and just winging the water change, maybe something in it has developed.

I hope someone can help you but water parameters of the tank he was in is what the experienced members need.


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## Hopefish (Feb 9, 2016)

Changing all the water at once in a 5 gallon filtered tank is not recommended, except in special circumstances, for a number of reasons.

In 3 inches of water, the ammonia is going to spike really quickly.

Sadly, he looks pretty sick. He is an older fish, and they can go downhill pretty quickly.
I'm no expert either, but I second much of what LittleMan has said.

What have you been feeding him? (Brand--)

good luck to you


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