# Breeding Pair issues? : /



## Larsa (May 6, 2011)

I got a blue crowntail female today who is healthy and sorta care-free. Id like her to breed with Ryu, who made a thick bubblenest before I got her. When I introduced the pair I put her in a glass cylinder in his tank. She doesnt show any lines on her body, vertical or horizontal. She ocassionally flares her gills at Ryu while he shimmies at her. Then she swims away. Its like she doesnt care LOL. Ryu stayes in one corner of his tank like hes scared or shy. 

Is there any hope she will lossen up a bit and wanna mate w/ Ryu??? 

All my females dont wanna mate except Sakura (veiltail) : she shows vertical lines and tilts her head down. However, im scared the fry would be ugly or undesirable.


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## Nymmers (May 2, 2011)

You just got her today? She needs to be conditioned first! Or she won't get 'eggy'.


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## Larsa (May 6, 2011)

yeah shes my new baby I got today : ) So when they have lots of eggs, females will wanna mate even if they are kinda stubborn!? I have protien rich foods set for them.  how do I know if a female is full of eggs?


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## 1fish2fish (Sep 10, 2009)

Do you know how breeding works at all? It doesn't sound like you've prepared or researched one bit. Please read the stickies at the top of this board and begin researching the proper way to go about breeding. You don't just stick a female and a male together and they breed and you have fry... it's a LOT of work.


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## Larsa (May 6, 2011)

I have bred before... I aint dumb :/ I have read the stickies a long time ago- im aware. I just wanted them to meet, thats all. No harm in introducing them, especially since I was planning to try spawning the pair in a month. All my pairs before, the females immedietly showed vertical lines, even before conditioning- like Sakura, Nami, and Atsuko for instance. I just can never tell when they are full of eggs or if I fed them too much while conditioning. LOL I just want to know how to tell if a female has eggs and ways to help a pair become more "compatable."

oh yeah, just sayin- it was an ichthyologist friend of mine who taught me how to breed bettas and I have lots of betta books, once specifically on breeding and genetics. Dont say I dont do any research.


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## Oldfishlady (Mar 1, 2010)

The female will have unripe eggs all the time and will either drop and eat them or not or reabsorb them on a regular basis.....once she senses the male her eggs will start to ripen and once the male senses the ripen eggs he will get excited wanting to spawn...this is with healthy fish of Breeding age

You get best results and healthiest eggs/fry when the Bettas are well conditioned...

As 1fish posted and as you already know from past spawns an research you have done....its not as easy as placing two fish together and spawning can be different from one pair to the next and from one spawn to the next even with the same pair....they do love to keep us on our toes....lol.....


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## DarkMoon17 (Apr 16, 2011)

Sorry but when you ask "how do I know if a female is full of eggs" and you are seemingly trying to breed a betta you just brought home our first reaction is that you aren't prepared, no offense. I would have assumed the same thing as 1fish. 

Anyhow, as OFL said, females are always carrying eggs. She might not react to the male if she isn't physically ready (ie, too young, not conditioned, stressed). I find most petstores sell CT females way too young. Is she really small?


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## Larsa (May 6, 2011)

she is about an inch and a half and 7 months old : ) I got to watch my mom's friend spawn and thats the fish lady I mentioned above, she kinda taught me years ago and its been 5 years since. I had one really great sucessful encounter myself but my half siblings liked to kill my fish and the babies died :'( Im really excited because this time I raise the fry without children bothering me LOL


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## datboyhieu (May 28, 2011)

lol gratss man i just got my spawn to hatch today so im waiting to see how many imma end up with but right now its looking like theres 150+


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## bettalover2033 (Feb 17, 2010)

Well it looks like everyone has covered most ground on the topic. I would just like to say that if you bought her just today, then you need her to feel comfortable and condition her for 1-2 weeks to be sure she is in the tip top health and is ready for anything to conquer.

To be honest and try to help you, i would say not to breed (just yet). Only because the female isn't ready and i really want to but just can't believe that you bred before because if you have and know the steps you have to take then you should have known that conditioning is an essential. And if you have been taught how to breed them, then i suggest researching the things that are most essential for breeding bettas.

Please dont take this offensive but i think that you should condition the pair first and go through the steps slower and more carefully.

Good luck and remember we are always here to give you good advice.

P.S: to answer your question, a female does not have to look full of eggs or ("eggy") to be ready to breed.


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## Larsa (May 6, 2011)

I know how to condition Iol. I wish there was a more clear sign their eggs are ready. Good thing this female is very care free about other bettas. I just wanted the two to say hi for a few mins  I wanted Ryu to see her so he can get his groove on a lil. He already made a bubblenest in his own tank since they met. Im preparing the spawning tank and cultures at the moment.


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## Larsa (May 6, 2011)

**set up the tank as in prepare it for spawning next month!! Gotta grow my live plants and then start my food cultures in a few weeks ;P Id never breed them too soon! Makin' it as natural as possible for the lovely couple with almond leaves and all that! 

I named the new girl Amaya, thats for the positive comments and suggestions :B


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## bettalover2033 (Feb 17, 2010)

Are you going to condition the female?


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## DarkMoon17 (Apr 16, 2011)

bettalover2033- from the sounds of it, she is going to condition the female.

Larsa- a female that is properly conditioned is always ready to breed since they always have eggs. That does not mean she is _willing_ to breed, but she is physically _capable_ of breeding. The only time they don't have eggs is when they drop them during spawning (or due to a failed spawning) and then they have eggs again 10 days later. Their eggs ripen when they sense the hormones of a spawn ready male-it can only take a few minutes and happens while they are in the spawning tank together. Don't worry, your girl has eggs. Just prepare her right and if she is willing to spawn, she will.


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## Larsa (May 6, 2011)

Yes thank you I am conditioning her and in a few weeks we will see if she wants to or not : ) I should prolly condition my other CT for back- up. I have live brine shrimp, bloodworms, and daphnia for lots of protien! Also doing a few extra water changes and live plants for her comfort. 

This is out there, but when I first got her I tried to see if she would eat anything else besides live or freeze dried. Petco fed her only bloodworms... :/ Any NLS I try she spits it out along with any other brand pellet food. Shes a stubburn lil one LOL.


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## indjo (Jun 6, 2010)

Larsa said:


> I got a blue crowntail female today who is healthy and sorta care-free. Id like her to breed with Ryu, who made a thick bubblenest before I got her. When I introduced the pair I put her in a glass cylinder in his tank. She doesnt show any lines on her body, vertical or horizontal. She ocassionally flares her gills at Ryu while he shimmies at her. Then she swims away. Its like she doesnt care LOL. Ryu stayes in one corner of his tank like hes scared or shy.
> 
> Is there any hope she will lossen up a bit and wanna mate w/ Ryu???
> 
> All my females dont wanna mate except Sakura (veiltail) : she shows vertical lines and tilts her head down. However, im scared the fry would be ugly or undesirable.


Since you're planning to breed her next month, I wouldn't worry too much. Let her "rest" in her solitary during the conditioning period. When you're ready to breed them, let them see each other and watch how she reacts. If she isn't in a spawning mood, take her out and float her in a sorority or let her flare to another female for a long time. Then rest her for a day or two in a dark place. Then float her in the breeding tank (with the male loose) and see if she's willing to breed (she should by now). If she still isn't responding, try reducing her water .... say 30% and refill with water containing the male's hormones. And introduce them again the following day.

note : I'm guessing you know enough about their body language - the difference between wanting to fight and wanting to spawn/flirt swimming.


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## DarkMoon17 (Apr 16, 2011)

That's interesting Indjo, I've never considered having them flare at another female to get them more interested in breeding. I might try that sometime.

Larsa-You should really get her to eat a pellet food. They are fortified with the types of nutrients you won't be able to supplement with just frozen foods and live brine shrimp. You can try soaking the pellets in thawed blood worms at first to see if she'll eat them or try other pellets. I've never had one turn down Atison's Betta Pro, they love it.


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## Larsa (May 6, 2011)

i have actually tried hiding a tiny NLS pellet in a freeze dried bloodworm but shes too smart for that. I need her to learn how to eat pellets because not only does she lack nutrients but feeding too much freeze dried foods can cause constipation. Someone on another site said to starve bettas for 3 days and then feed them pellets but that seems too cruel for me too do...


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## DarkMoon17 (Apr 16, 2011)

I thought you were feeding her _frozen_ foods. I hope you weren't planning on conditioning her with freeze dried foods, that's a no no. 

You need her to eat pellets during conditioning so she can get those essential vitamins for the eggs. Try fasting her for 2 days or so then offer her some pellets. If she eats those, then you can start conditioning her; pellets in the AM, frozen/live food in the PM or vise versa.


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## Larsa (May 6, 2011)

nooo im feeding her live food not freeze dried for conditioning- the brine shrimp and daphnia. right now she wont eat anything else besides freeze dried bloodworms cuz of petco. :/ I reaaalllyy want her to eat pellets, trust me im trying! My pellets are 50% protien so I really want her to eat them. XD Im scared to starve her for a few days, it feels mean even though its totally nessesary lolz.


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## DarkMoon17 (Apr 16, 2011)

50%? What brand are those? 

Are you offering her the live food right now?

It won't be tough on her to fast her for a few days, but it sure will be tough on you!


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## bettalover2033 (Feb 17, 2010)

Larsa said:


> nooo im feeding her live food not freeze dried for conditioning- the brine shrimp and daphnia. right now she wont eat anything else besides freeze dried bloodworms cuz of petco. :/ I reaaalllyy want her to eat pellets, trust me im trying! My pellets are 50% protien so I really want her to eat them. XD Im scared to starve her for a few days, it feels mean even though its totally nessesary lolz.


Even though it seems mean to fast a betta, but for breeding it is essential to make sacrifices. Also, you may even have to cull some fry that have certain deformities and imperfections. So just keep in mind that these small things are actually an important part.

How is she and the guy doing today?


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## Larsa (May 6, 2011)

Its some variety of NLS. I have the betta formula which is 37% and there is some other one ( growth formula? ) Im at work and not gonna be home until later today so I cant look at it XD. The bettas are fine : ) Amaya is enjoying her new home and Ryu keep making lots of bubbles under his filter, lol. hes practicing  They are obviously in dif tanks far away from each other tho.


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## Larsa (May 6, 2011)

Its weird that someone mentioned female bettas meeting can increase spawning mood because when I was cleaning my living room, I had to move Sakura and Amaya on another table. They saw each other tank-by-tank, flared a lil, and Sakura had pale vertical white lines  lolz bettas are interesting creatures indeed...

Yeah its NLS grow forumla im looking right at it and it says protien: max 50%. Its great for all aquarium fish types but since its not specially formulated for bettas i make it an occassional thing. Good news is I dont need to fast her  she ate 2 small NLS betta formula pellets today!! Im glad she finally gave in. I hope she didnt wait to spit them out after I left the room LOL that would be one sneaky fishy.


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## datboyhieu (May 28, 2011)

u mightt need to stave her bc thats wat i usually do when i get them and they wont eat pellets or anything but freeze dried bw so just starve her for mayb 2 days


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## bettalover2033 (Feb 17, 2010)

i agree that bettas are very weird and interesting fish and have such amazing personalities.


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## bettalover2033 (Feb 17, 2010)

datboyhieu said:


> u mightt need to stave her bc thats wat i usually do when i get them and they wont eat pellets or anything but freeze dried bw so just starve her for mayb 2 days



I have to say, i know what you mean, but "starving" isnt the correct term.

Dont take that offensive it just really bothers me lol. Sorry its just some small things bug me.


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## indjo (Jun 6, 2010)

DarkMoon17 said:


> That's interesting Indjo, I've never considered having them flare at another female to get them more interested in breeding. I might try that sometime.


The basic principle for both male and female is "rivalry"(?). If they feel threatened, some how it drives them to reproduce. Using another female is only to make the "rival" a female so she won't fight against a male. 

I do this more to reluctant males than females; against other males for aggressive ones and against females for the more "chicken" ones. I'd let them flare for about an hour or so.


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