# Internal Parasites



## Kytkattin (May 15, 2011)

Yesterday when I was feeding my boys I noticed that Monet had what I will call 'poopy-butt' because I have rabbits and that is what we call it when they have poop stuck to their bums. Basically he had a long white thing with poop on it. 

I went to Wally World and got some Jungle fizzy dissolving anti-parasite tablets. I broke them into 4ths because it said it was for treating 10 gallons and they are in 2 gallon tanks. Not sure I was supposed to do that, but they seem to be doing fine 5 hours after the fact (I am treating Smaug because there is a good chance that he could be infected too, based on his small poops and the fact that they share everything but the same bowl). 

Now, where could my precious Monet have gotten worms? I recently started feeding frozen brine shrimp, but I thought they were relatively safe. Of course the other possibility is that he has always been infected, it is just now noticeable. His poops have been very large and healthy, but I just don't know if maybe they did come out with white stuff before. 

So this is not really an emergency, but I obviously want to get this taken care of ASAP!


----------



## DarkMoon17 (Apr 16, 2011)

Are you sure the poop is white? How long have you had them and have you added anything new to their tanks recently? Can you fill out the sticky at the top of the disease section for us? That will help us diagnose them better.


----------



## Kytkattin (May 15, 2011)

Housing 
What size is your tank? 2 gallons (per fish)
What temperature is your tank? 78-80 degrees
Does your tank have a filter? A sponge filter.
Does your tank have an air stone or other type of aeration? In the sponge filter.
Is your tank heated? yuppers.
What tank mates does your betta fish live with? None. 2 -2gal bowls right next to each other (but I am trying to get them free of parasites so they can go into a 5.5 split tank).

Food
What type of food do you feed your betta fish? Frozen Brine Shrimp, Spectrum (the tiny crumble with high protein one).
How often do you feed your betta fish? Every day or every other day.

Maintenance 
How often do you perform a water change? Every other day or every 3 days.
What percentage of the water do you change when you perform a water change? 50-75%
What type of additives do you add to the water when you perform a water change? Prime

Water Parameters:
Have you tested your water? If so, what are the following parameters?

Ammonia: Fine
Nitrite: N/A
Nitrate: N/A
pH: I don't test this often, but our tap is always between 6.0-7.0
Hardness: N/A
Alkalinity: N/A

Symptoms and Treatment
How has your betta fish's appearance changed? Poop with white strands holding it together (the poop was normal colored brown, the strands holding the clumps together were white).
How has your betta fish's behavior changed? He didn't want to eat as much today as normal (ate 2 brine shrimp and then went back into hiding).
When did you start noticing the symptoms? Yesterday I noticed the white poopy butt.
Have you started treating your fish? If so, how? The Jungle fizzy tabs from Walmart.
Does your fish have any history of being ill? He has always been a mopey, lazy (lethargic?), miserable fish. I will never pick out a fish based on color instead of temperament! 
How old is your fish (approximately)? Probably around a year when you consider he was 6-8 months at the petstore.


----------



## DarkMoon17 (Apr 16, 2011)

If he has always been "mopey" then he might have come to you with a mild case of parasites. 

Jungle's Fizz tabs should do the job. If they don't then give them a break (1week) and try API General Cure. You can also soak their brine shrimp/pellets in garlic juice. That will make them taste better and garlic has natural anti-parasitic properties. 

Try to throw in a 100% water change each per week long term. For now, do a 30-100% water change every other day and clean the gravel thoroughly to remove eggs.

To be safe, premix the fizz tabs instead of breaking them. Dissolve one fizz tab in 5 cups of dechlorinated water. Use 1/2 cup of the mixture to treat 1 gal of tank water (1 cup per 2 gallons). 

Good luck and keep us posted!


----------



## Kytkattin (May 15, 2011)

I am actually really hoping that he came with parasites and they are not from the frozen food. Then that means I don't have to switch food. Oh, and I forgot to mention that only recently did he start eating normal amounts of food. He loves brine shrimp, so maybe now that is is not subjecting himself to starvation rations the worms got bigger?

Do they sell garlic juice in a little squeeze thing like they do lemons? That would be awesome! 

Hopefully long term (as in 1-2 weeks) they will be moved into a planted/filtered tank. Once this whole thing gets taken care of that is... I was actually going to move them in next week, but now I am thinking I will hold off. Oh well. They don't _need _to be moved until mid August when I move. 

I will dissolve the tabs now.

Thank you for your help! Hopefully he will be doing better in the morning.


----------



## DarkMoon17 (Apr 16, 2011)

I truly wish they sold garlic juice bottles but they don't! The closest thing to that are jars of precrushed/preminced garlic. You'll find them next to the fresh garlic in your local supermarket. You could also crush fresh garlic yourself, it might be more effective that way. I use garlic a lot for cooking so I always have a jar of preminced garlic laying around. It makes life much easier. 

I doubt he got parasites from his frozen foods so don't worry about that. You'll see him acting better soon if he did indeed have parasites. It's a good plan to keep them separate for a bit but I'm sure they will love the new tank! 

Good luck and keep us posted!


----------



## Kytkattin (May 15, 2011)

Gah! Will I do love garlic too, but right now I wish I had a juicer that I could put a few through. I do always have a jar of minced garlic on hand too! It is good in just about everything.

Now I do have a question about the whole treatment thing: How long should I wait between water changes and adding new medicine? It says I can re-treat the tank after 48 hours and a 25% water change. Should I wait that long?

Also, should I up the temp? I thought I had read somewhere that you are supposed to raise the temp for parasites, but maybe that was for ick...

Thank you again so much! I just want my boy to feel better. I would love to see him flare!


----------



## DarkMoon17 (Apr 16, 2011)

When I treat fish in a tank under 2.5 gal I try to do a 100% water each day and replace the whole dose of medication. This is especially important with parasites since you need to remove fallen parasites before they can reproduce. If possible, at least do a 30-50% water change every day where you clean the gravel thoroughly and replace the right amount of medication. You will need to continue treatment for at least 4 days (aka 2 courses) but you might have to do it a bit longer. Increasing the temp will quicken their lifecycle so it would help.

Keep us posted!


----------



## Kytkattin (May 15, 2011)

Okay. I did that. They both ate amazingly tonight. No more poopy-butt that I noticed, but since I fed him a lot hopefully he will poop a lot in the morning. What should I increase them temp to? Right now it is at 79, but I was thinking 82 or maybe even 86 if that would be safe.


----------



## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

Kytkattin and DarkMoon, if you can find it at a LFS, there is Seachem Garlic Guard. Foster and Smith Aquatics also carries it online. The breakdown is:
Garlic extract - 9900ppm
Allicin (active ingredient) - 130 ppm
Vitamin C - 1000 ppm
It works in the same way as garlic juice, soak the food in it. I know one of my LFS carries it so hopefully there will be a store that carries it in your areas.


----------



## DarkMoon17 (Apr 16, 2011)

Thank you Sakura! I saw that will I was looking up Seachem Kanaplax (you might want to look into that too- it treats Dropsy) and I was wondering how it worked. I'm going to my FAVORITE fish speciality store today so hopefully they have both. Some of my fish are "off" right now so I've been soaking their food in fresh garlic twice per day, really time consuming -.-


----------



## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

DarkMoon, I just got some today and it's pure garlic extract. Now my bloodworms smell as bad as they look! And everyone but my sick girl attacked the garlic soaked food so it works! I never once would have guessed fish liked garlic.


----------



## Kytkattin (May 15, 2011)

I will have to pick some of that up the next time I order from them. Which will hopefully be a while since I am broke now... lol. 

So far Monet seems to have perked up a little bit. I did 2 treatments, and now they are in clean water (no treatment). Should I do one more treatment? The box said to do 2-3 treatments depending on what the fish was infected with, but since I don't know what that was...


----------



## DarkMoon17 (Apr 16, 2011)

You'll want to do at least one more course of meds. Internal parasites typically take some time to get rid of. If you have Epsom Salt, you can use 1tsp/gal to help him expel the worms naturally.

Sakura- I found that Seachem Garlic stuff and it is amazing! The fish love their pellets even more now  Their love for garlic has surprised me too! It's really quite strange...


----------



## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

Kytkattin, I'm glad to hear Monet is perking up. Keep on fighting, the two of you will get those parasites whipped in no time. 

I'm glad you found the Garlic Guard, DarkMoon, it makes soaking food in garlic sooo much easier. I'll keep an eye out for the Kanaplax, too, it sounds like a good one to keep in the medicine cabinet.


----------



## Kytkattin (May 15, 2011)

Unfortunately I only have lavender scented epsom salts (well I also have these other plain ones, but they are soooooo old I don't know if I can trust them/would only use them in an emergency). Though apparently brine shrimp might help them go? Which might have been the reason I even noticed parasites in the first place since he would only eat them (I got them about 2 weeks ago and that was the first time since I had him he ate regularly). Now he is eating some of my spectrum crumble.  

I did one more treatment, and will do another in a few days. I get my wisdom teeth out in the morning, so wish me luck with a water change tomorrow (and also, I might be rather out of it so if I post something completely off the wall you know why!). Right now he is actually up at the top of the water cruising around! Smaug flared at him, but he just ignored it (though his back was turned, so I am not even sure he saw Smaug flare...). Just the fact that he is at the surface is major progress. Before he would just lay at the bottom of his tank (not dieing, just... there). 

I am just so happy he is perkier! He is so pretty, I just like being able to see him! Thank you again!


----------



## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

Yup, brine shrimp and daphnia both have a lot of fiber. Daphnia is probably the best but it's so small, I find brine shrimp a lot easier to feed. I'm so happy he's doing better, thank goodness you caught the parasites in time.  

I hope your wisdom teeth removal goes smoothly. I'm hanging on to mine for dear life, bound and determined not to have them out. I think it's because I remember how my brother was after he got his out and I'm like, "No way am I doing this." But then, I hate having anything done with my teeth in general. 

Take it easy, Kytkattin, and don't bend after for a couple hours after you get those teeth out.


----------



## Kytkattin (May 15, 2011)

I just realized that I don't know how to start a siphon without suction. :frustrated:

Water changes are going to be miserable. 

But I am glad to know that the brine shrimp are good to keep feeding for now. I was rushing out the door tonight so I just gave him some spectrum. He didn't even finish it. :-? Going to try brine shrimp again tomorrow evening. Hopefully he is just acting spoiled and wants his brine shrimp. Or maybe he is upset that I put medicine back in the water. 

And I do have a wonderful boyfriend that can help me with said water changes and feedings! So I will post again once I am done with my teeth extraction! :shock: ( <- how I feel right now)


----------



## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

This video should help. Dirty fish water would NOT be good for your mouth after the teeth extraction.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfEBbjKK5xQ


----------



## Kytkattin (May 15, 2011)

Thank you for the video! They will have to wait on a water change until tomorrow morning, but that is okay. I will manage to get the energy up to feed them in a little while. To be honest I haven't even checked on them since this morning before my surgery. Monet was back to his mopey self, but I think that is because of the meds. He should perk up with the water change in the morning.

For now I am enjoying watching various things. Including 1-5 of the Harry Potter movies.


----------



## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

The bright side of recuperation: everyone has to wait on you and you have a legitimate excuse to just lounge around. The downside: your mouth is probably killing you. Hang in there, kytkattin! Hope the pain goes away soon.


----------



## Kytkattin (May 15, 2011)

I got the water changed on both their bowls and their future 5.5 gallon tank. It was not fun, but I did manage to do it and start the siphon thanks to that video!

So far I am doing okay. Most of the pain was last night, I took like 800mg of Motrin. lol. I haven't taken anything today for pain so it is obviously not _that _bad. 

As a side note, I will be making an order from Drs. F and S so I can get the garlic juice! Free shipping on orders over $50, and that puts it right over (I am getting another stunner strip). Anything else I should considering ordering now that I have free shipping? I am positive once I do make my order I will think of something else I want/need, but in the mean time...


----------



## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

The Vita-Chem Freshwater is really good, if you're interested. You add it to the tank to help boost their immune system and speed up healing. And I know what you mean about thinking of something else after you place the order. I just placed my second order in as many days. :roll:

Glad to hear you got through the water changes okay and that the pain is now bearable. I hope your recovery is quick and speedy.


----------



## Kytkattin (May 15, 2011)

Okay, I added that too! It looks like good stuff! I just know I am going to want something else as soon as I order. Urgh! And I find it frustrating that they don't let you combine shipping on dog/cat/bird/rodent/fish stuff any more. I have all of those animals, but it isn't worth $7 in shipping for a $2 rabbit chew stick.

Yes, the pain in my teeth is pretty much non-existent now that I took Motrin again. But I didn't take Motrin for my teeth this time. For some reason I am having severe abdominal pain. I'm a tough girl, but this is just ridiculous! :checkedout:

Back to the original point of this thread, Monet seems back to his mopey self. We will see in the morning when I feed him if his attitude is better. :roll:


----------



## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

I hope so. Maybe he's reacting to you not feeling well? Be careful with that abdominal pain, I don't like the sound of that.  I hope you feel better soon, you and Monet both.


----------



## Kytkattin (May 15, 2011)

Eh, I don't think Monet really cares about me. He is just such an odd little fish. He seemed better this morning when I fed him. Ate a ton. Maybe once I move him to the new, planted tank he will be happier. Still waiting on my IAL to get here in the mail!

I think I might be in pain because I am not eating as much as normal. I have weird digestion on a good day, force me to eat weird foods, and my stomach turns against me! 

So far I have a new light, reflector for that light, thermometer, garlic guard, and vita chem. I think that should be everything but I will probably want something else. :roll:


----------



## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

I'm glad Monet has an appetite anyway, even if he is a funny little thing. Some of them are. 

I hope your stomach settles down soon, stomach issues are no fun. 

I hate waiting for orders to arrive. I check the tracking status every few hours, it seems. :-D


----------

