# African dwarf frogs?



## moodynarwhal (Mar 24, 2016)

So, I have a new 5 gallon (woohoo!) and I sort of want a betta and ADF tank. The 5 gallon is going to have a betta in it whether I get ADF or not, because I have to give my betta in the 1 gallon a bigger permanent home. So I was wondering, could I have 2 ADF with a betta in a five gallon, or would that be too many frogs? I read somewhere that ADF only need a gallon per frog, but that doesn't seem quite right. I've done a little research, and if I decided to go with ADF I would research tons more. Also, do ADF need filters? I've read some conflicting info on this.


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## kjg1029 (Jun 14, 2014)

If I remember correctly ADF's like to have a few buddies so 2-3 would be nice. not 100% sure on what others will say so wait for more advise 
is it heated?
I would filter the tank, and add lots of live or silk plants.

I would put in the frogs and all the decor and equipment in the larger tank and leave it like that for a month or so, that way the tank has a chance to hopefully cycle. I would change the water out 50% every week

goodluck!


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## moodynarwhal (Mar 24, 2016)

It isn't set up yet, but I'm totally getting a heater, it can get cold where I live. The whole filter thing is annoying because while I'd love to filter my tanks, I can't because I don't have enough money to always be changing the filter cartridges. I'm a teen and my allowance is smaller than the cost of the cartridges. :frustrated: I'm hoping that soon I can find a way to make some cash to pay for fish stuff.


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## allied123 (Dec 11, 2014)

Please do some more research on the frogs. There's a lot more to them than just throwing them in a tank and hoping they do fine with the betta. As they don't have scales I do believe they're a little more sensitive to the "fish" in cycling so I do not agree that you should use them to cycle a tank. 

Filters and cycling are pretty important though if you plan on heavily stocking a tank. If you *don't *plan on getting a filter or cycling you shouldn't plan on having anything other than a betta in a 5 gallon as the amount of water changes you would need would be killer. 

You shouldn't be using/switching cartridges very often, that would ruin a cycle (and be pretty expensive, I have never even gotten new media for my filters in 2+ years and don't plan on it anytime soon), there's a ton of information if you look around on this site about cycling and it's usually put in layman's terms so it's super easy to understand.

I have a moderately planted cycled 5.5 gallon that I've had 3 frogs in for just over a year now with no problems so I don't think 3 frogs is too many if you have enough plants as well as a filter and stable cycle etc.


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## moodynarwhal (Mar 24, 2016)

Wait, you don't have to change the filter cartridge if you cycle? That's awesome because I've been wanting to cycle but it's all very confusing. I'm going to do a lot more research, don't worry. I'm not the kind of person to waste a life because I didn't do my research. There's a lot of conflicting info out there, this site has been really helpful with a lot of stuff. I'm going to do more cycling research and a lot of ADF research now.


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## RussellTheShihTzu (Mar 19, 2013)

Read this tutorial. It will be of great help. And, nope, you don't change the filter media until it's practically falling apart. 
CYCLING: the two-sentence tutorial

If it's not in the budget for then Master Test Kit try to purchase a liquid Ammonia test kit and change the water when Ammonia levels reach .25ppm.

Allied is correct: Frogs are too sensitive to handle fish-in cycling. What filter do you have now? Is it large enough to work in a five gallon? If not, go ahead and use it in the five but run the new filter at the same time for three or four weeks.

If you need another filter I would suggest this one. It's very gentle and will not catch an ADF's little legs. It's the type I use in my ADF tank.

Aquarium Internal Filter IF-202


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## MadtownD (Aug 29, 2014)

If you replace those filter cartridges as often as the manufacturers say to, your tank would be in terrible shape. It's such a racket. Of course, you do need to do weekly partial water changes no matter what filter you use. It's great you're doing your research!!


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## moodynarwhal (Mar 24, 2016)

I don't have a filter for the 5 gallon, it isn't set up yet, but now I think I'm definitely getting one! So let me get this straight: I would do fish-in cycling, and once the tank was cycled I would get the frogs and quarantine them for 1-2 weeks then add them to the tank?


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## LittleStar (Oct 2, 2015)

Hi there,
Some great advice already for you here - just wanted to add - I'm sure you are reading all you can about ADF - they shed their skin, pretty much weekly, and from my experience they really require frozen blood worms to thrive. There are probably some other live or frozen insect foods for them but you can't just feed them fish pellets or they will starve. They are not the smartest creatures and feeding them can be a process, you may have to use a turkey baster to put the food right in front of their faces if they can't seem to find their meal on their own. You have to watch their weight and make sure they are not getting too thin. This can be harder to do with fish in with them as the fish may take their food before they have a chance to eat it.

This is also my experience: ADF are fully aquatic and like to hide under things, but like many snails they also like a place to get out of the water. We had a turtle platform that came out of the water just a couple inches at the very top and our ADF were always on it. If you have no way for them to ever get out of the water you may find them floating at the surface now and then. In my view that is a sign of stress. Others may disagree its just my experience.

One more thought - although this has never happened to me I have read that ADF can snap at long fish fins and end up going for a ride on Betta. Something to consider.

We had three ADF for about a year. I would only keep them by themselves personally because in my view they are a lot of work. They were very cute, a great learning experience and I don't regret it for that matter, but we did rehome them, and I would not have them again. 

Good luck, and have fun!


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## RussellTheShihTzu (Mar 19, 2013)

FWIW: ADF are fully aquatic and don't need any sort of platform. They cannot be out of the water for more than a few minutes or they will dry out and die. I would not recommend a platform. If it is not placed properly they can jump out or be unable to crawl back into the water. Floating near the surface is called "Zen" and is natural and not a sign of stress. Google it and you'll find a ton of photos. Don't want anyone with ADF that Zen thinking there's a problem. ;-)

LittleStar is right in that sometimes ADF will take a chunk out of a long-finned Betta's caudal; mistaking it for food. Actually, anything that moves they think is food since, as she noted, they aren't the brightest bulbs in the package and they are terribly nearsighted. I feed mine frozen Bloodworms, Brine and Mysis Shrimp, Cyclops, Daphnia and anything else I feed the rest of my fish. They also get aquatic frog bites and Ken's Five Stick Blend when I'm lazy.

Sand is the best substrate. As others will attest: They can get gravel stuck in their mouths and, trust me, removing it is no fun for either of you.

And, "Yes" to your questions in Post #8.


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## moodynarwhal (Mar 24, 2016)

Thanks everyone, you've all been super helpful! I have one last question: Can I use a small gravel vac with sand substrate?


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## RussellTheShihTzu (Mar 19, 2013)

I use a piece of airline tubing; makes it easier to get in and out of plants. Wal-Mart has the tubing for around $3.00. I buy all of my ADF from a friend in California so there's no need to quarantine. Esmeralda and Clayton are going on three and the other four going on two.


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## LittleStar (Oct 2, 2015)

Zen is something new I had never read about with ADF. Thank you for that very interesting and helpful info! The frogs came from a friends house. They were in a deeper aquarium with other fish and seemed to always be tired and floating at the surface. Thus when we took them in we gave them a smaller aquarium, and a platform. It worked very well. I do know they are fully aquatic, but I can truly attest that they loved the platform and never could have hopped out of their tank because it was covered so they couldn't, not that we ever saw them try it. They didn't get totally out of the water ever, but enjoyed sitting on the platform half submerged often. We even fed them there.

Those three frogs went back to the same friends house in the 5G with platform and they still have them today. Its a bare bottom tank.

Edit: To be clear we didn't force them to be out of the water in any way ever. We merely gave them the option and they took it.


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## moodynarwhal (Mar 24, 2016)

I already have the airline tubing! I think I'm going to start collecting the stuff I need for the 5 gallon and start cycling as soon as I can. Thank you everyone!


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## RussellTheShihTzu (Mar 19, 2013)

moodynarwhal said:


> I already have the airline tubing! I think I'm going to start collecting the stuff I need for the 5 gallon and start cycling as soon as I can. Thank you everyone!


Here's Zen for you. They also sing.  









Image is from _Frogworld.net_


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## LittleStar (Oct 2, 2015)

Thanks for the cute Zen pic and tip! Yeah ours always sang at night when we were trying to sleep lol.


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## Edmund the betta fish (May 5, 2016)

I don't know about frogs but I have 2 nerite snails and my betta attacked them within ten minutes of going in the tank (have had snails for about 4 months they are called Abney and Teal and are so sweet) Edmund nearly took Abney's eye off...however 5 days later and they are fine and he even lets them crawl on his log, think he was just letting them know he is alpha and in charge
Don't know if that is helpful to you but I do think some betta's will not tolerate anything or see everything as a threat ...they are ok now though


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## zuzuu (Mar 29, 2016)

so about how many ADFs could be in a 5 gal? i was thinking of putting 2 in my 5.5 once it's cycled, but would 3 be okay, or too much?


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## RussellTheShihTzu (Mar 19, 2013)

Three would be just fine. I thought I had answered; sorry.


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## zuzuu (Mar 29, 2016)

RussellTheShihTzu said:


> Three would be just fine. I thought I had answered; sorry.


it's fine! i'm on the fence now honestly on what to get as a tank-mate, i'm now considering panda cory catfish :|


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## RussellTheShihTzu (Mar 19, 2013)

Cory are shoaling fish so need a minimum of six; that wouldn't work in a five gallon.

You could do six Habrosus, Hastus or Pygmy Cory but not any of the larger ones.


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## VillagerSparky (Dec 1, 2015)

RussellTheShihTzu said:


> Cory are shoaling fish so need a minimum of six; that wouldn't work in a five gallon.
> 
> You could do six Habrosus, Hastus or Pygmy Cory but not any of the larger ones.


Learn something new every day. I would never have thought Pygmy Corys could stay in a 5 gallon tank.


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## RussellTheShihTzu (Mar 19, 2013)

Yes, Nano/Micro species of around 1" can be kept in five gallons.


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