# I suck at designing a tank for my female.



## IonBaller07 (Mar 29, 2009)

Well I gave up on breeding for a long while, since marina bit of a chuck of snowflakes tail (hes still pretty) and snowflake had nibbled on Marinas dorsal. Then I realized I had kingdra in his own 5g,snowflake in his own 10g, but poor marina was stuck in her 5g with 3 neons and a ghost shrimp :shock:. So I decided I am going to switch marina and the neons with snowflake, so she can have the 10g, but I wan to make it really nice for her since its pretty bare right now. I have a few questions though because basically Im stupid.

1) What kind of live plant is that grass looking stuff, I wanted to put some of that in the tnk because its really cool looking? What other kinds of plants are good in low light (I think it came to 1.5 wpg) and doesnt look terrible. 

2) I want to sand, is there some type of snail/cory that will stir the sand for me, I will still do it occasionally but I dont want to risk forgetting and killing them all, just a little help would be nice. Also so you guys know a way to make dunes or raised spots in the sand without it all falling to the bottom or falling apart.

3) I have a few options as for the stock I will add, I will either a) put in 3 more neons to give them a real shoal for once b) try to make a female sorority in the tank c) go a completely different route with some corys or a blue ram or something (I dont know Im just listing stuff). 

4) Any other tips or cool ideas you guys have? Im basically starting a new tank and want it tobe more creative then my crap other one.

If anything goes wrong or outgrows I could easily aquire another 10g.


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## onekatietwo (Apr 12, 2009)

I have a grass looking plant in mine (you can see it in the tank photos thread) and at petsmart, they were selling it under the name "Java Grass". So far it has done alright in low light. It seems to be dying a bit, but I kind of have abused it by moving it a ton and even putting it in a goldfish tank for a while where it froze and was nibbled on by giant goldfish and a koi. 

Creativity, well, mostly you'll have to come up with that on your own. You can use photos or magazine collages or movie posters as the backround of the tank (though some, myself included, may argue that this borders on the edge of tacky and creative)

Maybe come up with a theme?
I have one with a glow in the dark constellation map as the background, a moon buggy/rover as decorations, and i have ideas for floating planets/balls (anchored to the bottom with fishing line) so it has a space theme. 

Malaysian Trumpet snails are excellent sand stirrers. They reproduce a ton, but supposedly they keep themselves in check as long as your water is good because they won't have enough food to eat to make a billion babies. I've read that this isn't quite true though. Anyway, they're cheap and it's generally agreed that they are great at stirring sand and won't harm your plants much (not sure how true this is)

Elodea has grown REALLY well for me in low light. 

On sand: I've heard that you have to be really careful if you ever want to scrape algae because it stirs up the sand and then it will rub against the glass and scratch it. 

Anyway, good luck. Can't wait for pictures.


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

A female sorority is a good idea, too.


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## IonBaller07 (Mar 29, 2009)

Yah I really want to do a soroity, I was going to breed one but that didnt work, how many females could I have in the tank with 1 female,3 neons, and 1 shrmp?

Ohh, somehow I didnt see your post at all katie, thanks for all the info. I have seen the little packages for that java grass at petco but I never knew what it looked like. I think I will have tall plants in the back and the grass in the front.

Im thinking a Malaysion trumpet snail sounds like a great idea, not only is it pretty but it will serve a purpose.


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

You can have 4 females. I wouldn't do less than 4. The more females you have, the more it spreads out the aggression. Its a 10 gallon tank, right? I think you'd be ok with 4 females, 3 neons, one shrimp and a snail. If you want to know anything about snails, ask Lupin. He's our snail expert.


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## mumzy (May 23, 2009)

> Also so you guys know a way to make dunes or raised spots in the sand without it all falling to the bottom or falling apart.


I would think you could put some rocks on the sand and then put the sand on top to make a little hill..?


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## crowntail lover (Apr 25, 2009)

I think you should go with the sorority!!!


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## IonBaller07 (Mar 29, 2009)

Alright Im going to go setup the tankn today, maybe plants idk if I can find any today. But Im going to get sand and maybe the snail. The bettas will wait but I will probably get the 4 females, I have to get them around the same size right? By the way, is that tahitian moon sand just for marine tanks or is it freshwater safe?


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

I think Lanibaby has tahitian moon sand in her tank. I think there are some pics in the pic section of the forum. I'll have to look it up...

It's the 3rd page of the photo section, the second post down if you want to see pics. It looks really nice and she put some glass gems in it too. Her betta loved it. He kept poking around in it. lol


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## IonBaller07 (Mar 29, 2009)

Ohh I found it that is very nice, do you know if it can grow plants? I dont knowif I would rather have blackor white sand, I guess it will be a "spur of the moment" decison.

Thanks for the help.


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

I don't know if you can grow plants in it or not. You'd have to ask someone who knows about sand. You might pm Aunt Kymmie. She knows a lot about that kind of stuff.


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## IonBaller07 (Mar 29, 2009)

So I got bored again, stupid lack of social life, and decided to draw my tanks plans in MS paint. 









The tall plants in the back are going to be that easy to care plant that starts with an A that escapes me right now.
The short grass stuff is going to be java grass or anything else I can find that looks like that.
The big brown blob is supposed to be driftwood, Im trying to find a piece that arches up like that.
The two caves are going to be formed, hopefully, fromthose two rock formation decors I had in my breeding tank, covered in sand except the front hole.

What do you think, there will probably be more of the tall plants in the back and the grass will probably be bunched more together but I couldnt really shoe that in the pic.


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

Cool pic! I didn't know you were an artist besides a fishkeeper! lol Looks great. I bet your fish will love it.


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## crowntail lover (Apr 25, 2009)

When looking for the females look for small fined and small bodied...These are usually the young ones


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## crowntail lover (Apr 25, 2009)

Its great


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## IonBaller07 (Mar 29, 2009)

Thanks but Im not sure about the whole artist thing, lol.

My Petco has seems to recieve many shipment of those almost baby looking ones, that are probably less than an inch. I was thinking about just getting a bunch of those but I dont know if that would increase tension between them and Marina.


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## crowntail lover (Apr 25, 2009)

Thats what I will be getting...But I wasnt thinking about Marina


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## IonBaller07 (Mar 29, 2009)

Ive also discovered it is very difficult to find sand, neither Walmart or Petco have sand so tommorow I have to look at Lowes and another local petstore.


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

I don't think you can judge necessarily by size, who's going to be the most dominant. I think it's going to be trial and error and you just have to watch very closely and if you see one constantly bullying the others then remove her.


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## IonBaller07 (Mar 29, 2009)

Well I still cant find any sand. Im going to have to keep looking maybe on the internet.

I noticed Aquabid has some nice driftwood pieces, a nice oneon theretoo for just $7 Im waiting for the email on shipping prices though.

I am also disappointed because I found that most grass like plants are medium to high light plants. Would my 15w Florescent be considered low or medium?


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## IonBaller07 (Mar 29, 2009)

Well Ive been kinda busy searching for tank stuff so I missed a few updates but I got the sand, but in the rock formations, and as of 30 mins ago got my driftwood. It was a little smaller than I had imagined/hoped for, but they didnt have any bigger ones with and arch and it was pay by the pound anyway. Heres some pics of how its been for the last few days with just sand and rock caves.
Just sand:








Plus caves:








Now with driftwood and re-arranged caves: (without flash)
















Without flash:

















I realize its not too great to look at but I figure its about what the fish think and not me. Snowflake really likes it though he swims through the driftwood as if expecting it to change each time. Too bad he will have to move out soon. Now all I need is the plants and then the fish, sadly that is going to be the most difficult part.


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## crowntail lover (Apr 25, 2009)

I have my girls!!! My tank is rockin'! haha. I couldnt find sand so I bought royal blue rocks! I have a grass plant along with a huge, tall one that spreads over the tank...I also have Duck Weed on the way...
All of the girls are to small to tell the type...There all red except for the smallest 'GG' (looks like Pearl). I have removed her because of bullying...so! She likes it better anyway! :]
All are doing great!! :]


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## IonBaller07 (Mar 29, 2009)

Ohh you're soo lucky, I have to wait to get my plants still. Im still not sure if I want to do a sorority. I want to, I think, but Ive been looking around and the females arent to pretty around here right now. Ive also been thinking about expanding my fish keeping experience (Ive only owned bettas and neons) but I dont know if Ill ever get the chance to do a sorority again.

Of course right now Im trying to get my mom to buy me a bigger tank. I found a 40g w/ stand and "all the accessories" in the paper for just $30. But she still has to do the "Im a mom you cant have it" thing that all parents do even though they know they will get me it. ;-)


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## crowntail lover (Apr 25, 2009)

lol. You should get the 40g...But the 10 gallon will work if you choose the sorority!
My females that I rescued mine as well be fry!! They are the size of a 7 week old...
Well I dont get that much anymore because of my buying+ I gave her a speech about "I do ALL the work!!! I dont ask you for anything!"
It woked! haha. 
I found a 10 gallon, 2 5 gallons, 3 bowls, and plants in my storage!!! So I will be fish buying soon!!!


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## IonBaller07 (Mar 29, 2009)

Ahh I wish I found that stuff in my storage, my mom used to have a 50g with stand and all the accesories but she gave it away, FOR FREE!!! :evil:
I really wanted tolook for blue ram cichlids but no one around here has any, but alocal store did have corys, dwarf puffers, cherry shrimp, and a bunch of other cool stuff Im now considering.


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## crowntail lover (Apr 25, 2009)

Those puffers are MEAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
What are they fish that you have in with Marina???


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## IonBaller07 (Mar 29, 2009)

Ohh no if I were tog get puffers they would be the only thing in the tank.

Whats in with marina now? shes still with her neons and shrimp in her 5g half. I cant move her into the 10g until I get the rest, cant have her establishing territory especially since shes probably the biggest.


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## crowntail lover (Apr 25, 2009)

Oh good!! But I would want variety........I might get some goldfish! haha
I think I will put three neons in with my girls....They need something else to pick on other then themselves.....


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## IonBaller07 (Mar 29, 2009)

Neons are so pretty, eventually imgoing to set up a nice tank with maybe 10 of them. Thats actually one of the choicesIve been considering for this tank. Few neons and my female.


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## crowntail lover (Apr 25, 2009)

And there not that big right???
Are you still thinking of getting more bettas???


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## IonBaller07 (Mar 29, 2009)

No neons arent very big, well mine kinda are, I think the BIGGEST ones get almost 2" but the average is 1"-1.5" full grownm and mine are coming up on that fast. I just love how sometimes they follow each others moves exactly. And mine like to get under the filter and take it for a ride.

And yes a sorority is still my number 1 choice I just cant stand having more than one option. Takes me forever to choose. You should see me when Im picking out a new betta, I sit there for an hour looking each cup over again and again. Even when I picked out my ghost shrimp who all look the same it took for ever.


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

I take a long time choosing bettas too. lol


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## IonBaller07 (Mar 29, 2009)

Ok so I need some help and its too much for me to comprehend. I have some updates about me finishing the tank with plants, adding 2 MTS (for free), and 3 cories (possibly dwarf) but Ill get into that later. The problem is rightt now Marina hasnt changed shes still in her 5g side with her neons and shrimp buddies. But the 3 cories have now moved into Kingdras side to see if I can get them to eat my algae diatoms, and I moved him into a 1g bowl because I dont know if he'll eat them. Snowflake is still in the future sorority loving life with all his new plants. The things is I want to move my filter into the 10g because its going to have the most life in it, the divided is just going to have 2 males so I figure they can survive with just water changes. But to move that to the 10g Im going to have to move the fish over there, but I cant move Marina because she will establish dominence. So I was just going to move the cories, neons, and ghost shrimp into the tank and leave marina by herself. But I dont know if I should move the cories yet because there is still alot of algae and I dont know if theres any in the big tank.

I know I left something out but I guess the main questions are...
Should I leave the cories in the 5g side eating the algea even though it has a gravel substrate and not much room?

When should I move whom to where in order for this to work out correctly?

I think my issue is that I start thinking Im on a very strict time limit and if I dont get it right everything is going to die, me panicing like this probably makes it worse :roll:


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## IonBaller07 (Mar 29, 2009)

Ok I got everything temporarily settled in so I could do my update.

First here is what my tank has become, has come a long way but Im still not sure if its done. Its still kinda foggy from the sand and the plants werent the cleanest. Also the sandrefelection makes it impossible to photograph.
FTS:








Right side:








Center:








Left Side:









And heres my new little cories:

















I dont know what they are, they dont look like Google's dwarf cories but they are all less than 1" long so they might just be babies, idk. They are going crazy in the tank I guess they are eating the algae. One of them is kinda skinny I dont know if hes the male or if hes just hungry.

Ohh and I found a picture that actually shows Marinas colors:


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

She looks like she's fat or full of eggs. She's very pretty!


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## IonBaller07 (Mar 29, 2009)

Full of eggs, that was taken when she was in her vase for spawning last time.


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

Oh, ok. The cories are cute and your tank looks great.


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## IonBaller07 (Mar 29, 2009)

Thanks, they are so tiny when I look over at the tank I think they are little tadpoles swimming around.

Do you know about how fast they clear a 5g of algae?


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

Yeah, they may be just babies.Cories are fun to watch.


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## IonBaller07 (Mar 29, 2009)

Quick question I dont want to overstock.
Right now I have to go in the 10g w/filter and frequent water changes:
1 betta
3 cories (very small but they will grow, i think)
3 neons
1 shrimp

As far a I know thats not overstocked.

But what if I were to add three female bettas would that be too much. I read somewhere that a 10g could hold a sorority of 10 females, I figured if I replaced 6 of those with neons/cories it wouldbe ok since they are considerably smaller than the bettas. But I could be wrong.

Would it be too much?


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## IonBaller07 (Mar 29, 2009)

So it was a tough decision but I decided not to get the sorority. I asked on UB forums and they said I would basically need to double the plantage to for success and I been reading everywhere how they keep failing and the fish dieor need to be seperated so I decided to just mix the cories neons and my one female. Not that Ive don it Im very glad I did. The corys absolitly LOVE it in the new 10g sandy bottom. On is playing in the filter current the shy one is hiding in his cave and the other is sitting on its roof trying to eat something. The neons are a bit shocked because it was difficult to catch them, I had to chase them for a good 5 minutes (for future reference, I dont think neons can see glass because I was easily able to trap them in a hurricane lantern then put my net under it and scoop them up). Also my males are now in the divided, which I scrubbed out all the diatoms.they both are flaring at each other and look rather healthy. Basically all my tanks are running smooth now and I am happy.

On a side note, should I add any more neons or corys? They are both supposed to have shoals of 6 or more but each have three because theyve been in confined areas, now that there is a 10g should I add more. Tank has 1 betta, 3 neons, 3 cories, 1 ghost shrimp. And I dont know if they are still in there but there was 2 baby MTS.

Also I just sold my paintball gun on eBay for $300 to finance my fish keeping, maybe a new tank in the future.


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## IonBaller07 (Mar 29, 2009)

Another question, my filter flow appears to be affecting them as they were all gathered on the opposite side of the tank. Do you guys knowhow to slow it down some.Its just a crappy whisper filter so its not that strong but still.


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

Would a 10 gallon be big enough for 6 cories, 6 neons and one betta? I would think that would be fine but I don't know much about how many you could put in a tank. If it is big enough, I'd go ahead and do it to give the neons and cories more friends to hang out with.


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## IonBaller07 (Mar 29, 2009)

I dont know really know? haha. I dont think it wouldbe big enough forsixof each since thecories will eventually be 3" each but I thinkI could possibly give one group a few more freinds. If I had to choose which would be better, which species can do better in smaller groups? 

Both are sooo cute though I hope I can get more of both.


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

I don't know enough about them to know whether or not they will do better in smaller groups. Can you move the neons to another tank and add a few more cories?


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