# Thoughts on this male?



## Vizja13 (Jul 18, 2011)

I REALLY shouldn't be considering this...but he reminds me of a Van Gogh painting










What do you think? What would I need to find to breed to?


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## homegrown terror (Aug 6, 2012)

it might just be his posture, but it looks like his spine is curved and poking out to the side...that's not just a show flaw, that's a deformity that's absolutely inhumane to breed, regardless of how beautiful the fish is.

i may be wrong, or seeing things, but it's something to ask the seller about before you make a bid.


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## Vizja13 (Jul 18, 2011)

At the very end, near his caudal? I have to zoom on really close to see it, but yeah I see what you mean


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## valen1014 (Jan 20, 2013)

homegrown terror said:


> it might just be his posture, but it looks like his spine is curved and poking out to the side...that's not just a show flaw, that's a deformity that's absolutely inhumane to breed, regardless of how beautiful the fish is.
> 
> i may be wrong, or seeing things, but it's something to ask the seller about before you make a bid.


If it is a birth deformity, is it still cruel to breed him? I mean.. it doesn't necessarily have to be genetic right?:-?


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## homegrown terror (Aug 6, 2012)

valen1014 said:


> If it is a birth deformity, is it still cruel to breed him? I mean.. it doesn't necessarily have to be genetic right?:-?


unless he suffered a spinal injury (which would probably leave him paralysed) it's almost certainly genetic, and there's a decent chance it'd be passed on.


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## valen1014 (Jan 20, 2013)

homegrown terror said:


> unless he suffered a spinal injury (which would probably leave him paralysed) it's almost certainly genetic, and there's a decent chance it'd be passed on.


Oh I see =[ Well I hope it isn't his case. He really has great colors!


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## Mahsfish (Feb 21, 2013)

other than the deformit looks great. Maybe a few too many ryas, but ice OHM and fins look symetrical.


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## Vizja13 (Jul 18, 2011)

If it helps, I think I found the sibling female...


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## aemaki09 (Oct 23, 2012)

If it were me and I had the money, I'd buy and I'd spawn them in a heartbeat. After finding out if that spine is just the way he looked in the picture or permanent.

Personally, I'm leaning towards him just having been like that for te picture.
What seller is this? If its a more reputable one then I don't think that you have to worry about them going around and selling deformed fish


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## Vizja13 (Jul 18, 2011)

Phusit, I believe. Not on my computer so I can't look it up


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## aemaki09 (Oct 23, 2012)

From what I have seen of his, he or they is or are really good breeders. I would trust that he doesn't have the deformity if its their fish.


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## Vizja13 (Jul 18, 2011)

This is hard xP I really love the colors, and it would be sooo much better than a pair from Petsmart (HMxCT too >.>) BUT it would be almost $100 and I'd be nervous about the spines. 

Someone else buy them and remove temptation!!!


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## aemaki09 (Oct 23, 2012)

Why not contact the seller and see if he can send you another picture of this boy? They usually are pretty accommodating. I always ask the seller for a picture of a sibling female when I am thinking abou buying and they have it to me within a day. I'm sure they would with this male too. (I really like him lol I want you to get him)

Like I said I honesty don't think that this seller would sell deformed fish. I really don't.

It is really expensive to import, which is why I haven't done it yet, but its definitely worth it when you see the fish! 

There are some people in the US that sell imports secondhand. I think hopdiggitty-something on AB does that. So does fishlover007, but he doesn't have any bettas right now. Fishlover007 is actually the importer in FL. Just something to look into if you need something cheaper. I got my avatar and the girl in my spawn log from fishlover, he doesn't get matching pairs so you just gotta look for what woul go with them best with their fish.

There are also a decent amount of good breeders in the US. I buy from chard56 a lot and have only been disappointed 1x and that was because i got DOA's. bettascapes, basement bettas, and polukoff also have some great fish but they aren't the fancy type that you get from importing.


Just some suggestions if you decide not To go this route!


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## Vizja13 (Jul 18, 2011)

I think, actually, that it is only a few dollars difference, US vs. Import. The biggest cost is the US shipping ($35 dollars per box...bleh). I have looked at some of them though, and this is honestly the first fish that has really caught my eye. 

Do you know if sellers sometimes do discounts on pairs? 

Is there any other issue on these two I should be aware of,.other than the males spine?


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## Dragonlady (Nov 29, 2010)

His body shape, finnage, and overall balance is nice. He appears to be in motion in the photo. I would be more concerned if his spine was not flexible. Can you imagine if you could not touch your feet to your head? lol With some work and careful breeding, you could have some very nice tricolor butterflies from him.


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## Vizja13 (Jul 18, 2011)

So he is worth getting? Now just to talk the parents into letting a pair of really expensive fish in the house...


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## MattsBettas (Dec 18, 2012)

Those are so nice. I do not believe he is deformed. If you end up buying and breeding them, can you ship to Canada?


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## Vizja13 (Jul 18, 2011)

If you can help me with transshipping, I'm more than willing to try


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## MoonShadow (Feb 29, 2012)

I like the pair, I too believe he is in motion, and I've seen a lot of bettas who curve their body a bit when they flare. If you are very concerned email the seller and ask for more pictures. Are you looking to breed for show? If so I would worry about the long anals, even the females is a little long and there's a good change they will produce offspring with long anals which is not a trait that will win in shows!


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## Hadoken Kitty (Jan 24, 2013)

Vizja13 said:


> I think, actually, that it is only a few dollars difference, US vs. Import. The biggest cost is the US shipping ($35 dollars per box...bleh). I have looked at some of them though, and this is honestly the first fish that has really caught my eye.
> 
> Do you know if sellers sometimes do discounts on pairs?
> 
> Is there any other issue on these two I should be aware of,.other than the males spine?


Costs WAY more. $20 Thai fish + $5 to get to transhipper. Then $24.40 to get from transshipper to you. $20 U.S. fish, then $15 shipping+handling + $2.00 heat pack.

These are my most recent numbers, as I have purchased from both. Though I bought a $30 Thai fish, and a $35 U.S. fish at one point as well.


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## Vizja13 (Jul 18, 2011)

Oh...well in that case there is a difference. Most of the US fish I've seen (and liked) have been only a $7, or thereabouts, difference from Thai...weird.


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## Vizja13 (Jul 18, 2011)

So would something like this be a safer bet?


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## Hadoken Kitty (Jan 24, 2013)

He's a really nice PK. I like him! He's 4 ray, right? I think I counted that in one section of his branching, though he's dominated by 2 rays so idk...that part I still don't have clear.

Anyways, if you have a facebook, send a request to join Lone Star Bettas. A lot of American Sellers have joined that group and I just purchased my most recent females from a seller who is also in that group (referred to me by another betta lover). Here's an example of the quality. This is the girl I just purchased. White line of bettas.


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## Vizja13 (Jul 18, 2011)

She is pretty O.O Going to join now. 

SO if I can get him and a sibling female, would that be good stock to start breeding from?


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## tekkguy (Jan 28, 2013)

aemaki09 said:


> There are also a decent amount of good breeders in the US. I buy from chard56 a lot and have only been disappointed 1x and that was because i got DOA's. bettascapes, basement bettas, and polukoff also have some great fish but they aren't the fancy type that you get from importing.


I second basement bettas, for what it's worth! Carlos and Sherolyn are awesome. There's a show coming up this month here in Texas, so I'm not sure what they've got ready before the show. I do know that they are spawning my fish's offspring right now, and are expecting some really beautiful fry from that spawn to be ready in about 3 months. For what it's worth!


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## Vizja13 (Jul 18, 2011)

Thanks Tekkguy  I am looking at what's available on aquabid right now, and will monitor for awhile to see if I find anything really eye catching


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## tekkguy (Jan 28, 2013)

Vizja13 said:


> Thanks Tekkguy  I am looking at what's available on aquabid right now, and will monitor for awhile to see if I find anything really eye catching


I noticed when I was "fishing" that a lot of the US breeders are not listing what they have available on AB as much. Helps to just shoot them an email and check into what they have.


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## Hadoken Kitty (Jan 24, 2013)

If it means anything...if I knew the quality of fish that american breeders can give, I would've looked at them as equally as much (if not more) than the Thai sellers on AB. But, yes, if you want to breed PK, then I would get him and a sibling. Just don't rush yourself. You'll know when you really can't stop yourself from starting/continuing a line. I would get an idea of a fish that you want, without pictures, and then look on AB for parents to lead towards that fish. This may mean using siblings, or finding a random pair.


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