# Dead Betta + Worm = ?



## CWolf (Sep 19, 2012)

Today my poor betta died. He was acting all depressed and lying on the bottom when I turned on the overhead light to feed the fish but when I turned it off he would swim around. That was yesterday. 

When I got home from school today, I saw him lying dead on the gravel. He used to be red with bits of white at the tips but when he died his body turned off-white. Also the scales on his head seemed to have fallen off but that may just be a natural. 

Anyways, after I took him out, I was about to do a water change (I have other fish and shrimp in the tank) when I saw this reddish-brownish thing on the bottom that seemed to be moving on its own. I thought it was a long piece of feces at first so I stuck my hand in and poked at it. Lo and behold, it curled up. So I took it out of the water and began taking pictures. After about 5 minutes out of water, it stopped moving so I assume it's dead.




























As you can see it's pretty small. About the diameter of a penny. Also the body was transparent and I could see a red coil in it.

Does anyone know what it is and if it may be the cause of my betta's death? I'm planning to freeze it for now but once I'm done with a school project, I'm gonna put it under a microscope and have a look.

I think my tank may be around 15 liters. My thermometer broke and I haven't bought another but it feels around room temperature. It has a filter. It has an air stone. It has a heater but it's usually not on. I have 3 red Mickey platys, 5 red zebras, 6 glass fish, 4 gold dojo loach, 3 amano shrimps, another male betta (they get along well, sometimes flare at each other but usually keep to their own corners), 1 moss ball and 4 no-idea plants.

I usually feed them micro-pellets but sometimes I thrown in some flakes. They get a meal once or twice a day.

Usually weekly 50% water changes. I add in API Aquarium Salt, JBL Denitrol, and Nutrafin Aqua Plus every time I do a water change.

Haven't tested my parameters but they shouldn't be off the charts what with live shrimps, nitrifying bacteria and plants.

No change in appearance before death. Mopey when lights were on. Didn't eat. No treatment beyond trying to encourage him to swim and eat. He may have had a slight case of ich half a year ago but it was gone within a week. I've had him for a year but I don't know how old he was when I got him.

Now if you'll excuse me, I'll have to go back to typing up a report and sniffing over my poor Red.


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## BettaQi (Jul 26, 2012)

I am so sorry for your sudden loss.


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## BettaQi (Jul 26, 2012)

If it is a leech, it might be the cause. I don't know if they look like that.


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## LadyVictorian (Nov 23, 2011)

odd almost looks like a baby earth worm.


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## BettaQi (Jul 26, 2012)

http://www.google.com/search?q=leec...hl=en&client=safari#biv=i|1;d|bQNXUar6gCARiM:


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## Frazzle (Apr 10, 2012)

LadyVictorian said:


> odd almost looks like a baby earth worm.


Winner. Thats what it be.


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## LadyVictorian (Nov 23, 2011)

dbdfhjfgdjhgh

WHAT IS A BABY EARTH WORM DOING IN A TANK? He's a far cry from home :O

i mean in my garden I see them sometimes but how did a baby earthworm get into the tank? Oh poor thing it must have drown.


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## Frazzle (Apr 10, 2012)

Anyone else have access to the tank? Like a small child?


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## xShainax (Feb 11, 2012)

Does look like an earthworm


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## maycausedeath (Jan 29, 2011)

It sure does look like a baby earthworm
:-?

By the way, I hope I'm not completely butchering the conversion, but doesn't 15 liters come out to around 4 gallons?


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## Olympia (Aug 25, 2011)

Uh, tubifex worm is a more logical explanation. They like dirty tanks/decomposing things.

I'm guessing he died because of the other male betta, not the worm. . .
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LadyVictorian (Nov 23, 2011)

Wow your tank for a 4 gallon is WAY over stocked, ammonia levels likely killed your betta or the other male. They can sometimes get along and then one day rip each other to pieces. I would suggest getting a 10 gallon tank and keeping the surviving betta alone in the 4gallon tank.

Also it does look like a tubifex. How often do you clean your tank? Does it have a filter? Are their live plants?


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## Olympia (Aug 25, 2011)

10 gallons is too small for dojo loach, they can hit 9".
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## xShainax (Feb 11, 2012)

Ew, I re-read the 4 gallon part. Please re-home your remaining fish since you have no idea what you are doing


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## homegrown terror (Aug 6, 2012)

wow, i'm sorry for your loss but that tank was and still is a ticking time bomb. you've basically got the equivalent of a group of cats, rabbits, dogs, chickens and a pair of angry bobcats all being shoved into a seedy bathroom stall and hoping all goes well. if you're serious about keeping them, get at least a 30 or 40 gallon tank for them, and take better care of it. if not, see whether the pet store has a return policy, or sell/adopt the remaining fish on craigslist or some similar site. i'm sorry if this sounds harsh, but it's just the truth.


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## xShainax (Feb 11, 2012)

homegrown terror said:


> wow, i'm sorry for your loss but that tank was and still is a ticking time bomb. you've basically got the equivalent of a group of cats, rabbits, dogs, chickens and a pair of angry bobcats all being shoved into a seedy bathroom stall and hoping all goes well. if you're serious about keeping them, get at least a 30 or 40 gallon tank for them, and take better care of it. if not, see whether the pet store has a return policy, or sell/adopt the remaining fish on craigslist or some similar site. i'm sorry if this sounds harsh, but it's just the truth.


+1. I thought I was being a little harsh


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## PaintingPintos (Dec 27, 2011)

xShainax said:


> +1. I thought I was being a little harsh


+1 as well


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## LadyVictorian (Nov 23, 2011)

I agree, those poor things are living in a tiny box of doom. 4 gallons o.o that's only enough for ONE fish, that's smaller than my tank. Mine is a 5 gallon and that still is a small tank. Just so sad. If you can't I would be happy to take your remaining betta off your hands and give him a good home. I have an empty 10 and 20 gallon tanks and I was going to buy a 2.5 tank for a baby anyways. Plus I have some spare stuff from Aquarius that he no longer needs now that I am upgrading his stuff.


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## homegrown terror (Aug 6, 2012)

just a quick reminder that (apparently) cannot be over-stressed:


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## Jully (Aug 7, 2012)

The other betta could of killed it, and you probably didn't properly care for your betta and the levels got higher killing your betta. Please, do a 100% water change and start over and you cannot put 2 male bettas in the same tank without it being divided, and a 4 gallon is way to small for 2 bettas.

That worm does NOT look like an earth worm, it's very off from a 'earth worm look' and how the heck would an earthworm climb a tank and go in it? They prefer to say in soil and would never be in a tank unless put in there, so it's something else.


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## Olympia (Aug 25, 2011)

It's a tubifex, Jully.


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## CWolf (Sep 19, 2012)

Sorry. Gave bad info. I was thinking in terms of water changes. It's actually a 30 -ish liter tank. My bad. Also I have a large-holed mesh net in the middle of the tank that's not big enough for the bettas to swim through so I doubt a fight was what killed him.

I have been thinking of rehousing the loaches since one of them have grown 7cm long. The rest are all 3-5cm though.

I've had a look at some tubifex pics and they do look like it. Where did it come from though? The only worms I've fed the fish with were the freeze dried bloodworms that were in the flakes. BTW the flakes are Nutrafin MAX.

Also I like an over-stocked fish tank as much as you guys, which is to say not at all. All the fish, except loaches and betta, are under 2cm in length so it's really not that crowded.


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## Olympia (Aug 25, 2011)

Honestly I don't get where they come from. Maybe eggs in the tap, that's what I've always thought (yummmm). Just clean out the gravel really well next time, there might be more in there. (don't rinse it, stir it up in the tank or something).
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LizzyP (Jun 21, 2012)

As for the OP: it's not so much size I'm worried about, it's ammonia levels. Have you tested it lately? If so what are your results? I'm sorry about your fish, but two male bettas CANNOT be housed together, especially in that size tank.


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## SpookyTooth (Dec 23, 2011)

I'm sorry for your loss, it's never easy losing a beloved animal.



CWolf said:


> Also I like an over-stocked fish tank as much as you guys, which is to say not at all. All the fish, except loaches and betta, are under 2cm in length so it's really not that crowded.


 
As others have highlighted, your aquarium is rather overstocked. Whether 15 litres or 30 litres (4ish gallons or 8ish gallons) the majority of your fish would be happier and healthier in larger accomodation. The number of animals an aquarium can handle isn't so much in the length of each individual occupant but rather the amount of waste they produce and their activity level, schools also have to be considered if the fish species is one that likes to live in a group -- not to mention feeding habits.

In an aquarium of 30 litres I would say your other betta and the amano shrimp could live happily without any issues (when provided with regular maintenance) but the platys, zebras, glass fish (glass catfish by chance?) and loaches could all do with being in larger homes. I know that this will not account for the mystery of your worm (though I'm glad to see it's been identified) it may have contributed to your betta's passing and may also contribute to future deaths if something isn't done soon. Large numbers of fish in a small body of water will cause vast amounts of ammonia to be produced (again, this varies depending on species present) and you may find as time goes by your nitrifying bacteria simply can't keep up. You can only have so much bacteria in one tank and it may end up just not being enough.

All fish are sensitive to changes in their water chemistry, some more than others. Glass catfish are a prime example of this and can die very quickly if something goes wrong -- luckily you'll be able to tell if something is starting to go wrong as similarily to ghost shrimp your glass fish will turn less transparent and become a white colour, I just don't want it to get to that stage for both your sake and the fishes'.

If you are at all able to rehome or upgrade the other fish into other aquariums (I imagine they could all live peacefully if kept in larger quarters with an appropriate filtration system, fully cycled) that would be superb but I understand that sometimes we're in a fix and struggle to house things bought for whatever reason (whether it be lack of knowledge on fish store staff's part, impulse buying or a myriad of other reasons). If you struggle, you may be able to get away with temporarily keeping the platys with the betta and shrimp -- not something I'm usually recommend due to the platys' activity levels and bright colours but if you can compromise and monitor your fish carefully you should be able to avoid any more deaths.

May I ask how long these animals have lived together? I know that sometimes fish can get along wonderfully (or seemingly wonderfully) for a while then suddenly snap and things start going wrong, I also know that stressed, unhappy or unhealthy fish can coexist simply because they are too stressed, unhappy or unhealthy to do anything about it.

I wish you the best of luck and hope all goes well in future.


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

I think it is more likely some kind of nematode. Tubifex only grow in polluted waters such as sewers, which is one of the reasons why feeding live tubifex is discouraged - they're chock full of disease. It would seem that upon the betta's death, a nematode crawled out in search of a new host. This could possibly be an adult camallanus worm, although I haven't seen one get that big before.


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## Olympia (Aug 25, 2011)

I think that's bloodworms? Hmm.
I've seen a few aquariums with tubifex, always overstocked, if the gravel is dirty they'd be there. It looks just like tubifex, are there red nematoda?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

Camallanus are red. Could be a bloodworm. If it is a tubifex, I'm not sure how it got in there unless via live feeding or perhaps on the roots of a plant.


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## sunlight (Apr 24, 2012)

sorry for your loss
I am wondering what is the next step. Should she clean whole tank? Rinse everything in the tank?How to make sure it will not happen again? How to clean the filter? And i am wondering if you ever wash your filter? You need to wash your filter regularly and vacuum the gravel regularly. Watch fish make sure not symptoms will develop. I personally would do 100% water change.

And sorry for saying it just one more reason that i hate to cycle i love 100% water changes which removes all debris from the bottom of the tank which not possible to do with vacuuming. But i understand you can't do it for big tanks though.


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## Olympia (Aug 25, 2011)

Don't camallanus infect fish?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

Olympia, yes, they do. They're crazy hard to get rid of and also crazy contagious. This is why I'm wondering if the worm crawled out after the host died, in search of a new host.


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