# Breeder's Lounge



## Spazzfish (Feb 12, 2012)

Welcome fellow breeders! 
I have been thinking we need a place to just chat so BOOM! Breeders lounge!
ok, for the sake of keeping conflict down I have made some "rules".
*Rules*
•*Please Reserch Before asking Questions* Some very smart people took alot of time making those stickies! Use Them!!!
• *Do Not get Offended by Advise* _ For example: when some one says "that fish has a long anal fin" they are not saying "that fish is ugly" they are just trying to help 
• *Be Nice! * if some one is being jerky report them to a Mod _


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## Spazzfish (Feb 12, 2012)

this is my hmpk male from karen, he is a nice red and green marble (very christmasy) my goal for him is to keep that color around his edges and pass that down to his kids.


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

Is anybody else waiting for the shows in the next upcoming spring and fall seasons? I am certainly going to show in fall with my salamander HM's at the show in midlothian especially... And I'll be showing my salamander HMPK's in the spring season


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## Spazzfish (Feb 12, 2012)

I've got my eye on spring season! New breeder is going to be competative!


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

Yep. Mr. Vamp, you, sincerely, and I are all going to be showing in new breeders spring and fall seasons


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## Creat (Dec 6, 2010)

Hopefully my yellow salamanders will be ready in spring  I want to send them and my multis that are growing out now it will be my first show.


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## Spazzfish (Feb 12, 2012)

Who is going to convention? Its instate this year so i can actualy go !


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

The convention already happened... Do you mean the one in 2013... If so.. then I'm going


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## Spazzfish (Feb 12, 2012)

Well, derpety  derp! Yeah, I ment 2013!


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

Yeah, it's in like... February, right? Or is it in June?


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## Spazzfish (Feb 12, 2012)

It was in june this year. Idk if they changed it.


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## Enkil (Jan 15, 2012)

I wanted to join and start showing... But I only have one baby left from my spawn. >> I don't even know how he/she managed to survive. I had thought the entire spawn had failed since I saw no movement. So I left the tank alone for a while while I was getting over being sick. Cleaned it the other day and found a lone surviving fry. Moved him/her into a 10 gal. Not risking pictures. I am only bothering him/her for feeding and water changes. I think the little one has been through enough stress for now.

Needless to say, I wouldn't have anything ready for the fall. That pair is going into the spawn tank again, but I'm just not sure. Maybe next fall I'll be more comfortable.


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## Spazzfish (Feb 12, 2012)

Sorry to here that Enkil. Hopfuly it goes better the next go round!


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## Enkil (Jan 15, 2012)

Thank you.
It should. The last one failed the way it did because I became so ill that getting out of bed was beyond me. While I was sick, we got some very hot weather. My spawn tank got to the triple digits before I could get to it. The fry did not take the increased temperature well at all.
The temperatures have been a little more stable now and I bought a fan just for the spawn tank in case the temp rises too high again. Plus I'm feeling much better than I was.

My MW cultures seem to have failed since my spawn crashed. I'm ordering more on the 1st so I will be putting my pair back into the spawn tank once I have my new culture. I have other foods, but I would feel better having the MW as well. All my tanks have at least some infusoria plus I have a culture of it going. Also going to get a snail to help keep the tank clean.

At the moment I'm working on a HMPK line starting with a yellow dragon and a yellow marble. I also have HM dragons, other HMPKs, a marble HMDbT, and a giant. Going to work on a line of giants and half giants. Looking for the right fish to import since I can't find what I want in the states.


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## Spazzfish (Feb 12, 2012)

What all are you feedin? Microworms alone have been known to cause missing ventrals. Mo has some banana worms and micros for sale


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## Enkil (Jan 15, 2012)

I use infosuria and MW at first. I also have BBS and mosquito larvae for then are big enough for them.
I'm making sure to get my cultures from more reliable sources than the last time. I have one ordered already. Will probably look for more since I know how big of a spawn these two can produce.


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## MrVampire181 (May 12, 2009)

Micros don't cause missing vents. Bacteria on the bottom does. Ergo, feeding micros = prolonged exposure to bacteria.


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## Spazzfish (Feb 12, 2012)

MrVampire181 said:


> Micros don't cause missing vents. Bacteria on the bottom does. Ergo, feeding micros = prolonged exposure to bacteria.


Wow, didn't know that! What do you feed Mr.V?


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## MrVampire181 (May 12, 2009)

I was feeding micros but I can never keep em alive -_- 

I feed BBS from the get go well into adulthood. Then live daphnia and pellets


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

BBS, Vinegar eels, Microworms, and banana worms


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## Spazzfish (Feb 12, 2012)

Hey, what lines are you guys working on?


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

Right now I am currently working on salamander lines. Both Halfmoon and Halfmoon Plakat. The HMPK's are dumbo's. I am working on weaving the dumbo gene out of this line. Dumbos are considered a major fault. I might actually not show in september because my dumbos are the only fish thatll be ready by then. I plan on showing my HM's in october. Specifically the show in midlothian, Tx


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## MrVampire181 (May 12, 2009)

White HMPKs, metallic multis (this line throws mostly red copper), red dragons, masked blues, and I want some multi HMs and black HMs.


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## Creat (Dec 6, 2010)

Yellow salamander HM 's are my project and I am perfecting my multi hms who this spawn just decided to marble so we will see what they look like.


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## Enkil (Jan 15, 2012)

I'm working on:
yellow dragon HMPKs
marble HMDbTs
dragon HMs
and Giants

I also have some other HMPKs to work with.


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## Sincerely (Apr 22, 2012)

I am working on a Royal Blue/Turquoise HM Line but I had some blue marbles from the spawn so I may start a line of those. Lastly, I have a blue/yellow metallic HMPK line I will be starting soon once my pair comes in this week ;-)


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## Spazzfish (Feb 12, 2012)

I am going to be working on:
a multi Hm line
a green/red marble hmpk line
and a blue marble Dthmpk line


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## tpocicat (Aug 8, 2011)

I want to work on a multi HM line and salamander HM, if I can get them to breed that is....
I have one beautiful blue HM male I thought was a butterfly, but the white is actually clear! What would you call that? I might show him. I have a couple of females I might show in fall too.


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## Anitax3x (Aug 26, 2011)

I'm starting a Halfmoon blue/turquoise line, and also am taking on a Green/marble hmpk line. My final pairs come in this week! So excited!!!


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## Spazzfish (Feb 12, 2012)

Do you like large spawns or small spawns or maybe those right in the middle?


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

My roomie brought in the mail two weeks ago and my microworms were left without anyone telling me sooo... I have no mw culture. Again. So angry  but I got decap bbs..

I personally would like larger spawns. To me (or maybe just for me) there is more chance of more living fry plus more to choose from if line breeding...

I think I will be working on CT first... Though I think my CT gal has a long anal fin... My CT male has a short caudal (hopefully that'll even out lol). One fry I have is a shaggy bkue VT from my male and vt female... Now I found a CT girl so I hope that goes well.


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## Anitax3x (Aug 26, 2011)

to even out the long anal, you'd need a male with a nicer shorter anal. 
At least thats how much I know. My first spawn is starting in 2 weeks. Conditioning right now. VERY excited


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

Spazzfish said:


> Do you like large spawns or small spawns or maybe those right in the middle?


Definitely large spawns... More of a challenge and much more fun. My first large spawn was eaten by damselfly/dragonfly nymphs


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## Anitax3x (Aug 26, 2011)

Mo said:


> Definitely large spawns... More of a challenge and much more fun. My first large spawn was eaten by damselfly/dragonfly nymphs



How did that happen?


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

Anitax3x said:


> How did that happen?


I'm not sure /: it was around one hundred and somehow a bunch of mosquito larvae, and all of those nymphs got in my tank... Now I just have 30 and I transferred them to my other CLEAN fry tank. We live out in the country so its not a suprise


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## Anitax3x (Aug 26, 2011)

Ohhhhhhh I see. Thats interesting. I guess It really is important to keep the fry tank covered! Where they indoors or outdoors?


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

Indoors. Had a hood. And cover... I just don't know how they got in there


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## Spazzfish (Feb 12, 2012)

Thats freeky!


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## tpocicat (Aug 8, 2011)

I prefer a medium sized spawn. Easier to take care of than a really large spawn.


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## Anitax3x (Aug 26, 2011)

That is CRAZY! I'm glad some survived though. What pair are they from your dumbo ear pair?


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

Yep.. The female perished in the spawn tank though along with another male...here's a recent pic of the male


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## Anitax3x (Aug 26, 2011)

I'm so sorry to hear that mo! 

Is that male still alive?


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## Oldfishlady (Mar 1, 2010)

Mo said:


> Indoors. Had a hood. And cover... I just don't know how they got in there


I have intro dragonfly and damselfly nymps by accident in my inside tanks when feeding mosquito larva....I think and this is just my theory......that it was their eggs that I added since I know what the nymps look like and remove them before I feed.

In my outside spawns I leave the male and female for that matter...lol... and they usually take care of any predators. I don't have any problems with either of the breeding pair eating the fry and I want to get multi spawns. I do move the larger fry to a grow out bucket or bring them in the house-just depends on the plan....


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

Yep. He's still alive and I'm going to breed him again tomorrow or today with a female big ear HM


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## Anitax3x (Aug 26, 2011)

Oldfishlady said:


> I have intro dragonfly and damselfly nymps by accident in my inside tanks when feeding mosquito larva....I think and this is just my theory......that it was their eggs that I added since I know what the nymps look like and remove them before I feed.
> 
> In my outside spawns I leave the male and female for that matter...lol... and they usually take care of any predators. I don't have any problems with either of the breeding pair eating the fry and I want to get multi spawns. I do move the larger fry to a grow out bucket or bring them in the house-just depends on the plan....


You make it seem so effortless it really is awesome!


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

Oldfishlady said:


> I have intro dragonfly and damselfly nymps by accident in my inside tanks when feeding mosquito larva....I think and this is just my theory......that it was their eggs that I added since I know what the nymps look like and remove them before I feed.
> 
> In my outside spawns I leave the male and female for that matter...lol... and they usually take care of any predators. I don't have any problems with either of the breeding pair eating the fry and I want to get multi spawns. I do move the larger fry to a grow out bucket or bring them in the house-just depends on the plan....


Thanks for the info OFL!


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## Anitax3x (Aug 26, 2011)

Awesome Mo! keep us updated!!!

Edit: your fish album is AWESOME!


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)




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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)




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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

Aww. Cute.


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## Anitax3x (Aug 26, 2011)

How awesome  Those fry look great ! I am excited to start breeding. Have my fry foods ready and I'm going to be setting up the spawn tank soon.


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

Thanks!


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## MrVampire181 (May 12, 2009)

My blues are wrapping as we speak. Last time she just dropped the eggs and he placed them in the nest but now they're actually embracing. I love this pair!

I'm getting a black dragon on Tuesday from Lori of Overcoppermoon to breed into my lines. He's amazing and Lori wants his genes secured before I send him back.

I get my pair from Karen next week as well! 

I'm waiting for Bettascapes to grow her blacks and then I'll have those as well!


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## Anitax3x (Aug 26, 2011)

Awesome mr V! Your opaque hmpk juvis are gorgeous! Are you entering them into the show?


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## inareverie85 (Apr 18, 2008)

Im getting a pair from Karen, too!

Beautiful butterflies :* That pair and another MG female.

So excited.. 

And on top of these, I'm getting a beautiful marble girl from Linda's personal collection of girls. She's.. breath-taking. Im hoping she compliments some of the boys I have coming from Ploybettas. 

I need to start buying spawn tanks.


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## Anitax3x (Aug 26, 2011)

Karen's fish will make you so happy! They look better in person! I love butterflies! The female I just got was a beautiful blue butterfly. 


I got my spawn tanks recently bc petco had their dollar per gallon sale. So I went and bought a 10 and 2 20 longs. I found a 30 gal tank on CL for $20. I think I may be spawning in the 20 long instead of the ten to help from having to move the fry at an early age. And then move them to the 30 at a later age. I have first up my HM spawn, Followed by an emerald green/marble HMPK spawn  

Try going to goodwill or thrift stores too. I found tons of jars there for like $.25-$50 cents each. I think I'm just going to end up buying deli containers. I really have to get started on a barracks system for my males. I've been slacking!



Question to the fellow breeders. How do you create your barracks? How much does it generally cost? I have Ideas for low cost but I'd like to see what you guys have and how you did it!


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Someone here really wants a black crowntail... So now I am on the hunt lol. Same with a yellow pair... So many plans =D


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

Dom, are your fish back home now?


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## PitGurl (Feb 22, 2011)

I'm jumping in a bit late but I currently have a very small breeding set up due to my current living situation. I'm looking at buying my first home soon, going to talk to the mortgage lady on Tuesday :-D. Once I'm in my own place (crossing fingers and toes) I'll be able to breed on a larger scale. My hobby name is Serendipity Splendens. I have 2 main breeding pairs with a couple back ups. My other bettas are just pets.

Right now I have five 11 week old HMPK fry. Sadly I had some issues with this spawn which is why I ended up with such a low number of fry. The parents are from Karen Mac Auley. That spawn, http://www.bettafish.com/showthread.php?t=101487 I'm hoping to show a couple of these guys this fall in the NB classes. 

My next spawn planned is a DT/HM spawn. You can see the pair here,
http://www.bettafish.com/showthread.php?t=105991 The female is from Karen and the male is from Bettascapes. I'm worried the male is going to be to small to wrap the female so I may end up using her brother who is the male in my avatar. I also want to get a pair of Karen's MG HM's. I love the green multi's that pair produced.


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## Enkil (Jan 15, 2012)

Still have my one remaining fry from my yellow dragon HMPK x yellow marble HMPK spawn. He/she is being tended and fussed over. Not brave enough to take pics and risk stress yet.

Going to order more fry foods next week and try again.


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## tpocicat (Aug 8, 2011)

Enkil, can't wait to see your little one..


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## PitGurl (Feb 22, 2011)

HMPK juvies flaring at each other for the first time...


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## Enkil (Jan 15, 2012)

tpocicat said:


> Enkil, can't wait to see your little one..


Thank you. ^_^ I'm doing everything I can for him/her. He/She has a nice 10 gal to himself. He/She eats well so I have hope for him/her. Found someone to buy some more cultures from on AB that has really good reviews. Conchenn is so full of eggs that I have my fingers crossed on how this next try turns out.


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## Anitax3x (Aug 26, 2011)

Just got my hmpk pair :-D

Here's the link to the thread. 

http://www.bettafish.com/showthread.php?t=108664


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Hmm I should see if my may 10 baby will flare :lol:


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## Spazzfish (Feb 12, 2012)

What are your breeder's homes like? I have mine in 1.5gal shoeboxes that you for 978 with a great deal of live plants


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## Creat (Dec 6, 2010)

Same as you. Hopefully barracks as soon as I get the design right.. or at least a drip system


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## Enkil (Jan 15, 2012)

My breeders are in big tanks. >> With live and silk plants along with other decorations and heaters. Some of my tanks also have filters.


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## choob99 (Aug 9, 2010)

I keep all of my males in their own 10 gallon tanks, females all go in a sorority, i am considering splitting my 10 gallon tanks and keeping a male in each side but haven't decided yet, but space is an issue when each has their own 10 gallon tanks! lol


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

All my breeder females and males are separate in 10-20 gallons or females are divided... All with heaters, live plants like java fern, java moss, frog bit, etc... Gravel at the bottom and a cave of some sorts. Plus a heater unless they are in the fish room which is at 84 degrees minimal.


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## Enkil (Jan 15, 2012)

My fishroom is also my bedroom. XD Being in Oregon and living upstairs... Lately the room has been in the 80s and 90s. I have the heaters set at 80 for when the day starts to cool off.
Have more females coming in for breeding and a sorority. If Conchenn doesn't take to sorority life, she will get her own 5 gal.


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## Anitax3x (Aug 26, 2011)

Right now my breeders are in 1-2 gal bowls in a heated room with live plants and no substrate. 

The ones I'm not conditioning are in their own tanks while I get a barrack system set up in my room


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## inareverie85 (Apr 18, 2008)

I got my first two girls in!!



















They are even MORE lovely in person! Wow! I don't know which could possibly be my favorite!

The blue marble girl from Linda is gorgeous, though a bit timid right now. 

The white though, oh my GOSH is she confident! She seemed completely unfazed by the acclimation process. Most of my Thai fish take some time to become accustomed to my water, and they hate the drip. She flared at it a few times and swam around like she already owned the place  I think she'll be a great breeder!


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## MrVampire181 (May 12, 2009)

Them whites are kicks. I miss my pair Q_Q But you'll love working with them!


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## inareverie85 (Apr 18, 2008)

She's SO big, too. Reminds me of Karen's girls. Lol

Better be sure I have a beefy guy to wrap her. 

Ill take some photos soon.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

That's the problem with bothbmy imports... Small males and I have mainly beefy females lol.


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## tpocicat (Aug 8, 2011)

My males all have their own 5g tank, filter and heater. No substrate, java moss and a small pot sideways for a cave. My females are in my 30g and are kept as a soroity with substrate, real and soft plastic plants. Of course it has it's own filter and heater.


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## indjo (Jun 6, 2010)

I'm glad everyone is having fun .... it keeps me going. 

I've had a number of bad luck, starting with bad water source which I didn't realize until the second week. I've lost almost all but 2 of my spawns (SB x black orchid from black drg - blue drg and traditional blue black x blue from royal blue - blue drg half giants). Although I've change the water with mineral water and have been changing with more mineral water since the second week, I'm still losing one or two daily. 

I was working on half giant drg, mainly breeding for size and form. Didn't care much about the color. And for regulars, was trying to create SQ SB which is kind of hard - the SB always have poor form, IDK why. So I crossed them to better formed females of different colors. Later I planned on crossing the half giants to the SB.
Not sure if I'll continue my quest .... depends on the remaining fry (all are 2 -2.5cm aged 8 weeks - very slow growth). 

Most of my adult breeders are still lethargic. I guess the damage was too severe to fix. I may be losing 2 more half giants, as they now refuse to eat anything, including ML. I only have 1 worthy regular male (actually he is a runt from a half giant spawn). I don't have any adult females small enough to breed to him (regardless of form). I've lost all but 1 male SB adults but he is lethargic and rather poor quality. So, no more breeding for me until 2-3 months.

Sorry if this sounded more like a rant than a breeding plan.


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## inareverie85 (Apr 18, 2008)

I bought this girl a few days ago, so that I have two white girls. 










She's not as great as my other white, but I think she's definitely very nice.

Also, I'm sorry, indjo, about your water issues.  That really stinks.
I hope your breeders bounce back though!


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## Sincerely (Apr 22, 2012)

I keep my boys in divided ten gallons, heated, filtered and stuffed with Christmas moss. My breeder girls are kept in their own jars and when they are retired they join the sorority.

I am sorry to hear about your bettas Indjo, I hope the rest of them pull through. I have had a problems with my municipal water and no longer use it because of the grief it has caused me. R/O water reconstituted with minerals for me!


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

I have to be careful when acclimating... I will be moving to well water so it will be different.

But I decided I may retire Ricky the CT and find a wider spread male (since he may have pk in his background plus his tummy is a perma-eggy look LOL his baby took after that..urg!)

Awesome thing is I now have four 10s, six 20s, a 40 and an 80 plus a 5. I have room. ;-)
I plan to find an HM pair a doubletail pair (imports are so... Short lived!) and a couple CT ladies and a CT male. When I move I shall post pictures... Well, more pictures.

First is Dianne who is a mean broad... Pk lady who I would like to breed to Altair my PK male.

Second and third is Candy my marble CT lady. Red-wash purple, white, yellow-green and light blue =D


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## Thomasdog (Jan 26, 2012)

Hi everyone!

*Still* searching for a female for Sparta. He's about 7-8 mo old now, and I found these 10 week old red girls for sale on the bettafish.com facebook page. Her colors are still coming in, but I think they might be a good match for Sparta. I'm asking for pics of the parents so I can see how their form looks, but here are some pics.
What do ya'll think?

Sparta: <3
















The possible wives:
















And their bros:










Thanks!  Just wanna have a sucessful first spawn! Hoping to get red HMs.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

I think they may balance each other out...


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## Thomasdog (Jan 26, 2012)

DDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD
Did I FINALLY find a match???!?!!!!!???!!?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!???????????????

Pros?
Cons?


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Not sure but the female caudals are not as full... The male's anal is a bit off as well (to me)


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

defaults on the male are excessive and uneven branching
long anal
shaggy fins
spoon head

females
round caudals
skinny dorsal
uneven branching
long anal


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## Anitax3x (Aug 26, 2011)

I agree, His fins are really shaggy and His anal is much too long for my taste. I would find a female with balance, Straight caudal edges, and a broad dorsal. 

I don't know if I would breed him IMO. He needs alot of work to improve. I know for sure I wouldn't use that female as she wouldn't help balance him out.


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## Sincerely (Apr 22, 2012)

Hate to disagree with you Mo but my critique of the boy and girl are abit different ;-) 

The boy only has a slight spoon head, something that can easily
Be resolved. His anal fin is long so it will require some work but he has a pretty nice dorsal, long first ray but the width of the base could be improved. His branching is slightly excessive thus leading to ragged fins. I would find a girl who has less branching and more webbing in between to help reduce his. With his coloring he has a slight iridescence on the body which can be difficult to remove. It may take a few generations to get rid of it completely. Overall he isn't a bad boy, long anal fins run rampant in HM's especially imports.

The girls are not flaring so it's difficult to give accurate critiques on them. If
I were to choose between those two girls would say female number 2. Dorsal width needs improvement but she has a long first ray. Her anal fin is not long, it has a good rectangular shape to it and is level. I cannot give you an accurate critique of the caudal because she is clamping it but it has sharp edges which you want in a girl. IMO a red DT female would be your best bet for this boy but finding a quality one before he becomes too old may pose a challenge. 

Just my thoughts on the pair ;-)


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

sorry. im still learning standards about females..


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## LittleBettaFish (Oct 2, 2010)

Well after my first successful spawning attempt with the below fancy HMPK pair ended up being not so successful after all (eggs weren't fertilised, I haven't tried my hand at breeding since. 










However, I have since sold off some of my fish and have purchased a nice looking OHM fancy male who I will be hopefully crossing with the female in the picture above. Hoping for some nice fancy marble HM females out of this cross and if all goes well I intend on breeding them back onto the original male who is sibling to the female. 

Also why does everyone have this thing about their imports not being long-lived at all? I've been seeing it a lot recently on this board. Over 90% of my bettas are imports from Thailand and some of them are amongst my oldest and healthiest fish. I found I had more deaths and problems with locally purchased stock than I do with my imports.


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## indjo (Jun 6, 2010)

@Thomasdog; Your male has excessive rays. Look for females with less rays (4 rays) because you risk creating severe roses. Sorry to sound negative.

For future picture; try getting a picture while they're "defending" or holding their stand ... when they "attack" the dorsal will lean back, thus the actual form is not shown.

@Sincerely; Thank you.


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## Thomasdog (Jan 26, 2012)

Hmm... so a red DT for him or a few branched female. I AM going to breed him. The problem is going to find a girl for him. I know that I am going to have to work and it will take time, but I know that eventually Sparta's children will be ledgendary. I imported him, and he is a OHM and has some extra branching, but with a good female, the spawn won't turn out too horribly. Plus, he's better than A LOT of males out there. Not trying to defy your opionion and valuable help (I hate it when people do that), but I'm going to breed Sparta, Anitiax (sry I spelled your name wrong!!  ) I appreciate your opinion and advice, but it is my first spawn and I'm not trying to shoot the moon on my first try.  Of course, the atmosphere is much closer, so I'll aim for that!  Eventually, with a lot of work I'll have a shooting-the-moon spawn of children. So I need a female so I can reach the atmosphere first. 


Eek I hope I didn't anger anyone. :/ 
-Thomasdog


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## Thomasdog (Jan 26, 2012)

Oh and another thing:
What is so bad about rose/feather tails? Are they just a genetic disformity, and can't be showed, or is there something AWFUL HORRIBLE TERRIBLE wrong with them? Just wondering, I've always thought they were pretty, but as a new breeder, I don't want to do anything durastic/wrong. :*(


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## Sincerely (Apr 22, 2012)

Mo, I totally understand about learning female conformation, it took me awhile to get a good grasp on it. ;-)

I wanted to mention this as well, it is VERY easy to point out the faults on a fish but I want to challenge people to find all of the good points on fish they critique (Even if a fish is a mess they usually have something good about them). It is just as important to point out the good as well as the bad in a critique. This is NOT directed at any person in particular, but I have been noticing when members are giving critiques they are not telling what is good about the fish, only their faults.
This isn't about fish but when I showed my dog I knew each and every fault on her and she is not a perfect specimen of her breed, no fish is either so that is why you work towards improving them in future generations.

Anyways, that is just my two cents about critiques, continuing onwards **Inhale for dramatic effect** 

**Booming, thunderous voice**YOUR CHALLENGE OF THE WEEK: is to list all of the good points on a fish! Faults should be noted and what can be done to improve form, not just a list of imperfections because that doesn't help a new breeder learn what they need to look for. Each good critique gives you a little star sticker on your chart ;-). *Giggles* But no really, it helps to teach you better the conformation of betta forms.

I can't wait to see the spawn log LittleBettaFish!~I love reading all spawn logs, it seems I learn something new from each one.

Your Welcome Indjo!


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

good things about this male 








Nice Topline
Sharp caudals
outward facing anal fin
outward facing dorsal fin
fins line up almost perfectly
doesnt have excessive branching and isnt a rose tail
nice thick ventrals
nice marble coloring
only cost me 45 bucks :-D


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## Creat (Dec 6, 2010)

Just got some new boys from mn bettashop!  I had to interupt the convo. Lol. I asked my significant other to order them and he orders the yellow hmpk for the yellow salamander line I am working on ( the ONLY one I asked for) and two others lol. A copper hmpk for himself and a surprise multi hm for me who is very patriotic. There still aclimating better pics of when they are feeling better. Yes I will breed them and the copper is stunning he flared once for me and I drooled XD 

Edit: PICS


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## Sincerely (Apr 22, 2012)

Thomas, Rosetails/Feathertails have not just effect on the fins but the overall health of the fish. If you continue to breed for excessive branching you soon start to come across something called Extreme Rosetail. Here is a picture of one,










Their scaling is generally very misaligned and poor. As you can see on these girls its awful.

Rosetails also seem to grow slower than their regular counterparts,









(Eight Week Old Halfmoon)









(Eight Week Old Rosetail)

Once you have rosetail in your line it can become very difficult to get rid of it. 
The reason I would not breed for RT is because of the chance of extreme rosetails, it is almost cruel to those fish to have such scaling and deformities in your fry and culling very hard would have to be done in order to keep a RT line clean looking without becoming extreme.

Awesome job Mo! *Places little gold star on chart* ;-)

Can't wait to see your pictures Creat! I will be breeding my HMPK pair soon after they have conditioned for a few more days. They are already flirting and seem ready to go but I am not! :lol:


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## Sincerely (Apr 22, 2012)

Dumb question but I cannot find the source of this answer for some reason.

What are the inches needed for a fish to be show size? Isn't it like 1 1/4 inch of body for a girl and 1 1/2 for a boy?


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

1.25 inch for females and 1.5 inch for males


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## inareverie85 (Apr 18, 2008)

Just want to chime in and say that I approve greatly of your assignment, Professor Sincerely  Haha.


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## Sincerely (Apr 22, 2012)

Thanks Mo! I forgot which thread it was on. Some of my females have gotten a SERIOUS growth spurt the last few days and now I have a few who are show size :shock: 

I seriously didn't even notice it until I was changing their water this evening and I was going "Who put these females in the grow out? Wait... :brow:" I hope to see the rest of the fry hit their growth spurts soon.

Hee, Ina I wanted to suggest something which could be fun. It really came from when my mom would say to me and my brother when we would argue and insult one another and she would say "You are really good pointing out one another's flaws now give each other just as many compliments." It was very hard for us to do LOL.

P.S. Just call me Sensei Sincerely  (LOL I am kidding, I thought it was funny :lol: I still a lot to learn myself)


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## inareverie85 (Apr 18, 2008)

Senseirely?!


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## Sincerely (Apr 22, 2012)

LOL, that is hilarious. But to veer this thread back into the right direction, I have a question to all breeders ;-)

What color do you think is being the most neglected in improving color? I believe it is pastels. You hardly ever see a good pastel anymore, I would love to start a pastel line but I would need to find some fish first.


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## inareverie85 (Apr 18, 2008)

I love pastel blues.

Aren't there blue cambodians out there? Or have all the pictures Ive seen been fake?

I think that coloration is amazing, and Ive never actually seen one for sale.


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## Anitax3x (Aug 26, 2011)

I have never seen a blue or turquoise cambodian. That would make me drool!


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## bettalover2033 (Feb 17, 2010)

Yes. There are blue cambodians out there. I'm actually working on a line of HMPK blue Cambodians.;-)



inareverie85 said:


> I love pastel blues.
> 
> Aren't there blue cambodians out there? Or have all the pictures Ive seen been fake?
> 
> I think that coloration is amazing, and Ive never actually seen one for sale.


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## Thomasdog (Jan 26, 2012)

Thanks Sensi! *hugs* 
You make me feel better (indirectly of course)

Ya'll do know that I am quite afraid of you? It's true, I repect higher power and HATE getting in trouble. Even on a computer screen to people I have no idea who they are. Which is why I only want to do good things for my fish, and for you. But I love Sparta. The end. <3 <3 <3


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

Blue cambodians are beautiful.


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## Anitax3x (Aug 26, 2011)

I'd LOVE to get my hands on one! That would be fantastic!


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Hmm what has been most neglected for improvement... Cambodians, pastels, solids (no flaws are hard to find), and getting a rich yellow is rare in my area.


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## indjo (Jun 6, 2010)

Yes, rose deformities are difficult to breed out.
@Thomasdog; you don't need a HM female. Just pair him to a delta with 4 rays but has pointy caudal edges - never mind the rest of her ..... if getting a "perfect" girl is currently impossible for you. Sometimes you have no other choice but to breed imperfect forms (before the male gets too old) ........ Just keep in mind that you need to breed the pair a couple of times to get as many of his genes as possible. Then choose a few of the best pair and breed F2. Cross breed the F2's ..... and so on.

If you do breed to an "imperfect" female, you may have to cull hard - raise hundreds but only keep 10 at most. Either sell or cull the rest. But if you're lucky enough to find that perfect female, your work will be much easier.

Solids are not neglected. They are very difficult to achieve ..... specially the past 2 years. ..... I mean true solids - one color on the whole fish except the head which is usually black/dark brown. Even a pair of solids produced by "luck" will not produce 100% solids.


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## inareverie85 (Apr 18, 2008)

Is there a way to get Blue Cambodians without having them already as breeding stock? The more I think about them the more I sort of want try them. Finding a pair though would be problematic.


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## Thomasdog (Jan 26, 2012)

> Thomasdog; you don't need a HM female. Just pair him to a delta with 4 rays but has pointy caudal edges - never mind the rest of her ..... if getting a "perfect" girl is currently impossible for you. Sometimes you have no other choice but to breed imperfect forms (before the male gets too old) ........ Just keep in mind that you need to breed the pair a couple of times to get as many of his genes as possible. Then choose a few of the best pair and breed F2. Cross breed the F2's ..... and so on.


 *stalks aqubid* THANK YOU INDJO!!!!!!! So a delta would be an almost HM, right? Which would probably produce HMs becuase Sparta is an OHM? Or at least we could get pretty close. Then spawn a few times, get the blood out, the cross the best F2s, to get a good result.
So look for a red Delta/HM/DT? (I though I heard someone say Dt...?) Have 4 branching, sharp caudal edges(what does that mean?). 



> Solids are not neglected. They are very difficult to achieve ..... specially the past 2 years. ..... I mean true solids - one color on the whole fish except the head which is usually black/dark brown. Even a pair of solids produced by "luck" will not produce 100% solids.


I like solids!  Perhaps I should try to sting a line of red solids with good confirmation? That would be a good goal for me to shoot for. Your right, I hardly ever see pure reds, its usually cambos and mostly marbles/mixed coloures. 


Thanks, everyone! 
-Thomasdog


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## Anitax3x (Aug 26, 2011)

Delta is like hm but with less rays, making the spread less than 180 degrees  

I think it was me who said DT lol to make it easier, focus on a nice lil delta female. You don't want to let your male sit and never breed as indjo said. 

This looks like a great project if you're willing to do the work!  No fear! You can do it!


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## indjo (Jun 6, 2010)

Imagine the edges of a perfect half circle - they should be pointed, not rounded. These faults (round edges) are more obvious in short fins.

Your guy is too gorgeous to not be bred. Though I never limit the age of my breeders, yet I wouldn't chance the good ones not breeding due to old age.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Omg have fun breeding him. I cannot wait to breed Ricky the CT to my marble CT. Took forever to find a female.

Btw for solids I have only seen ONE true red and he was Sasuke the rescue VT


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## Thomasdog (Jan 26, 2012)

Yay! You guys are awesome. Now I shalt be hourly stalking every single betta sales website I know. And I am willing to get a good, true, red HM line going. With work and dedication, I know I can do it! 

Thanks for the good lucks, Sparta is a total character and breeding him is going to be.... intersting. 

-Thomasdog
PS - Is it possible for fish to get narcolepsy? Because I think Sparta has it....... :S He just randomlly falls asleep and then wakes up and is totally normal. It only lasts for a minute or two but..... oh well, we'll figure it out!


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## Spazzfish (Feb 12, 2012)

I am pretty sure this guy is the definition of a near perfect dthmpk


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## Thomasdog (Jan 26, 2012)

ohhh Spaz, GORGEOUS!


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## Anitax3x (Aug 26, 2011)

Spazz what a dorsal on that boy! I'm in love lol


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## Spazzfish (Feb 12, 2012)

Karen snuck him in my box! He was bred by seig.


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

he is beautiful!


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## choob99 (Aug 9, 2010)

Blue Cambodian is very hard to find, i'm not even sure what I would use to try and get some, also total solids are getting more and more rare, a true yellow is almost non existant anymore as well. So is this supposed to be a challenge for us all? lol I would love to work on a blue cambodian line, no clue what I would parents I would use to start the work


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## bettalover2033 (Feb 17, 2010)

Well I believe I will have a true Blue Cambodian HMPK line that will breed true in a matter of 2 or so years to perfect it to the fullest. As well as a solid royal blue line.


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

im hoping to have my dragon and salamander lines going with marbles as a side project...


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## bettalover2000 (May 10, 2011)

I will be doing a very small experience project this year with my 2 VTs. Then I really want to breed chocolate CTs.


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## Anitax3x (Aug 26, 2011)

Mo said:


> im hoping to have my dragon and salamander lines going with marbles as a side project...
> 
> View attachment 61178
> 
> ...


That last male. OH MY! 

All your fish are gorgeous Mo!


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## Oldfishlady (Mar 1, 2010)

Thomasdog said:


> *stalks aqubid* THANK YOU INDJO!!!!!!! So a delta would be an almost HM, right? Which would probably produce HMs becuase Sparta is an OHM? Or at least we could get pretty close. Then spawn a few times, get the blood out, the cross the best F2s, to get a good result.
> So look for a red Delta/HM/DT? (I though I heard someone say Dt...?) Have 4 branching, sharp caudal edges(what does that mean?).
> 
> 
> ...


Here are some nice Betta imports already in the US with fair shipping...
AquaBid.com - Auctions Offered By Hopdiggity


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## inareverie85 (Apr 18, 2008)

I've be really interested in breeding Blue Cambodian HMs, but I would have no idea where to start.


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## bettalover2033 (Feb 17, 2010)

There is a blue Cambodian here on the forum. Probably an F1 though considering it has only partial blue color on his fins With the Cambodian body.










The owner is batmantha.


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## Thomasdog (Jan 26, 2012)

OFL!
They are sooo pretty! Sadly, hopdiggety dosen't have what I need at the moment :*( 
Thanks though!!!! I am totally in love them them! <3


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

One thing I have never learned is well water... Is iron bad for bettas or causes problems for breeding? Lol I have lived in cities so it never occured to know.


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## choob99 (Aug 9, 2010)

I add an iron supplement to my plants in my betta tanks and haven't had any problems, don't know what the actual answer is though


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## LittleBettaFish (Oct 2, 2010)

If it is a commercial fertiliser like Seachem Iron the actual iron content is usually very low so it might not be an equal comparison. I am not sure on the iron front causing any problems but I'd recommend checking it out further.

Well I finally threw my fancy HMPK pair back into the spawn tank. Female is so much more assertive this time around and is barred up and ready to roll. Male has been in a breeders' net for ages now in another tank and looks like a completely different fish (not in a bad way). 

Fingers crossed I get fertile eggs this time around. If not I am going to break down and cry. They are such a lovely pair and really compliment each other well.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

LittleBettaFish said:


> If it is a commercial fertiliser like Seachem Iron the actual iron content is usually very low so it might not be an equal comparison. I am not sure on the iron front causing any problems but I'd recommend checking it out further.
> 
> Well I finally threw my fancy HMPK pair back into the spawn tank. Female is so much more assertive this time around and is barred up and ready to roll. Male has been in a breeders' net for ages now in another tank and looks like a completely different fish (not in a bad way).
> 
> Fingers crossed I get fertile eggs this time around. If not I am going to break down and cry. They are such a lovely pair and really compliment each other well.



Thanks choob too 

And good luck littlebettafish!!


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## LittleBettaFish (Oct 2, 2010)

Well they are spawning sporadically. Not sure if they actually know what on earth they are supposed to be doing. Female swims under the nest, wraps with the male, they go down and look for non-existent eggs, female loses interest and swims off, realises male is there and the whole cycle repeats itself haha 

Even my virgin wilds were less awkward than this and this pair has done the deed before. Male gets one more chance before I switch him out. If that doesn't work will have to use my other female.


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

24 day old Betta fry


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## MrVampire181 (May 12, 2009)

BL2033... that's a grizzle.


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

Mr. V is right


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

a true cambodian woldnt have those black discoloration splotches on there body


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## inareverie85 (Apr 18, 2008)

Tony has some lovely DTs this shipment.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

From my May 10 spawn. This little fella has gone through a move lol so he does not have the color he usually does. Blue fins  and grew fast!!


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## Anitax3x (Aug 26, 2011)

inareverie85 said:


> Tony has some lovely DTs this shipment.


Yes he does :shock:


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## inareverie85 (Apr 18, 2008)

I received my second white girl today, and the seller gave me a second white female for free! And she has pretty nice form, too! 

Now I have three white beauties with no boy for them. Hehe. But I'm SO happy. Watching these girls swim under the lighting is so mesmerizing.


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## Spazzfish (Feb 12, 2012)

I have two marble boys who need white females!


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## tpocicat (Aug 8, 2011)

:evil:WARNING!!!! I've sold all the bettas I needed to find homes for. All was going well, until one of my buyers told me all four of the bettas she bought from me were sick and soon died. They were shipped Priority and I explained she didn't have a live arrival guarantee because I only give that with Express shipping. She says since they all died, they had to have been sick before I shipped them. I then told her that none of my bettas share water except for my females, and she had bought two females and two males. Now she has taken her complaint to Paypal, and they have frozen the money she paid me, even the already spent shipping money! Now I have to wait (I guess) for Paypal to decide who is in the right. I think they got hurt by rough handling in shipment.:evil:


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## VictorP (Jun 5, 2012)

That's horrible! Hope all is well.


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## tpocicat (Aug 8, 2011)

VictorP said:


> That's horrible! Hope all is well.


Thank you, BTW, I forgot to add, all of my bettas are healthy, no sign of sickness anywhere.


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## inareverie85 (Apr 18, 2008)

That's just terrible. Paypal has a nasty habit though of always siding with the buyer and not allowing the seller much of a chance..

I hope this is resolved in your favor.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

That SUCKS. Sorry but the BUYER has to know there is a risk in shipping. They also are informed of policy... Such as live arrival or not which you did. People are just....urg!


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## VictorP (Jun 5, 2012)

Some people are just like that. Can't help it Lol


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## tpocicat (Aug 8, 2011)

Thank you all for backing me up. Even if I lose this thing I know I'm right, especially since all of my bettas are still healthy! I'd question myself if even one came down sick. Oh well thanks everybody.


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## Spazzfish (Feb 12, 2012)

Muwahahahahahah got 4 15g bottles of atison's betta pro in the mail today along with someother goodies! I have enough bloodworms to feed a betta army!


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

where from? I want some too!


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## VictorP (Jun 5, 2012)

Same! Do the ship to Canada?


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## tpocicat (Aug 8, 2011)

Where did you get it Spazz?


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## Spazzfish (Feb 12, 2012)

I have my ways...


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## tpocicat (Aug 8, 2011)

I got my last order from IBC, is that where yours came from? I thought they were all out.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

shaaaaare :lol:


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## tpocicat (Aug 8, 2011)

:lol:^A+


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## VictorP (Jun 5, 2012)

^(x2)A++


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

Natasha. Did Carlos give them to you? I thought so since he gave me some atisons and Bloodworms. He only gave me 1 container though. He gave me a whole bag full of bloodworms.. Or did you draw another picture for Karen?


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## Spazzfish (Feb 12, 2012)

I got my ways thats all I am saying
moving on!
I am getting ready to breed my multi pair! Might look for a nice triband to see what i could get...


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

I ghinknit comes from the IBC.


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## Spazzfish (Feb 12, 2012)

No blake i din't get it from carlos and i diidn't draw another picture for karen I've been doing commistions and don't have the time!


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## Enkil (Jan 15, 2012)

So happy it is the first! Waiting to be able to get to a store and then going to be sending out payments for the lovelies I have on hold and get some more fry food.


This boy will be going into my spawn tank:








He doesn't flare for pictures, but he has a full 180 spread with sharp edges.
The female is a yellow marble HMPK carrying the double tail gene.
I have spawned the pair before. I still have 1 left from that spawn. Heat got to them. I now have a fan for the spawn tank should the temp here spike again.

I have a second spawn tank that isn't being used yet. Going to be getting some new girls. Will be letting them settle in so I can see how they all do before I pick another pair to condition.


@tpocicat:
I'll definitely be doing Express shipping. Not going to take any chances with the girls I'm getting from you. And once they get here, I will try to get pics of them and their new home to share with you. ^_^


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## tpocicat (Aug 8, 2011)

Thank you so much Enkil! It always makes me happy when people pay Express. The fish have a much better chance getting to their new homes in good shape.


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## VictorP (Jun 5, 2012)

Cool! Dthmpk babies lol


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## Enkil (Jan 15, 2012)

I tend to do express because I'm a worrier. The last girl I picked out from you will be taken special care of. I think she'd make a nice cross with my Frost.

At some point, I'm going to try the female I'm spawning with my yellow dragon with my marble HMDbT male.


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## Spazzfish (Feb 12, 2012)

He guys what food do you feed your fry and at what age?


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## Spazzfish (Feb 12, 2012)

Everyone asleep?


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

nope


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

I feed mine banana worms, microworms, crushed up atisons, vinegar eels, decap brine shrimp eggs, live brine shrimp, tubifex worms and bloodworms


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## VictorP (Jun 5, 2012)

Sleep is for the weak. Actually, what is sleep? XD


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## tpocicat (Aug 8, 2011)

I tried to come to some agreement with the person that bought four of my bettas and paid Priority for them. As you know, she filed a complaint with Paypal. I offered her half of the money she paid me, and SHE TURNED ME DOWN!!! I then told her I only give a live arrival guarantee with Express shipping. She took the chance and lost. I also reminded her that I also paid for the styrofoam liner and bags. Some people want guarantees on everything. I'm sorry the fish died, after all, they were my babies. But she has to be reasonable I would think. I'm so upset, she never should have put in a complaint in the first place.


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## VictorP (Jun 5, 2012)

I have to say tpoc, I would not be as calm as you are in your situation. Kudos to you!


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## tpocicat (Aug 8, 2011)

Thank you. Actually I don't feel very calm. Upset is what I feel. I just don't understand some people.


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## inareverie85 (Apr 18, 2008)

If this individual is on this forum, is it against the rules for you to send me that person's name (forum username) in a private message?

I'd just want to make sure I don't sell fish to this individual when I start selling them.


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

tpocicat said:


> I tried to come to some agreement with the person that bought four of my bettas and paid Priority for them. As you know, she filed a complaint with Paypal. I offered her half of the money she paid me, and SHE TURNED ME DOWN!!! I then told her I only give a live arrival guarantee with Express shipping. She took the chance and lost. I also reminded her that I also paid for the styrofoam liner and bags. Some people want guarantees on everything. I'm sorry the fish died, after all, they were my babies. But she has to be reasonable I would think. I'm so upset, she never should have put in a complaint in the first place.


Did she properly acclimate the fish? Is that why they died?


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## tpocicat (Aug 8, 2011)

I'm not sure. All she sent me was a picture of one of the males in a little cup showing the slime the fish lost while in transit. She called it little white threads in the water, but since my fish are healthy, that is all I can think it was.


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## indjo (Jun 6, 2010)

+1 VictorP.

@tpocicat; try not to think about it ... it happens - you never know how they were handled during shipping. And buyers are always at lost .... (did I say that right) .... I mean they lose both fish and money. It's just that some can't accept it and look for someone to blame. Remember, it was her own decision to go with Priority instead of Express.


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## tpocicat (Aug 8, 2011)

Thank you guys so much. Now I have another problem! I shipped a male betta Priority on Monday. He is now stuck in New York. He's been there since 4:00 AM yesterday. I've filed a complaint and they will let me know whenever they find him. If he dies, I'll probably have two complaints on my Paypal account.


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

I am so sorry this is happening to you. It's the buyer's choice whether to go with priority or express. If you go the cheaper route then you'll probably end up with dead fish. NOT THE BREEDER 'S FAULT. It's the tightwad buyer's fault IMO. If I was spending good money for quality fish then I'm going to do my best from my end to ensure that the fish get to me alive. I paid $35 I think to someone for 2 fish she gave me for free. They got to me in good shape.


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## tpocicat (Aug 8, 2011)

I sure hope Paypal agrees with you. I've told them everything I did to get the safely to her, now it's up to them to decide where the money goes.


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## Enkil (Jan 15, 2012)

With this male you have stuck in transit... Have you contacted the buyer to let them know? Maybe if you both are complaining, they'll look a little harder. >>;

If anything happens to my lovelies I'm getting, I'll definitely be blaming how they were handled in shipping. I didn't have any trouble the last time, so I'm hoping that trend continues.


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## tpocicat (Aug 8, 2011)

I'm at work right now, so yes I plan on emailing the buyer as soon as I get home to tell her what has happened and what I've done so far. I'm just so scared that my beautiful boy won't make it. It's already been 4 days!


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## Enkil (Jan 15, 2012)

Oh wow. Hopefully he'll have luck on his side!


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## jeffegg2 (Apr 5, 2012)

tpocicat said:


> I sure hope Paypal agrees with you. I've told them everything I did to get the safely to her, now it's up to them to decide where the money goes.


I have received a few fish priority without a problem. Isn't it insured?

You have to put in your ad that priorty fails are at buyers expense... 4 days is really not that bad, he should be ok.


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## Anitax3x (Aug 26, 2011)

I agree jeff. I have received fish via priority, they were shipped on a monday and I got them on a thursday/friday perfectly fine. I don't do it all the time, but I'm really sorry that person is doing that to you and I hope that you keep your money.


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## tpocicat (Aug 8, 2011)

Thank you all for your support. I checked the status of my betta and he is now in KY. I should hear from the buyer soon. I sure hope it's good news. I contacted her last night and told her what was happening.

On a better note, I've got eggs. One of the males I kept from my spawn spawned with his sister. I sure hope they are fertilized. The male is acting like it.


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## Thomasdog (Jan 26, 2012)

Tpo: At least you got eggs! Now I'm afraid to ship, LOL


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## tpocicat (Aug 8, 2011)

tpocicat said:


> Thank you guys so much. Now I have another problem! I shipped a male betta Priority on Monday. He is now stuck in New York. He's been there since 4:00 AM yesterday. I've filed a complaint and they will let me know whenever they find him. If he dies, I'll probably have two complaints on my Paypal account.


Good news! The buyer emailed me, said she was a little afraid to open the box, but he was alright! After 4 days in that little bag he was still alive. Sure made my day.


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## bettalover2033 (Feb 17, 2010)

Glad to hear good news


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## Thomasdog (Jan 26, 2012)

Hey y'all:
Here is a pic of Sparta's sis, in Thailand. I don't think she has good form and her tail looks really featherery, but.....
Exhasuting all my options... :*( no luck so far.


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## VictorP (Jun 5, 2012)

You shouldn't get that female. It doesn't balance with his form


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## Creat (Dec 6, 2010)

You could always try cambodian females maybe if you cant get any nice red females.


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## Thomasdog (Jan 26, 2012)

Figured so, cuz she's his full sis, and since he has kinda wonky fins, she does too! There arn't ANY reds that anyone like out there, not even cambos. :*(


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## Creat (Dec 6, 2010)

Well you dont always have to start perfect it will just take more work to prefect. I had to cross hmpk for my hm when I couldnt find any good hms to work with


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## VictorP (Jun 5, 2012)

Have you considered a white female?


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## Kelly0727 (Jan 8, 2012)

Hey everyone, I was wondering since most of you have paypal if any of you had to go through providing more information? If so how long did it take you? They put my account on limited because of this 

My worm culture died a couple days ago and now my other worm cultures died on me today gah! Now with paypal being a booty.. I cant replace them until they go through the information they asked for and approve it.


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## Thomasdog (Jan 26, 2012)

Well, I really wanted to keep his color becuase it is so nice and red, becuase I know that I can eventually fix some fin issues (slight), but getting rid of color would be a pain... :*(

Here are some more girls. Rip 'em apart guys! 

http://www.aquabid.com/cgi-bin/auction/auction.cgi?fwbettashm&1344396465 - Cambo :*( has good branching(?) long anal fin, flat head <--- good or bad, I'm just pointing out what I see! I can't seem to find a guide for FEMALES


http://www.aquabid.com/cgi-bin/auction/auction.cgi?fwbettashm&1344478615 - shaggy fins, too much branching (?) 


http://www.aquabid.com/cgi-bin/auction/auction.cgi?fwbettashm&1344655742 - hmmm  perhaps her.... 0_0 but fins are kinda shaggy


http://www.aquabid.com/cgi-bin/auction/auction.cgi?fwbettashm&1344656073 - good fins, as far as I can tell, but is a cambo. To cambo or not to cambo? 


http://www.aquabid.com/cgi-bin/auction/auction.cgi?fwbettashm&1344912775 - good fins


http://www.aquabid.com/cgi-bin/auction/auction.cgi?fwbettashm&1344740689 - FINALLLY a red one. shaggy fins


http://www.aquabid.com/cgi-bin/auction/auction.cgi?fwbettashm&1344740683 - nice red color, nice fins as far as I can tell, but something happened to her bottom fin?


http://www.aquabid.com/cgi-bin/auction/auction.cgi?fwbettashm&1344616580 - anal looks too long




Hopdiggty has some other Red HM females, but I didn't post them. If you see anything else you like better, I would love you to post her. 

Of course, I could go with a cambo and do what I was going to do with Sunny, try and get the cambo out. Or I could go with a red with iffy fins and.... 


I really owe you guys now... ;(
I really must say that you guys are awesome.
And you really want to help people. 
I really like you. 
Really, that was a LOT of reallys. ;P

Over and out 
-Thomasdog


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

I like 4 the best


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## Thomasdog (Jan 26, 2012)

That was fast!  
I like her too - therefore to cambo or not to cambo. Plus she is in the US.  

Thanks Mo


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

She does has a long anal but she also has a 180 spread and a nice dorsal.


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## Thomasdog (Jan 26, 2012)

Yes, Sparta also has a wee bit of a long anal. *ick* Luckily it doesn't look WAAAY too long. Plus she has a nice sharp edge to her fins, not shaggy like Sparta's. 
-Thomasdog


PS - for your location..... grr... you got me. :V)


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## Thomasdog (Jan 26, 2012)

http://www.bettafish.com/showthread.php?t=98051 - this is about what I would get. So I would be able to keep his red color going.


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## VictorP (Jun 5, 2012)

Watch out for alot of branching. And what is your goal for breeding? I also recommend finding another female non of these are eye catching.


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## Thomasdog (Jan 26, 2012)

VictorP - Darn you females!!! *shakes fist*
I can't find one ANYWHERE. Do see any good ones?  Please let me know. 
Don't want Sparta to get too old. :/ (hes about 5-6 mo now)

I want to produce a nice, solid red HM line. That's why I'm so eager to breed Sparta. He has a good red color. Getting harder and harder to find nowadays. :*(


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

I'll email Aquastar. I think his name is like kit. I call him that for short, . He has some nice reds. I'll ask him for the price of a female for you. Usually they run about 20-25 from him if you ask personally


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

I emailed him and his name is actually *kit watchara


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## Thomasdog (Jan 26, 2012)

Moooooooo! 
Thanks soooo much! <3


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

Your welcome. They usually reply around 3 AM so I won't be able to give you a response till tomorrow


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## Thomasdog (Jan 26, 2012)

LOL. 
3am -
Me- Mo? Did they answer?
Mo - .... (to self), crazy person. 

YAAAAY


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## Thomasdog (Jan 26, 2012)

HIIII!!! EVERYONE!!!!!
Guess whhhhatttt???? I found more!!!! Aren't you excited. (sarcastically)
http://www.aquabid.com/cgi-bin/auction/auction.cgi?fwbettashm&1345528187 - iffy coloring, but good finnage as far as i can tell, nice branching

http://www.aquabid.com/cgi-bin/auction/auction.cgi?fwbettashm&1346389060 - good coloring, but iffy fins...

thats alll....
And back to jus the lounge....

Don't you all hate it when someone on Aquabid.com says 'ABSOLUTELY stunning, gorgeous, perfect, breed ready, great color, fantastic form blah blah blah', so you look at thier totally expesive fish andddd...... 
It's hideous. A total rosetail, and with bad coloring. Plus, its disformed. And has an evil look that says 'I will eat you'....

yeah....

female searching.... -_-


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

I'll give you a link to some awesome females for like ten bucks! Alsol contact Rachel herself. She doesnt list up all the fish she really has for sale. A lot of the fish I got from her were deals "behind" the scenes. I called her and we made a deal from there.


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

SUPER nice females!!!

http://www.aquabid.com/cgi-bin/auction/auction.cgi?disp&viewseller&Ashtinbuchanan


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## Thomasdog (Jan 26, 2012)

WOW!!!!!!!!!!
MO!!!!! OMG thanks!!!

I like #3 and #5 the best for Mr. S, since they seem to have the least amout of branching and the least shaggy fins! <3 
Plus, they are a really GREAT deal. 

Which one do you like the best for him?


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

Hmm Ill look. earlier I was thinking 2 and 5 had the best form but ill double check


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

number 3


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## Thomasdog (Jan 26, 2012)

edit* 
I ment #3... its #2 on the list. *hopeful smile*
no really, I really do like #3 the best due to her: non excessive branching, rich color, and nice topline. 

Perhaps I now have a female!


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## Thomasdog (Jan 26, 2012)

Definetly getting #3 - if I get win the bidding war :O 
Wish my luck, prayers, and LOTS of crossed fingers tomorrow!


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## tpocicat (Aug 8, 2011)

Great news guys! Paypal decided in my favor so I got the entire payment back. I offered the buyer 50% of the money back even though she went Priority, but she turned it down. I still feel bad that none of the fish I sent her lived, but for one thing, she wasn't home when they arrived, so she had to go to the post office to pick them up. I have no idea how much longer they had to stay in their little bags because of that.


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## Anitax3x (Aug 26, 2011)

That's odd because I had fish delivered to my house priority when I wasn't home and they left the box at my front door, fish perfectly fine.


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## tpocicat (Aug 8, 2011)

You were lucky! Was it a hot summer day like now when they were delivered?


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## marktrc (Jun 6, 2012)

Thomasdog. Maybe you could get females from this spawn? Near the end there are pics of cambodian females.

http://www.bettafish.com/showthread.php?t=101541


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

She already got a fish. They were from that spawn


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## Anitax3x (Aug 26, 2011)

tpocicat said:


> You were lucky! Was it a hot summer day like now when they were delivered?


Yeah I live in south Florida, and it was the end of July. The fish were shipped on a monday, and arrived on a thursday that same week. I guess I was lucky, but the fish didn't seem distressed they were pretty colored up and active. They came from minnesota.


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## Thomasdog (Jan 26, 2012)

Yup Mark, 2 happy lil female are en route now!


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

I got two fish from a former member one time and I had to be home to sign for them. The mailman wouldn't leave them. We weren't up when he came and I thought I'd have to wait until the next day to get them but later that afternoon when he delivered our mail he brought the fish.


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## Thomasdog (Jan 26, 2012)

The girls are happy and alive!!!! AYAAAAYY! They are in great condition and even better than I'd hoped! The mailman just left them at my door.


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## MollyJean (Dec 29, 2009)

OK I just have to tell someone... I did a head count on my 14 day old fry and at about 100 I got lost! They're all so big and healthy and it's so sweet watching them eat! But I didn't think the spawn would be so big! O.O Need to invest in more jars..

AHHHH so excited!!!!


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## Thomasdog (Jan 26, 2012)

Yay Molly!


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## indjo (Jun 6, 2010)

Good on you Molly. Keep up the great work .... oh don't forget pictures.


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## ccooper (Aug 23, 2020)

Spazzfish said:


> Welcome fellow breeders!
> I have been thinking we need a place to just chat so BOOM! Breeders lounge!
> ok, for the sake of keeping conflict down I have made some "rules".
> *Rules*
> ...


Any breeders in Central Pennsylvania? Looking to breed my fish full of eggs! PLEASE text me Craig 717-825-4150


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