# Live black worms



## SusieG (Oct 19, 2015)

I ordered a bad of them from my work and I din't rinse them very good prior to feeding them to my breeders a few days ago. After I feed one (1.5 inch) worm to each, I thought," ew, they need to be cleaned off next time, this water is a little dirty looking. "

I have them in a container in the fridge and i clean out the water several times day now since i'm chopping them and feeding them to my fry. The water is clear now, I simply fill the container up, then drain half the water out, fill it up again, drain half out and so on about 5 times to get out any nasty stuff. Yesterday i really didn't see any specks of poop at all in the container. 

BUT a day and a half after I fed them to my breeders, my most expensive , nicest fish has dropsy..... I got Merycin two and epson salt for him.... I have Methyl (sp) blue to soak him in a few times a day..... I'm very very upset over this. I haven't gotten to breed him or show him yet.... He is stunning and slimply my favorite fish. And just this morning, now about 5 days after feeding them, my nice marble half giant female seems to have a bit of SBD going on.... WTH.... She is having a little bit of a hard time swimming and goes a bit sideways when up at the top. I clean all their 1 gallon containers out 1x a week and I am a day late, I tested some for ammonia an all came out 0. They have some poop at the bottom, but nothing more then normal before WC day. After the worm feeding they went back to eating their normal diet of: One day freeze dried Blood worms, one day Omega One mini Marine pellets ( looks more like crushed pellets lol) and One day NLS pellets and repeat ( some times i switch it up and do frozen bloom worms or freeze dried mysis shrimp for fun) So really nothing out of the ordinary for them. I have been a day or two late with WC's with never having a problem or even ammonia or nitrite issues. ( I test them all the them all the time like a freak to make sure I'm not going to long in between to change the WC's) 

I just don't know what could have gone wrong besides the black worms....I have been feeding them chopped to the fry and whole to my cichlids and everyone is ok. I just read a few articles on here and some other site about live worms being fine and no one really having much trouble. 

I'm not sure what to treat the female with SBD with and I gave two of my other favorite boys some merycin two in their water once I changed it just incase.... I cleaned out the females tank and put some epsum slat in there for her. 
I'll do some research on SBD but from what I remember i think just the salt and don't feed for a few days? I've only every had one fish get sick on me and that was after he got ripped up from this female while breeding and he got dropsy, most likely due to the fact he was torn up, even with WC every two days while he was healing. I knew I should have put him on something just incase  

Anyway, I've read a lot of the breeds use these worms to feed to breeding/show stock. Should I just not give the worms to them again? I'm a bit paranoid now that something will happen to my fry, but they LOVE them! I have a bad batch of BBS eggs and my new ones aren't here yet and my cultures of walter worms, gindal worms and banana worms ( came in a set of starter cultures so i said why not get all the different worms lol) should be here in a few days, so they have to eat something other then microworms. Sorry for the rambling!
Any insight be great on what to do for my poor guy and this female. I read a lot already and it seems like dropsy is a killer  
I want to put him on Terta Paragurad as well, but that will be over kill correct? Or the different meds may not work together and could have a bad reaction. 

thank you all in advance!


----------



## Aqua Aurora (Oct 4, 2013)

I'm sorry you've having issues with your worms. I don't have advice for medicine/help with healing but wanted to offer another source for black worms, as I'd suspect that where you bought them from (or where they get them from) didn't do a good job keeping their worms healthy/parasite free.

I've had black worms for over a year now and keep them cultured in bins with floating plants now. But I sometimes have to replenish my batch and order some more. I bought mien from eastenraquatics.
http://shop.easternaquatics.com/Live-Black-Worms-1.htm
Shipping is expensive but they always arrive alive. They do have some harmless leeches with them but its easy enough to get rid of the leaches (they stick tot eh sides of containers you culture worms in (leeches don't grow in worms/feed on worms/fed on fish). Drain bin-dumps worms into another container and simply peal or rinse leeches off the sides or now empty bin and repeat. I've not had issues with any of my fish using these worms for a year+
I keep my worm bin is in the basement (water temp around 60f) they do fine. Light is on a timer and I don't do that many water changes.


----------



## Sadist (Jan 1, 2015)

I'm not a medicine expert, but I would lay off on the freeze dried stuff on any fish that's bloated or having swim bladder issues until they're better. It's easy to overfeed freeze dried foods. 

I agree that it's possible that your worm culture came in with parasites -- there's always a chance of that sort of thing happening. I hope it didn't!


----------



## SusieG (Oct 19, 2015)

Thanks for the advise! I'll have to try and order from that site and culture my own  As form my female that seemed to have SBD, she seems 10% fine now and her color is back to normal.... Very odd! She is a red marks and she was pale. I tested her tank for ammonia and nitrates and came back 0, so I have no clue as to why she is now fine lol but phew! Maybe the espsome salt worked.....


----------



## SusieG (Oct 19, 2015)

Small update, the male just died.... I looked at him before I feed the babies and he looked the same, took 20 mins feeding them and looked back at him and he's gone  Damn near in tears..... I couldn't wait to show him in Group C, I know he would have done great in the Purchased fish Divison. On a good note, Jaws the female seems like she was just constipated and is pooping


----------



## NickAu (Sep 28, 2015)

Sorry to hear that.



> I'm not a medicine expert, but I would lay off on the freeze dried stuff


I do not use or recommend the use of freeze dried food. If you feel you must feed it to a fish make sure you pre soak it for at least an hour before use.


----------



## SusieG (Oct 19, 2015)

They don't get to much of it, they love it so I feel like it makes them happy lol but if it could possibly have caused and issue with this female, ill lay off it. I've always had a few Bettas for the past 8 or so years and never had any issues with freeze dried a few times a week as a treat, but now that I'm breeding and have a crap load more fish, I'm seeing how things effect different fish differently. More fish = more Possible issues! Like at my horse boarding stable, we once had 67 horses and literally every week the vet was out for something! Now that there is only 42, we see the vet less lol Except last week when two had colic due to NJs funky weather and one put his hoof threw the stall wall....


----------



## Sadist (Jan 1, 2015)

Wow, that's a lot of horses!

I'm sorry to read about your male passing. There are so many factors with him, it's hard to really point to one thing and say that's what happened.

I hope you get new blackworms soon and see if they work better! Good luck with your fry!


----------



## GhostFeather (Jun 23, 2011)

You have to rinse!!!
At least once a day and twice does not hurt.
No telling what kind of crap was in the dirty water, my guess is that is what killed them.
I have been feeding Black Worms for years and never had a problem.
Forget that other source and get them here:
http://blackworms-direct.com/LiveBlackwormsM.html
Good prices and next day FedEx delivery.


----------



## liamthen (Dec 18, 2015)

have you try prawn meat? it make good betta food, there's two way to use it, first is to feed them raw, 2nd is to boil them first then blender them to the size consumable by your bettas.
Caution !! might stench fishy smell to the water, but my fellow breeder friend tell me the cooked one give less stench


----------



## SusieG (Oct 19, 2015)

GhostFeather: I had rinsed them  And even filled, then drained, then filled and drainer their container multiple times until the water ran clear, then picked the worms out and rinsed them lol the water never really even looked dirty when i would drain it, just a tiny tiny bit of black dots. 

I'll never use them again though! I finally got my grindal worms from the worm guy and KittenFish had sent me a nice batch as well! I was also finally able to order from the IBC and I got 5 different fry foods, golden pearls (200-300 micron and and 300-500 micron) and the growth meal #00 and #2 and the micro crumble I think? Seems like that are too big for everything but the Growth meal #2 and they LOVE it!!! I also have them eating the Omega one marine mini pellets 

So I now have tons of food for my next fry and shouldn't ever need the black worms again lol! Keeping up on my micro worms and walter worm culture, grindal worm culture and having plenty of BBS eggs on hand, plus all the Kens food! 

I think my next batch of fry though, I will do the egg yolk then right to golden pearls and BBS....Have over 100 fry right now with missing vents even while doing 75% WC daily


----------



## SusieG (Oct 19, 2015)

liamthen: I'll have to look into prawn as well!
thank you!


----------



## GhostFeather (Jun 23, 2011)

Susie,
Don't give up on them.
I keep mine in a plastic shoe box in the fridge along with 1 or 2 gallons of treated water.
I just pour water in the shoe box, dump out the excess and repeat, never had a problem.
As for the dry food you have for them, try this, works great!
Buy a pepper grinder at Walmart, the refillable type, put your dry food in it, I just mix different kinds together.
You can adjust it to how small of a grind you want and make a bigger grind as they grow.


----------



## GhostFeather (Jun 23, 2011)

Susie,
I would watch the Micros, a lot of people blame them for missing Ventrals, I quit using them and use VE for first food along with BBs.


----------



## Detectorist (Jan 8, 2016)

I killed $100 worth of beautiful Bettas by feeding them Blackworms. They were specially cleaned for tropical fish feeding but the Bettas still got dropsy. never again.

Frozen brine shrimp and red worms do well. Only as a supplement, though.


----------



## Tolak (Nov 13, 2012)

You really do have to watch where you get live blackworms from. Often shops will rinse them with tank water, exposing them to whatever diseases the tank may carry. If you get them from an outfit that specializes in blackworms this won't be an issue.


----------

