# Help planting first NPT - so excited!



## summersea (Jul 26, 2013)

So I have been lurking through threads and journals regarding NPT tanks. Oh the envy I have been subjected to ;-) but I didn't have the money to buy a new tank (though was saving up) when my dad surprised me with a 4g Fluval View tank. 

While I greatly appreciate the gift I am a little concerned about making this my first attempt at an NPT. It has a small foot print (so not much planting room) with LED lighting (that the reviews say isn't the best for plants). Below is the link to the tank if you want/need to look at it. 

http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B009ZKZHQ8?qid=1389314068&sr=8-1-fkmr0&vs=1

So, first question, can I still make this into an NPT tank if I use low light and smaller plants? I was thinking java ferns, a smaller crypt, maybe a bacopa, or something along those lines. I would probably want either the java fern or a moss ball as my tap water has low levels of ammonia so would love to soak those up. If this tank can be used I would love suggestions for plant stocking (with quantity suggestions). I was also thinking a small Mopani wood piece would be awesome but I don't want to overcrowd the tank either...

Second question, a bit more lengthy, regards the actual set up process. If this tank can be used what is the easiest method for setting up a NPT? I was planning to use miracle grow organic potting soil (assuming I can find it) and possibly play sand as the cap (maybe gravel but the only gravel I have on hand is blue which isn't very natural looking). Does the soil need to be "washed" before using? I read OFL's sticky on NPT tanks and she says you don't have to wash the soil but I have read other that do. I would love to hear which has worked better for people!

Any other tidbits or pieces of advice are welcome. I don't want to do this wrong so all help is appreciated. Though really hoping this tank works for a NPT!


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## Stone (Jan 6, 2013)

you can use it just limits what you can use, I would stick with java ferns anubus maybe anacharis you don't have to was the soil but you do need to pick the bigger sticks and roots and bark out, you can cap with gravel or sand if you use sand wash the sand to get rid of the "dust"


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## Aus (Feb 3, 2012)

If you are using those low light plants, you don't need NPT (dirt tank) at all. Gravel will do wonderfully, as few low-light plants actually get planted in the gravel anyway.. and you can still have a wonderfully jungly, planty tank. 

NPT's use fast-growing stems to kick the maturation of the tank soil off, with 70% or so of the tank floor needing to be planted with these fast-growing (light-loving) plants. Otherwise, things can go belly up and in a dirt tank.. well, the horrible smells are the least of your problems. 

In a tank the size of the one you have, and with a LED light, I would seriously fill it up with nice gravel, sand w/e and a ton of java fern (you can't kill it with an axe, and it gets quite tall in time..) and anubias tied to a bit of wood or a rock.. (you can't -plant- these plants, they'll rot). Java moss is nothing but win, I adore it. Maybe some floating plants? They look nice and bettas love flossing about in the hanging roots.. Cryptocorenes are -lovely- and you can get some really tall varieties, those can be planted in the gravel.. 

If you have a peek at my gallery you'll see my 3g cube, it's a jungle, and all those plants are in there..

But yeah, I would not do dirt tank with a very small footprint/low light.

eta: I also am a big fan of peacock moss.. I have a lot of that, it's prettier than java moss and while it grows best right under the light/in a slightly brighter light it does quite well under LEDs, in my experience.


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## Betta Nut (Dec 3, 2013)

My crypto wendii grew from 2 inches to 6 inches under low LED light in a month, that might be good for a root one in that tank.. I think the low light is what caused it to grow tall. I think one leaf I am looking at is more like 8 inches from base to tip. That's just in gravel with a little sand on the bottom, not NPT.
Now that it's tall, my guy likes to play peek-a-boo, or lurk amid the leaves, then dart out. I can hear him say BOO!


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## summersea (Jul 26, 2013)

Thank you all for your responses! Looks like I won't be doing an NPT if low light plants don't need it (kinda bummed but hey- free tank! ;-) ). 

Aus - is there a special method for tying anubias to a rock/wood? And do I need todo the same with java fern? I would love to do a floating plant - is wisteria a good ammonia sucker-upper? Or would you suggest something else for a low light tank? I LOVE your 3g! Definitely what I would like my tank to look like so any suggestions on what you put in and how are greatly appreciated!

Betta Nut- I was looking at the crypto wendii! Do you have a pic of it in your tank? I love to see what other people have done to get ideas!


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## Betta Nut (Dec 3, 2013)

here's a before/after of the crypto wendii.. I got it at petsmart in those packages they hang up. I had some anacharis too, but it died pretty fast.

Moneywort's been growing crazy, and banana plant is doing good too. The original 4 leafs on it died one by one, but each was quickly replaced by a fresh one. 
I have an onion plant too that shot up from the bulb to the surface in a few weeks time. The before, the crypts were already grown a bit from when I got them a couple weeks before.
Sorry the pics aren't very crisp.
Before:







After:


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## summersea (Jul 26, 2013)

Betta Nut said:


> here's a before/after of the crypto wendii.. I got it at petsmart in those packages they hang up. I had some anacharis too, but it died pretty fast.
> 
> Moneywort's been growing crazy, and banana plant is doing good too. The original 4 leafs on it died one by one, but each was quickly replaced by a fresh one.
> I have an onion plant too that shot up from the bulb to the surface in a few weeks time. The before, the crypts were already grown a bit from when I got them a couple weeks before.
> Sorry the pics aren't very crisp.


Thanks! I didn't realize that Petsmart sold wendii! I was debating on trying to go just based on stuff at my local pets mart (more expensive per plant but no shipping) or to try the Planted Aquariums Central website someone suggested on another thread but to get what I was looking at cost $50 (shipping included) so going to have to price check.

Is your tank sand with a gravel cap? Couldn't tell in the pic. Thinking I might go that route if I get a crypt.


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## Aus (Feb 3, 2012)

> Aus - is there a special method for tying anubias to a rock/wood? And do I need todo the same with java fern? I would love to do a floating plant - is wisteria a good ammonia sucker-upper? Or would you suggest something else for a low light tank? I LOVE your 3g! Definitely what I would like my tank to look like so any suggestions on what you put in and how are greatly appreciated!


Well thank you very much for kind words. 

Tying anubias .. no special method. Some folks use cotton (I do) and other use aquarium-safe glue, lol. Whatever suits you, I guess.

Yes, you'll need to do the same to java fern, though it's just as easy to leave it floating or stuff it behind something a bit, to stop it floating (as I did with the java in the 3g..) or tie it to a rock.. 

Both plants hate being rooted in substrate. 

Wisteria - yes, great ammonia-eater. When it gets long roots, plant it in the gravel and get some more. :> Though it does like more light than the others. I usually just left it floating, for the betta to play about in. 

Other good ammonia-eaters are java moss and susswassertang. Java moss has been scientifically! proven to reduce ammonia levels significantly, so I like to have lots in my tanks, even though I'm fussy with water changes. 

The crypts suggested above are very nice also.


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## summersea (Jul 26, 2013)

Thanks Aus! I am going to look at PetsMart and my local LFS to see what they have on hand. Would be nice I I don't have to ship. I will be taking the list you and Betta Nut have given me and hope we have it! I won't be able to buy until next weekend but am loving the planning mode! Yay!


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## summersea (Jul 26, 2013)

Okay, so I talked with my Dad and he wants me to be able to do the NPT I was hoping to do. So we are returning the Fluval and getting a Marina 5g kit that has a filter with adjustable flow and 2 lights (the are incandescent but I will put in 2 CFL daylight bulbs). Sooo with that change - does anyone have recommendations for plants they think would be amazing in 5g NPT tank for a beginner? I am wanting to put in a small piece of driftwood too. Thanks!!

Oh and here is the tank I that helps:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B0035HBFWM?vs=1


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## peachii (Jan 6, 2013)

With that tank and the 6500 CFL you can pretty much grow anything you want in it.


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## summersea (Jul 26, 2013)

That is what I was hoping but being so new to this that I was hoping to hear what plants were peoples favorites in looks and ease of care (since I worry about keeping them alive with my not so green thumb ;-) ). 

Do you have any favorites you would recommend Peachii?


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## NikiD (Dec 28, 2013)

Subscribing! I'm going to start a 5gal NPT soon (waiting on shipment of tank, and cuttings from peachii  ) Looking forward to seeing your progress! This is the tank I ordered:

https://secure.petco.com/Shop/Product.aspx?SKU=2166354


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## summersea (Jul 26, 2013)

NikiD - awesome! That is a nice tank! You will have to let me know how yours works out for you and what plants you use! I love seeing other tanks and how they evolve!

I am heading to petco today in hopes of finding a place that sells Nerite snails and shrimp as no one in my area appears to sell them. So, on top of the plant suggestions if anyone knows a place where nerites and shrimp (particularly cherry or amano) are sold at a really decent price I would love to hear about it!


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## Aus (Feb 3, 2012)

Well, you just have an awesome dad! 5g is a great size for an NPT, and I recommend reading OldFishLady's thread on how-to. 

Couple things I found useful for set-up.. 

-- Make -very sure the soil you use is organic, and doesn't contain any ferts or water-saving stuffs. Sift it for lumps of wood, etc. 

-- Put a little sand in a ring around the outer edges of your tank before you fill in the dirt inside it and cap that off with more sand, that way you won't have dirt showing (if you care about that, heh) 

-- plant your stem plants in the soil and cap the sand around them carefully. This makes for less dirt in the water column than poking them through the sand... make sure you know where your plants are going -before- you plant them! So really, you have to have all the plants you are going to use right there.. and you will need a LOT of plants.

-- You will need a -heap- of fast growing stems. Elodea is awesome. Hornwort too, and that chomps on ammonia. Wisteria's brilliant. Any stems that will grow fast.. It's the fast growth you want. Fill the tank floor to about 60-70% of its area witht he stems. 

It -will- look like a total jungle for a while but that's good, it means the plants are nomming on all the extra nutrients. You can trim them back and plant the cuttings, or put them in your dad's compost bin -- aquatic plants make the best compost!

-- Fill the tank -slowly- and with a tube if possible, to avoid disturbing the new substrate and uprooting the plants. Planting the tank with no water in is a good idea. (I learned this the hard way, haha)

-- Bamboo skewers make awesome soil-pokers. I would poke the soil once a week even if you have MTS, while it's new. I wish you lived nearby, I have a ton of trumpet snails you could have!

-- You can slowly replace many of the stems in a few months, as the soil ages, if you want, with other plant species. Remove all fish before doing this as you'll stir up the dirt a bit (it settles pretty quickly).. Don't pull up a heap of stems at once, this'll make a mess, lol. 

-- try to add at least one sword, though in 5g you'll probably have to chuck it on the compost when it grows too big (and it will!) but they soak up nitrites instead of ammonia.. very useful!

-- You'll need to do some pretty large water changes for the first few weeks. I do about 90% change before I put the fish in. Twice, hehe. Then 2x 25% per week for about two months. That worked really well for my 10g. After that, I changed 25% about every 2 months. Which is more than I needed to, by far, but that's what I felt I wanted to do. 

But yup - read OFL's sticky post on how-to. You're so going to love your dirt tank.


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## summersea (Jul 26, 2013)

Awesome advise Aus! Thank you so much! I can't wait for my tank toget here. Just reading the advise from this thread makes me want to get started now!

Unfortunately it looks like I will have to order almost all of the plants online and I may not be able to afford that for a couple weeks. SO planning stages it is. I have spent so much time looking at aquarium plants online all of the names are starting to blur together. I am going to have to sit down and figure out exactly what I want my tank to look like. I wish I could sketch so I had a rough draft! lol


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## summersea (Jul 26, 2013)

I am starting a list of everything I need for inside my tank. Is the pic below of the correct miracle grow organic soil I need?


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## kodawg9 (Dec 25, 2013)

Yep, that's the correct Miracle Gro


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## summersea (Jul 26, 2013)

Okay, thanks kodawg9!


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## rsskylight04 (Nov 9, 2013)

Hornwort is a great floater that doesn't need any special care, but in a small tank youll have to keep it trimmed to avoid blocking too much light. I started a soil tank with sand cap about a month ago and I'm so glad I did. No fish, but its full of plants and very beautifull. I have anacharis, hornwort, java fern, and sword plants. The plants grow so fast with the soil that I use the clippings to keep fresh plants in myother tanks- the cichlids especially are very hard on plants so that tank requires continuos replacements for the ravished plants. Also my loaches love to nibble on anacharis and its nice to have a ready supply.
Good luck.


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## summersea (Jul 26, 2013)

rsskylight04 said:


> Hornwort is a great floater that doesn't need any special care, but in a small tank youll have to keep it trimmed to avoid blocking too much light. I started a soil tank with sand cap about a month ago and I'm so glad I did. No fish, but its full of plants and very beautifull. I have anacharis, hornwort, java fern, and sword plants. The plants grow so fast with the soil that I use the clippings to keep fresh plants in myother tanks- the cichlids especially are very hard on plants so that tank requires continuos replacements for the ravished plants. Also my loaches love to nibble on anacharis and its nice to have a ready supply.
> Good luck.


Thanks for the suggestions! I am definitely going to get java fern when I order online but still planning the rest of the tank so I love to hear what has worked well for others! I will likely get anarcharis as I can also use that in my high school science classroom for several experiments (yay for plants pulling double duty lol).


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## rsskylight04 (Nov 9, 2013)

summersea said:


> Thanks for the suggestions! I am definitely going to get java fern when I order online but still planning the rest of the tank so I love to hear what has worked well for others! I will likely get anarcharis as I can also use that in my high school science classroom for several experiments (yay for plants pulling double duty lol).


Hurray for teachers! I teach english at university. Wish I could do cool experiments with plants in my classes. Only thing I could use anacharis for would be a spelling test! Jk
Good luck!


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## NikiD (Dec 28, 2013)

Question for rsskylight04 - I know you said no fish but do you have any snails or shrimp in your 10g planted? What supplements do you use? Thanks in advance! Just gathering intel for my 5g planted


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## rsskylight04 (Nov 9, 2013)

NikiD said:


> Question for rsskylight04 - I know you said no fish but do you have any snails or shrimp in your 10g planted? What supplements do you use? Thanks in advance! Just gathering intel for my 5g planted


I have nothing but plants sand and soil. I am thinking about making it a grow tank for guppy or platy fry, haven't decided yet. I only use regular flourescent light, no fertilizer or co2. I run a heater in the tank but not sure if that's necessary.
Good luck with your tank!


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## NikiD (Dec 28, 2013)

Thanks!


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## summersea (Jul 26, 2013)

*Plant List Ideas...*

Okay, so here is what I am thinking, plant wise, for my 5g (eventually when I can afford them...so hopefully in the next month):

Bacopa Carolina (background - left corner)
Dwarf Lily (midground left side)
Pigmy Chain Sword (foreground - left and right side)
Wisteria (background - right corner)
Crypto wendtii red (midground - right side)
Ludwigia (background - center)
Driftwood with Anubias (foreground - center)
Java moss (floating)


What do we think? Too much? Not enough? Bad choices? Can you tell I am insecure about starting my first NPT? :roll: lol


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## summersea (Jul 26, 2013)

Oh and I forgot, I am thinking of adding in anarcharis (elodea) that I have in my classroom tank right now to fill in spaces in the back/midground areas.


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## Aus (Feb 3, 2012)

As long as more than half of your tank floor is planted (up to 70%, ideally) those are great choices!

Remember, you can remove some of the elodea and other bushy plants that might overwhelm the tank for a while, once the soil has settled down and quit leaching mega nutrients. You'll see this as a noticeable decline in rapid growth. 

It can take a week or two for that rapid growth to kick in, as well. But boy, it's amazing when it happens.


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## summersea (Jul 26, 2013)

Great! Thanks Aus! The new tank just came in yesterday and I am afraid I may be looking at too many plants. It is so hard to tell since I have to order from online. Ugh! But I can always put some in another tank if needed

The other thing that "just came in" was the electric bill. And thanks to the lovely "polar vortex" that came trough a couple weeks ago it looks like I will have to wait until next payday to order plants. *sigh* Guess that gives me more time to plan/research!


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## summersea (Jul 26, 2013)

Phew! Long time no see...err write ;-)

Thanks to the weather it has tank me forever to order plants and get everything I need for the NPT but I had a breakthrough today (thanks to warming temps this week)! I finally ordered plants and managed to get a piec if driftwood pre-scaped with an anubias! 

Here is the list of plants I ordered from Plantedaquariumscentral.com:

1- hygro corymbosa
1 - wisteria 
1 - bacopa carolina
1 - ludwigia repens (though wanted a crypto wendtii red but they sold out)
1 - Dwarf Lily
2 - Pygmy chain swords
1 - section of Java moss to float (or tie to the driftwood - haven't decided which)

Hopefully they will all do well! Here is the empty tank with just the driftwood center piece for now. Hopefully by the end of the weekend I will be able to get this party started! I am as nervous as a new mother lol


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## summersea (Jul 26, 2013)

Phew! Finally got my NPT set up! Here are the plants I ended up using:

Crypto wendtii red - back left corner
Wisteria - 2 back center plants
Hyrgophilia corymbosa - back right plant
Bacopa Carolina - mid ground left
Anubias - attached to driftwood center
Java fern - attached to driftwood on back limb
Dwarf Lily - front right corner (not sure if it will survive)
Pygmy chain sword - foreground plant

Hoping to get my shrimp and snails soon. Any thoughts/opinions are greatly appreciated. I maybe escape I into something less - boringly symmetrical after it matures. Since this is my first attempt I wanted to keep it simple! I think it ended up pretty heavily planted but hope not too heavily planted.


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## sponge1234 (Oct 29, 2013)

Looks very nice! I cant wait to see it when it is filled in! Very Nice!:-D


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## summersea (Jul 26, 2013)

Thanks! I can't wait for it to fill in either!


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## kman (Dec 10, 2013)

Looks good! I agree it's a little overly-symmetrical and too evenly spaced, however... looks a little artificial, mostly the front row? I think you could mess with the placement a little, just make it all a little more irregular, and it would be nicer. It'll all look great as it grows out regardless, though.


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## summersea (Jul 26, 2013)

Thanks kman - exactly what I was thinking! I moved the Pygmy Chain swords (put the lil center one in my other non-NPT planted tank to see if it could survive), trimmed my hygro temple plant, and moved the dwarf lily back. I don't know if the lily will survive as it's leaves are very wilted but we shall see!

I have 5 cherry shrimp on order that should be in by Tues. Then I am thinking of getting an EE as I have always loved their fins and think a NPT tank would be great for keeping them from bein ripped! 

Here is the slightly new rendition of my NPT


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## kman (Dec 10, 2013)

Much better!


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## NikiD (Dec 28, 2013)

Looking good!


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## summersea (Jul 26, 2013)

Thanks guys! I am definitely happier with how it looks now and can already see signs of growth! I wasn't expecting that so quickly - can't wait to see it fill in!


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## sponge1234 (Oct 29, 2013)

Looks good! Keep up the good work!:-D


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## summersea (Jul 26, 2013)

Thanks sponge! I will do my best!!


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## summersea (Jul 26, 2013)

My red cherry shrimp are here! Woohoo! I have attached the obligatory pic of a pair (male and female) below. I have a total of 6 with 3 of each gender. 

Now on to a new question. Before acclimating my new tiny guys I did a water check. My ammonia showed up at 1ppm. I was surprised by this as I have heard that an NPT should have zeros across the board when checking water parameters. I did a 50% water change before putting the RCS in the tank. 

Does anyone know why my reading was so high? Did I do something wrong? How do I fix this? I don't want to bring a new betta home if my parameters aren't ready to go :-(

Any help would be greatly appreciated! I may also post this question on the NPT thread to see if I can get more eyes to looks 

For now enjoy the cuteness factor of my RCS ;-)


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