# Betta not swimming much with clamped fins.



## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

He has a heated 2.5 gallon heated tank to 78* and Iremoved his filter after he got stuck in one and received two sores. After that he was fin for a few days. Then their was an algae bloom three days after, I believe. He showed signs of swim bladder( floating and staying put except to breath or at the bottom of his tank only coming up to breath). I did a 85% water change because the water was so bad. He also had the clamped fins before I changed the water. He developed a weird white veiny thing down his back and his sores look like their healing but have some white on it and much around his body has. Heras one white dot in his eye. I put in 2.5 milliliters of maracyn plus because the dose for a ten gallon is 10 millimeters. What's wrong with him, will maracyn help?


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## dash45 (Aug 2, 2012)

best thing is to post a picture if you can. so we can see whats going on along with your description.


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## Hadoken Kitty (Jan 24, 2013)

Subscribing to this thread. Please post pictures.


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## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

*Pictures*

Okay here's one, I'm still new to this so bare with me, ha.


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## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

*Another picture*

And another


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## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

The spot on his head and the beginning of his dorsal fin are his sores from the filter but you can see the white stripe?


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## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

*Last photo*

This one shows the white veiny stripe


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## DoctorWhoLuver (Feb 23, 2012)

It's hard to tell, but that looks like some sort of fungus to me...


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## Hadoken Kitty (Jan 24, 2013)

Does that look like the beginning stages of pine-coning to you guys....? It may be why the fungus is sticking so easily to the scales....bump and get Sakura or Callistra in here.


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

Hi jasperandecho and welcome to the forum. Sorry to hear about your guy and his runin with the filter.

Has he had any other symptoms like lack of appetite, darting and rubbing, or bloating?

The good news is I don't think his scales are pineconing. It's just that the mucous is making them look more defined.

It appears that he is reacting to either a topical bacterial infection from his wounds or external parasites, either of which can cause a fish to overproduce slime coat. When there is a lot of slime coat, the body can sometimes develop a cloudy film like that. 

The Maracyn Plus should be helpful for a topical bacterial infection so I would recommend continuing with that for the recommended time of dosage. If he hasn't shown any improvement, then it may be time to try a stronger medication.


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## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

It looks like velvet!!! Is this velvet? How can I cure it?


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## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

No his scales are not protruding at all, which I am very thankful fpr


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

Nope, not velvet.  It's not gold really, unless the gold isn't showing up in the pics. It's mostly slime coat.


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## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

Sakura8 said:


> Nope, not velvet.  It's not gold really, unless the gold isn't showing up in the pics. It's mostly slime coat.


What explains the clamping of his fins. Is the bacterial infection exterior or could it be internal? I have never fed him anything raw, just flakes. He has not eaten for four days.


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

The clamping is probably from the stress of not feeling well so it could be from both internal and external. If he hasn't eaten for four days, that's a little problematic.  Has he responded at all to the Maracyn Plus? 

If you do suspect he has an internal infection as well, then we'll need to treat that after we treat his topical infection.


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## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

Kind of, he's swimming a bit more. It's only been two days out of six days of treatment so well see.  well I don't think he sees the food or has interest. But he tryed attacking one yesterday but didn't and went up for air so I took it out


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## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

Good news! He ate a full meal today! But he still keeps his physical appearance. I'm taking him to an experienced pet store to see if they can diagnose him...


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## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

Okay so I strongly believe it is ich now, as the lady at the pet store said. I'm treating with nox-ich. Is that a good medication?


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

I think it is about as good as any other ich med. I've only used Kordon Rid Ich. Although, if you prefer a natural method of treating ich, 3 tsps of aquarium salt per gallon and raising the heat to 86 F will do the job too.


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## KAV 204 (Dec 29, 2012)

Haha this is a fungus from to much spoiled food. But don't worry!!! I can help you. First get him into a heated tank and raise the temp to about 80-82. Second, get som aquarium salt and put some in your tank (5 tea spoons per gallon). It looks pretty mild so it should work. BUT! If it does get worse for some odd reason then go to the petsmart, petco etc. some type of fish store and pick up some fungus meds.


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

Uhm, 5 tsps per gallon is just a little too much. Salt can severely damage the internal organs if improperly used so best to be careful and always err on the side of caution.


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## Hadoken Kitty (Jan 24, 2013)

I agree. 5 tsp/gal is too much. When dealing with the worst of cases, 3 tsp/gal is the maximum that you want to use.


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## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

KAV 204 said:


> Haha this is a fungus from to much spoiled food. But don't worry!!! I can help you. First get him into a heated tank and raise the temp to about 80-82. Second, get som aquarium salt and put some in your tank (5 tea spoons per gallon). It looks pretty mild so it should work. BUT! If it does get worse for some odd reason then go to the petsmart, petco etc. some type of fish store and pick up some fungus meds.



I really don't think it's from spoiled food because I watch him eat his food and never let it sit and I clean up his feces regularly. I don't think it's safe to put that much salt in. I have 1 1/4 teaspoons of salt for his 2.5 gallon tank, which is what the directions advise (1/2 teaspoon per gallon).


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## ANHEL123 (Jul 21, 2010)

Do not follow instructions on the box it just for preventative care . If you still treating him with medications i would finish it and then start with aquarium salt. Well i would like to Sakura confirm if i am right about it. Use as suggested by Sakura 3tsp/gall . If you raise the temp it will help to speed up parasites life cycle and help them to fall faster. Wash and completely dry out all changing equipment after each use- will kill any parasites(no host they die). Pre mix salt and make sure it completely dissolved so you don't burn him. I would also take all decorations out and wash it in hot water and live it to dry out until you sure he don't have parasites. Or you need to wash it and dry out all decoration with every change. Do daily changes. And make sure you acclimate him to the new water temperature so you don't shock him with drastic temperature difference. How he doing?


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## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

ANHEL123 said:


> Do not follow instructions on the box it just for preventative care . If you still treating him with medications i would finish it and then start with aquarium salt. Well i would like to Sakura confirm if i am right about it. Use as suggested by Sakura 3tsp/gall . If you raise the temp it will help to speed up parasites life cycle and help them to fall faster. Wash and completely dry out all changing equipment after each use- will kill any parasites(no host they die). Pre mix salt and make sure it completely dissolved so you don't burn him. I would also take all decorations out and wash it in hot water and live it to dry out until you sure he don't have parasites. Or you need to wash it and dry out all decoration with every change. Do daily changes. And make sure you acclimate him to the new water temperature so you don't shock him with drastic temperature difference. How he doing?


When I did the 100% water change I washed every decor and gravel thoroughly with near boiling water. Do I have to do it again? He's doing better, he's swimming again, but his fins are still clamped. He's sores, I believe are just missing scales that scraped off by the filter and I hope they will grow back. He still has ick and that white veiny thing on his head developed a small fuzz maybe? I'm hoping the ick treatment will kill it off though.


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## ANHEL123 (Jul 21, 2010)

I would think that fuzz may be his slime coat from the medications which is his natural defense against parasites. 
About decorations i would wash them and just keep them out of the tank until you know he don't have parasites any longer. If you have live plants take them out and quarantine them in the water without water conditioner untill you know he don't have parasites any longer.
Take the filter out.
Do you still using medications? If you finished them or if you will finish them soon i would start him on aquarium salt 3tsp/gall with daily 100% water changes.
When you do 100% water changes make sure you acclimate him. People do it diffirent ways. You can have him in his changing cup with about 15% of the water and keep adding new pre mixed water about every 5 min for about 4-5 times. This way he will get used to the new water temperature . There is a few other methods to acclimate betta to the new water temp/chemistry. I think it a bad method when you put betta in the bad and let it float for some period of time ...I am not sure how to do it, may be other people will give you instructions. 
Of course you need to add salt with each water change when you do 100% water changes. You can pre mix in in one gall jug and use it for 2 treatments. Always cover the container when you acclimate him to prevent him to jump out. They really good jumpers. My bettas always try to jump out when i keep them in their changing cup.


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## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

ANHEL123 Are you sure? Because the fuzz is in an uneven patterned line on his dorsal side.


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## Hadoken Kitty (Jan 24, 2013)

I really feel like the pet store employee was wrong on this one. Ich would look like gold specs, not white fuzz.....Follow Sakura and ANHEL's advise, as I believe that they are correct.


Sakura is one of the more noted people for dealing with fish diseases. She knows the ins and outs. Callistra is also a very good person. If you ever need any help, these two are often the go-to people on this forum.


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## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

Ich is not gold spots, ich is white sandy grains. AND he has a small line of fuzz, he's getting better when I added the ich treatment. His fins are starting to relax as the parasites die. I don't know what the fuzz is but I know those white specs are definatly ich. Thanks for the advise!  from everyone too I really appreciate it!


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## Hadoken Kitty (Jan 24, 2013)

You're right, sorry. White specs is what I wanted to say. They look like white specs, not fuzz.

Here's a really good pic of what it looks like, though.


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## Chevko (Nov 15, 2012)

I want to pipe up about the filter. I believe I bought my parents this one from WalMart when I visited last and it had a pretty strong current. Could maybe a muffled flow help out with getting him to unclamp? The bait minnows my dad put in the tank, and are fairly big then and now, seemed to stress about the increase in flow (then again the filter I replaced was at least 10 years old and hasn't had a new slide-in filter in it in almost as long).


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## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

I didn't have a filter when he started clamping. I just now put one in and he's starting to unclamp


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## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

He has that but it's only on his body and one eye not fins.


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## Chevko (Nov 15, 2012)

jasperandecho said:


> I didn't have a filter when he started clamping. I just now put one in and he's starting to unclamp


Ooh, okay. Just pass over me then! :3


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## Hadoken Kitty (Jan 24, 2013)

jasperandecho said:


> He has that but it's only on his body and one eye not fins.


And it looks exactly like that...? They're parasites, so they're not fuzzy at all. If the ich treatment is working, continue it. Though don't do it any longer than a week.


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## ANHEL123 (Jul 21, 2010)

He is probably unclamp not because you put the filter in, but may be because medication is working and he might feel better. Always treat 3-4 days longer after you see the parasites last. Because how i understand if any of them left and you don't see them especially in the gills area they can reproduce. That is why i think it better idea to use salt treatment after you finish with medications. And i also always confused with filters since i don't have them in my tanks. So if you put filter in and he still have parasites do you need to rinse and dry out filter every time you do water changes? Could parasites left in the filter media?


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## Hadoken Kitty (Jan 24, 2013)

I would assume that yes, they can be caught in the filter. I would replace the filter cartridge. Most people treat in a quarantine tank.

Does he itch or rub against objects in the tank? That's a tell tale sign of Ich. Please post pic updates of his progress! I look forward to seeing an ich-free o fungus free betta!


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## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

Okay I've got good news. He's swimming around and his swimming fins (the side ones) are completely unclaimed but the rest of his fins are still clamped. The ich appears gone but I will continue treatment for 3 more days after skipping today (as says on instructions) he has developed a peeling spot where the fuzz was, does that mean its dieing and going away?


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## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

I also took the filter out last night! He's eating like a pig and made a small bubble nest. He's instincts are in check when I put a mirror in front of his tank, he flares and does not coward (I only put it up to his tank for less than 15 seconds a few times a week because I don't want to stress him). Overall he is making great progress!


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## Hadoken Kitty (Jan 24, 2013)

Quite possible. He may have an open wound for a bit, but I would expect that to cover up soon.

The side fins are called pectoral fins. This is awesome news!!! Do you have pics!? Sorry, I'm a bit of a pic junkie.


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## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

Oh but I noticed that some of his clamped fins keep breaking then falling of. One side of his beard fin did that as well as the tip of his dorsal fin?


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## Hadoken Kitty (Jan 24, 2013)

Sounds like fin rot is taking place. The AQ salt will take care of the fin rot as well. 3 tsp/gal. No more, as this is the max dosage. Do this for one week after the Ich treatment.


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## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

It's not fin rot. I know what fin rot looks like, this looks like someone or thing fractured it and then it comes off.


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## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

Chevko said:


> I want to pipe up about the filter. I believe I bought my parents this one from WalMart when I visited last and it had a pretty strong current. Could maybe a muffled flow help out with getting him to unclamp? The bait minnows my dad put in the tank, and are fairly big then and now, seemed to stress about the increase in flow (then again the filter I replaced was at least 10 years old and hasn't had a new slide-in filter in it in almost as long).


And I always muffle the flow with the water bottle trick!


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## Hadoken Kitty (Jan 24, 2013)

Fin rot doesn't always include gray or black areas on the fins. Sometimes it progresses fast enough to just make whole parts of fins fall right off.


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## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

Hadoken Kitty said:


> Quite possible. He may have an open wound for a bit, but I would expect that to cover up soon.
> 
> The side fins are called pectoral fins. This is awesome news!!! Do you have pics!? Sorry, I'm a bit of a pic junkie.


Maybe in a few minutes, Because I have to use my good quality camera and idk if its charged, I will try!


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## ANHEL123 (Jul 21, 2010)

I think do not overdose with medications , just do one course of the treatment(but do not stop on the middle of the treatment) and continue with salt that will help with wound and parasites. If you can do it for 10 days.And do not put filter back , less water movement is better for him now. And still continue with washing and drying all changing equipment after each use.


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## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

What changing equipt ment? Like for water changes.


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## ANHEL123 (Jul 21, 2010)

anything that you using to change betta( a net, or if you using a cup, siphon , thermometer, filter)well you don't need to use siphon now since you do 100% water changes, anything that you really have to use when you change him.
How i understand anything in his tank can have parasites so if you will put his silk plant or share the same thermometer with oyu other fish they can get parasites. Also how i understand , but i always too protective and extra careful (better be careful than sorry later) i would take the gravel out and rinse it the hot water and dry them out to make sure any parasites can be left in there died. And the same with decorations, and especially of course if you have live plants you just have to keep them out and quarantine for a few weeks. So basically anything that touch him or go in the water in his tank has to be just rinse and dry. And with parasites luckily its very easy you don't have to disinfect like from other disease, its enough just rinse in the hot water and leave outside for a few days or if you can in the sun to dry out(no host parasites die)


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## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

And when should I do this? I don't want to shock him with another full cleaning and 100% water change?


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## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

So here are some photo updates. On his dorsal hump in this photo, I'm concerned about is weird fuzz, it almost looks like parasites? What do you think? His fins are unclamped and he's swimming happily!!!!


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## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

He also has a coating over his face.


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## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

His tail has always been crippled but now it's beginning to split, is this fin rot???


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## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

Here's another tail view


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## ANHEL123 (Jul 21, 2010)

I think it look like, i don't know if it can be from irritation because of the parasites. If you will acclimate him right way you not going to shock him. Can you make sure that the new water is approxematelly the same temperature as his? I but bettas for other people sometimes and i keep them on my work table sometimes for 2 weeks just to make sure they healthy before i give them to owners. And i do daily water changes and i keep them in the store cups. Don't get me wrong i just don't have another choice, because i have my betta on my work table and it not a lot of space. And my new water always the same temperature, i never had any problem. So i would definatelly would do salt treatment.


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## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

ANHEL123: okay I will try it!


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

I read through the thread and I'm not 100% sure what is happening but from what I can see in the pics, the betta's fins are FINE. Messing with them, medication or otherwise, could result in a problem with resistant bacteria. 

In regards to the picture of the fuzz: slime coat. If your betta was in AQ salt, he may have a bit of excess slime coat that he is in the process of shedding. There are really only a very few external parasites that are visible to the naked eye and bettas only get two of them as far as I know: ich and velvet. He has neither. If he had ich, you were able to get rid of it but he definitely doesn't have it now.

His fins are also perfectly fine. As much as we'd like them to, a betta's fins will never remain as perfect as they were when we first got them. Those long fins of theirs are very very fragile and delicate and when we release them into bigger tanks where they can properly exercise, they are going to put wear and tear on those fins. The only way to keep them pristine is to keep them in little cups or bowls where they can hardly move and that is definitely not advised.

For future reference, the best way to treat ich is in a small hospital tank with 3 tsps of aquarium salt per gallon and the heat at 86 F. At that high heat, the ich parasite is actually unable to complete its life cycle. The AQ salt helps the betta create the necessary slime coat to shed the parasites into the water; it may also kill some outright as freshwater parasites cannot live in saltwater and vice versa. Daily 100% water changes will get rid of the parasites before they can reattach. This is a much safer way to get rid of ich than proprietary medications, which should only be used if the ich proves resistant.

In regards to sterilizing a tank from an ich infestation. If possible, remove the betta and any other live organisms (plants, snails, shrimp etc) to a hospital tank for treatment. Meanwhile, do as close to a 100% water change as possible without tearing down the tank. Crank up the heat in the tank to 86 F or even higher since it's empty. In a matter of days, any freeswimming ich parasites will be dead. Lower the temp and return the residents when they are cured.

This treatment is also the best way to treat velvet and other cases of suspected external parasites such as flukes. It is best not to use proprietary medications unless necessary, especially in the case of suspected external flukes when a diagnosis can only be made with a tissue sample and a microscope. 

Other than all that, he looks very good and quite healthy. Is he acting and eating normally?


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## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

I'm going to change him to a 10 gallon in a few days once I get it balanced and heated. I'm doing the QuickStart thing. So wont this be like a 100% water change? I gave him a 50% water change but I dot have a lot of water left. He's eating normally. He's still a bit under e weather meaning he hangs out on the top of the tank in the side of the glass but then when I walk in and he sees me, he will perk up. Thanks Sakura for the info!


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## alwaysaBettaLover (Mar 28, 2013)

Your poor betta!!!!!!! Awww.....those pics just break my heart.... :-(


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## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

alwaysabettalover: he's better now, just ugly but as long as he feels better!


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## ANHEL123 (Jul 21, 2010)

Follow the directions from those two links for 10 gall tank. I am glad he is better
http://www.bettafish.com/showthread.php?t=107771

http://www.bettafish.com/showthread.php?t=115758


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## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

Okay new problem guys! He freaked out when I did a cup sized water change and hid behind his heater AND is laying sideways breathing hard through his gills. What's wrong?


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

Has he improved at all now that some time has passed? The heavy breathing could be because he was frightened.


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## jasperandecho (Mar 27, 2013)

Yeah he's better, but he's still lingering around the heater at the bottom of his tank. And he's terrified of me. When I walk by he darts all over the tank like a bouncy ball in a small room. The heavy breathing has past. Why is he so afraid if me? 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

Sometimes when a betta gets scared, it takes a few days (and food) before they get over their fright. If he seems extra nervous like that, maybe try turning off his tank lights for a few days.


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