# WYSIWYG or not. How to spot the difference.



## LotsOfBubbles (Jan 31, 2015)

This may be impossible to answer!

I have recently discovered (by looking at things on Facebook) that a Betta shown for sale can 'colour-up' after several weeks in their new owner's homes. Mainly white / pale coloured finage can become dark blue, dark red or whatever. 

For me this is a bit of a complication as I tend to like white / pale colouration on Bettas and would like to buy what I see, and for no changes to occur later. I'm still looking to buy my Betta.
*
So I'm looking for hints, tips or signs that may indicate if a Bettas pale / white finnage going to stay as it is, or if it will likely colour-up later.*


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## MattsBettas (Dec 18, 2012)

Not sure what WYSIWYG stands for? Edit: nevermind. Google revealed "what you see is what you get". 

You're talking about marbles, which are bettas that are genetically programmed to change color- often in response to a change in environment. The best way to avoid them is to avoid fish with any random specks or patches of color, solid white or clear (cellophane) fish are more likely to retain their coloration than a marble with specks and splotches.


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## LotsOfBubbles (Jan 31, 2015)

OK thank you. So its only marbles this applies to? (just that the pics I saw didn't seem to be a marble IIRC more like your standard solid colours - I may try to find those pic on the web again). 

I will have a read up about the marbles changing colour - seems very interesting. Here is one thing though. If you had two tanks both different, would a marble revert to the same pattern/colour if moved from one tank, to the other and the back again? - ie Does the pattern change to some environmental conditions (like water temp, hardness, light levels, gravel colour etc) or is it a matter of change of environment prompts a colour/pattern change but what that change finally looks like is more random?


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## Aqua Aurora (Oct 4, 2013)

You'd need to scrutinize a photo and get a 100% white Betta to avoid thn changing. I bought a white with cellophane genetics and some spots of red delta last fall, the red is spreading but for 4-5 months it's not much (small photo: Oct 2014, larger photo Feb 2015). However with a marble they can do an EXTREME color change over night at any point... Or hardly non at all.. 
His body scales are white but the light tends to make him look pink at certain angles


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## MattsBettas (Dec 18, 2012)

I can't think of an example of a fish that will genetically change color (as opposed to coloring up as a result of improved environmental conditions, like heated water or better food) that wouldn't be considered a marble or a marble something (ex. marbled grizzle). Fish with the marble gene can appear solid, though they still have the gene- and have the potential to change. Often people buy beautiful marbles that show up from overseas and then change to awful blue/red combinations that look nothing like the same fish. 

The pattern change is random and will not change to the same pattern if moved back and forth between tanks. All I meant was that changes in the environment seem to be linked to prompting a color change, the change isn't dependent on the exact environmental conditions though, and can happen without any change.


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## LotsOfBubbles (Jan 31, 2015)

OK Thanks for your replies. Seeing I'm only going to have the one male Betta I think I will now definately avoid marbles. The one I get has to be just right or as near as I can get it. But a marbled-gene solid puts the cat amongst the pigeons!


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## MattsBettas (Dec 18, 2012)

Marbles can be some of the most beautiful fish, and some are fun and exciting to watch change. Don't count them out completely! 

No problem .


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## BettaStarter24 (Mar 24, 2014)

I currently have one marble (and one potential marble) and he's changing so slowly it's been hard to see without comparing to old pictures. I bought him as what I thought was a cellophane with a black dot on his dorsal fin, later found out he was actually a yellow butterfly but now his tail is going grey and he's got black spots all over his body. 

My other guy (in my avatar) i recently bought, he has a lot of potential of marbling. 

Now, the fish you see in stores, sometimes look pale but color up darker due to better water conditions, they arent marbled, they just got pale from stress. My old boy Cas was this way I believe, white body, red fins, by the time he passed he had red in his body. 

there's marbling and then there's coloring up. Marbles are really fun to watch, so don't count them out just yet, but you'd want to avoid random splotches of color if you really didn't want a marble.


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## indjo (Jun 6, 2010)

White opaque and pastel like colors (specially with really thin irids) may change as they get older . . . sorry not really change, but the NR and blond genes may be overcome by red and black that the white fish may eventually have some red/black on them. There are various beliefs on this, some say it's food related, others say direct sun light. IMO if the NR, blond, and opaque genes are incomplete or not strong enough, tints of red or black will appear. 

What looks to be a red cambodian, if it had red dots (sort of - grizzle like)) on body may become more red when older. And as stated above what looks to be pale in poor conditions may color up in better conditions.


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## Crossroads (Jun 28, 2014)

Marbles are interesting, but not always prone to change. They are literally a grab bag surprise. My guy Cain is a very unstable marble (went from being mostly white to mostly black in a matter of 1-2 months) while Aristodemos(my avatar fish) has hardly changed at all. (which is awesome because he's a really unique looking fellow and all of his brothers at the store marble quickly and become blue-black. He has stayed half white, half blue-black.)

Marbles are fun to watch but pretty easy to spot usually:
For example this is Cain right around when I bought him. I knew he would marble due to his body coloration. And marble he did.















After 1 month:















He's currently sticking close to that second set of pictures but filling in the white patches in the black areas.
Butterfly patterned fish may or may not marble. 

Dalmatians like my late Angelos are stable and shouldn't change.


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## kittenfish (Dec 1, 2013)

indjo said:


> White opaque and pastel like colors (specially with really thin irids) may change as they get older . . . sorry not really change, but the NR and blond genes may be overcome by red and black that the white fish may eventually have some red/black on them. There are various beliefs on this, some say it's food related, others say direct sun light. IMO if the NR, blond, and opaque genes are incomplete or not strong enough, tints of red or black will appear.


Ooh that explains my cellophane girl's color change. She had a little bit of red on her fins when I first got her, which quickly faded, and then a year or so later the red came back along with one or two black spots.

Nov. 2013:









Jan. 2014:









Feb. 2015:


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## Sadist (Jan 1, 2015)

The non marble ones that color up are just pale at the store because of the cold, dirty water. Good breeders on aquabid will show the fish at their full color, so you can probably get what you see from there.


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## LotsOfBubbles (Jan 31, 2015)

indjo said:


> White opaque and pastel like colors (specially with really thin irids) may change as they get older . . . sorry not really change, but the NR and blond genes may be overcome by red and black that the white fish may eventually have some red/black on them. There are various beliefs on this, some say it's food related, others say direct sun light. IMO if the NR, blond, and opaque genes are incomplete or not strong enough, tints of red or black will appear.
> 
> What looks to be a red cambodian, if it had red dots (sort of - grizzle like)) on body may become more red when older. And as stated above what looks to be pale in poor conditions may color up in better conditions.



You have me at a disadvantage...what does NR stand for?

Are all random splish splash colourings indicative of a marble? Thing is I do quite like some of those but I'm still going to avoid a marble on the chance it changes and I don't really like the outcome so is there any way to tell the difference between marble and non marble splish splash colours or are all splish splash colours going to be marble? (I mean splish splash as in random patterns randomish colours). I see Crossroads has mentioned a Dalmation and I've seen some described as Koi that had splotches of colour. I have not got my 'eye in' to be able to discern what it is than makes a pattern a marble or a dalmation etc.

I've also noticed I'm liking the Bettas with pink faces - I think they are cute and you can see their eyes easily and what they are looking at better. So the likelihood is they will lost the pink face and go black/red there? Going black would work with the second lad but not the first.


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## indjo (Jun 6, 2010)

I'm sorry,
NR = Non Red. It changes red pigments into orange, yellow or white.
Blond removes black pigments.

There is no way to know marble or not other than from the breeder or from long term observation. The color changing process may exhibit any pattern.


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## LotsOfBubbles (Jan 31, 2015)

Thank you


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## LolaQuigs (Mar 28, 2010)

It's crazy how drastically marble fish can change. The only indication that my current betta was marble when I got him was a small dark patch on the top of his head and a few dark scales on his side, and now he is almost completely blue.


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## Sadist (Jan 1, 2015)

Wow, that really is a huge change! My grizzle male continues to add green to his body and some of his fins -- he almost looks like a butterfly now but not quite.


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## LolaQuigs (Mar 28, 2010)

Two of the three marbles I've had experienced crazy big changes like that! My first betta was the guy in my avatar. He ended up completely blue and turquoise piebald!


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