# Is my Betta just sleepy or is there something seriously wrong?



## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

First, I am sorry I have been posting so much about my betta the past few months. He has been battling disease after disease and I freak out when anything seems the least bit wrong with him...

The reason i'm posting this is because, All day today he has been acting really lethargic and clamped. But, he is showing no other symptoms. He's not pale, not bloated, no fuzzy patches, nothing. 
So, i'm wondering. Last night I woke him up about four times. Once with a Flashlight, once actually turning on the hood light and the other two times just looking at his tank. I didn't mean too, but I put in a new heater and I was making sure it didn't overheat (I worry a lot). 
So, is he just tired or is he really sick?

Housing 
What size is your tank? 5 Gallons
What temperature is your tank? 76-78 degrees
Does your tank have a filter? No
Does your tank have an air stone or other type of aeration? No
Is your tank heated? Yes
What tank mates does your betta fish live with? None

Food
What type of food do you feed your betta fish? I switched to Omega One Betta Buffet Pellets last night.
How often do you feed your betta fish? Twice a day, two pellets each time. 

Maintenance 
How often do you perform a water change? Twice a week
What percentage of the water do you change when you perform a water change? 50% each time. Once just water, once with gravel. 1-100% a month.
What type of additives do you add to the water when you perform a water change? Stress Coat Plus

Water Parameters:
Have you tested your water? If so, what are the following parameters? N/A


Symptoms and Treatment
How has your betta fish's appearance changed? None, just clamped fins.
How has your betta fish's behavior changed? He is acting really lethargic.
When did you start noticing the symptoms? This morning.
Have you started treating your fish? If so, how? I turned off the light in his tank since he seemed a bit stressed. It seemed to help a bit.
Does your fish have any history of being ill? Oh, yes. When i first got him he went though a period of Extreme and I mean EXTREME stress, he was lethargic and pale. Just this month he got ick and fin rot. The rot is still healing.
How old is your fish (approximately)? I don't know.

Again, I am sorry for posting another thread about Mr. Plum. 
Thanks in advance!


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## Tikibirds (May 26, 2011)

when was the last water change? 

maybe something icky got into his tank from the new heater or something that was on your hands?


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## SpookyTooth (Dec 23, 2011)

I'm not an expert but it could very well be the heater. If it's an adjustable heater you could always rub your fingers gently around the adjustable valve and see if there's any gunk there. Sometimes the valve will get slime over time anyway, but sometimes it's really unpleasant and just seems unnatural.

Once you've done this... smell your fingers. Smell the water, see if there's a rubbery or unpleasant smell that doesn't make sense. Heaters can and do malfunction sometimes... you just have to be unlucky enough for it to be one you're actively using.

If your heater isn't adjustable still give the water a good ol' sniff and see if you find anything around or on the heater that may indicate it's leaking fluid. I don't know if said fluid is toxic to fish but at the same time I don't see why it wouldn't cause such a change to your little guy's behaviour.

I had a leaking heater in the past (luckily there weren't any fish in the aquarium at the time) and it took me a while to actually spot that the heater was leaking this weird gunk into the water. If in doubt, unplug the heater, give it a good rinse and fill a sink with water; then submerge the device (with it still be off and unplugged) and check around all the seals to see if you notice anything leeching into the water.

If worst comes to it you can leave the heater submerged in the sink for a little while and check if there's any unusual gunk/fluid in the sink water. If there is you know it's the heater - of course wrap your guy's tank up in towels or blankets if you're worried his aquarium will go cold while you do the testing.

Best of luck and I hope all is well soon!


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

Update: Today he is pale on top of being lethargic. 

@Tikibirds- The day before He started acting lethargic, I did a 100% water change. Should I put him in QT with new water and clean the heater to see if it helps?

@SpookyTooth- Well, I actually took out the new heater when I woke him up one time. I had read some bad reviews after I put it in so I was really worried. I put in his old heater that I've never had a problem with. It's a Tetra Submersible Heater for 2-10 gallons. 
Should I put him in QT with new water and clean the heater and see if it helps?


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## Tikibirds (May 26, 2011)

I am not fish expert but usually whenever I see a fish acting unusual, I always do a water change to see if its a water quality problem. 

Since you don;t have a filter, do a 100% water change and clean the tank just in case something nasty got in the water/tank.


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

Can I put him in QT with new water, so I won't have to totally clean his new tank again? If it helps and he gets better then I will clean the 5 gallon.


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

Update: I put him QT with new treated water and there is no improvement! I'm really worried because this is how my other boy Lucky died. Same pattern and everything. I will post a link to the thread about Lucky.

Here is the link! http://www.bettafish.com/showthread.php?t=85820


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Is it also an acrylic tank? although there are many people rooting for acrylic tanks, I find scratches can hold toxins, and release them.

How old is the conditioner you use?
Have you tested your tap water? bring in a sample of your tap water to a pet/fish store, and they can tell you what's in it. It could be from what is in your tap water - for instance, here, our tap water never kills our fish. Even when some people forget tap water conditioner (yikes!) the bettas don't even show stress or illness (wheew!). While say... somewhere else, their metals are through the roof!


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

No, this tank is Glass. My conditioner expires in 2014. I have never tested my tap water so I will take it in when I go to Petco. Do I need to add my conditioner to the water I take in? 

Recently, my county changed the water and started adding some new stuff. They didn't tell us what they added, but it was something weird and a lot of people in my county are mad about it. Could this have something to do with it?


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Do this:
sample 1. is tap water NO conditioner added.
sample 2. is tap water with conditioner
You'll need to see if you can find out the metals and their levels, chlorine, and other cleaners.

If something was added, it could have been killing your fish. If anyone else wants to pipe up, I'm not sure how to make the water safe for the fish (some use bottled water but it is NOT recommended)


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

I was thinking of buying API's master test kit. Will this be good and tell me what I need to know?

Update! Whenever I look at him in QT he is either at the bottom or at the top. Upon closer inspection it looks like he has an open sore on his face. I tried to get a picture but, he keeps moving around and I can't can't a good one.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

I have an API kit as well, but it doesn't tell me metals. Still get the metals checked if you can.

could you describe it?

1. where is it?
2. what color is it?
3. is it fuzzy?
4.how are his eyes?


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## Tikibirds (May 26, 2011)

Is there anything he could of hurt himself on?

Master test kits test for ammonia, nitrIte and nitrAte and i think two other things. Its good if you are trying to cycle the tank but I won't tell you other stuff thats in the water.


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

I tried to draw a picture of what he looks like. I'm on my phone so the picture might be a bit big. 
Please excuse my poor drawing skills. 









The sore isn't fuzzy and it's kind of a Yellowish-Brownish color. It looks like there is a sore on each side of his head in the same place. So, I don't if it's always been there and I just didn't notice it. Though I have never seen it before.
His eyes look kind of hazy. Their not swollen or bulging out. 
He is getting more and more pale as time goes by.

I have double checked his tank and there is nothing he could have hurt it on.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

ammonia burn. Sounds like ammonia burn, or a toxin has "burned" his face plates. I've seen this before on many fish who have a burn of somesort - either 1. ammonia 2. chemical 3. metals which would also explain the clamped fins, and pale color


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

I don't know how he could have gotten ammonia burns. I always keep up with water changes. I have never used anything with chemicals around or on his tank. 

What can I do to help him?


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

well it could be chemicals in the tap water... which is why I recommended getting it checked out. I am not sure what you can do, to dilute any possible toxins...


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

Ok, so if I take the water to petco will they test for everything? I will try to get out today and do it. 
Will, he be okay for today? Should I put him back in his big tank? What should I do to make him as comfortable as possible?


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

I forgot... sometimes tap water has high ammonia. sometimes.

I don't think it'd do him any good to put him back. It's better to have him in this smaller container. I do believe they test for metals and chemicals. Tell them, that there is something in the water that's hurting your fish, and when you find out what it is, buy a conditioner that "neutralizes" whatever it is.
best to do it ASAP. otherwise he might not make it.


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

Ok, I can't drive myself so I will have to get someone to take me. But, I will get out as soon as I can! 
Right now his QT is at 76 degrees. Is that ok?
After I get back from Petco I will post the results!


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

see if you cannot get the temperature to at least 77. hot water bottles, usually last 2 hours. if you place them around (not against) the tank.


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

I have a heating pad that I could set on low? I also have those rice things that you can heat up. They get pretty hot though.


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

Update! Ok, so I took both my water samples to petco and the worker said my water was perfect. No, chlorine, no ammonia, nothing! I explained everything and she said to put him back in QT with AQ salt and that it would help with his color and thy he would get better......

So, what do you think I should do? I got some test strips (I know liquid ones are better, but it's all my mom would buy me). He is still pale and everything. I will try to get a picture later but, it may take a little bit.
Sorry for double posting!


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

hmm... Well, it sounded like a burn of somesort, so now I wonder what the heck they put into your tap water that people dislike? Aquarium salt will work for ammonia burns. Dissolve it first and add in small amounts.


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

So, I should put him back in QT with AQ salt? How long should I keep him in treatment, For five days or the full ten? When you mean small amounts, like make the dose smaller or actually do half normal water half salt water?


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

1 tsp of Aquarium salt per gallon to start dissolved firstly.. the quarantine is how big again?

Add over a period of time rather than all at once.


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

The QT tank I will be using is 2.5 gallon completely bare besides the heater.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Okay. You'll want to dissolve I'd say 2 teaspoons right now. Add over a period of half a day. You don't want to shock him with too much salt 
After that, you can do another 2 teaspoons of salt, added over the course of the day, slowly. That'll have you at 2 teaspoons per gallon (minus the half gallon).


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

Ok! Thank you so much for your help! I will keep you updated!


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

You're welcome  and I hope he gets better!


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## bahamut285 (Dec 10, 2010)

Sena Hansler said:


> Is it also an acrylic tank? although there are many people rooting for acrylic tanks, I find scratches can hold toxins, and release them.


Glass tanks scratch as well. I honestly don't think aquarium makers would be in business if their acrylic tanks were not fish-safe. 



Sena Hansler said:


> ammonia burn. Sounds like ammonia burn, or a toxin has "burned" his face plates. I've seen this before on many fish who have a burn of somesort - either 1. ammonia 2. chemical 3. metals which would also explain the clamped fins, and pale color


Metals don't cause burns. Heavy metal poisoning is often quick, sudden and without symptoms or warning


@Arctic: If it is indeed a burn I would keep a watchful eye on putting SALT on a BURN. Normally I repair ammonia burns with 100% water changes and a double dose of Stresscoat+


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

Here are the pictures I promised! He is just laying at the bottom of his tank...


























His belly looks kind of grey/white. This is the best picture i could get.


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## bahamut285 (Dec 10, 2010)

How much exercise do you give him? My CT was acting the exact same way for about a week because I was away. I was really worried about him, so I let him have some flare time with a hand mirror for about 10ish minutes (1 min flaring, 2 min break).

Just throwing out an idea because I personally think he looks fine? (remind me, is he in a QT?)

Pretty much 100% water changes SHOULD help him out, unless there is something detrimental with your water source


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

Yes, he is in a 2.5 gallon heated QT. But, when he got sick he was in a 5 gallon, heated, tons of plants, two caves and flaring exercise everyday! He is juust laying at the bottom all clamped up. He has lost so much color its scary.
And there nothing wrong with the water it's been checked four times. Twice at Petco, Twice at home.
I just don't know what's wrong...


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

He looks fine to me, now seeing the pictures. His poop is normal and everything too?

I will note I had one betta who scared me a bit :lol: he'd act up, like he was all sick, then he'd be better without me even stepping in. Make me wonder :| do fish get "colds" too? xD (meant as joke not fact)


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

His poop looks a little darker then usually but, not a lot different from the normal brown. But, it's not white and stringy. 
So, he is just pretending to be sick?

This his normal coloring. So, he doesn't look fine to me (Not trying to be rude).


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

:lol: it's not being rude to inform 
I do see the difference in color. can you get him to flare? look at his gills for color (pink, red, black, etc)

also shine a light on him.. see any odd coloration that is there.

it may be just me, or the pictures, but does he seem to have a yellowish color to him??


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## bahamut285 (Dec 10, 2010)

Sena and I just mean that he physically looks OK (i.e. No scarring or lesions)


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

His gills have always been red and they still are. He did eat today so there is no loss in appetite!

bahamut285- Ok, I understand. That's good though.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

hmmmmm bahamut, any suggestions for this little betta? :lol:

Is that yellow (as seen in the pictures) just a picture/light thing? or is it actually on him?


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

Its just the lighting. I have checked for velvet and everything else under the sun that can be seen. I just have no idea...

Can fish be Immune Compromised? I'm just wondering because it seems like I can't go two weeks without something being wrong with him. 

I want to thank both of you for how much you've been helping me. It means a lot. Mr. Plum means so much to me and I just want him to get healthy and stay that way!


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Okay making sure!!

And actually, my boy Shiloh has suffered through a beating (cichlids? gouramis? another betta?? idk.) he's scarred up on one side of his face, can only half flare... he finally stopped biting his fins (20 gallon x.x high-demand fishy..) but now he got ich. He's got constant problems :lol: 

I've also had another boy, super low immune system: Dusk Falls. A pretty little boy, but acted all suffering diva like for simple things like food change, water change, etc x.x

So yes, some bettas can have lower immune systems or lower tolerance. Which is why now I am soooo careful with each new member, until I can learn their limits.


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

I guess I'm just going to have to be extra careful with him.... I just wish I knew. This is the second time he has had a period of sickness like this. The first time it happend was a week or two after I bought him. 
I just thought of something... Lucky died three months after I bought him. Getting fin rot first, then showing the same symptoms as Mr. Plum is showing now. I have had Mr. Plum for three months, he got fin rot and now he is sick like Lucky... Strange Pattern. Although, Mr. Plum isn't nearly as bad as Lucky was. Just makes me wonder.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Hmm high maintenance fishy :lol:


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

Yes, but aren't they all? Haha!


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

xDD Eh...some of mine are a "mind their own business as long as they are fed and water is clean" fish x.x then Shiloh... And El Dorado are my main high maintanence xDD


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

Well, I will give an update on his condition tomorrow. Fingers crossed that he's better!


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

I hope so!! I wish ya luck


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

Thanks!


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## WineDarkSea (Oct 8, 2011)

Hi Arctic Rain,

Was the heater by TopFin?

I'm just learning the ropes of betta care myself, but once you mentioned the heater, your symptoms and everything sounded just like something I went through with a new TopFin heater.

My Valentine was perfect, I put in the heater, and within hours he was clamped, pale, and lying on the bottom of the tank. I noticed there was some bubbles/foam on the water by the filter, which I believe now was caused by whatever toxin leaked off the heater. When I did WCs and dumped the old water it the tub, it foamed a lot. Did you notice anything like that?

My Valentine did survive and recover. He already had a scarred right gill ever since I got him, but now both his gills look a little scarred to me; and it does sound like your boy's gills look like that too. To treat, I put him in a QT tank, daily 100% water changes, and while researching on this forum, I took some advice OldFishLady had given someone else in another thread about poisoning, and added fresh activated carbon to the QT tank to extract/counter toxins. I used 1tsp/gallon AQ salt for the first three or four days, no salt for a few days, then switched to 1 tsp/gallon Epsom salt for about a week. The reason I switched to the ES was that I noticed his gills and head looked swollen such that his profile had changed so he actually looked like he had a forehead rising above his little jaws.

And, because it can't hurt, I also asked my sister to do (long distance) Reiki on him.

He still ate, like your boy, but he lay there clamped for about a week before slowly regaining his strength, and that was after only three hours of exposure to that heater. Further research on the net reveals a *lot* of people with dead fish they track to a TopFin heater.

I should mention I have very hard tap water, which my two fish seemed pretty much accustomed to, but after the heater, Valentine's rays (he's a crowntail) began dropping off, which I read can be in reaction to hard water. I think the heater toxin taxed him so much he could no longer tolerate what he was doing okay with before. He then went through a bout of fin rot where the rays had fallen off, despite salt in the water and daily WCs: the poison hit him that hard. If it's the same thing, you should be prepared for complications after this from a weakened immune system as well.

I think since you removed the heater as soon as you did, sounds like within a few hours, and got him into a QT tank in clean water, he's got a chance. Like I said, Valentine lay in QT for a week or so before he started to perk up, and took another week to get his strength back before the fin rot struck. This is not a quick fix, but my sense here is that since your boy survived the initial poisoning, that's the worst of it and he'll hopefully pull through.

As a note: I had water changed the heck out of Valentine's tank and put carbon in the filter for the whole three weeks or so Valley was recovering. The day after I put him back in, with a clean bill of health, he started hiding in his cave; odd behavior, he's very social and that's something he'd only done while he was sick. He was in a cycled 3.5 gal, but I tore it apart, soaked the tank in scalding water, and threw out the gravel. Put him back in an all new tank, and he was fine again. I think that the gravel soaks up the toxin and re-releases it. Tank is acrylic, but it doesn't seem to be releasing anything; just the gravel.

I don't know if you even had a TopFin heater, but your experience sounds close enough I thought I better speak up.

Best wishes for your little guy. Would you like me to ask my sister to do some Reiki on Mr. Plum?


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

First, thank you very much for taking the time to post your reply!
The heater was an Aqueon Heater but, I had read some bad reviews about it leaking toxins into the water. I removed the heater only out of fear that it would leak something. Maybe it did... Your case sounds exactly like what could have happened to Mr. Plum. Reading your case with Valentine definitely made me think, and I think we may have an answer to his problems. The two cases sound so alike in so many ways!
I will leave him in QT and see what happens. Did you put any decorations in the QT tank with your betta?
About the Reiki, anything helps! So if your sister is willing to do it, tell her I said Thank You!

Thanks again for telling me your experience! You may have just figured out what's wrong with him, why it happened and a possible cure! Maybe there is some hope for my little guy yet!


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## WineDarkSea (Oct 8, 2011)

If it is the same thing, I recommend getting the fresh activated carbon into the QT tank ASAP! I did give my Valentine decorations. Since he was lying on the bottom, I wanted him to have the option of being right at the surface for breathing, so I gave him his betta log and his plant with wide silk leaves. He was too sick to even look at it, though, or try to do anything to help himself. He could only lie there. Honestly, for the first week I thought he was dying, except that he was eating. He would swim to the top for food. Then I started to fear he had survived, but sustained such damage that he could only suffer and I might have to euthanize. It was really bad, and if this is what your poor Mr. Plum is like, my heart goes out to both of you.

But, however bad it looks, eating is good. As long as he's eating, you've got a lot of hope. Valentine looked that bad, and he made a full recovery. Oh, btw, another thing that I did is soak his pellets in garlic juice; it's supposed to be naturally antibacterial. I don't know that it did any good since poison is not a virus, but it doesn't hurt and I've read most betta like it. 

I have emailed my sister about the Reiki and will let you know what she says. You're taking great care of him, and he can tell how much you're rooting for him: he knows and it really does make a difference.


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

Thank you, I hope Mr. Plum doesn't suffer too much. I don't think he would ever stop eating though, he is my piggy. I will put his Betta log in and a silk plant in the QT. 
What does the carbon do? Just make the water softer? My water is already soft so, I don't think that's a problem. 
I really do think I caught it soon enough so that if it is this it won't leave a lot of damage. 

Thank you again, I also believe that they can tell that you really do care for them and want them to get better. Hopefully this story will have a happy ending.


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## WineDarkSea (Oct 8, 2011)

I think you saved his life when you pulled that heater out. One of you had a guardian angel at work that night!

Carbon is nothing to do with hard water; I'm sorry, I seem to have given the wrong impression.

Fresh activated carbon absorbs toxins, which is exactly what you need. Here's a couple of links:
http://www.aquariumslife.com/saltwater-101/activated-carbon-in-aquarium/
http://www.algone.com/aquarium-articles/aquarium-filtration/activated-carbon

You give it to your fish the same as poisoned humans take charcoal: it absorbs toxins out of the system. So the idea is that having it in the water will hopefully be able to draw the toxins out of your fish's body. Humans are given liquid charcoal to drink, as I understand it, but I never heard of making fish eat it; just putting it in the water.

That's why you can also use the activated carbon in the filter of your contaminated main tank; it'll absorb toxins out of the water and maybe anything else they would have soaked into it. The gravel was apparently too porous though, as I said: I had to get rid of the gravel.

I think you caught it soon enough too. As horrible as the poisoning looked, Valentine is right back to his active flirty self. He's even got a new game of hunting bubbles. Mr. Plum survived the poison full in the face, so it's all uphill for him now. Just let him go real slow and at his own pace and try not to get too scared. It did look really bad and take a really long time. Just get that carbon in there!

Thank goodness for the piggies! I think it helps them a lot when they're going through rough times. Just you keep feeding and pampering your little guy. As long as he's eating, it means he's fighting and he wants to live. You said he's always been a sickly boy, but for him to survive the heater, his spirit has to be powerful. When it comes to the line, that means a heck of a lot more than anything physical.

I really sympathize with both of you. I'm crossing my fingers and hoping for a happy resolution too!


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## SpookyTooth (Dec 23, 2011)

I'm sorry I disappeared last night when trying to help, we had a bit of a family emergency. I'm glad you've gotten more help though (and from more experienced members too :lol, ArcticRain and hope that Mr. Plum feels better soon!


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

WineDarkSea - Thank you very much for all your help! I really do appreciate everything you've done and I'm sure Mr. Plum does too. 

SpookyTooth - That's alright, things happen. 

Update! He is swimming around a bit more today, still clamped but trying. He is also eating like the little piggy he is and has gotten a bit of his color back. Things are looking up!


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

It's pretty hard some times to find out what's wrong. When Spartan went through his mystery poisoning problem (the poison killed other fish, leaving him alive) I tested the water, as the tank was cycled... nothing wrong. Filter was working. threw away gravel. threw away ornaments and fake plants. then lastly...threw away the heater (ugh. there went money ;( ) 

because I thought it could be leaking something... even though everying kept telling me it was impossible for "a manufacturer's heater to leak harmful chemicals" :| In the end, it was the tank (sigh) but, yeah. :lol:

I have a topfin heater   Also, when getting another heater I've been recommending people to test it out in something of equal size for 1. overheating 2. not heating. Maybe now there is another test: foamy appearance? o.o

And may I ask what Reiki is? o.o


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

Reiki is a Japanese technique for stress reduction and relaxation that also promotes healing. 
I really hope I don't have to throw away everything that was in his tank. I JUST redid everything and bought all new decorations... That would be really depressing to throw it all away.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Well I don't think you need to throw away anything  if it is the heater, I'd pull it and get a new one (tested in another container first). Rinse decor and fake plants, and gravel, with hot water and vinegar half and half mix. Then rinse really really well with lukewarm water.  Can do the same with the tank.

And oohh ok never heard of it


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

I already returned the Aqueon Heater and put in my Tetra Submersible heater that I have never had problems with. I have heard about the vinegar method but, I have never used it. I usually just use really hot water and a day in the sun to really clean the tanks and supplies. But, they may not be enough this time...

Random Question, how much could a used heater go for on Craigslist? I have never had any problems with the heater but, I was thinking of offering it with a kit that I'm selling for an extra fee.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

depends what size of heater, and remember the initial price you paid... you'll be asking for lower since it is used. Then add the kit, at whatever price you feel fits. People look for deals


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

It's a tetra submersible heater and I think I paid $20 for it originally. 
I'm selling the kit for $15 which I don't think is enough but, my mom refuses to let me sell it for anything more. I feel that the kit is worth at least $20. Besides the kit it's self, I'm also adding things like a net and some other supplies. Any ideas?


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Well what does the kit include?
I've got tetra too :lol: it's the 2.5-10 gallon that works better for anything under 5 gallons.

ok, well you can go with 20 kit +... we'll say 10-15 (up to you!!) for heater... together "with the following items:" will make it to 30-35. depending what's what


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

The kit is the Aqueon Betta Bowl Plus 2.5 gallon. It comes with everything I got with it and comes in original packaging. 
The kit includes.

2.5 gallon mini bow- great condition!
Tank hood with incandescent light
Filter with one filter cartridge in original packaging. 
Divider, food sample and water conditioner sample. All in original packaging. 

Then I added in a Net, small kritter keeper and thermometer. 

I think $20 is a fair price for all of it since it's in great condition and since I have only used it for 2 months. 
Then I though I would post a blurb saying that if they want the heater it's $10. 
What do you think?


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

That's a good idea! That's actually a good price for all that.


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

I just hope someone in my town will buy it. There is not very many fish people in my town an I don't know if I could handle having an empty tank in my closet. It probably wouldn't stay empty for very long....


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

:lol: you're talking to the one who has...4...3 gallon...2 10's....1 20.... 1 29... :lol: Nothing DOES stay empty. you tell yourself "just one" then end up with 4


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## WineDarkSea (Oct 8, 2011)

Hi Arctic Rain! So happy to hear your little guy has perked up a bit!

My sister did the Reiki session for Mr. Plum at about 2:00 pm Eastern Standard Time. I give the time because I noticed when she did it for Valentine, I would see immediate improvement in him and then find out it coincided with the Reiki session.

Sena, Arctic Rain did a really good job of describing Reiki. It's a Japanese method of energy healing, which is why it can be done long distance. My sister used the pictures of Mr. Plum posted here to tune into him.

Please keep up with the updates on Mr. Plum!


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## WineDarkSea (Oct 8, 2011)

I'm sorry, I got my time zone translations wrong, because I live in a different time zone than she does. I have to correct myself. She started the Reiki session about 3:00pm -- actually closer to 3:30 -- Eastern Standard Time.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

That's very interesting o.o and would explain why I didn't know what it was


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## bahamut285 (Dec 10, 2010)

As a Buddhist: 
ಠ_ಠ


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

:lol: you have too much time, bahamut.


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## WineDarkSea (Oct 8, 2011)

Just wanted to let you know this is what my sister reported about Mr. Plum's Reiki session:

_"I think Mr. Plum is still feeling very sluggish, but he's already on the road to recovery and just needs to recuperate for a while._"


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Well there ya go that's good.


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

bahamut285- Haha!

WineDarkSea- Tell your sister I said thank you! He seems to be getting much better! I put a leafy plant in the QT tank and I've seen Hines rest on it twice so far. 

Sena- Yep! He seems to be much better!

Here is an updated picture of him! Sorry if it's really big!


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## Lucille (Dec 20, 2011)

He's beautiful!


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

Thank you!


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## WineDarkSea (Oct 8, 2011)

My gosh, what a lovely vibrant beauty he is! Did he get his full colors back or is he this pretty and still pale?

So happy he's feeling better!


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

His body it's self I back to normal but, his fins look a little ratty. His fins usually look more bright. Right now they look a little dark. But, not pale. 
He is my awesome guy. He's the one you know you'll never find another one of. That's why I have a tendency to overreact when he looks the least bit sick, I guess this time thats what saved him.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Oh -.- I know. With my yellow male. :lol: I completely understand lol


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

I love your El Dorado so much you can't even imagine. He is just a stunning yellow. Where did you get him again? Wasn't it at Petsmart or something?
(I promise I'm not a stalker who creeps all your threads....)


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## SpookyTooth (Dec 23, 2011)

He looks wonderful!


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## bahamut285 (Dec 10, 2010)

Guys...please stay on-topic. How is he feeling today? #nochattingplz


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Arctic, he was a return from an Edmonton store, to this lame one.
And yeah!! I'd like to know how the little fella is doing :lol:


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## ArcticRain (Aug 11, 2011)

Much better!! I think he is almost recovered. I can tell that he is still a little sluggish but, I think I will put him back in his big tank soon. After a clean it all and let everything dry I'm the sun of course. 

Thank you everyone for all your help with my little guy and all your concerns about Mr. Plums health! I have really learned a lot in this experience and I never knew that him being lethargic would result in this 9 page thread. 
Thank you all so much!


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

that's good to hear!!


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## WineDarkSea (Oct 8, 2011)

Yay Mr. Plum! What a beautiful little fighter he is, to get through all his other problems and then this on top of everything! I am so happy he's doing well.  You're doing such a great job caring for your little guy.


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