# 2 Males together?



## Vier (Feb 1, 2012)

This is more of a hypothetical question, but..HYPOTHETICALLY! How big of a tank would you need to safely house 2 male bettas together? I'm really curious because obviously they live in the wild together, with their own territories and get chased out... fish get killed in tanks because there is not enough room to swim away when they encounter each other, so. How big of a space do you think 2 bettas would need to coexist? This is assuming the tank would be heavily planted and have hiding spots throughout the whole space.


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## copperarabian (Apr 27, 2011)

A heavily planted and cleverly designed 50g that allows the fish to establish they're own territory's. They'll still probably have the occasional battle but they should be able to retreat.


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## Vier (Feb 1, 2012)

I have a 72g tank in the house that I might one day be able to stock myself so I was wondering how possible this would be  Id be stocking with other fish, and probably a bunch of girls but I thought maybe 2 males might work too.


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## MistersMom (Aug 9, 2011)

that sounds interesting....let us know how it works out!  i'd have 2 back up tanks just incase :/


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## diablo13 (Jul 1, 2011)

I would do 2 males OR a sorority. I'm not going to promote having 2 males together, but If it's VERY well planted, like more than a sorority, and you have them seperate in different community tanks to see their personality with other fish, and theyre both really calm, I guess just maybe, but having males and females is just asking for trouble.


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## Vier (Feb 1, 2012)

Yes, I didn't mean I would do both genders. I intended to do a sorority, but then it occured to me that maybe just 2 males could potentially work. I'm wondering if anybody has tried this...or has a large enough tank to try... I can't find anything on google on people trying this, except this thread: http://petoftheday.com/talk/showthread.php?136153-Bettas-together-and-living-Peacefully and it seems that most people are still saying its a badidea in a 55g. I wonder how big their territories can be in the wild. I've only got one boy and a family member is thinking about another... they are in individual tanks but eventually, if I get the big one set up, I might give it a shot and if it does not..back to their respective places, no harm done.


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## MistersMom (Aug 9, 2011)

and yours is bigger...id give it a try!


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## LittleBettaFish (Oct 2, 2010)

Personally, I wouldn't risk it. Most male bettas will actively hunt down competitors no matter the tank size, and even if there is no fighting, it will be very stressful for whatever male is the weakest.

Using the whole 'betta-in-the-wild' scenario is pretty pointless. Wild bettas are nowhere near as aggressive as domesticated splendens, who have been selectively bred for aggression. I have wild bettas and it is rare that any of mine have fought as viciously as two splendens.

The only way I could ever see it was working was if the males were siblings that had never been separated. But I would still want a minimum 3-4ft heavily planted tank to ensure fights and chases were a not so attractive option.


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## Badjer (Oct 25, 2011)

Personally it's not something I'd ever be comfortable with doing. I know Oldfishlady has some males together, but hers were selectively bred over many generations and she has LOTS of experience. If I were you I'd get some tips from her or another person who has done this successfully before attempting it.


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## GreenTea (Jan 31, 2011)

I'm frustrated I continually see people recommending it. There is really no reason to do it other than to see if they won't kill each other. Put a divider in that big tank, bam. Two males, no risk. Stop telling people to plant it heavily and put two males in there! Fish release hormones into the tank, and as others have mentioned, two males will hunt each other down. There is no reason to do it, so just don't.

When males work out in tanks together they have been together since they were born or very young and grew up together. Even usually then it doesn't work out.


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

Bettas are very territorial and are solitary fish. I would never recommend putting males together, heavily planted tank or not.


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## Bambi (Sep 11, 2011)

You should do a wild tank. ^^ You can buy wild type bettas on AB. They aren't as finny and bright as what you're used to but alot of the time you can keep males and females together, even multiple pairs or trios depending on the type.

Alot of wild types are mouthbrooders instead of bubblenesters.


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## Olympia (Aug 25, 2011)

A wild type tank would be awesome^^


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## Badjer (Oct 25, 2011)

Just do your research if you decide to do a wild tank. Some species require different care and environments than our splendens.


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## LittleBettaFish (Oct 2, 2010)

I have wilds and there are some species I wouldn't house two males together.

Even in pairs, the females can sustain a lot of fin and scale damage, particularly before spawning I have found. 

Albimarginata and channiodes are very peaceful fish that can be housed in groups with no real aggression.


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## Arashi Takamine (Mar 3, 2011)

I think the only way it would work would be to try to get ahold of a whole spawn and raise them together. I believe I heard once that males and females if they're siblings and raised together can still remain together as long as their not seperated.


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## SDragon (Sep 26, 2011)

My friend had a 50g that was planted relatively well. She had like 6 mollies and 5 other fish along wth the two males. They did great!!!


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## Arashi Takamine (Mar 3, 2011)

But SD Dragon not all betta's act the same. They have their own temperments. Some females can't stand being in sororities and honestly I think even with the heavily planted tank..Two males is one of those questions that really doesn't need to be asked because of what they do to each other.


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## GreenTea (Jan 31, 2011)

+1 AT

How long did they do great for? Until they died? Sometimes males might be ok for a day, few months, or even a week. Eventually, it will probably not work out. Making a divider is so easy, there is literally NO REASON to do this!


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

Even males raised together will fight.


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## Vier (Feb 1, 2012)

I was really just curious and wondering how successful other people have been if they tried. I dont think I will now, instead go for a sorority or import a centerpiece male in the future.


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## GreenTea (Jan 31, 2011)

Ok, good. And just to be clear, you mean keeping the male separate from the girls, right? Because putting him with females is another terrible idea.


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## Vier (Feb 1, 2012)

Haa yes. I wish I could though! I love both, yet room is limited and I dont like the look of divided tanks.


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## GreenTea (Jan 31, 2011)

Just curious, why don't you like them?


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## Vier (Feb 1, 2012)

Visually just...unappealing? Hard to say, from photos I've seen, it just looks very shoddy and jarring, as opposed to one whole landscape that fish can swim from end to end. 

otoh, something like http://media.photobucket.com/image/recent/divyb/PA190689.jpg looks nice! Its even and clean. http://media.photobucket.com/image/recent/divyb/PA190689.jpgcompared to something like http://images.yuku.com.s3.amazonaws.com/image/pjpeg/e7216342fa88e40ea418bd84bdad990c8921b49e.pjpg which I don't like the look of. I personally dont think I can pull it off and make it look 'nice'

My goal is more of plants everywhere! http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/aquarium-pictures/displayimage.php?imageid=5239 A divider will throw the look off, unless there are some good ones to get inspirations from?​


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## Tikibirds (May 26, 2011)

I dont like the look of divided tanks either. I had 2 and only liked the look of one. One had an asian theme and th eother was a bunch of random decorations thrown in the tank


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## Curlyfatbottom (Sep 29, 2011)

Two mellow male can be kept together.
With a open tank.
Other then that then no.
Some sibling can be kept also.
But you can't change anything in the tank.


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## bettafish15 (Oct 3, 2010)

Curlyfatbottom said:


> Two mellow male can be kept together.
> With a open tank.
> Other then that then no.
> Some sibling can be kept also.
> But you can't change anything in the tank.


No. Even if the males were mellow, they're still likely to fight because it is INSTILLED IN THEM.


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## Curlyfatbottom (Sep 29, 2011)

I've second that.
Mellow male won't fight.
Plus no plant or decoration inside of the tank.
So The male won't establish a turf.
The most male I've ever kept together was 6 from different Bloodline.
One alpha and 5 that lost the will to fight.


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## Bombalurina (Oct 10, 2011)

That sounds to me like 5 males who are far too stressed to fight due to having no cover and being constantly exposed to other aggressive fish. That sounds like a very cruel way to keep them.


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## Olympia (Aug 25, 2011)

Uhh.. what.. they lost will to fight? Which probably means they fought a lot, until they were too beat up to do so? For lack of a better example, that's like tiring out a lion so it can live with zebras. From what I get, a betta NEEDS to have some sort of territory to feel comfortable.


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## TorisExtraordinaryBettas (Nov 12, 2011)

at least 50 yet it depends on the temperment of the two bettas. you can try it but make sure when you do it you have the time to watch them and make sure they dont kill each other.


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## Curlyfatbottom (Sep 29, 2011)

Not really
Cause all of them show color on stress line.
I think it cause when there young.
They never gain any turf or show any aggressive.


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## Bombalurina (Oct 10, 2011)

Bettas come from really heavily vegitated bodies of water. They need that turf. Without cover, they feel stressed and vulnerable to predators and to other fish. A betta doesn't have to be showing stress lines to be stressed.


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## Curlyfatbottom (Sep 29, 2011)

True.
Clamp fin,fish staying at the bottom or top and staying at a single spot.
My saying is if there no fighting among each other with no rip fin.
All the fish are health and can be kept together why not do it.


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## LionCalie (Sep 24, 2011)

The fact of the matter is Betta's were originally domesticated and bred specifically for fighting. In the wild their fights don't last very long, but through specific breeding they have been engineered with the desire to continue a fight as long as they can. Obviously as their popularity grew people began to want to keep them as pets and to show. Fighting started to lose its social acceptance. So the Betta was engineered once again, but this time beauty outweighed desire to fight. It was never really bred out of them though.

The result are fish with the heart of a lion, in very delicate bodies. 

People ask "Why not try males together?" which I reply with "Why risk it?"


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## Luimeril (Dec 29, 2010)

also, you gotta remember this:

_*just because it works for one person, doesn't mean it will work for everyone.*_

a very good example is sororities. i've seen some that work. beautiful, colorful girls. no stress stripes, no fin nips.
then, i've seen sororities where all the girls are dull, visibly stressed with stripes and clamped fins.
then, i've heard stories of near constant fighting, or the owner waking up to all but one beaten up girl dead.

just because you can keep x-number of (obviously unhappy) males together, doesn't mean everyone can, or should. it _will _end in horror and tears.


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## SnowySurface (Apr 25, 2011)

Curlyfatbottom said:


> True.
> Clamp fin,fish staying at the bottom or top and staying at a single spot.
> My saying is if there no fighting among each other with no rip fin.
> All the fish are health and can be kept together why not do it.


I will give you the same answer I give everyone who swears up and down a betta only needs a 0.5 gallon unheated bowls with monthly 100% water changes. If this seems like a rant, that is because it is very direct and to the point. If it seems a bit harsh it is because tone in forum post. 

Just because your fish are healthy does not mean you are right. 

Just because your fish aren't nipping at each other anymore does not mean you are right.

Just because a pecking order was established does not mean you are right.

Just because your fish aren't dead yet (and I do mean yet) does not mean you are right. 

There is a difference between living and not being dead yet. The males who have lost the will to fight are not dead yet. There is a difference between thriving and surviving. The male who does have the will to fight is surviving by constantly intimidating an endless line of opponents. That is no way for any creature to exist even if the creature is able to adapt. 

I will admit that my 5 gallon cycled tanks I am re-cycling for each of the new betta fish is a betta paradise. I will also admit that people with much simpler set ups have had fish for longer than I had Luigi and Snowy. By no means do I believe my way is the only right way. If a unique set up works for a unique situation then I'm gald when the person found a way around a problem.

However, I do call people out when they do something just because they feel they have a right to do something. If your curiousity about how well males can live together is satisfied, rehome your fish properly so they can thrive while living for the rest of their lives. Even if your curiousity isn't satisfied because you want to know who long males can live together before the inevitable happens, rehome them properly anyway. 

I wouldn't start a sorority in a bare tank with no hiding spaces... -_-


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## bettafish15 (Oct 3, 2010)

SnowySurface said:


> I will give you the same answer I give everyone who swears up and down a betta only needs a 0.5 gallon unheated bowls with monthly 100% water changes. If this seems like a rant, that is because it is very direct and to the point. If it seems a bit harsh it is because tone in forum post.
> 
> Just because your fish are healthy does not mean you are right.
> 
> ...


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## Curlyfatbottom (Sep 29, 2011)

Most of my offspring live longer then 2 years.
Can be kept together.
My male can be breed two time in a month up to three month with great success.
Just because a male won't fight or flare at another male.
Don't make him unhappy.


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## Luimeril (Dec 29, 2010)

i will say it again, curlyfatbottom.

_*just because it works for you, doesn't mean it will work for everyone.*_

that means, that just because you can have males live together, doesn't mean anyone who's new to this should. i've kept bettas for 2 years. all of mine, except my CT and my new Veil, can live in plain sight of each other with little to no flaring.

does this mean i'm gonna put them in a tank together and force them to live together? 

HECK NO!

my boys and girls are happiest in their own tanks. with their own territories. with the ability to hide in their plants or caves from each other whenever they feel stressed.

clamped fins and inactivity, like you say your males show, are signs of them being stressed. 

which means, in simple terms *they aren't happy*.

stressed fish get sick easier than happy, not-stressed fish. it's a proven fact that stress lowers their immune systems. i'd rather my fish live in their own, unique tanks, than shove them together because i can. :I


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## Curlyfatbottom (Sep 29, 2011)

No I was replying to the last post.
Stress fish won't breed and don't live as long.


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