# $1 Otos @ PetSmart!!!



## Xaltd1 (Dec 9, 2012)

I went to PetSmart yesterday & discovered that the otocelifer catfish were on sale for $1! (1/2 price.) I ADORE these guys. I bought 12 (I had 2 already) for my girls' 29 gallon. The fish are TINY! Neon tetra size. They are amazing algea eaters. I bought 5 for a 2.5 gal w/ a bad green algae problem. The little guys hd the tank sparkling within 3 days. The problem is that these are extremely delicate fish. They are wild-caught in rivers, and prefer cool, soft water with a good current. I lost 3 fish in 4 days. That being said, the 2 remaining are awesome- I looked them up on the web, and they can live 6-9 years in "classic" tropical tank temps if they're healthy. I expected to find a few dead otos this morning, but all are doing well. I did take almost 12 hours to adjust thier bag water to the temp & Ph of the tank; I think this helped. I'm sure I'll lose a few, but that's why I bought so many.

They are chowing down on the algae in the tank & the driftwood. The bettas aren't intimidated by them, but they enjoy a good chase! No betta can outswim the otos, so the otos don't take them very seriously!


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## registereduser (Jul 30, 2010)

Do you mean otocinclus? I love them, have 2. $1 is an amazing price!


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## Xaltd1 (Dec 9, 2012)

Yes; I can't remember the spelling between the otos and the ocef... whatever, I have 4 of the latter.

I just did a head count, and I can see 12 at a time. Since there's some of the tank I can't see (behind the driftwood & plants) I assume they are all OK. Apparently they often starve to death in fish stores b/c there's no algae. The have to be in an established tanks. These guys must be starved- they're eating like there's no tomorrow! I wonder if they can overeat them selves to death? I had one pass that had a very swollen belly. I'm guessing my bettas would eat a dead oto quickly, unless they have barbs-


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## Xaltd1 (Dec 9, 2012)

P. S. I love Anderson Cooper! How stunning!!!!


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## registereduser (Jul 30, 2010)

Xaltd1 said:


> P. S. I love Anderson Cooper! How stunning!!!!


Thanks! A Petco find


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## Xaltd1 (Dec 9, 2012)

I try not to look at the males @ petco/smart; I don't have room for more (actually I do, but I don't want another tank to take care of). They are getting better & better fish. I was in Petco buying a replacement bulb when I saw an entire shipment of bettas come in. I went to the fish-manager-guy and told him that I was a betta addict and that under NO circumstances was he to let me leave that store with another! He totally understood b/c the people who work there have tanks & temptation everyday! Like working in a candy store. I peeked at the boys, then got out b/f I fell in love.


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## Elsewhere (Dec 30, 2012)

I had Otos for a while, and "swollen bellies" means QT as fast as possible- it's a disease that I never managed to classify. Of course, if it's a healthy swell that means "OM NOM NOM DIS IS GUD", like a small little regular size swell, it's fine, but even a little over that can wipe out your whole tank. It sucks. I wish you the best with your little guys, they're so entertaining! I wish I could get more, but my last experience... I just can't :/


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## Xaltd1 (Dec 9, 2012)

This one was dead by the time I noticed it's belly. It's really hard to know a nom-nom-belly vs. bloat belly when you've never had experience w/ the fish. According to the web, they're supposed to have a little belly. I wonder if they CAN eat themselves to death? Bettas can. I know where you come from; I originally had a shoal of albino cory cas. Something asymptomatic wiped them all out in 24 hrs. I'll never get over that. As for my oto, if I had noticed, I'd have QT'd the poor little thing :0(
These fish aren't popular enough for them to have a disease analysis board for them. Couple that w/ a $1 price tag & they're almost considered disposable fish.


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## xShainax (Feb 11, 2012)

I lost 3 to bloat and one to dropsy


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## InfiniteGlory (Dec 17, 2012)

i have been thinking about getting some oto's too. Since this price is hard to pass up how many would you think I would need for a 4 gallon planted tank?


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## registereduser (Jul 30, 2010)

InfiniteGlory said:


> i have been thinking about getting some oto's too. Since this price is hard to pass up how many would you think I would need for a 4 gallon planted tank?


just one for 4 gallons but they like to school so more is recommended


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## GhostFeather (Jun 23, 2011)

Man,I drove right past Petsmart yesterday!!!!!
Bill


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## InfiniteGlory (Dec 17, 2012)

I was thinking one due to the size of my tank. I did read that they like to school but I feel with the one betta and snails that 1 would be a good start.


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## Xaltd1 (Dec 9, 2012)

It depends on your algae. I really needed help w/ the algae on my real plants; anything else, you can wipe off. I read somewhere that you "need" 2 per gallon, but they're so tiny & seem to like being with each other- I'd try 5-6.
I'm amazed all 14 of mine are present and accounted for! And eating like crazy!
I also read that they can die from getting caught in the nets we use; I got & used a shrimp net for them. I've also learned that they need driftwood to nibble on.
This is just from me scouring the 'net. I don't know how much is fact or fiction. They are all over my driftwood!


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## InfiniteGlory (Dec 17, 2012)

i get brown algae breakouts ever now and then, but mostly it's my fault because I missed a WC. but it also seems that my snails can't keep up with the cleaning. so I am thinking 2 should be enough.

no driftwood at this moment


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## Elsewhere (Dec 30, 2012)

You really shouldn't have Otos in anything less than a 10g ABSOLUTE MINIMUM. They are much more active than people think, and they go through that brown algae in about four days. Mine wouldn't switch over to algae pellets and I had to continuously feed them zucchini, which sucked. They need a lot more room to swim than you think, trust me.


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## InfiniteGlory (Dec 17, 2012)

so even one wouldn't be a good fit for my 4 gallon?


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## Xaltd1 (Dec 9, 2012)

These fish are amazing!!!
My glass looks like it was cleaned w/ Windex from the inside, even the dark spots of algae!!!
Now, they're working on the driftwood & plants. I WISH they'd get around to the gravel (I was going to replace the gravel, but we'll see if it's not too rough). They cleaned the glass while the bettas (and I) were sleeping; the girls don't like their view obstructed by a little fish, so they butt them off. 
I have a plastic net around the filter intake to keep it from jamming w/duckweed. It's covered w/ the brown algae. I was just going to replace the net, but now it will be food! I can put another net on the filter, & drop the old one in the aquarium for a snack. Hopefully, more algae will grow on the new net & I'll have food for the otos. They DO have a lot of plant cleaning to do.
Now I'm worried that I WON'T have algae. I'll have to start experimentingw/ algae wafers. Maybe there's one kind they like. I usually have frozen veggies, maybe I can concoct little, microwavable mixes for them. I'm thinking that it would be a good idea to start supplementing the otos w/ shredded, boiled carrot & spinach now.


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## Xaltd1 (Dec 9, 2012)

I read that otos "need" driftwood. At Petco, they sell waterlogged pieces w/ plants attached. I have one of those, and I boiled some dead wood from outside that grew algae very quickly. They like that "wild caught" wood better than the Petco wood, but they're all over both pieces.


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## Elsewhere (Dec 30, 2012)

@Infinate Glory: No, sadly. Not even one little guy.


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## Xaltd1 (Dec 9, 2012)

The littlest ones seem to like the company of others otos, too- they break off in 3's, while the larger (still not big!) ones strike out on their own.

@Infinite Glory, there are some super little fish & critters you can have! Amano & Red cherry shrimp are amazing to watch! They keep plants tidy, clean up detritus and have basically no bioload. I have 30 cherry shrimp in a 5 gallon stuffed w/ plants. Right now they are small; if they grow large enough to not be lunch for a betta, I'll toss some in the betta tanks.


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## GhostFeather (Jun 23, 2011)

I went to the PetsMart near me,they only had 2,I bought them along with 2 Albino BristleNose Plecos for my 55.
Bill


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## Xaltd1 (Dec 9, 2012)

I guess other people got my message ;0)
It was in the Petsmart "sale" web flyer. I just happened to stumble into the sale when buying cat food for my "boss". (They're his fish.)


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## Nicci Lu (Jan 7, 2013)

A fat oto is a happy oto. Unlike bettas, they can't eat too much. Usually, it seems that the life threatening bloat is one that is higher up on the belly. And they start acting differently, stop hanging out with the other otos in the tank and don't move very much. I lost one to that- at the end it was resting with its head out of the water. Poor little thing. Females can also be bloated when they are gravid. 

I use a solo cup and my other hand to shoo them inside when I need to catch them. I find it easier with these fast little guys, and I'm always afraid their odontodes will get caught in any type net.

They're not like plecos- they don't really need wood. It just has a nice indented surface that tends to hold lots of yummy algae. But any pitted surface will do nicely.

Xalted1, if you're worried about running out of algae, try Repashy's Super Green. My otos _love_ it. In fact, they're getting spoiled now- they turn their noses up at the zucchini. Or, you could put a piece of wood or pitted rocks outside in some old tank water and grow more algae for them.

I started out with 2 otos, and then got two more. The behavior change was amazing after I added the last two- they are so much more active and just seem happier. I would never recommend anything less than four- at least 6 is even better.


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## Fieldz (Apr 6, 2011)

True, Ottos are amazing and hardy fish which eat alot of algae. Just dont forget that they grow up to 2 inches!


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## Xaltd1 (Dec 9, 2012)

Nicci- ADORABLE pic!!!
I had my 1st death this morning :0( s/he looked perfectly fine, and all were swimming normally when I turned the lights out last night. I bougth 12 b/c I assumed a few would not acclimate properly, but all have lived out the past 4 days but this one.
The problem is they pass so quickly w/o symptoms! The one that died w/ bloat must have bloated up in the few hours b/f s/he died; I would have noticed.
I agree with them being happy w/ lots of company. Even if one is on a plant, it's usually not too far from his buddies on the driftwood!
I put a few small algae wafers in the tank b/f lights out. this AM they were untouched; just turned to mush on the tank floor. Now, 24 hrs later, the wafers are gone. Of course, the girls could have eaten them. Jeez, I wish I had an infared camera on them during the night, and a "fish cam" on during the day.
I was thinking about growing my own algae. I also got some green algae sheets. Pet Solutions Aquatics has a "grazing block" that sounds ideal- greedy bettas can't steal it (not that they wouldn't try!) and it wouldn't muck up the tank like the wafers.
I will try the Repashy's Super Green. I want my little guys to be healthy. Funny, they aren't going anywhere near the intake netting, which is all gunked up. Being river fish, I didn't think the suction would bother them. Maybe they can't chew on the net. I could use the net to colonize more algae on some smooth stones.
Thanks!!!


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## Nicci Lu (Jan 7, 2013)

I'm sorry about your loss. Even though it's accepted as a given that some otos will pass in the first month, it's still sad, especially if you take fish losses personally like I do. At least he/she got to spend its last days in a nice tank, and not that bare cell at the the store.

They don't usually respond to treatment very well, either. I tried with mine, but they're so sensitive, especially during that first month. By the time you notice something's wrong, it's usually too late.

I've been wanting to try the algae sheets, or nori which I've heard is basically the same, just cheaper. You'll have to let me know how it works out. Be careful about the algae wafers you feed them. Most contain fish/seafood protein, and otos just aren't meant to digest that type of protein. It can cause problems with their digestive tract. I know a lot of people feed them stuff like the Hikari wafers, but IMO it isn't healthy for them. The only commercial food I've found so far that is appropriate for otos (ie, 100% vegetarian) is the Super Green and Nutrafin Max Spirulina tablets, which I haven't tried.

My otos have hung out on the filter intake before. It doesn't seem to bother them. Yours are probably just finding plenty to eat elsewhere. When I notice a buildup of diatoms on the upper leaves of my plants (where my otos don't go), I shake the diatoms off so they fall lower. You could try that.

I never actually see my otos eat the food I give them, either. They hang out right next to it, but don't seem to actually touch it. Then, I look a few hours later and it's gone.


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## Xaltd1 (Dec 9, 2012)

Yuck- I bought a box of Omega One "Super Veggie Green Seaweed" & a clip. It turned into gross mush that the otos don't seem to give a hoot about! Now I have to clean up a mess- they don't seem to be eating it.
They do seem to be paying a little attention to the algae wafers: I'm using the Hikari 100% veggie sinking wafers. I ordered the Rashapy algae gel blocks & TetraNature Algae grazing blocks. ($75 of oto food: this guarantees they'll die.)
Now, my worry is that, since bettas are carnivores, and the Synodontis are "more carnivorous" (I use bottom-feeder sinking pellets for plecos) that the otos will get into the carnivour's food & it will kill them!


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## Xaltd1 (Dec 9, 2012)

To clarify, Hikari makes several sinking wafers. (I'm reading the "Pet Solutions: Aquatic" catalog, but a lot of these products are in Petco.) They have vegetarian algae wafers, and the sinking wafers for cory/pleco types. I have both kinds b/c I have both kind of fish, but I've been feeding my Synodontis the small sinking pellets b/c the fish are small & it's easier to "dose" a small amount of food.
The Synodontis I have are basically fry-- 1/2 the size of the bettas, and are buried under the driftwood at the back of the tank. I use a drinking straw & long tweezers to "shoot" the sinking pellets to the back of the tank just b/f I turn the lights out. They get eaten. I wish the Syndontis were more outgoing- they are beautiful fish; just not good w/ bettas. I'm going to wait until they (hopefully) get to about 2+", then maybe sell them.


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## Aluka (Dec 25, 2012)

You brought $75+ worth of Otto Food?  You must be feeding an army! I have one little bag of it, and i use it to feed my ottos and pleco. That bag is still 90% full after 3 months. ....


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## Xaltd1 (Dec 9, 2012)

I guess I'm...optimistic? I still have 13 otos!!!
(It included shipping!)
Also, it keeps me out of PetCo/Smart. I can NEVER walk in and "just" buy food.


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## bettafishgirl (Mar 29, 2013)

How many can I have in a 5 gallon tank with one male betta?


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## Sparrowhawk (Nov 19, 2012)

Shush everyone, you're making me want otos!

I wish I could have those cute little guys in my tanks, but alas, they're unfiltered NPTs. I'm assuming they need water circulation, and that their requirements are not limited to good water quality, is that correct?

I'll have to live vicariously through the people in this thread.


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## Xaltd1 (Dec 9, 2012)

Otos, 'they" say, are river fish & "need" a swift current. HHmm... they seem to be OK in my 29 gal! I have the filter baffled & directed toward the back of the tank. The bettas can avoid it, but it's there for the otos- eventually they ate the algae off the back of the filter outtake. The intake & thermometer is another matter!
I've only lost 1 out of 14 otos this week; I'm thrilled. I'm convinced they need lots of company & areas to swim.


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## Xaltd1 (Dec 9, 2012)

This morning I saw 3 dead otos under the glob of decayed seaweed sheet I put out the night before.
Sigh; I got out my 12" pinchers & a cup to dump them in... but wait! Where are the dead otos???
It turns out that the little cats were feeding UNDER a sheet of algae! When I put my pinchers into the water, they shot to the other side of the tank!
I tested my water; the nitrates are up a bit: maybe due to algea sheets?
I removed the algae, vacuumed the gravel & did a 1/4 PWC.
Live and learn; how can I keep the otos happy w/o driving the nitrates too high?


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## Aluka (Dec 25, 2012)

wont your nitrates go up just because you added 13 ottos? there is a higher bioload.


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## Xaltd1 (Dec 9, 2012)

Yes; they are TINY fish, though; none even close to 2". I honestly thought 1/2 would be dead by now! So far, I've only lost 1.
I tested agin later; my nitrites are 0ppm but nitrate was up 5.0ppm.
I changed another 5 or so gal of water, and changed the charcoal part of my 3-stage filter (the sponge needs changing, the other part was changed last week- you can't change all 3 at once, according to the filter directions). I added a bit of "Nite-Out" & "Microbe-Lift Special Blend".
This AM, I had another betta down. She is listing & bloated. 
In the 29 gallon I have 10 bettas, 13 otos, & 4 synodontis= 27 fish, but not 27 
inches of fish, but add a few Ramshorn snails & I am pushing the bioload.
I've got to attend my ailing fish- she's in a hospital tank, then do another liquid test.


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## Aluka (Dec 25, 2012)

I think synodontis are kinda agressive for the ottos? I'm not sure lol, but dont they get pretty big? They are going to out grow your tank pretty soon, lol

i wish i can keep 10 bettas in my sorority, but i only have a 10 gallon! lol


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## Xaltd1 (Dec 9, 2012)

My #1 problem is that I'm an impulse buyer. These were on ebay for CHEAP so "what the heck? I'll get 4!" (I was shopping for a good bottom feeder).
B/f I bought them, I learned that they were hardy fish, & that they didn't get more than 4". AFTER I bought them, I read more on-line articles: I can't get any to agree on the "final" size: it ranges from 4" to 20"!!!!
These synodontis are very young- about 1", (hence the low price) and they are TERRIFIED! I have 2 pieces of driftwood & they are under them. I rarely see more than 1 fin. The bettas are MORE than curious- I've found the girls staring intently at what appears to be plain gravel... I thought they were nuts until I realized a synodontis must be under the gravel.
What I want is one good-sized synodontis that will "come out and play" b/c they are sooo beautiful! I'm one of the few that thinks plecos are, um, unattractive & kinda gross- they remind me of my ex husband ;0) I think I'll wait until these 4 grow out (as I hope they do) then sell them. Good sized ones get a nice price. I'd like one to keep until it gets too big (a couple of years? I may have a 55 gallon by then!) I hope that they learn that the bettas don't want to kill them, just play!
The otos hae no interaction w/ the other cats. If a betta gets too curious, they zip around the tank like they're on fire.


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## Nicci Lu (Jan 7, 2013)

Veggies don't seem to have much effect on nitrates. I have to leave my zucchini in for over a day because the otos won't touch it til after 24 hours, and I've never noticed a difference. Perhaps there was just too much of the seaweed? Try smaller portions, it might help. Or get some floating plants if you don't already have some to suck up the nitrates.

Hope your sick betta gets better!


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## Xaltd1 (Dec 9, 2012)

I'm going to try algae grazing blocks. My order just came in today! It's tough to know how much to feed them. I'm scared b/c they can starve to death. I'm convinced that's why some die so fast when you bring them home. When they were in QT, I put some of my algae-coated ornaments & plants. They are teeny fish, but boy do they eat!!

I kind of hate floating plants- they clog my filter intake. I went on Aquarium Plants .com & found some that look like I could suction-cup them to the tank wall.


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## Nicci Lu (Jan 7, 2013)

Yea, if they go without eating too long during transport then their gut bacteria dies off and they can't process food even they later start eating. I'm paranoid too about mine not getting enough- it's hard to tell with these guys. I just keep an eye on their bellies. As long as they don't look concave and they're pooping a lot, they're ok. I think it took mine a good two weeks after I got them to finally start getting nice and plump.

My floating hornwort is good at staying put. In fact, I use it to corral my frogbit, which does drive me to distraction with its tendency to zoom under the filter outtake. The suction cups are a good idea.

If you got the Super Green, make sure you prepare it right. The first time I did it, I microwaved it too long and it didn't set properly. So, when I put it in my tank it was really loose. Along came my betta, who decided to plow right through it, kicking it up everywhere with his fins. What a mess! That gave me nitrites at .25. Little stinker... Microwave the water _first_, then add the powder. You can pour it in a small container, put a piece of yarn it and let it set. Instant grazing block that you can hang.


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## Xaltd1 (Dec 9, 2012)

AWESOME idea about blocks on a rope! I think I'll use cotton twine. I was smart for once & bought a container of suction cups @ Christmas time (used for hanging mini lights on windows) so I got like 24 for $1! (Better than $24 for 1 @ Petco!!!)
Bettas are such little monkeys!!!! Probably why I love them so much. It's like thay say to themselves, "What's this? Can I eat it? Can I swim through it? Can I destroy it?" no matter what they see!

Once a plant of mine once released some sort of floating, teeny pale blossoms, and these litte plant bits overnight clogged my intake so bad the filter shut off. What a mess & aggrevation to get rid of it all!


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