# Blackwater attempt failing to lower ph levels



## Betta man 123 (Aug 5, 2015)

My Veiltail betta is currently in a 2.5 gal and I recently discovered his ph was off the charts! I didn't have the same brand of filter as the tank and I discovered it had way too much charcoal in it so I removed the coal. His ph remained too high to even read above 8.4!:shock: I'm too afraid to lower it chemically so I was turning it into Blackwater with extract and oak leaves, in hopes of straightening his fins which are starting to curl. When I collected the leaves I was trying to make sure they were from the same species of tree so I could get the best accurate measurement of the leaves strength. After I made the extract I tested it with the water from our faucet which is about 6.5 ph.
When filling the cup 90% and filling the rest with extract and it reduced the ph to a 5.6. I did 40% water change and filled it with that mixture as well as add a couple leaves in the tank and nothing changed! I've been at it for almost two weeks and I don't think it's working I'm concerned for his health and I hope the curls aren't permanent.:-(

Here are some pictures of how he looks from two weeks ago to today. Today.









two weeks ago.


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## Laki (Aug 24, 2011)

I can't see your pictures, download them to your computer and upload from there. 

Your tap water is probably all kinds of pH. I think API or someone else makes something to lower and keep the pH more stable. 

What kind of leaves are you adding to your tank? Are they dried and adding tannins?


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## AquaPlayz (Aug 14, 2015)

What test kit do you use?


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## Tolak (Nov 13, 2012)

What's the hardness of the tap water? This plays in with pH, especially when trying to adjust it & keep it stable.


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## Betta man 123 (Aug 5, 2015)

Sorry about the pictures I'm pretty new to this and I'm just getting the hang of things. Anyway about the the ph, the faucet I get the water for my fish has a ph of 6.4 and the gh is very soft. I'm currently using the API test kit for the ph, and the ammonia. I also have a MARINELAND 6-in-1 test strip kit that reads for ph,gh,nitrates,chlorine,ect... And the leaves are from oaks from the woods around my house like Virginia oaks,White oaks. All the leaves I collect are completely brown and I rinse them if they have dirt on them and I make sure they're totally dry.And the leaves are producing tannins giving the water kind of a tea color I also have some Marimo moss in the tank.


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## Betta man 123 (Aug 5, 2015)

Sorry about the pictures I'm pretty new to this and I'm just getting the hang of things. Anyway about the the ph, the faucet I get the water for my fish has a ph of 6.4 and the gh is very soft. I'm currently using the API test kit for the ph, and the ammonia. I also have a MARINELAND 6-in-1 test strip kit that reads for ph,gh,nitrates,chlorine,ect... And the leaves are from oaks from the woods around my house like Virginia oaks,White oaks. All the leaves I collect are completely brown and I rinse them if they have dirt on them and I make sure they're totally dry.


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## Lilypad (Oct 15, 2014)

My PH is always an 8-8.2. That is even using live oak leaves in the tank. It doesn't harm my betta, fluctuating PH is actually where the harm comes in. It's better just to leave it alone.


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## AquaPlayz (Aug 14, 2015)

Test strips are not accurate, because they get moisture on them and don't work properly.
I would get a API master test kit to test your parameters


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## Betta man 123 (Aug 5, 2015)

Sorry about the pictures I'm pretty new to this and I'm just getting the hang of things. Anyway about the the ph, the faucet I get the water for my fish has a ph of 6.4 and the gh is very soft. I'm currently using the API test kit for the ph, and the ammonia. I also have a MARINELAND 6-in-1 test strip kit that reads for ph,gh,nitrates,chlorine,ect... And the leaves are from oaks from the woods around my house like Virginia oaks,White oaks. All the leaves I collect are completely brown and I rinse them if they have dirt on them and I make sure they're totally dry.And the leaves are producing tannins giving the water kind of a tea color I also have some Marimo moss in the tank.


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## Betta man 123 (Aug 5, 2015)

Lilypad said:


> My PH is always an 8-8.2. That is even using live oak leaves in the tank. It doesn't harm my betta, fluctuating PH is actually where the harm comes in. It's better just to leave it alone.


But parts of his dorsal fin and caudal fin have begun to curl. And I know fluctuating ph is dangerous which is what's turning me away from fixing it chemically and, I've heard blackwater can staighten fins so I was hoping it would work but i hasn't.:-(


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## Betta man 123 (Aug 5, 2015)

AquaPlayz said:


> Test strips are not accurate, because they get moisture on them and don't work properly.
> I would get a API master test kit to test your parameters


Ignore this reply read the other one, I can't figure out how to delete it.


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## Betta man 123 (Aug 5, 2015)

AquaPlayz said:


> Test strips are not accurate, because they get moisture on them and don't work properly.
> I would get a API master test kit to test your parameters


Sounds like a good idea but nevertheless the results from my API kits which are dip solutions into a glass tube kits and my MARINELAND strip kit show almost the exact same results. I've only got one strip left so I might as well try to get the kit. I'm only in high-school so if it's huge and crazy expensive I wont be able to get it.I would really like to try and lower the ph naturally with what I have before buying more kits, I have API stress coat which I use when I do water changes 40% or more I would never go above 50%.


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## AquaPlayz (Aug 14, 2015)

So you have API liquid tests too?


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## Betta man 123 (Aug 5, 2015)

AquaPlayz said:


> So you have API liquid tests too?


yup the strips have a ph range of 6.2 to 8.4 while the ph liquid kit reads from 6.2 to 7.6.


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## ao (Feb 29, 2012)

It's hard to budge the PH even a bit if your water is hard enough...


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## Betta man 123 (Aug 5, 2015)

So this morning I got a lucky break and I'm finally seeing results just this morning I did a ph test and it went down to 7.8.:shock: I then did an ammonia test and it went up to around .30!:shock: So I took all the dead leaves out of his tank and you might not believe this but I did an ammonia test right after removing the leaves and it returned to zero! I'm so relieved. Unfortunately he lost a scale overnight I'm assuming he was stressed when the ph went down and maybe he hit something? But he seems so be behaving normally now eating well and swimming and exploring his surroundings. I'm not going to continue the blackwater idea, I don't want to risk killing any beneficial bacteria or ph, and amonia spikes.


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## Laki (Aug 24, 2011)

What kind of leaves are you using? And where did you get them? 
Removing the leaves without a water change shouldn't have changed the ammonia since the ammonia would be present in the water, not on the leaves themselves. If the ammonia id leaking from polluted leaves then you should have still performed a water change.


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## AquaPlayz (Aug 14, 2015)

Ammonia won't go down that fast especially without a water change, also I would switch over to only API liquid gets because they are more accurate and costs less in the long run.


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## Betta man 123 (Aug 5, 2015)

Laki said:


> What kind of leaves are you using? And where did you get them?
> Removing the leaves without a water change shouldn't have changed the ammonia since the ammonia would be present in the water, not on the leaves themselves. If the ammonia id leaking from polluted leaves then you should have still performed a water change.


I didn't think it made much sense either and after taking the leaves out I only waited a little under an hour"Maybe I exaggerated right after" before the test I'm assuming my Marimo moss took care of it. The leaves I used were oak, I did a 45% water change afterward and I got the API master test kit yesterday. I'm aware that the ph rises and falls throughout the day slightly when you have live plants so I did the test a couple hours after the lights were on and the ph read as 8.0 so I feel confident that the ph is finally going down. And the biological filtration appears stable because the ammonia and nitrates are at 0.Also when I do water changes around 40% to 50% I add API stress coat.


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