# Help Eggie- Breathing hard, laying on tank floor



## smellsfishie (Apr 14, 2011)

Eggie has been "off" for awhile but I could not figure out what it could be. She's been eating fine, but less activity, and more and more laying on the floor. Today, she has not moved much from one spot and appears to be breathing hard/open mouth breathing like either something is stuck in her throat or she just is having a hard time breathing. I have NO clue what could be wrong with her, maybe a parasite? Maybe a bacterial thing? I was going to start General Cure tonight thinking maybe it could be gill flukes or something causing her to not be able to breathe properly? if anyone knows what this could be and how to treat it please let me know. I am starting the General Cure tonight though because that is all I have besides Betta Revive. I'm probably just going to treat the entire tank, it is safe for live plants... 

I'll post a video of her in a few minutes once my camera charges so people can see what I mean...


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## smellsfishie (Apr 14, 2011)

waiting for the dumb video to load.........


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

Is she eating? Is she bloated? Any other signs of illness? When was her last water change? 

They can also breathe hard when they can't rise to the surface as often or when it takes a lot of effort to move or when they are stressed.


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## smellsfishie (Apr 14, 2011)

She ate like a champ a few days ago when I gave brine shrimp, but she is not a fan of pellets and that's what I have been feeding the past 2 days at least. I did the anti-parasite pellets today but none of the fish really cared for them... and I had to crush them cause they were huge. She doesn't look bloated but you can be the judge once I upload the videos. The only other thing that is odd to me is she looks like she lost a bit of color in the black part of her body. It's not quite as black as I think it was before. And water change, I honestly don't know the date. I want to say a few weeks ago. I tested the water 2 days ago and everything was great. My PH is high but it's always high. I know, I need to do a water change. Just been crazy... busy... She's also a bit clamp finned. I wonder if I should just treat her or the whole tank. if I do just her I will prob do Betta Revive which is for protozoan, bacterial, and fungal diseases... ingredients are water, neomycin sulfate (<10%), methylene blue (<0.5%), proprietary polymer mixture, buffers, EDTA, malachite green chloride (<0.01%), cyanocobalamin, and electrolytes.


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

What size is her tank? Sounds like some ammonia poisoning, that will cause them to become lethargic and breathe heavily. Clean water will help tremendously. If the other bettas aren't having any problems I don't know about dumping Betta Revive in there because it's got some powerful meds in there.


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## smellsfishie (Apr 14, 2011)

No, I wasn't going to put betta revive in the whole tank. I was going to do that with General Cure in case it was a parasite. But, I think I will try the betta revive first by floating her in a cup in the tank. The tank is 28 gallons. If it was ammonia poisoning, wouldn't all the fish be acting that way? She's the only one acting sick...


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## smellsfishie (Apr 14, 2011)

Here's the better video (IMO)... At about 1:32 or so you can see what I mean about the "open mouth breathing" although it is hard to tell because she is not facing the camera, but she is kind of flipping out there.... the rest of the time her breathing is labored but not open mouth... 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DLw6sfNymAo


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## smellsfishie (Apr 14, 2011)

the other video..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WyYHDJrs5PA&feature=channel_video_title


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

Well, she still had enough energy to chase her tankmates away which was kind of funny. Nope, not ammonia poisoning, I didn't remember your tank was so big. I thought "Few weeks ago, small tank, yup, ammonia poisoning." >.<

Have you seen her rubbing up against any of the decor or the walls? That would say to me gill flukes but I would also think all the other girls would be rubbing too. At this point I would say yes, treat her with the Betta Revive. I hope it helps her, poor thing. She doesn't look desperately ill but she definitely doesn't look healthy. That she doesn't look desperately ill is good because hopefully it means you caught it in time for treatment to be effective.


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## smellsfishie (Apr 14, 2011)

I'm just baffled as to what it could be. She hasn't been rubbing against rocks, none of the fish have. So, maybe it is not gill flukes. But, since I have had her, her belly area has always looked bruised so maybe that is something? She has always breathed a bit harder than my other fish but seemed totally fine otherwise so I thought maybe it was just the way she breathes... But now, she's doing this weird open mouth thing and laying on the tank floor all day (except to chase away the other fish :} or go up for air) and it's just so weird to me. Anyway, if I can cup her tonight I will try the betta revive. I'm going to mix it in a jug (1 drop to 16 fl. oz) and just change the cup water daily for like 3 days with the jug water (does that seem ok to do or will the meds not work unless it is mixed right away?)........ anyhoo thats my plan. I plan to float a "clean" cup with just the medicated water to switch her over to each day so it stays the same temp as her tank water... thoughts?


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

No, that sounds like a good plan. I think the meds in the jug should work for up to a day or so, then you may need to mix a new batch. It doesn't sound like gill flukes to me, it sounds like perhaps she has some ammonia burn scars in her gills that she had before you got her and that's why she's always breathed a little harder than the others. How long are you supposed to treat her with Betta Revive?


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## smellsfishie (Apr 14, 2011)

Up to 7 days with daily water changes. Minimum 3 days. I've had her since... like, mid-May... so, a little over 2 months. Do you think ammonia scars would last that long? I think the bruising is so weird.... maybe it is just her coloration, but she looks bruised... And honestly, I was SO mad when I got her because her IDIOT of a transhipper literally packed her in 1 teeny bag with only enough water to barely cover her, and threw her in a box with NO insulation, NO protection, just 2 pieces of newspaper shoved in there. I could kill him. I thought she got bruised in transport but the bruises have not gone away so maybe it is something else.


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

Are you sure they're not part of her coloration? What color are they? Stupid transshipper, that's so rotten! How'd he qualify as a transshipper anyway? *pouts* 

Some ammonia scars can last their whole lives depending on the severity of the burns. And it sounds like she had a rough trip, that may have had a permanent effect on her ability to breathe.  Poor girl, she's been through a tough time.


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## smellsfishie (Apr 14, 2011)

Well, the bruising is definitely not an outside color... It's an internal color. It's on her belly, and it looks like a pinkish purple. Like the color of a bruise. 

And yes, he was a HORRIBLE transhipper, and RUDE! Kevin in NY is his name. Never, ever, use him. I will only use Jennifer Viveiros from now one... learned that lesson the hard way.


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

You don't suppose she had some internal damage from the shipping and she's been suffering from it all along, do you? *gulp*


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## smellsfishie (Apr 14, 2011)

ugh... I would feel so bad... I hope that is not the case, but she has always been a little bit stressy/funny to me... like, she gets stressed pretty easy. She's not really friendly like my other girls. Oh my gosh... I hate netting fish so I rarely ever do it. So i was trying to "cup" her into one of those betta tubs they use at the pet stores when they are selling them. K... every fish but her was swimming into the dang tub... Every time she swam up, I would try to put it under her and she darted away... I finally caught her with food and by moving very slowly.... only problem was, there was 5 other females in the tub with her! I had to carefully let them all out, one by one, until it was finally just her... LOL... ughghghgh


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## smellsfishie (Apr 14, 2011)

can add stringy white poo to her list of ailments.


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

Parasites would be my guess. Unless you think she recently ate her own eggs or someone else's. If she egged up and then released her eggs, she would most likely eat them and that can cause the stringy white poo as well. But considering her behavior, I'm going to go with parasites. Sounds like your fun is about to begin. Time for the General Cure for everyone. :/ 

Haha, your netting experience sounds like the time I tried to get one of my girls out with a little plastic cup, the kind you drink punch out of at parties. Three of them ended up in that tiny thing, all tangled up and I couldn't figure out which one was the girl I wanted. Got them all out and found out the girl i wanted had been hiding at the back of the tank all along. Grr, three of my girls are virtually identical from the top view, that's why I had this problem.


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## smellsfishie (Apr 14, 2011)

Yeah, whats up with these AB fishes and parasites?! My 3 guys I got last time (Pencil, Cherub, and no name) came all down n out... pink fins... (well, 2 of 3 of them were down)... I treated with General Cure and they are now GREAT! So i can only assume it was parasites!? Eggie has been "fine" for months but I guess that doesn't mean much if it's a parasite. I can't say I have ever watched her poo, but she has the stringy white stuff goin on right now... I don't think any released eggs, but have no clue honestly. 

Haha, yeah, I know exactly what you mean! Only for me, the dag fishies are so friendly they are like "doot dee doo... oooOOoooh... plastiiiccc..." and they swim in it and around it and want to bite it... and then, Eggie, just is too smart and swims away. The ONE fish I actually WANT to catch... blarg. But it's all good. I got her eventually. I much prefer slowly catching fish in a cup (without much stress) than chasing them around the tank with a net (and lots of stress)...


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

Yeah. I'm thinking about taping a long piece of plastic to a cup so I can reach into the depths of the tank better. And then baiting it with food so they swim right in. And isn't it always the one fish you want to catch who knows better than to swim right into the cup. :roll:

I wonder if the AB fish from Thailand get parasites from the way they are bred and raised, basically in big tubs outside on their own until they are like 3 months old. I'm glad the General Cure helped your other guys, it means it will prevent any infection in the other girls for sure.


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## smellsfishie (Apr 14, 2011)

That sounds like a good idea, as long as the tape is non-toxic  And as long as when it gets wet, it doesn't just fall off.  I have sometimes used a net to encourage fish toward my cup, but I try never to do it too fast just to keep stress level low... I am just personally overly sensitive about how animals feel, I think... particularly with breathing, cause I don't swim... Had a traumatic event when I was 3, and so I've always been afraid of water/drowning. It's better now that I am an old lady, but... still, the fear is there. So, to me, netting a fish and removing them from their environment where they breathe, and moving them into air, is like me being netted and shoved under water... SO SCARY!!! So I like to keep them immersed at all times... and it works! Just takes a little more patience. 

Anyway, sorry for rambling... I'm tired. My brain is still waking up.

I wondered the same about the thai bettas... I bet it's very easy for them to get parasites considering they are outside like that. I mean, I don't know if all Thai breeders method of breeding/rearing fry is the same but... I would assume they are outside. 

Update for the morning: Eggie is still floating in her cup (hoorah!) Alive ... I didn't think she would die, but it's nice to see she is still alive. Her breathing looks slightly better... she has always been a hard breather, so I can't tell if she is "better" or still having trouble. But, anyway, she hates the cup like I said, and in her little head is imaging every way she can possibly escape. I feel bad cause the cup is stressing her out, but, I think removing her from the tank altogether would be more stressful. Her buddy, Goose, (they are in the top ranks of the sorority) was by her cupside this morning as if to encourage her and let her know she was not all alone. :}


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## smellsfishie (Apr 14, 2011)

Oh, but other thing I noticed last night that I hooooooooope is not.. what... it could be... is that Beamer has a white thing on her side. Um... like a small, very short, white thing.... not a perfect dot like ich, but maybe a visible external parasite??? D: erg............


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

Gulp. I hope Beamer doesn't have the beginning of anchor worms. Or fish lice. Or skin flukes. Yeeeeeeeeek, say it ain't so! 

I think it's great you are so considerate of your fish and their comfort level. I really wish everyone would do what you do: imagine themselve in the same situation and then imagine if they'd like the treatment they get. I wouldn't like being chased with a net and dumped into water if I was not meant to be in water, so like you said it makes sense that fish wouldn't like being chased by a net and raised up into air that they aren't meant to be in. You're a good fish momma.

I'm so glad Eggie made it through the night. It's cute Goose stayed with her this morning, like spending some time in a friend's hospital room. I hope Eggie continues to get better, hopefully the Betta Revive will do its stuff.


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## smellsfishie (Apr 14, 2011)

oh my gosh, i hope beamer does not have any of that either!!!!

I think people (non fish people) think I am a bit crazy to think of my fish that way, or other animals. But I have my reasons why I am the way I am! And thank you! You are a good fish mom too!


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

I try to be. I loves mah bettas like they're family. And let the non-fish people think we are crazy. Personally, I think the non-fish people are the crazy ones. 

Have you started the General Cure for the whole tank? If Beamer *gulp* has any kind of external parasite, the General Cure should help get rid of them. Poor Beamer. Have you seen anyone rubbing or flashing?


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## smellsfishie (Apr 14, 2011)

No one is rubbing on rocks or anything. I was going to wait on the General Cure until Eggie is back in the tank (maybe 2-3 more days) so they all get treated at once. Beamer seems normal just that white thing is a bit concerning... 

Here's a vid if you want to have a look
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sdbSk7Wr4rk


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

It definitely looks like some kind of external parasite to me. I want to say the beginning of anchor worms or something similar. It looks like the worms in another thread, where the betta had them coming out of his nose. In that case, the tank was treated with Jungle Labs Parasite fizz tabs and the worms were going away but I think General Cure would be better. While you wait for Eggie to get back in the tank, watch to see if that thing gets any bigger or longer. I'm hoping I'm very wrong and it's just a cyst or a bump or something harmless. And not contagious to the other fish.


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## smellsfishie (Apr 14, 2011)

I was kinda hoping whatever it was would be gone by today but it's still there. I am definitely keeping an eye on them. Hopefully it is just some weird floaty thing... sometimes weird things get stuck to bettas  oy.


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

Yeah, maybe one of those harmless worms that always supposed to be in our tanks but we usually can't see them. Like a nematode or planaria or something like that and it just got stuck to Beamer for a while. :/ Poor Beamer and Eggie.


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