# Sick Betta



## LadyReds (Oct 4, 2013)

My female betta has been sick for about 3 wks now. She seemed to have fungus (white cottony film), she was staying at the bottom of the tank, her dorsal fin looked smaller (which was of course fin rot), and she was not really eating. I took her to pet smart and the worker and I decided it was fungus. I bought Fungus Guard from Tetra which is supposed to treat various things other than fungus such as fin rot. Within 2 days my betta seemed to be doing better but a couple of days after that the fungus came back though not as aggressive.The days that followed have been me researching whatever I could and trying other meds to no real avail. Her dorsal fin was looking like it was dissolving at one point and I was really scared. I have read so many diff opinions and advice from many sites regarding betta diseases and their proper treatment that I am confused and so have decided to just follow one (bettatalk.com). I have continued with my diagnosis of fungus and fin rot..now... it is hard for her to swim because she also has developed a kink in her spine (her spine is S shaped) which I have read is either fish tuberculosis or a really bad bacterial infection (in small cases and I may be that lucky =(...) OR she may also have swim bladder disease which can also be brought on by a bacterial infection at this point I don't know. I have lowered her water so that she doesn't have to swim to much to breath, so she is essentially in a 1/2 gal of water. This makes it easier to handle for the cleaning as well. Anyways, according to the website I am following. I am treating her with the fungus treatment stated above and am also using T.C. Tetracycline from API for the bacterial infection (fin rot). I have also added aquarium salt (very little) as I have read that this helps with bacterial infections (ONLY to be used if the betta is sick). I am also using a water conditioner with Tropical Almond Leaf extract to help with the stress. I bought her a real plant so that she could rest on it and not have to be lying at the bottom damaging her fins further and also I understand it helps them feel better too, and am changing her water every 3 days (100%). She currently doesn't seem to have any fungus, her fins are clamped, she is missing some scales (where the initial fungus attacked), she sometimes eats (every other day it seems), her fins still have that black tinge at the ends (the rot) but her dorsal fin seems to be holding. Her spine is still crooked, and she still has difficulty swimming. So at this point I am playing a waiting game hoping she pulls through. I would like to mention that when I took her into pet smart my water was tested and they said it was perfect so i have no clue how she got sick. I always aged my water (24 hrs.) and added water conditioner. My other male betta is doing perfectly well and I used the same water for both fish all the time. they shared everything except the same aquarium. My boy is at my work place and my girl is home with me as she is sick. I bought some indicators for my water 1 for ammonia and 1 for ph. my ammonia level is non existent but my ph is high. I bought ph down but I have to go from an 8.2 to a 7.0 or close so this process may be a bit slow...especially since I am changing the water every 3 days. I am attaching some pics so that hopefully someone with more knowledge can tell me whether there is more to what ails her than what I know so far. I am really worried about my girl and would appreciate any help or suggestions....I am mostly worried about the kink in her spine I would like to know if anybody knows more about it than me...


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## sainthogan (Sep 27, 2012)

I'm sorry if I didn't see it, but what is the temperature of your tank?
You may want to message Sakura8 to help you with this.


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## ANHEL123 (Jul 21, 2010)

How long you have her?
How big was her original tank? 
How much water(%) you used to change her tank?
How big is the boy's tank at work? and how much water changes(%) you do for him?
DO NOT use pH down. You don't want to mass with pH . The fish get very stressed when you change it . Bettas are very adjustable to the ph. Leave it the way it is. Just use water conditioner. Its also extra chemical. She is stressed already .
Your boy at woks , and she at home so you not sharing anything between them. Do not put anything from her tank in his tank , you will contaminate his tank . So NO SHARING.
Do daily water changes for her. Do not use aquarium salt. If there is internal problems its better do not use aquarium salt. Aquarium salt retain the fluid in the body.
What i would do is use Epsom salt. Pure 100% magnesium sulfate Epsom salt (unscented, without any additives,dyes,perfumes) . Epsom salt also has antibacterial affect, laxative affect and its reduce fluid retention in the body, helps with swim bladder problem. So i would use it with daily water changes. Pre mix salt 1 tsp/gall in the one gall jug for the right dosage. You can use a jub from the milk or spring water. Make sure its disolved (no crystals left). You can mix Epsom and medication together. Epsom you can buy at any pharmacy dep. not at Pet store.

When you adding the water with Epsom take very long time to acclimate him. Just have him in his container with his water and just keep adding small amount of the medicated water. May be do about 2tbs every 5 minutes for about 45 min let him to get used to the new water .

Now there is very good medications that you can only buy at the special store or you need to order it on line. So if you can get Kanaplex Seachem its a good antibiotic and treats a wide range of bact infection and acts internally , as well as externally

Also do not make the temp in her tank too warm. Bacteria and fungus get worse in the warmer temp.


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## LadyReds (Oct 4, 2013)

I have had her for about 3 months. At work she was at a temp. ranging from 77-79. At home the temp. is set to 76 but the room I have her in is warmer than the rest of the house so I would say the temp is 77. I have always changed 100% of the water with both of them every 7 days as they are in 1 gal tanks (with new aged water of course). At first I had her share a half gal container with the male betta I have at work. When I realized bettas like bigger spaces (I was not aware, I have never been a fish person and I found the boy abandoned at my work place so it wasn't a choice in the beg). I bought them ind. 1 gal tanks each. When I mentioned that they share everything what I meant was that they only share the water. Accessories , plant, or anything was always kept separated. I always used to fill a 2 gal container so I had enough water for both of them, that's what I meant. I used the same water and she got sick but he did not. I will mention that I saw the change in her behavior when I moved her from the 1/2 gal tank to the 1 gal. I bought the boy the 1 gal first and it was a couple of days until I bought hers she was in the 1/2 gal for a bit. she seemed lost/a little stressed in the extra space. It may sound silly but that is the impression I gathered. Within days she started to get sick. The only new thing that I introduced was the tank and a real plant. (I bought 2 plants kept in the same water one for him, one for her and as I mentioned he is perfectly fine). I will refrain from using ph down as I personally was on the fence about it because of the chemicals. I want to ask Anhel123 why daily water changes. I have read that the changes stress them out a lot and won't this mess with the meds. having enough time to take effect. Like I mentioned the web I am following states to change it every 3 days. I will give the Epson salt a try as I see the logic with the internal water retention. As far as how you mentioned introducing the Epson salt (2 tbs every 5 mins.) is this every time I change the water or once the 1st treated water has the right measurement she can be changed with water that is already prepared? I can make the dosage for a half gallon and introduce it into her 1 gal tank which is currently filled 1/2 way so that it will become 1 gal altogether (did I make sense to you?) and then continue with water that is half normal/ half Epson salt...When I get the Kalaplex should I contunue to use the fungus med. I have or should I just treat her with the Kalaplex as I am reading that it helps with fungal infections as well?..One more question can you think of any reason why her spine is crooked??


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## LadyReds (Oct 4, 2013)

I want to amend something from the reply I just posted....When I noticed her change in behavior it was when I moved her from the 1/2 gal to the 1 gal. In the 1/2 gal she was very happy. Always active, attentive, and being a hungry little piggy =)..Once I moved her she stopped being active and literally seemed lost.


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## ANHEL123 (Jul 21, 2010)

Ill try to answer your questions
S shape can be due to swim bladder problem or constipation. It's like a person who gets cramped up with gas and bloating. However its also can be sign of mycobacterial infection. And also if she is bloated and has white,clear or black poo could be internal parasites too. And like you said is TB.
Why she got sick not sure. All bettas i guess has different immunity just like humans are. I had bought 2 bettas long time ago. I did exactly the same care . Now one of them is 5 years old , another died 2.5 years ago. So i guess when you have a pet or a kid they get sick. So its not your fault . But i did read that some bettas has big tank syndrome which my bettas never did. So i don't really know if its can be the cause of her stress or something else.

You are using aged water , i am doing this all the time too. Its easier for me to match the temperature. And i like aged water because there is not bubbles when you do that. I just brought new betta home and didn't aged the water, its so many bubbles in the water everywhere, and i think i read its can be the problem, not sure. Any way about acclimation i told you acclimate because you going to add Epsom and i want her to get used to the new chemistry. Then i guess you don't have to do it for that long time. Just first time so you don't shock her with too much diffirence in the water.

So you still using Fungus Guard Tetra and Tetracyclin? You saying not more fungus you can see? She also might have production of the slime coat meaning its natural protection against the infection . Slime coat usually slimy, clear substance on the tips of the fins. 

May be try to get frozen blood worms for her, you can feed it using a tweezers . Frozen food has a lot of protein in it and very good for the immune system. Frozen daphnia is good for the constipation. Does she poop? Did you see the poo? If its white or black, or broken white it can indicate she has internal parasites. If she is constipated that might explain why her spine is crooked, the same if she has swim bladder problem.

If you get Kanaplex you don't have to use Fungus Guard. But you still can use Epsom. Epsom supposed to help with sbp and with constipation. Also what i would do is pre mix 1 tsp/gall for the first two days and then increase the dosage to 2 tsp/gall. 

Daily water changes. You don't have to. But i like to recommend it. No it will not messed the treatment because you will redose with the required dose of the medications. The space that she is not though , she really need daily water changes. If your water the same temperature she should be fine . When you do full water changes just always make sure you live some of her water and then mix new water in her container. Or at least do water changes every other day. 

For the boy do full water changes every 4 days if you can. I also have 3 -one gall tanks at work and i do it every 4 days. I would really recommend it .


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## LadyReds (Oct 4, 2013)

thank you so much for all your help. I bought the kanaplex today. Just so I understand once I start the kanaflex I can stop using the fungus med but what about the tetracycline? ....as far as her poop I just noticed today that she is pooping and that it is the same color as the food she is eating which I understand is the way its supposed to be.


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## ANHEL123 (Jul 21, 2010)

Oh good, use only 1tsp/gall of Epsom. Do two 50% water changes back to back before you add kanaplex. Keep us updated. You can use kanaplex 2-3 courses so don't stop it. Let us know how she doing so we can decide if you need another round of it.


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## ANHEL123 (Jul 21, 2010)

I was thinking do a few 50% and one full water change to get rid any medication that you been using. I am saying 3 water changes because its gradual change for her. I think its better then big change at once from one chemical to another. And do just kanaplex since its works internally and externally. And we can add Epsom salt later depending on how she doing. I think its will be less stressful for her. And its good that her poo was normal.
Take a little time to acclimate her to the new water, since its too much changes from one medication to the clean water, to the another medication. So just acclimate her slowly. May be for about 30-40 min.
How long you been using Tetracycling?


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## LadyReds (Oct 4, 2013)

I have been using tetracycline for about 5 days. Also I wanted to ask, does the kanaplex work for internal parasites?


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## ANHEL123 (Jul 21, 2010)

How she doing? No kanaplex will not help with internal parasites. Do you think he has internal parasites? How is her poo? It was normal on 10/05 did it changed?
Is she bloated?


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## LadyReds (Oct 4, 2013)

her spine is still crooked so she is still having issues swimming which is why I think that she keeps hanging out at the top of the tank. Easy to breath without much effort. She is eating though it is hard on her to keep herself afloat long enough to eat so she doesn't seem to eat as much as she wants too. I am going to post a pic of something white between her front bottom fins which is the reason why I asked about internal parasites. I don't see fungus on her. I'm not sure about the bacteria. I think there is a little black on the end of a small section on her tail fin but other than that her fins are holding. They are however not growing...so not to sure what that means. Thanks for checking on her


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## ANHEL123 (Jul 21, 2010)

How i understand if it would be internal parasite you can see it only with her poop. So it only if something coming from her anus . Front bottom fins it is her anus.

Look at the link , betta anatomy and see if what you see is coming from the anus.
Is it her poo? Is it wormy shape and white? 

http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl...a=X&ei=QYRTUqSrB5ew4APapYDQBA&ved=0CDQQ9QEwAg

I also think add 1 tsp/gall of Epsom for a laxative affect.


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## LadyReds (Oct 4, 2013)

I looked at the pic and that is indeed the place the white thing is poking through. She has had it for a very long time but it has always looked the same. Just a little white tip. At first I thought that she was pooping something white but its still there. I will try to post the pics tonight


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## LadyReds (Oct 4, 2013)

I can't post the pic because skydrive is being stupid but if you actually look at the first pics I posted in my original post you can actually see the white thing I am talking about. Also, I was reading that her spine will very surely stay deformed. Do you know if that is true? have you had a situation similar to this where the spine was able to be fixed?


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## ANHEL123 (Jul 21, 2010)

She might also has internal parasites. Is there any way you can go and buy API General Cure? You can actually mix it with kanaplex that you already using. General Cure contain Metronidazole and Praziguantel that is good for internal parasites. If spine will stay deformed i am not sure. I think what ever she has it pretty serious and may or may not be resolved since it a long time that she has it . I would think if she would recover she might get back to normal though. But kanaplex along with General Cure and you can continue 1 tsp/gall of Epsom , and daily water changes. You can alternate between 50% and 100% daily water changes. Sorry;(


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## LadyReds (Oct 4, 2013)

its okay, thank you so much


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## ANHEL123 (Jul 21, 2010)

Please let us know how she doing. The Kanaplex still good for internal infection and works for external infection as well. And General Cure is supposed to help with internal parasites. So it a very good strong med's when you mix them together. A lot of people recommending it. If she is eating and pooping it a big + so she can pass the parasites out. 
And if you can give update i will appreciate as i want to know the outcome. Good luck!


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## LadyReds (Oct 4, 2013)

will do...i am actually still waiting on the kanaplex. I ordered it online and today I am going to buy general cure. I will let you know how it works out.


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## ANHEL123 (Jul 21, 2010)

Thank you , good luck!


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## LadyReds (Oct 4, 2013)

I wanted to give you an update. Infection wise she is good, no fungus or parasites. Her bacterial infection seems to have stopped as her scales are growing back. Her fins do not seem to be growing and sometimes it seems like there is still a little black at the edges but they are no longer deteriorating. She is going to the bathroom just fine. She mostly eats, there are some days when I don't see her eat. The bad news is that her spine is very twisted and she has to use so much energy to swim that she just stays anchored to a plant I have in there. She rests at the top of the plant so that it is easy for her to breath. Just like with the swimming it is hard for her to eat as well. She usually gets about 3 bites in and gets tired and has to perch herself on the plant. I hate to see her like that and I'm considering to euthanize her. I hate to see her struggle like that just to eat or swim =( I stopped everything except the Kanaplex since she doesn't need anything else and I have been steady doing 100% water changes every 2 days. I am out of options as her spine will never correct itself.


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## ANHEL123 (Jul 21, 2010)

I am sorry i don't know why i didn't see your post. How she doing? Oh its like 15 days later i am replying.


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## LadyReds (Oct 4, 2013)

its okay. She is still alive and seems to be doing fine health wise. Her dorsal fin is still not growing back though and her spine..well its still crooked. It is still hard for her to swim. If I choose to keep her alive then that will be her hardship for the rest of her life. Her happy spirit is back  so its making it a hard decision to euthenize her. Not sure what to do.


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## ANHEL123 (Jul 21, 2010)

Well not sure what to say. I guess if you keep her she will be special needs pet. Her fins didn't grow back . I had 3 years old betta that had very bad fin rot. His fins got to the point when he looks like baby female. He couldn't even swim upright because of that and he couldn't couch the food because of that. It took me 5-15 min to feed one pellet. Its took long time for the fins to grow back. I treated him 3 times Salt, medication,salt. I would say it was drastic diffirence with last treatment of the aquarium salt. So if you want you can try to treat her with aquarium salt and see if it will help.

My house is cold during the night and the day when we at works. My husband put the thermostat on 65* at night . So if she would be my pet i would not able to keep her because i think its better to keep her in the shallow water. And it difficult to heat it up. So my suggestion if you room temp allowed you to keep her then i would not euthanize her yet. But if she in the shallow water you need to do daily water changes which i don't think take a lot of time . 
She is one lucky girl , she would be already dead if you left her in the store. I really think if the temp in your house ok i would keep her. But again if you decide to euthanize her, it understandable. 
What do you think? And i hope your other betta doing good?


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## veggiegirl (Nov 20, 2012)

Hey there,

I am glad that your little girl is doing much better now. Internal bacterial infections can cause permanent damage to the swim bladder making swimming difficult. Sometimes over time the problem will improve a little. Although it looks quite distressing to us when she is having difficulties swimming bettas can adapt quite well and still live a happy life. It looks bad to us but in reality it is most likely bothering us more than it is the fish. Animals are quite adaptable, they generally get used to and accept a situation, unlike people they not not feel sorry for themselves they tend to just accept the way things are. 

I recently lost one of my bettas Spartan and I was quite upset about it. Spartan was just 3 months old when an internal bacterial infection damaged his swim bladder beyond repair meaning swimming was extremely hard for him and indeed so was coming up to eat. Over time though he got used to it and even would try to flare at the bettas next to him. He loved his food and would even manage with an effort on occasions to jump for it when he just could not contain his excitement. He lived a long happy life and died at the age of 3 and 1/2 years.

Euthanasia is a personal decision and only you can make it but in my opinion your fish still has a chance to live a perfectly happy life even with her new disability.


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## LadyReds (Oct 4, 2013)

thank you all so much for the advise. For now I'm just watching and waiting. She seems to be in good spirits


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## veggiegirl (Nov 20, 2012)

That is great that she is in good spirits, the most important thing is that she is happy


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## ANHEL123 (Jul 21, 2010)

Keep us updated


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## LadyReds (Oct 4, 2013)

will do


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