# Black smoke/Gunmetal blue spawn



## tpocicat

I've been waiting to make sure this spawn would last awhile before I posted anything. My fry are now 1 week old. I've also been waiting to post some pictures I took, but the computer needs a new power supply before I dare do anything more on it. I'll post pictures as soon as I can.
The male is a gunmetal blue with black/brown fins HM, the female is a gunmetal blue almost HM DT.


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## bettalover2033

tpocicat said:


> I've been waiting to make sure this spawn would last awhile before I posted anything. My fry are now 1 week old. I've also been waiting to post some pictures I took, but the computer needs a new power supply before I dare do anything more on it. I'll post pictures as soon as I can.
> The male is a gunmetal blue with black/brown fins HM, the female is a gunmetal blue almost HM DT.


That is great! I can't to see some pictures. Especially of the pair. What do you mean by "Gunmetal?"

There are so many custom names that most breeders make up that I can't keep up. Which breeder did you get the pair from?


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## tpocicat

It's a dark blue, but not like royal blue, almost black. As soon as I can load my pictures, it will be easier. I'm doing the best I can to describe what they look like.

I also forgot to mention, the male only made a little bitty bubble nest. Once the eggs hatched, he just spit them to the top of the water! Never saw that before.


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## bettalover2033

It is pretty cool how they just stay up there. The bubbles do provide extra security, but I used to think that they were supposed to stay with a huge nest or they wont be able to stay up there.


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## Badjer

Very interested to see some pictures of the parents! Congrats on your new babies.


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## tpocicat

Thank you. I will be posting as soon as I can. I've got a really good one of my female. The male won't hold still, so I'll probably post several of him so you can get an idea of what he looks like.


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## tpocicat

Two pictures of my male and one of my female. These are the parents of my current spawn.


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## tpocicat

The two of them together getting to know each other.


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## tpocicat

Not such good pictures of the fry. As you can see, he just spit them to the surface! No bubblenest.


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## tpocicat

Anybody?


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## betta lover1507

yea am here  atleast you could see the fries with your camera


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## tpocicat

Yeah...sort of. Little black blurs. Anyway they are a week old.


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## Badjer

Wow I love your male! Odd about him building no nest...I've never heard of that happening!


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## tpocicat

When I saw him, I just had to have him. A LFS imports bettas from Tailand, and I got there the day they were delivered.

About the bubble nest, there is a picture in the IBC 2012 calendar of fry being spit to the surface with no bubble nest. Never heard of it before, but since my fry are now a week old and free swimming, it didn't hurt them.


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## Badjer

Wow I wish we had a store around here who sold decent bettas. That'd make buying off Aquabid a little less tempting!

That's very interesting! I wonder why that happens.


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## tpocicat

I don't really know. I conditioned him, he build a little bitty bubble nest, and before I knew it, they were spawning! Since his nest was so small, I expected him to build it up once they were done.


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## beat2020

Very nice...The male is actually a Black Melano. Not sure what the female's color is called...


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## Badjer

Because I can't help but ask...will you be selling the fry?


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## tpocicat

Yes, but of course it depends on how many make it to adulthood. 

The female's color was the closest I could find to his. Female malanos are known to be sterile.


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## kfryman

tpocicat said:


> When I saw him, I just had to have him. A LFS imports bettas from Tailand, and I got there the day they were delivered.
> 
> About the bubble nest, there is a picture in the IBC 2012 calendar of fry being spit to the surface with no bubble nest. Never heard of it before, but since my fry are now a week old and free swimming, it didn't hurt them.


What is this store called? lol. If I ever go around Fresno i wanna check it out.


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## tpocicat

Kaz Tropical Fish. It's on McKinley just of of freeway 41. Good luck.


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## kfryman

Interesting the sell actual 5* plakats. I guess since they are shipped from Thialand. Prices aren't to bad for being imports either.

Btw I really like your pair, I wish I could get some fry but my mom doesn't like fish in the mail lol.


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## tpocicat

What I really like about getting my bettas there, is I can see them in person. Mine are HM's, but he does sell 5 star plakets, of course they cost more than 4 - 1 star plakets.


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## GreenTea

I really like your female! You and Tisia are making me jealous of your dark females, I always go for the bright ones! 

How many babies are there? It looks like she was super full of eggs.


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## tpocicat

My female looks almost black when the light isn't on her, I got her because she has fabulous fins IMO.
I don't really know how many fry there are. They zip all over the tank really fast. 
Yesterday when I got home from work, I went to look at the tank, and three of them were looking back at me! By the time I got back with the camera, they were gone>.< I just love looking at them.


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## bettalover2033

If the pair were in chards spawn they would be called "blue lace"


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## tpocicat

What I find interesting is that some of them have light colored bodies at the moment. They are all over the tank and really seem to love the decaps, almose like feeding them bbs without the work.


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## Bambi

Glad they like them, i'm staring at full orange bellies of my fry eating the decaps aswell.

The parents are gorgouse. And they do look a little similar to chard's blue laces, but alot darker.This is one of chard's old blue laces if you wanna see, but they've worked on their lines alot since then so i don't know how their blue laces are now


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## bettalover2033

Bambi said:


> The parents are gorgouse. And they do look a little similar to chard's blue laces, but alot darker.This is one of chard's old blue laces if you wanna see, but they've worked on their lines alot since then so i don't know how their blue laces are now


True, but I was talking more about the females "Blue Spots" on her body. Almost all of his blue lace females have the blue spots on their bodies.


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## Bambi

Ah, my black wit blue iridescence female has black spots on her body much like alot of black laces i've seen.
i'm assuming blue laces are like that just more..blue, like the royal blue? Color names still confuse me a little as some are strain specific and such(like all black crystals are blacklace,not all blacklace are black crystal)


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## Weeknd

This is my new girl.
It's pretty plain color, I was wondering if you any of you think it might change color some more or if that could be it.


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## bettalover2033

Weeknd said:


> This is my new girl.
> It's pretty plain color, I was wondering if you any of you think it might change color some more or if that could be it.


She is a very pretty girl you have there. Yellows are kind of rare to find in pet stores and do vary in tail types. IMO i would say that she is done with changing color. Though only time can tell and who knows, but it is highly unlikely she will change anymore. She might just get more of the yellow color on her fins to spread a little more, but that's about it. From what I would guess.



Bambi said:


> Ah, my black wit blue iridescence female has black spots on her body much like alot of black laces i've seen.
> i'm assuming blue laces are like that just more..blue, like the royal blue? Color names still confuse me a little as some are strain specific and such(like all black crystals are blacklace,not all blacklace are black crystal)


Well not really royal blue, but I would say it's more of a darker turquoise color that shines and is very noticeable especially with flash.

Also remember that all Marbles are Multicolors, BUT all multicolors are NOT marbles.

I agree that color names can be very confusing at times. Though it is to show ownership by the breeder. Usually names like "Blue Diamond" (meaning blue marble dragon) is just a name that breeders use when they have their own line. Though you would say why don't they just say blue marble dragon? They do this to be sure that the costumer remembers a unique name and can pass it on, thus making the name, breeder, and breed of fish/betta, very popular and the breeder will get lots more costumers and business.

Does that make sense?:lol:


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## tpocicat

I'm working to get really nice melanos, but since female melanos are sterile, I'm using the darkest female I've got, in the spawn that produced her however, there was some white and blue, so until my babies start to color up, I still don't know what I'm going to get.

My fry are two weeks old today! YAY!!! It looks as if I have around 25 or 30 healthy ones. Of course some are larger than others.


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## GreenTea

Awesome tpo  You know I'm gonna ask... pics? It's pretty amazing, I keep thinking my older fry are so small, but now with these new borns I'm like WOW they've grown so much! It's pretty amazing.


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## Curlyfatbottom

Want to see the out come of those two fish.


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## tpocicat

Thanks GreenTea and Curlyfatbottom. 
As soon as I can get some good pics, I will post them. They are still eyes and tails, just a little bigger.


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## Bambi

Betta lover: haha I know WHY they have strain names, it just get's confusing after a while because so many simply become overused and then generally accepted as fact(like what happened to mustard gas. though none of the MG's anyone here has are from that original breeder it's become the go-to name for blue/yellow fish. x.x)
hehe and yeah, up until my current spawn i only bred marbles so I've become familiar with marble vs multies. 

Weeknd: agree with bettalover, her yellow may spread a bit but she's very likely not going to gain any other colors. I haven't seen many yellows over here, congrats xD

tpocicat: from this spawn if you get a nice dark girl with not too much iridescence you could probably find a melano male to breed to her. But either way you're sure to get some lovely fishies.
My last 'line' had a tendency to throw alot of opaque whites xD so i suppose they do just pop up everywhere.


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## tpocicat

I believe my male is a melano, I just can't get a good picture of him.


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## Weeknd

Thanks for the answers bambi and bettalover.


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## tpocicat

I tried to take some pics yesterday, I think I might have a few good ones, just need to put them on my computer to see. They just look like little spots on the viewfinder on my camera.


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## xbecky685x

Your fish both have such a gorgeous colour!
I think i may have to look out for a fish similar when im ready to get my second 
x


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## tpocicat

Thank you!


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## tpocicat

My fry are still doing very well. I've only found one dead fry so far, doesn't mean I haven't lost more, I just haven't seen them.
Last night while siphoning out water (I use air line), one of the fry somehow got sucked up and fell on the paper towel I have in front of the tank while cleaning. Anyway, I very carefully touched him/her with my finger, and swished him/her back in the tank. The fry looked a little stunned at first, but then swam off, what a relief! Probably saying, "hey guys, guess what happened to me?"
When adding new water, I use the drip line method. That way the chemistry doesn't change very quickly. There is a size difference, but I've come to believe that is normal in spawns.


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## indjo

Size difference is normal. You might get some 2cm (less than 1") while some are still less than 5mm. If you have an extra tank, it would be best to separate them by size. This should give the small ones a chance to grow.

Keep up the good work.


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## tpocicat

My fry are only a little over two weeks old. Isn't that too young to be moving to new tanks?


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## Bambi

Mine are the same age and i'm afraid to separate them yet as well. >< But yeah, i also have the huge size differences. x.x


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## bettalover2033

It is never too early to separate and start movingbthem as long as you can catch them and have the water ages and with very close to the exact water as your current tank.

I would suggest separating, but it isnt essential at he moment. Just wait until they are three or three and a half weeks or so if you would feel more comfortable then.

This kind of thing, many breeders have to make choices and it differs as many breeders have different ways of breeding that works for them, but may not work for others.


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## tpocicat

At the moment, I feel comfortable leaving the smaller fry in with their bigger siblings. I have a large amount of java moss that they can hide in if there is any trouble. So far, I haven't seen any of the bigger fry picking on the smaller ones. 
At feeding time, they all come out and that is pretty much the only time I see the smaller ones. I haven't seen any agression yet.


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## Curlyfatbottom

You should be fine for another few weeks.
Cause The bigger one is not big enough to eat the little ones yet.


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## tpocicat

Thank you Curlyfatbottom. I think that there shouldn't be any trouble especially as long as they are fed often enough.


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## indjo

tpocicat said:


> My fry are only a little over two weeks old. Isn't that too young to be moving to new tanks?


I didn't mean now.

I often begin moving when they're 3 - 5 mm. I don't move according to age because some spawns grow faster than others.


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## tpocicat

OK, that's better. They aren't large enough to eat each other yet.


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## bettalover2033

@Indjo: That is very true, I forgot to consider that. I was meaning my own experience and how I averagely get fry and their sizes.......My bad....

@tpocicat: How are they today?


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## tpocicat

They are doing very well. While cleaning the tank, I discovered there are way more than I thought! A lot of them are hanging out in the java moss.


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## bettalover2033

I knew it! There are always more than we think. Especially when we have big bunches of live plants. Marimo balls are their favorite to hang out at. (Infusoria)

How old are they?


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## tpocicat

They will be three weeks tomorrow. They are doing very well, I am so excited, can't wait until they start showing color. I can barely seen their tiny fins.


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## bettalover2033

Great. Well since it is past midnight, they are a week and a day old.

Im sure it is very exciting. There are so many breeders on this forum now. Its amazing.

Which fins do you see on hem growing? My favorite fins to see "sprout" are they ventrals. They are too young to have them right now.


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## tpocicat

Just tiny caudle fins. They should be HM or at least close, father is HM, mother is almost HM.


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## bettalover2033

So the male is a HM and the mother is a Super DeT or just a DeT? If you are able try getting pics up.

If you have a phone you can do it that way or a webcam? I know you stated that you don't have a camera that is new. (New Old Camera) lol.

Well from this spawn you should see half and half with the tail types more so.


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## tpocicat

Mother is a super delta. I have pics, but I'm waiting for my daughter's BF to load them on the computer. He has the memory card device, so I'm having to be as patient as possible. By the way, I can now see anal fins and little bitty dorsal fins...so cute.


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## tpocicat

Finally a few pictures of my fry, not clear, but you can at least see them.


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## BeautifulBetta

awww lookit those sweet little guys <3 <3


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## bettalover2033

They look like little dots. How old currently?


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## tpocicat

They are 3 weeks old. The tank isn't as dirty as it looks, I let some algea grow, they like to pick at it, they love eating the micro organisms that grow there.


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## Bambi

such dark little babies you have <3


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## bettalover2033

If you want to reduce the chance of letting the algae take over the tank add some snails and live plants. Snails also help with the process of infusoria growth just as well as plants


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## tpocicat

I have some trumpet snails, they somehow didn't make it into any of my pics. The front and bottom are kept clear, I just let it grow on the back, you will see some lines where it has been eaten LOL.


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## tpocicat

Bambi, 
Yep, dark is what I'm aiming for, there are a few light ones, but the spawn my female came from had a few steel blue and white fry, so I think that might be what they will be once a little color comes in.


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## bettalover2033

tpocicat said:


> I have some trumpet snails, they somehow didn't make it into any of my pics. The front and bottom are kept clear, I just let it grow on the back, you will see some lines where it has been eaten LOL.


That's good. I have two trumpet snails and just one common pond snail.

I was hoping for a BUNCH of them to be produced, but they aren't really doing anything. I always have to look for some snails at the LPS and currently he doesnt have any apple snails and I dont have the money so I'm gonna have to look again and cross my fingers for a bunch of snails. Usually the pond snails leave a bunch of egg sacks and then they hatch within a day or so.


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## tpocicat

I went to the LPS to buy some mystery snails, but all the ones they had were dead! I'll have to wait to get more, anyway, maybe some more trumpet snails will hitchhike their way into my tanks by way of live plants.
It's funny, years ago when I started having aquariums, I hated snails hitchhikeing their way into my tanks, now I hope for them!


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## tpocicat

Last night I saw an almost all white fry! It must have been hiding in the java moss. I'll be very interested to see how that one turns out.


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## Fasht

I haven't subscribe to this post and nows the time, i just love the color of the parents! Is the male melano black? Not really sure how to name the colors yet but he's pretty. Can't wait for your fry to get bigger to see their real colors!


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## Bambi

Ooo
I know that some established black lines throw whites(like the Black crystal strain from Bettatalk will occasionally throw some of her Holy Grail whites).
It'll be nice to see how yours turns out


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## tpocicat

Fasht, yes the male is a melano from Thailand, the female I bought from a LFS that had several bettas from the same spawn.
Bambi, yes I will be very interested to see how that white one turns out, just because I'm breeding for melanos, doesn't mean I would turn away from any other really good types that may show up.


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## tpocicat

The fry will be a month old tomorrow! Happy one month Hatchday!!!

I also would like to give my daughter credit for helping me with my fry. I work full time, and without her help, I wouldn't have enough time to spawn bettas.


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## bettalover2033

YAY for your daughter!

Any iridescent color on them yet?


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## tpocicat

I can see a little, when I shine a flashlight on them. Melanos are supposed to be noniridescent, so I'm not looking for a lot or iridescence.


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## bettalover2033

Ah I see. I just like the look of shiny bettas


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## tpocicat

Actually, me too. 
I have a red dragon male that has some iridesence in his tail, it looks as if he has a bright pink streak in it. I think it's beautiful, but I could never show him, I just love looking at him though.


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## bettalover2033

My dragons have a purple iridescence when the florescent light hits them from an angle.

See:


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## Bambi

Mine will be a month tomorrow too(30days). xD 
It's awesome your daughter helps you out.


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## tpocicat

I don't really mind the iridescence in my red dragon, I think it's beautiful! Just in shows red isn't supposed to be that way.
Without my daughter's help with cleaning, water changes and feeding, I wouldn't be able to breed.


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## Fasht

Yeah thats cool your daughter helps you, she might end up breeding too when she grows up. Well how old is she? If you dont mind me asking. Wish someone would help me clean my tank too, sometimes its frustrating to siphon all the debris on the bottom o the tank with a small airline tubing ug, it sux


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## tpocicat

She's already grown up, she's 30. She still lives with me because she can't find a job, darn this economy! We share in the breeding. It's lucky we both like the same colors and tail type.


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## Fasht

Ahh, that's cool, i know i hate this economy too, its like theres no other job option rather than being in a health care


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## tpocicat

I agree, I'm just grateful I have a job.


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## Fasht

Hell yeah lol


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## tpocicat

^LOL.

Anyway, my fry are beginning to look like real bettas! The shape of the body is there in the larger ones. I'll try to get some pics soon.


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## Fasht

tpocicat said:


> ^LOL.
> 
> Anyway, my fry are beginning to look like real bettas! The shape of the body is there in the larger ones. I'll try to get some pics soon.


Thats good! Pictures are always welcome, how much water change do you do and how often do you and your daughter dothe eater changes?


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## tpocicat

The water in the fry tank gets a 50% water change every other day.


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## Fasht

Ahh, how big is your tank and how many fry do you have?


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## tpocicat

They are in a 6.6 bookcase tank. I think I have around 30, but it's hard to say for sure.


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## Fasht

Ahh, ive been doing 50% water changes everyday, i wonder if itll make a difference if i do it every other day


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## tpocicat

I've heard that more water changes = faster growth. All I can say is every other day works for me.


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## Fasht

I can see my biggest fry getting really big but not as much on the smaller ones lol


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## tpocicat

I know what you mean. But I've also heard other breeders say that some of their best bettas have been the "slow bloomers", so I don't give up on them just because they take their time growing up.


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## Fasht

Yep, deffinitely! Equal opportunity to everyone lol


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## wallywestisthebest333

good luck with your slow ones! I don't breed but I heard feeding a mixture of different food types at different sizes helps the big ones to get their food and the little ones to get theirs. =]


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## tpocicat

Mine are being fed microworms, brineshrimp decaps, and betta starter. They love the decaps the most, but I believe a mixture is best to make sure they are getting the nutrients they need.


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## tpocicat

My spawn is 4 weeks old now. Some of the larger ones are getting the betta shape, and ventral fins. I tried taking pics of them, but they turned out too blurry. My battery is low on my camera, so I'll have to change them as soon as I have the money to buy more.


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## bettalover2033

Well This is Tax Season so hopefully you will be able to do a lot for you fish these few months"


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## tpocicat

I see you've read my info


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## indjo

If you have an extra free tank, separate the large and small ones. Though the small ones eat like crazy, for some reason they will remain small if not separated.... maybe it's the stunting hormones, IDK. I didn't separate mine and the difference was 2.5cm - 0.5cm.

I often keep 6 - 12 fry under 2cm (less if I want to boost growth) in 1g (flat/shallow containers are better than normal tanks) but give them 2x 30-50% daily, feed 3 x a day. But once they reach 2cm, they have to be moved or reduced. Otherwise you might get problems.


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## bettalover2033

tpocicat said:


> I see you've read my info


Was this reply for me?


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## tpocicat

BL2033, yep.


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## tpocicat

I'm starting to see a little red wash on some of the fry, not to worry, the mother had red and lost it as she grew.


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## bettalover2033

That's fine, I'm sure she will either make it work or grow out of it so not to worry. In fact it is a bit hard to breed out (doable) but I like the red wash sometimes in dark bettas. Like for my Red and Black male, he has red wash and it suits him so nicely. They are HMPK's or HMs? I forgot from so many spawn logs I follow.


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## tpocicat

Mine are HM's. The fry's tank got cleaned last night, and since they are getting bigger, they are much easier to see now. As soon as I get batteries for my camera, I will post more pics. The ventrals are comming in too.


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## HayrideHaunter

I love reading these thread...ca't wait to see pics! betta babies are the CUTEST...gorgeous pair too =)


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## tpocicat

Thank you HH.


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## tpocicat

My fry are now 4 weeks and 2 days old. I'm seeing some blue on the larger fry. I'm waiting for my tax refund to come in, then I'll have new batteries and new pictures to post. The largest are just a little under 2 cm.


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## Fasht

tpocicat said:


> My fry are now 4 weeks and 2 days old. I'm seeing some blue on the larger fry. I'm waiting for my tax refund to come in, then I'll have new batteries and new pictures to post. The largest are just a little under 2 cm.


Yey morr pictures!!


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## tpocicat

The fry are starting to show colors now, red, turquoise, and blue. The melano fins of the male are on several of them.


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## BeautifulBetta

Awwwe!  Cant wait to see photos! I love when their colour starts to show


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## tpocicat

My daughter's favorite has a dark blue body and red fins. I don't know if it will stay that way, but sure will be interesting now that they are showing color. I've been way too busy. I got only one good pic of a turquoise fry! Must be irrid, because the truquoise can't be seen by the naked eye.


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## BeautifulBetta

Wow dark blue and red fins? That should be pretty cool  Yours are growing faster than mine I think! haha


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## tpocicat

I'm so frustrated! I took some pics last night, and all I got were dark bodies. I was trying for color, but didn't pick up any. I'll try again tonight.


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## tpocicat

I've got some new pics, so now I have to wait for my daughter to load them onto the computer. Please be patient, I have to:-?


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## Curlyfatbottom

How old are your fry


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## tpocicat

My fry are now 5 weeks and 5 days old. I'm so suprised by how many colors I have when I started with dark parents. So fun!!


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## Curlyfatbottom

That cool.
What are you feeding your fry


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## bettalover2033

They looks amazing! The colors on them are really interesting since you did have dark parents that were both blue. I guess their colors are coming out nicely.


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## tpocicat

I'm feeding the fry Atison's betta starter, decaps and microworms.

The colors are a surprise, but I'm really enjoying the surprise. It's part of what makes breeding bettas such fun.


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## Fasht

@tpocicat Kudos on that! I have a question for you, does your fry ever lose their colors temporarily when the lights have been off for a certain amount of time, or if they haven't been fed for a certain amount of time?


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## bettalover2033

@Fasht: I have had that happen to me as well. Usually when I turn off the lights a little while. I turned it off for a few hours of my time out of the house and came back to a bunch of fry that looked to be stressed. I guess they need to see...

I thought it was just my fry lol.


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## Fasht

ahh, lol I thought it was just me too, but this also happens alot to my only female betta and some of the fry


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## bettalover2033

Fasht said:


> ahh, lol I thought it was just me too, but this also happens alot to my only female betta and some of the fry


I find that it happens to some of the smaller males and just a few females really show the stress stripes.


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## Curlyfatbottom

Bbs really bring out the color of the fish.
Will in never try atison betta starter so I won't know a thing about it.
Most young fish and female more like all.
Lose there color when they sleep.
Light out mean sleep time for the fish.


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## tpocicat

Yes, mine are usually a little pale when the lights are first turned on, but they color up very fast. Then they start begging for food!


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## bettalover2033

Well once mine eat their food, they start to color up and their orang stomachs become bigger and brighter.


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## tpocicat

Well, the blue baby with red fins really did it! Last night we saw that it had lost the red and is now, black/white/blue. Really interesting.


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## tpocicat

My fry continue to grow and are developing their fins. I'll attempt to get some good pics this week end to post.


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## bettalover2033

Pictures soon I presume?

They sound healthy and happy! How old are they?


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## tpocicat

There were 7 weeks old yesterday.


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## tpocicat

I took pictures, but as always, I have to wait for my daughter's BF to put them on the computer so that I can post them...


----------



## bettalover2033

You owe us big time LOL.


----------



## tpocicat

I did my part, now it's time for my daughter's BF (who shall remain nameless) to do his part. LOL


----------



## tpocicat

We have at least one marble fry. He/she started out with a blue body with red fins, it's now black and white! My daughter really loves that fry.


----------



## BeautifulBetta

Awwwwwwe cute!!  I can't wait to see photos!


----------



## tpocicat

I'll be happy to post them as soon as my daughter's BF transfers them to the computer.
BTW, Curlyfatbottom came over Tuesday night and gave me some grindal worms for my fry...Curly, you have first choice of my fry (after me) if you're interested.


----------



## bettalover2033

Must be amazing to have another breeder to share ideas and breeding techniques with!


----------



## tpocicat

I think I'm the lucky one, he really knows what he's talking about.


----------



## Curlyfatbottom

Will see how my breeding goes.
In the next two month.
If I manage to produce some number then I'll be alright.
Thank for the offer


----------



## tpocicat

You're welcome. Of course we have to see how the fry develop anyway.


----------



## EvilVOG

looking forward to pictures


----------



## tpocicat

FINALLY!!! As you can see, I have been taking pictures of my fry, and now you can see what I see every day. Enjoy:


----------



## Curlyfatbottom

Just how I've remember it.
Looking good
Keep up the good work


----------



## BeautifulBetta

Awwww, theres a couple nice marbles in there! :O 
How big are they now?


----------



## bettalover2033

Wow they have really grown since the last few pictures we saw! The colors on them are really starting to show now! Also I did see a marble in there. He/She looks great and get ready for a huge change. Try to keep an eye on that marble to really see some changes. Also take tons of pictures of him/her for reference for us and yourself of course.

You're doing a great job!


----------



## tpocicat

Thank you, they will be 8 weeks tomorrow. 
The larger ones are about 1 1/4 inches now, I don't know how many cm that is. The smaller ones are about 3/4 inches.
Thanks Curlyfatbottom, they really love the grindals you gave me.
I can see at least 2 marbles, and I'm definately keeping an eye on them. One of them is black and white ATM, we'll have to wait and see what happens, they seem to change a little every day!


----------



## tpocicat

I've got a lot of colors, I'm now waiting to see if any of them develop into HM's. 
The mother is a super delta, and the father was '() a HM. There's red, blue, steel, and of course marble, so fun to watch.


----------



## Curlyfatbottom

Thing I look for in a hm spawn is fat tail base with a wide spread in fry.
80% of the time those are the keeper
Plus you can tell when the fry is a keeper or not when theyre 1 1/4" long
Not much will change


----------



## tpocicat

That's good to know, HM also depends on how many rays there are. The tails are too tiny and they are too fast to be sure yet how many rays are there.


----------



## Curlyfatbottom

Ray play a main role to.
You can tell that early to.
If the branching break of early and close to each other then those will be the one with a lot of end ray.
Number of ray matter to.
At the base of the tail you should count 9+(not count the first and last)and the end 8+
Those are the few thing that I've look for when I'm breeding hm


----------



## Curlyfatbottom

Don't worry with the diet change to a bigger worm
They will hit a growth spurt


----------



## tpocicat

Thanks CFB. I have several with wide tail bases, I'll start watching them reallll clooooose :0)


----------



## tpocicat

The marble is now almost all white. There is a tiny amount of color on the fins, but the black on the head has all but disappeared. The rest are doing fine, no problems with them so far...


----------



## Curlyfatbottom

The marble is still young n have time to change still.
Has the grindal worm boost te growth of the fry yet


----------



## tpocicat

They are growing, but I'm not sure if it is the grindal worm or just nature. They sure love them! Even the smallest ones will fight to get their share.


----------



## Curlyfatbottom

If it faster then usually is the food.
Switching to bigger food usually boost there growth


----------



## MoonShadow

What adorable babies!! They look great! And such a variety! Did you have any troubles feeding them decaps instead of live bbs? It seems like it would be so much easier then hatching bbs, but I would be afraid the fry wouldn't eat the eggs if they're not moving!


----------



## tpocicat

Thank you.
This was the first time I tried Decaps, and I didn't have any trouble. They went right after them.


----------



## tpocicat

The fry have been moved to a bigger tank. Besides getting a little pale for awhile, they made the move fine and are busy exploring their new home.


----------



## bettalover2033

That's great to hear. About how big are they?


----------



## tpocicat

The larger ones are about 1 1/8", the smaller ones are about 5/8 inches.


----------



## bettalover2033

So they are a nice size. I'm in love with their colors!


----------



## tpocicat

Thanks! I'll post more pics as they grow and change, just not much change ATM.


----------



## bettalover2033

I know what you mean...my fry just hit 1 week old today.


----------



## tpocicat

Since the father was a HM, I'm waiting for the caudles to develop, I'm sure I'll get deltas, but I'm really hoping for some HM's in this spawn.


----------



## bettalover2033

What was the other tail type you crossed? True. Most likely a bunch of deltas or super deltas with about 1/3 of HMs maybe depending on th tail type you crossed.


----------



## tpocicat

The mother is a delta with wonderful fins (why I chose her). The male was a HM with wonderful color.


----------



## bettalover2033

Well if he male has a pretty large amount of rays on his caudal you should see a bit of HMs in there. Probably about 45%. Depending on how many fry you result in. Though most of them will be super delta.


----------



## tpocicat

I have a couple I'm watching right now, I think they are male, and their caudles are looking pretty good so far.


----------



## bettalover2033

That's a good sign. Very early. Just make sure the tank is always clean and their fins will grow rapidly right along with the water changes taking out the stunt hormone.


----------



## tpocicat

My daughter changes the water every other day, so I think the water is as clean as it can be.


----------



## tpocicat

The marble fry is now 50-50 in color, white/smoke. We just have to wait to see what the future will bring.


----------



## GreenTea

Nice  Any new photos?


----------



## tpocicat

I plan to take more pics soon, I'm sick with a cold and asthema right now, so I plan to take pics when I feel better.


----------



## tpocicat

I have one fry that at this moment looks like what I am aiming for. The only problem is he/she has only 1 ventral fin. I know I can breed this betta, but I can't show it. There are others that have both ventrals that are close, so maybe they will develop into what I'm looking for.


----------



## BeautifulBetta

Funny how some bettas just dont develop a certain fin. Hope you get what you're looking for and that you feel better soon!!


----------



## tpocicat

Thank you. 
The doctor prescribed Prednisone and that makes me light headed. At least I don't feel like I'm going to drown anymore. 
Watching my bettas and playing with my cats and dogs helps me feel better.


----------



## BeautifulBetta

Animals are such good therapy when you're sick! <3


----------



## tpocicat

^A+++^


----------



## bettalover2033

How are the fry?


----------



## dramaqueen

I hope you feel better soon. Your fry are so cute.


----------



## tpocicat

Thank you, they are doing great! More colors than I had anticipated. I will take some pics as soon as I feel up to it. I just love watching them swim around. They eat anything I offer them now, and there is a little bit of agressiveness going on, not enough to be worried about though. No nipping, just chasing.


----------



## bettalover2033

About how old are they? I can't wait to see then.

I'm sure their genetics really came out wit this spawn.


----------



## tpocicat

They are about 2 and a half months old now.


----------



## bettalover2033

tpocicat said:


> They are about 2 and a half months old now.


A couple more months until parting. How many are there? Sorry about all the questions.

I am pretty excited to see them.


----------



## lvandert

Have you had to separate and jar any of them? If so when? if you don't mind me asking


----------



## tpocicat

They are still together, there hasn't been any serious aggression. I have about 20 and they are looking pretty good.


----------



## lvandert

I'm assuming you have a heavily planted tank then? It sounded like it from reading your posts. I got maybe a month before I move mine (if they hatch) into the grow out tank, what plant would you recommend? I can also get some bigger plants from my LPS if needed. They have some that are pretty big


----------



## tpocicat

I love Java Moss, it grows easily and doesn't need a lot of light. Just make sure when you get plants that they are fully water plants so that they can remain healthy.


----------



## lvandert

hmmm java moss...might have to make another run to the pet store lol. how big will it get in only a few weeks though? I'd love to avoid jarring if I could


----------



## lvandert

Well no such thing as a "bushy" live plant at petsmart, so I improvised. I found one of the fluval chi bush plants. But when I removed the top layer and flipped it around before putting it on I got this big square bushy plant mass.


----------



## tpocicat

Of course the fry will have to be jarred eventually, but it is nice having plenty of hiding places for the smaller fry. My Java Moss doubled in size in about 5 weeks. I've divided the origional mass among my other tanks. If I ever get too much, I plan to put it in my 50 gal goldfish tank, they eat EVERYTHING.


----------



## lvandert

Yeah I do realize but I'm kinda low on space LOL. what little space I had I used for my 20 gal. It doesn't beat the real thing but it'll work for a little while right?


----------



## tpocicat

The plant you have looks great, should work as long as the leaves are soft. The smaller fry will still be able to hide in it.


----------



## lvandert

Thanks tpocicat!


----------



## tpocicat

I took some pics, but they aren't very good. It's been raining, so there isn't much lighting. However, I did get one good one of the marble. I'll post as soon as I can.


----------



## djembekah

yay ^-^ are you feeling better as well?


----------



## tpocicat

I'm getting there. Still not 100%, but much better than last week. Thanks.
It's really hard to tell because they won't stay still, but I was able to count 4 rays on one of my babies! That's really exciting since they aren't near done developing yet.


----------



## bettalover2033

I hope you feel better! The family just got over a horrid stomach bug that went through us all.

You think this is fun...you'll love the point where you have to sex them.


----------



## tpocicat

My fry are 3 months old today.


----------



## lvandert

YAY! Do you have pictures of the little ones?


----------



## tpocicat

I have a few. I plan to take more as soon as I can.


----------



## bettalover2033

I cant wait to see pictures of the little guys/gals!

The exciting part is yet to come!


----------



## tpocicat

I am suprised at the color variety I've got. They are all growing very well, and I hope to get some good pics up soon.


----------



## KadenJames

Excited to see them. :thumbsup:


----------



## bettalover2033

This is really just pulling hairs for me!


----------



## Fasht

Happy 3rd months to both of us, hows your fry doing?


----------



## tpocicat

They are healthy and developing well. The colors are coming in, and there are a few suprises. I'll post as soon as I can get my daughter's BF to load them onto my computer.


----------



## bettalover2033

tpocicat said:


> They are healthy and developing well. The colors are coming in, and there are a few suprises. I'll post as soon as I can get my daughter's BF to load them onto my computer.


You need to figure out how you can do this soon because this is way too torturous!


----------



## tpocicat

Here they are: I got a really good shot of the white one, I think it's a female. As you can see, I have the dark ones I was trying for as well as turquoise(green), royal blue, and some that are light with turquoise fins. Enjoy!


----------



## bettalover2033

Oh wow they've already got their color in! I cant believe how big they are. Great job tpopicat! How old are they? The first one...is she the only oddball?


----------



## tpocicat

Yes she is the only white marble in the spawn. There were others early on, but they didn't make it. My daughter has already called dibs in it (her?)


----------



## bettalover2033

I would guess she is a she because all of the obvious males have longer fins and darker.


----------



## tpocicat

I plan to jar some of the more aggressive fry this week end. That will give the smaller ones a better chance to grow bigger and strong.


----------



## bettalover2033

When fry are jarred, i noticed that one of two things happen... their color comes out a lot more or they get extremely stressed and look to be depressed with less color than before and the stress stripes are very obvious.


----------



## tpocicat

I know, but it's time, besides, I want to give some of the less aggressive fry a chance to swim without having to hide in the plants all the time.


----------



## RayneForhest

when are you going to start taking orders ... or are you?


----------



## bettalover2033

Thats very good! It will give the "runts" a chance.

Is there a huge difference in size from the runts?


----------



## RayneForhest

bettalover2033 said:


> Thats very good! It will give the "runts" a chance.
> 
> Is there a huge difference in size from the runts?


Same here


----------



## tpocicat

The runts aren't too much smaller than the larger ones, it's just that some of the males are beginning to get a little aggressive, a few nips from fins, that sort of thing. I was lucky this spawn. 
When the fry get a little bigger, I'll post the ones that are up for sale here first 
I got a surprise too, a have two more fry that are beginning to marble!


----------



## bettalover2033

Can't wait to see them. Interesting how there are marbles from a pair of solid steels.


----------



## tpocicat

Some of the mother's spawn mates were blue/white, and I was told that blue lace (father) comes from marbles.


----------



## bettalover2033

Well they must have been one of the few solids.


----------



## tpocicat

I agree...I saw the female's spawn mates, but I didn't get to see the male's.


----------



## bettalover2033

And from what I'm told...the females are the ones that carry most of he genes passed on for finnage and males mostly pass the color. I remember indjo saying that.


----------



## tpocicat

She has fantastic fins, and that is why I chose her, it looks as if a lot of them have them BTW.


----------



## bettalover2033

True. Her fins are very nice


----------



## tpocicat

I didn't jar them this week end as planned. I got a new heater for the tub, but because my daughter needs new glasses, I didn't have enough to get a tub and jars, so we'll have to wait until next pay day. Lucky for me, they aren't TOO aggressive. The all seem to be growing well, no really small ones.


----------



## bettalover2033

Even though things don't go according to plan, we can still find a way to cater our fish the correct way.


----------



## tpocicat

You're right. I try my best to do what is right for my pets, furry and finny!


----------



## bettalover2033

I think it's crazy how we do so much just to see our pets happy and develop feeling for being such as fish, rats, dogs, ect....though that's just what makes us human:roll:


----------



## tpocicat

I'm still enjoying my fry. I have 3 marbles that I know of right now. What a wonderful surprise.


----------



## Enkil

Marbles are beginning to grow on me... lol

Been following along and keeping an eye on your pretties. I might have to grab one up. XD


----------



## tpocicat

I'll be happy to let you know when they are ready, and which ones I plan on selling, however, I don't have any shipping equipment yet, I'm waiting for the IBC store to come back up. I really hope it doesn't take too long.


----------



## Enkil

Sounds like a plan. ^_^ I'll keep an eye on the thread. Wish I had room for another male, but only have room for girls at the moment.


----------



## tpocicat

It's really funny, but so far, all my marbles are females!


----------



## Enkil

Well, aren't I lucky then? XD One would definitely stand out in my sorority.


----------



## MrVampire181

www.kensfish.com has better prices on shipping supplies than the IBC page.


----------



## tpocicat

:lol:


----------



## tpocicat

Thank you MrV for the address.

I fed my fry mosquito larvae for the first time, and they went crazy! They were so excited they were flareing at each other to be the first to eat the new exciting food.


----------



## tpocicat

My fry have eaten all of the mosquito larvae, so I'll just have to wait for the mosquitos to make more, LOL.


----------



## bettalover2033

Any new updates one these fry?


----------



## tpocicat

I've got jars, but my daughter hasn't jarred them yet. I want to start another spawn, but not until I have the room for them.


----------



## bettalover2033

Great to know, your not going to stop breeding just yet


----------



## tpocicat

I'm trying to breed show quality fish. I'm aiming for form first, color next, if they both happen on the same fish HOOORRRAAAYYY!!!


----------



## bettalover2033

I have to agree with that! If the fish has Nice fins plus nice color, that's a bonus!


----------



## tpocicat

Some of mine look pretty good, except for those darn long anals! The females seem to have better anal fins than the males, so at least that's a plus. I'll try to post some pics of what I'm trying to say when I get the chance.


----------



## bettalover2033

Okay. Yes I know what you mean. It's mostly the males that get stuck with the long anals. Females seem to be a lot more thick and the anal fins tend to stay fairly short. This is the number one reason I don't breed halfmoons.


----------



## tpocicat

I love the look of a good HM, so what am I going to do? LOL


----------



## bettalover2033

I agree. If you breed HMPK with HM, it works perfect (most times) sometimes the finnage is just horrible if the breeder doesn't know what they're doing....though that happens with any tail type.


----------



## tpocicat

I've used deltas to improve on the dorsal fin, but I haven't worked with plakats.


----------



## Curlyfatbottom

Use Dt to improve the dorsal fin


----------



## tpocicat

You're right. I have a male HM Dt, his dorsal looks like a sail! I plan on spawning him next.


----------



## Curlyfatbottom

How many male did you jar up already?????


----------



## tpocicat

I have 4 to jar up. My daughter is taking her time...I'm waiting for her to do it.


----------



## Curlyfatbottom

With hm line you want to jar them early to prevent fin rip 
Even without aggressive behavior 
I'll still jar them early
It's easier to make a fish flare to work out it's back fin


----------



## tpocicat

I've been sick lately, viral flu, so I'm having to rely on her to do the jarring. I've asked her once again today to jar the fry.


----------



## Curlyfatbottom

K.
Suck to be sick.


----------



## jeffegg2

tpocicat said:


> I've been sick lately, viral flu, so I'm having to rely on her to do the jarring. I've asked her once again today to jar the fry.


Just got my over my bout of the flu. I hate being sick.... You never appreciate being well until you are not.

Jeff.


----------



## bettalover2033

I have to agree jeffegg. Being sick and sometimes not able to do what you want is frustrating.


----------



## tpocicat

That's for sure! I ended up in the Emergency Ward because I was dehydrated. Getting better though, I plan on going to the betta show on Saturday in Santa Clara, so I've GOT to be better!!!!


----------



## bettalover2033

OF COURSE you have to get better only so you can take tons of pictures and videos for us back here in the middle of no where.

Can you?


----------



## tpocicat

There are several of us from this forum that plan to meet up there. If all works out well, there should be quite a few pics to enjoy.


----------



## bettalover2033

Sounds great! I'm excited to see these pictures. What day is it?


----------



## tpocicat

This Saturday, May 12, can't wait. I'm hoping to be able to buy some nice HM females for my sorority, and maybe a male HM, they should be really nice.


----------



## bettalover2033

I'm sure you'll be able to find AMAZING HM's there (and HMPK's!). It's Aquabid bettas (nice ones) minus the shipping charges lol.

You're so lucky! I need to look at some upcoming events for my area.


----------



## tpocicat

I'm only sorry Karen won't be sending any of her's to the for sale table. Oh well, as I said to her, maybe next time...


----------



## Enkil

If I had the money on me right now to send, I'd have you grab me a couple too. XD


----------



## tpocicat

I'm pretty sure I'll be able to find something I like, even without Karen's beautiful fish there.


----------



## jeffegg2

tpocicat said:


> That's for sure! I ended up in the Emergency Ward because I was dehydrated. Getting better though, I plan on going to the betta show on Saturday in Santa Clara, so I've GOT to be better!!!!


Drink more water!!!

Jeff.


----------



## tpocicat

jeffegg2 said:


> Drink more water!!!
> 
> Jeff.


 I was and still am, but the other end wouldn't cooperate


----------



## tpocicat

I have four of the more aggressive males jarred. I may have to do some more jarring, looks like there are more females than males in this spawn.


----------



## bettalover2033

Your original pair, was the mom older or younger than the dad?


----------



## tpocicat

She is older than he was. She had also been bred before too.


----------



## bettalover2033

Okay, well when you breed her again (if you do) please let me know the male to female ratio. I want to compare mine to other breeders because OFL and I have a theory that Older male to younger female or Older female to younger male will result in More females to Less male or More males to less females.

Just a small experiment with these guys.


----------



## tpocicat

Just got my mailing boxes, now to get the bags. I'll post pics here of the ones I want to sell first before posting on Aquabid.
That's the hard part: getting good pictures of bettas!


----------



## bettalover2033

I can't wait to see them. They must be so big now!


----------



## tpocicat

Almost as big as their parents.


----------



## tpocicat

Some of my babies are HM's! At first, I thought that all of them were super deltas, but yesterday when I flared a couple of the males, they showed full HM caudles. I'm really happy about that. I need batteries for my camera, then I'll post pics.


----------



## lvandert

Yay!!


----------



## tpocicat

There are several royal blues. The one with the best spread only has one ventral (boo), but other than that, they are doing very well.


----------



## bettalover2033

The ventrals IMO, aren't too bad and one missing ventral isn't going to burn him.

You have to get PICTURES SOON!!


----------



## tpocicat

I just can't show a betta with missing ventrals. He will be a great breeder though!


----------



## bettalover2033

Well you don't have to put him in an IBC show (if that's what you mean)

But I meant, pictures here so we can see all your lovelies!


----------



## tpocicat

I understand, and I will post pics as soon as I can. I'm trying to breed for IBC shows, so that is why I'm a little disapointed since IMO he's the best of the males.


----------



## Enkil

Congrats on the HMs! Can't wait to see pictures. Sorry your one boy is missing a ventral.


----------



## tpocicat

Thank you Enkil. 
I hope I will have the opportunity to send some to a betta show soon. There's going to be one in Florida in June, but I hope there will be another one here in California I can send them to.


----------



## RayneForhest

What causes missing ventrals?


----------



## jeffegg2

RayneForhest said:


> What causes missing ventrals?


It appears there is a bacteria that hangs at the bottom of the tank. When feeding MW, the Betta fry feed from the bottom, so that it how it is related to MW. The fix seems to be keep the bottom of the fry tank squeeky clean!

Quote:
Missing Ventrals
This has been a major ordeal for us and we have finally got to the root of the problem. In fish 
tanks there is bacteria that grows this is very normal if the bacteria is kept to normal levels. In 
fry tanks this is quite difficult to do has it is not so easy keeping the bottom of the tanks clean. 
We have resolved this issue by adding an airstone to the tanks to keep the water well circulated
and the fry off the bottom of the tank most of the time. Dry commercial foods can also be a 
problem as this sinks down to the bottom of the tank and causes abnormal bacteria grown. 
Every second day from when the male is removed we siphon the bottom of the tank and wipe 
carefully with a sponge. We also only feed Microworms or other live foods for the first 3 weeks 
this is the time period that the ventrals are most likely to be dissolved. Baby brine shrimp is also 
a good option as they swim around the tank and will keep fry of the bottom, we stopped 
feeding Baby Brine as we were getting lot of fish with Swim Bladder problems but this could 
have been due to over feeding. I personally do not like Brine Shrimp in any form I find it bloats 
the fish and is a very unnatural food for fresh water fish, they can also carry a lot of parasites. 
But in saying this a lot of people feed it with no problems. Feeding live food also saves cleaning 
up a lot of mess on the bottom of your tanks.


----------



## tpocicat

We clean the tank bottom as soon as the babies stop eating when we feed them MW. Seems a few got through anyway. Only one has one missing ventral, so that isn't TOO bad.


----------



## jeffegg2

Probably nothing with housekeeping, just if you happen to have that bacteria on the bottom of your tank....

Lucky you did so well.

Jeff.


----------



## tpocicat

I agree, especially since the first spawn I had, all the fry had missing ventrals! I didn't know as much then as I do now.


----------



## RayneForhest

Will the ventrals regenerate?


----------



## tpocicat

No because they never formed, they don't have anything to regenerate from.


----------



## MrVampire181

I had missing vents in the past from micro feedings. But when I used them recently I actually didn't have any issues because I was always changing water and siphoning the bottom.


----------



## tpocicat

I learned my lesson with my first spawn. As soon as I see the fry are done eating either me or my daughter siphon the bottom.


----------



## Timberland

Awesome!


----------



## tpocicat

I have pics of two males and two females I would like to sell. I will leave them here for a couple of days before putting them on Aquabid:


----------



## MrVampire181

Oh wow! Id keep em both lol. They are nice.


----------



## tpocicat

Thanks MrV! They are, but I've already picked several females and one male with a butterfly pattern for my future breeding.


----------



## Enkil

Oh my gosh! That first female! <3
I need to upgrade my sorority. Or set up my other 10 gal. >>


----------



## tpocicat

Thank you this spawn really turned out nice.


----------



## jeffegg2

Great looking Bettas!!

Jeff.


----------



## Enkil

I may have to set up my other 10 gal and see if I can talk Devon into letting me have a couple more. XD


----------



## Sincerely

Look at those babies all grown up! They look fantastic!


----------



## tpocicat

Thank you everybody! They are only the beginning. I have several I want to sell, but I just don't want to overwhelm myself.


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## bettalover2033

The wait for these pictures was worth it. The second male and first female would be my first choice as a pair. Nice job.


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## tpocicat

Thank you. I might just take a pic of the ones I chose to keep if I get the time that is


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## bettalover2033

That'll take another couple of months LOL. Though I have to say, from the parents til now my eyes were like this O.O when I saw them.

Also the parents were so dark I'm surprised there is so much blue.


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## Curlyfatbottom

Really nice turn out


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## tpocicat

There was a lot of blue and white in the spawn the female came from. The male came from Thailand, so I don't have any idea what his spawn looked like.


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## Curlyfatbottom

From my guess he was from a black marblexblue spawn


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## tpocicat

I've posted these four bettas on Aquabid, two already have bids.


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## tpocicat

All four of the posted bettas have sold on Aquabid. I was honestly suprised at how fast they went! I've gotten my first payment and will be sending the betta tomorrow, the buyer paid for Express.


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## Anitax3x

Great job! This is inspiring!


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## bettalover2033

Nice job! I look forward to your future spawns!


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## tpocicat

I'm currently trying for a salamander spawn, but my couple are behaving like room mates instead of a pair!


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## bettalover2033

That kind of annoys me. My salamander pair died a few months ago. I was waiting to spawn them.


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## tpocicat

I'm so sorry for your loss. Salamanders are sooo beautiful.


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## tpocicat

I just wanted to let you know I have a few females available. Their pictures are on tpocicat's bettas thread.


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## VictorP

What about the pairs you are keeping? I would like to see them!


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## tpocicat

I will as soon as I can get pics of them. It takes time, since I work full time.


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## Enkil

I hope your salamanders start cooperating! I'm sure you would end up with some lovely fry.

Very happy to be getting a couple of your girls though.


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## tpocicat

Enkil said:


> I hope your salamanders start cooperating! I'm sure you would end up with some lovely fry.
> 
> Very happy to be getting a couple of your girls though.


Thank you Enkil, I'm feeding them really good to get them all conditioned again. I hope this next time they will be more willing. Last time, they acted like room mates rather than a pair.


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## tpocicat

Here is one of the males I've decided to keep:
So pretty and his color is such a wonderful suprise.


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## Anitax3x

He is Just like my breeder male!!! GORGEOUS COLORS!!!


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## inareverie85

Really great-looking guy you have.


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## choob99

I hope you salamander pair works out, I would love some fry. My LPS has a Dumbo salamander male and i keep resisting buying him lol he is $45 which I don't care about but i'm not really into PK's but that dumbo on on him with the salamander is just beautiful


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## tpocicat

My salamander pair cost $60. I got them from Karen and they are worth every penny. Now if I can just get them to breed...


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