# Bladder snail problems (Prolly not what you think)



## AbraCassandra (Oct 27, 2021)

So a couple months ago I made a post asking what type of new snails I was seeing in my tank. I've accepted them into my family and my girl's home. HOWEVERRRRRR it's dang near impossible to clean my betta's tank now. Truth be told, I don't clean it very often. Now hear me out. I know you're supposed to do a 25% change once a week or so...But she went a whole month without a change. I tested the water every day and everything was perfectly balanced. PERFECTLY. I think everything in there has formed it's own ecosystem and has been literally taking care of itself.

I decided today to go ahead and do a 25% change JUST to cull some plants that were getting out of hand and vacuum the substrate a tiny bit. I figured "OK. if I accidentally vacuum up a couple bladder snails I'll just pick em out with my tweezers and plop em back in the tank". And THAT folks was my mistake. So I used a clear gallon crystal geyser jug for this errand, figuring once the silt settles I'll see all the snails I sucked up..I...Thought...WRONG. Oh I saved about 6 or 7 bigger ones....But did YOU know that they can be almost MICROSCOPIC?! I legit saved one that was as big as the point of a needle and ONLY because he was crawling up the inside of the bottle and I saw movement. Omg...I must have rescued 20 so far. I feel so frickin bad it's been 12 hours and I'm still checking the jug to see if anymore have started moving around and have been saving 4-5 every time I check. Guys...How TFFFF do I clean my girls tank now without harming the littles? I am frickin responsible for every single teeny tiny life in there now.

Help???.....O.O


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## Eridanus (Jul 1, 2021)

I have the same issue with mine in one of my tanks.. 

Personally, and unfortunately, I ended up coming to the acceptance that I wouldn't be able to rescue all of them. 

But, I use a large 5gallon bucket that my dirty tank water goes in for my cleanings. 
There's more visual space imo and it's easier to get them out. I also use a flashlight to help see them better. 
Maybe consider a bigger bucket or using a light to see? 

When people want to get rid of them in a tank they'll stick in a piece of lettuce to attract the snails. 
What if you put a piece of lettuce in the bottle after every cleaning? See if that attracts the ones you siphoned up? Then you could stick them back in the tank? 
I've never tried this, but if it works one way I'd think it'd possibly work another. 

Hope this helps! And how's Sundance doing btw?


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## AbraCassandra (Oct 27, 2021)

Eridanus said:


> I have the same issue with mine in one of my tanks..
> 
> Personally, and unfortunately, I ended up coming to the acceptance that I wouldn't be able to rescue all of them.
> 
> ...


I'll definitely try the lettuce trick. I always have lettuce on hand for my fur son John Wheek.

Sunny is doing great but she kinda peaked as far as looks go. I think her fins were so bad that they got perma damaged because they just stopped growing and she still has that one eye that I think will always be popped out BUT besides that she is a very happy little girl with a voracious appetite and she always comes up to the glass when me or my husband are around. Lol we've started calling her out little pink torpedo.


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## Eridanus (Jul 1, 2021)

I hope it works for you! 

And awww! I'm so glad to hear she's doing well


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## AbraCassandra (Oct 27, 2021)

Eridanus said:


> I hope it works for you!
> 
> And awww! I'm so glad to hear she's doing well


You know I really don't think these are actually bladder snails. Way too tiny. They have spirals but NOT spirals big enough to be malaysian trumpet snails. I haven't been able to figure out what the heck they are but the biggest ones I have are maybe less than a 4th of an inch. VERY small. I'll try to get some pics along with a pic of sunny's tank now.


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## AbraCassandra (Oct 27, 2021)

First of all here's the queen in her castle. 









And now these snails...So Bladder Snails sound like they grow large, like half an inch. Plus they're kinda stubby and short...Malaysian trumpet snails have a super long spiral. THESE guys are kind of in the middle. Their spirals aren't very long but they're definitely not short and stubby like bladder snails...Any idea? I'd just like to know so I can understand them better. And yes there are Nerite snail eggs all over the dang place lol They haven't hatched though since the water isn't brackish but my two nerites lay them nonetheless.




























I've googled ALL over trying to identify these.


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## Eridanus (Jul 1, 2021)

Sundance is such a beautiful girl!!

Definitely not bladders lol
How long have you had them?
I know there's a few varieties of MTS', but I don't know much about the others.
MTS' get, at max, to be an inch. Maybe your guys are just on the smaller side? I know they grow kind of slowly and can live a few years.
Admittedly, I don't know. Just kind of speculating. I'll do some research too though..


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## BettaloverSara (Oct 15, 2020)

You can put a piece of nylon over the end of the hose.


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## AbraCassandra (Oct 27, 2021)

BettaloverSara said:


> You can put a piece of nylon over the end of the hose.


Will that allow me to still suck up the silt in the substrate? That's what it really needs. That natural mud like substrate gets SO much nasty silt and stuff in it but the snails live in it too lol


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## AbraCassandra (Oct 27, 2021)

Eridanus said:


> Sundance is such a beautiful girl!!
> 
> Definitely not bladders lol
> How long have you had them?
> ...


So it all started when I ordered some Duckweed from an Etsy seller. The plants arrived in great condition but I noticed there were two teeeeensy little snails in the cup with the duckweed. A tiny ramshorn and a teensy whatever these spiral dudes are. I was so new to betta fish and was scared of snails at the time, not knowing if they'd be harmful to her, this was also the time when she was soo ill. So I decided to leave them in the cup with some duckweed and take some to put in my tank after rinsing it off with 3% peroxide and then water. So there they lived for months. I assumed they'd you know...pass on on their own but they just stayed aliveand kept fighting with all the nasty things starting to grow in the cup and eventually I felt so bad that I put them both in the tank and figured whatever happens happens. The Ramshorm whom I named Turbo was suuuper active. zipping around all over, even on the top of the water upside down, super cute. The other mystery dude I named Dracula because I only saw him twice in the proceeding months and only at night lol. Turbo passed away and I figured the other did too since I never saw him again...Months later I noticed another little mystery spiral snail, then another, then another. They're all over now lol Dracula's little legacy. I guess I've had them for a few months now at least that's when I started noticing them. They start SUUUPER tiny. I'm talking tip of a needle tiny.


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## sparkyjoe (Feb 27, 2012)

I love a good mystery…. this could be way off but look up the New Zealand mud snail and see what you think.


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## AbraCassandra (Oct 27, 2021)

sparkyjoe said:


> I love a good mystery…. this could be way off but look up the New Zealand mud snail and see what you think.


Hey that looks REALLY similar...You know what? I'm gonna see where that Etsy seller is from.


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## AbraCassandra (Oct 27, 2021)

Welp I think Sparkyjoe found the species. Very interesting. 230 snails per year per snail eh? lol good thing I live by a lake. Once they start taking over I can start evicting them to a more natural environment if need be. haha

How frickin sad I cannot find any care instructions because they're considered a highly invasive species.


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## sparkyjoe (Feb 27, 2012)

That’s a lot of snails!!!!


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## AbraCassandra (Oct 27, 2021)

sparkyjoe said:


> That’s a lot of snails!!!!


Yea...As far as my 5 gallon tank goes I kinda see them everywhere I look. My only concern i\s if they eat the beneficial bacteria. I was rocking 5.0 nitrates for months and almost reaching the recommended 10 but then suddenly it was 0 so I've been adding new Fritz turbo bacteria in again but like...Did the snails do that? There's nothing else that's been going on in the tank.


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## sparkyjoe (Feb 27, 2012)

My nitrates are always zero because of live plants. I would think that many snails would increase the bioload?


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## NoodleTheMysteryBetta (Mar 22, 2020)

AbraCassandra said:


> Welp I think Sparkyjoe found the species. Very interesting. 230 snails per year per snail eh? lol good thing I live by a lake. Once they start taking over I can start evicting them to a more natural environment if need be. haha
> 
> How frickin sad I cannot find any care instructions because they're considered a highly invasive species.


Please do not release anything from your aquarium into your local ecosystem. This hobby has done a lot of damage to freshwater ecosystems and it is our duty to do our part and not further introduce species that are not native to our waterways.


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## AbraCassandra (Oct 27, 2021)

NoodleTheMysteryBetta said:


> Please do not release anything from your aquarium into your local ecosystem. This hobby has done a lot of damage to freshwater ecosystems and it is our duty to do our part and not further introduce species that are not native to our waterways.


Sure thing


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## sparkyjoe (Feb 27, 2012)

If you haven’t already done so, you might want to notify the seller. You might also want to add a review that tells other buyers of the possibility of introducing these invasive snails to their aquariums.

It doesn’t necessarily have to be a negative review, but as a buyer I’d sure appreciate that type of information.


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## AbraCassandra (Oct 27, 2021)

sparkyjoe said:


> If you haven’t already done so, you might want to notify the seller. You might also want to add a review that tells other buyers of the possibility of introducing these invasive snails to their aquariums.
> 
> It doesn’t necessarily have to be a negative review, but as a buyer I’d sure appreciate that type of information.


I had tried to look up the order shortly after I made this post to see if anyone else had said anything and the order and seller are both gone. I guess they left Etsy.


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## sparkyjoe (Feb 27, 2012)

AbraCassandra said:


> I had tried to look up the order shortly after I made this post to see if anyone else had said anything and the order and seller are both gone. I guess they left Etsy.


Wow. That’s a little freaky. Wonder if they started getting a bunch of complaints?


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## betta4ever! (Oct 5, 2021)

I have those snails in my tank for 2 years now! I've been trying to identify their species all this time!! I now have.... At least 500 or more of them. So now I know that they're new Zealand mud snails...! And WHERE did those snails come from???!!! I have no idea!!! Do you think releasing some of them in a lake is a good idea? 
Also, I am glad Sunny is doing good!


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## FishandBirdLover (May 5, 2021)

betta4ever! said:


> Do you think releasing some of them in a lake is a good idea?


Please don't do that. They will start populating as much as they do in your tank. Then I don't even want to know what happens. Have you tried selling them as feeder snails?


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## BettaloverSara (Oct 15, 2020)

betta4ever! said:


> I have those snails in my tank for 2 years now! I've been trying to identify their species all this time!! I now have.... At least 500 or more of them. So now I know that they're new Zealand mud snails...! And WHERE did those snails come from???!!! I have no idea!!! Do you think releasing some of them in a lake is a good idea?
> Also, I am glad Sunny is doing good!


Never do this. In Canada this is illegal and you can get a hefty fine if caught. But more importantly it messes with the areas natural ecosystem and can do a lot of damage to the native plants and animals.


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## betta4ever! (Oct 5, 2021)

Woops I meant pond🤪 There is a pond in a park near my home.


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## sparkyjoe (Feb 27, 2012)

betta4ever! said:


> Woops I meant pond🤪 There is a pond in a park near my home.


Still a very bad idea and quite possibly illegal. Even if it’s just your own private pond. 

Introducing non-native species is usually very detrimental to the local native species. It’s the same whether it’s a snail, a bird, a mammal, a tree, an insect, or a plant. 

The alien species can frequently outcompete the local population for food and breeding locations and can quickly spread. 

One of my other passions is our local (USA) eastern bluebird. They are cavity nesters so having a hollow in a tree or, more commonly, a bluebird box is mandatory to their ability to reproduce. 

The cute, feisty little “house sparrow” is an invasion species from Europe. They have actually spread to most areas of the world except the poles. 

Those cute little “sparrows” are actually murderous death machines when they want to be. Go do a quick internet search for what a house sparrow can do to bluebirds and their offspring. But I probably wouldn’t do that research if you’re eating or have a weak stomach because it’s not pleasant.

If you want to get rid of some of your NZMSnails do it carefully. Don’t pour them down the drain, because apparently they can possibly survive chlorine (aka bleach). Don’t pour them outside where there’s even the slightest chance of them surviving. 

There are ways to humanely destroy them. Or you can try an assassin snail but I haven’t found concrete evidence that they can/will eat them. 

Unintended consequences can be a real (insert bad word here).

Ok…. Stepping off my soapbox now. I’ve got bettas to feed!


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## betta4ever! (Oct 5, 2021)

Ok... I guess I will keep them all  I don't want to kill them, and I honestly didn't think that releasing them in a pond would be bad, obviously it is, so they'll all stay with me.


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## AbraCassandra (Oct 27, 2021)

betta4ever! said:


> I have those snails in my tank for 2 years now! I've been trying to identify their species all this time!! I now have.... At least 500 or more of them. So now I know that they're new Zealand mud snails...! And WHERE did those snails come from???!!! I have no idea!!! Do you think releasing some of them in a lake is a good idea?
> Also, I am glad Sunny is doing good!


Nah. I had considered it but after considering it'd be a bad idea to put those in our lake I decided that I'll let em be and when Sunny is ready to cross rainbow bridge, I'll just keep the tank going til they all die off naturally. Eventually they'll run out of food and pass on.


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