# IMMEDIATE help! two new rescues!



## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Okay, I trudged over to the pet store, and found 2 healthy bettas (left there as they WILL find homes), one with minor fin rot (water had been recently changed though), and 3 males and 2 females.

So, looking them over, chose Juniper (yep  ) over the other two males. Why? Not only have his fins been chewed down by tiny fish like neon or ember tetras, he has fin rot AND his body is VERY VERY stiff. I'll have him ASAP on AQ salt and warm, clean water!

Now, looking at the others since I wanted to rescue two. The dalmation, was such a beauty... but, rescue over healthy... so no. Didn't get him. Then I look over and go, "another empty bowl?" I looked in and WRONG. not empty. a tiny, barely over a half inch baby "female" betta. Her fins, were clamped. Fin rot is apparent. Caudal fin is missing a chunk.

And... Dorsal fin GONE with a HOLE in her BODY. The hole is filled/covered with white fuzz, which I can only assume is rot/slime coat mix.

I've speed-walked home, holding them to let them take all the heat (hands freezing x.x) Now I have them in my sauna-of-a-bedroom covered in a quilt and leaned against two pillows, until I get their quarantine containers ready.

1. The male's stiff body I am not familiar with. Is it just from cold, stagnant water?
2. The female, now named Sarah, what is the hole from? another fish? or fin rot?


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## Luimeril (Dec 29, 2010)

the female is your biggest worry. for now, keep the male warm and dark with clean water.

the female with a hole in her, though... if you could get photos, we'd be able to help better. i dunno what that could be from, unless it's columnaris. that's been known to eat into them, i think...


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Well, I've watched a betta suffer in the store (I couldnt get him) with mouth fungus. he had it on his mouth, then fins, then bursting sores over his body. Hers... I dunno. I'll try getting a photo, but my camera needs batteries and my ipod takes bad pictures. Even if I can get a video of my poor Sarah!

The male might be a butterfly. or, it's fin rot  or both :lol: he is not a terrible worry, he is a medium severe, she is a major severity.


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## Luimeril (Dec 29, 2010)

crappy Ipod pics, are better than none right now. as long as we can see the fuzzy hole. :V and as long as they're not so fuzzy, she's just a colored blob.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

I took ipod pics, and you can see the fuzzy spot where the hole is, you can see she lacks any dorsal fin. she has no color either o.o 

As for the male, he is very stressed, stress stripes and all. I don't blame him. I covered his container with syran wrap (with a space for air to get through) so it stays warm and humid. Neither betta has true color, or barely any color. He, might be a blue. I cannot tell. D: she is a "no clue probably none". Okay, so, there are no fuzzy spots, sores, gashes, or anything elsewhere on Little Sarah

also I wish I could resize the pics so it was more defined.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

*picture flooding*

You know, I should just draw what I see. I can do it accurately. this'l take a little while, but I'll do it and post it too along with THESE other pics

and now seeing the pictures on here... yeah Ima draw her. and show you what it looks like. thank god for artistic talent.


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## Fleetwood (Jul 8, 2011)

Hm. Are her fins black or frayed at all? It could be Fin Rot, but it could certainly be from another fish. Keeping the male in dark warm water is the best thing you can do for him right now but, you're right. The female is your main concern right now. You say "fuzzy spot"? To me, that sounds like the hole could have been caused by a fungal infection, but I'm unclear as to whether or not you mean "fuzzy" in terms of photo quality or appearance of your fish.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

I'll draw ya (did draw a rough simple non-intricate drawing) a picture, and it'll show you the missing piece, the fuzz spot, and fast-written details :lol: Fuzzy, as in both? xD The pictures suck, yes I am sorry D: The fuzzy, is on my girl too

I'll make another one once I find a pen, for more of a detailed look

Also, the fins are clear as were my other 4 females I have. however, there are some spots that are deteriorating (not seen in picture, spots, on fin) there is a huge chunk missing, and the top one I found a single strand of fin left

secnd picture added


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

An update on my little Juniper: He has shown immediate progress in not only movement, but color. Here is a picture of Ghengis - why? Because THEY ARE IDENTICAL  

Ghengis is more purple/red, but he too started out a nice light brown with a tinge of maroon. So here is an idea of what Juniper will look like with his fins grown back!!!!


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## Luimeril (Dec 29, 2010)

sounds like she had fin rot that reached the body. erm... do you have any fungus meds? or... what meds do you have? maybe someone can tell you what to dose her with out of what you have?


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

do I have meds? :lol: I do so  -grabs them all...in the bin....-
1. parasite clear tank buddies jungle brand
2.mardel maracyn 2
3.furan-2 anti-bacteria 
4.jungle ich guard 
5. epsom salt
6. aquarium salt

I'm just using AQ for Juniper.


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## Luimeril (Dec 29, 2010)

hhmm.... i'm not sure which one would be good for this. my mind keeps saying the Maracyn 2, but i'm not 100% on that. :T i'd not dose with salt, in case it IS Columnaris... that'd be bad, i think.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Okay. Yeah, I'll only use it on him. I'd like to use it on her, to help the open wound, but I'm not sure either on the salt.

Maybe I'll have to see when she poops? All that was in her cup was uneaten food (she ate one soaked flake while I was walking around the store with her bowl), and tiny little poop pieces, all of which were brown.

got both home, he won't eat (that is fine) and she ate a bloodworm.


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

WOW! Poor Sarah-good luck! I hope she pulls through.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

thanks D: I'm wondering if I should go ahead and use Maracyn...it says for cotton wool, bacterial fin and tail rot, and septicimia...


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

I think it's a pretty good broad spectrum as far as fish antibiotics go. Good luck & keep us posted!


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

okay, I'll give them a shot.... reading instructions- x.x She better get better D: I'd hate to have lost her.

but... it says 2 packages per 10 gallons, then 1 package second to fifth day per 10 gallons...

she is only in a gallon...and a half... o.o


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

The dosage thing is kind of tricky. I can't dose my tanks (except Ty's which is a 5 gallon) with antibiotics without checking. Let me message my friend, Sakura8, who is not only a great diagnostician, but is good with dosage amounts. Oldfishlady too is super good at that. Would it be okay if I sent Sakura your question and story?


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## Myrtaceae (Dec 17, 2011)

I don't know a whole lot about sick fish, but I've always liked math.  Our powers combined, we are captain planet? :lol:

Dissolve one packet into one cup of water and add 15 teaspoons of the mixed up water to the 1.5 gallon tank. 

Explanation: 1.5 gallons is 15% of 10 gallons, so you want to give her 15% of the standard dose. If you dissolve 2 packets in 1 cup of water (250ml), then the appropriate dose for a 1.5 gallon tank would be 37.5ml of that water (15%). To avoid wasting medicine, you can dissolve 1 packet in the 250ml of water, but double the amount of water added (30% instead of 15), since one packet can effectively treat 5gal and medicine is expensive. Each teaspoon is 5ml.

250*0.15=37.5 -- 15% of a cup
37.5/5=7.5 -- number of teaspoons in 15% of a cup
7.5*2=15 -- twice the number of teaspoons (since we are using half strength solution)

I'm sure there was an easier way for me to explain that, but I need more coffee.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

go ahead and tell Sakura  and my goodness, Myrtaceae. :lol: I fail at math, thanks! xD

So, for using one packet.... one cup of water... 15 teaspoons...?


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## hummingbird (Dec 30, 2011)

I am so sorry Sena! Thats horrible! The pet store should learn to keep their fish in MUCH better condition! 
My local pet store is the same but maybe even worse! Normally they have about 20-30 Betas in a small 5 gallon tank all squished together! It's horrific! Dead Betas everywhere and disease will probably kill them all. Thats why i decided to rescue a few of them.  I have a 60 gal tank so that should be fine for a few of them to live and not have to suffer anymore!
There's also not much cover or plants in that small 5 gallon tank.
Arn't Betas mostly solitary fish anyways? 
Stupid idiot store keeper also ripped me off in the past with WAAAAAAYYY over priced supplies and not to mention, fish(Bettas are being sold for $15-20. yes maybe they are worth that much but certainly NOT in that condition!
People are so cruel sometimes!


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## BettaMommy531rip (Dec 29, 2011)

Treat her for an extreme case of fin rot. Hit that nasty olf fin rot where it counts! You will win! Little Sarah will pull through! All you have to do is give her lots of meds and TLC! Visualize her happy and swimming to her little heart's content!


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Hummingbird, I know, I helped ya in your thread about your male and female  and yes, males are solitary and females "can" be together with the tank stuffed so full with plants you cannot see your female bettas. 

BettaMommy, I definitely will :lol: She is actually swimming around some, in the 1.5 gallons of water. I don't think she knows what to do with more than a cup of water :lol:


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## Myrtaceae (Dec 17, 2011)

Yep, 15 teaspoons if you're using one packet. 

It's actually took me a lot longer to explain it than to do it. I like to bake, but I only live with one other person, so I'm used to figuring out weird adjustments for recipes, lol. 

They are amazing healers. She must have a lot of heart to have made it this far in such terrible condition, so I'm sure she will make it!


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## hummingbird (Dec 30, 2011)

I know Sena and I appreciate your help. I was just rather upset with the condition the Bettas werre in at the store.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

I do not blame you! That is just another reason I created Spartan Betta Rescue Program, for mainly Canada. I accept sick and dying, old and young bettas from stores, owners, and people who found them.


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## hummingbird (Dec 30, 2011)

Oh! Thats wonderful! Where are you located?


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Camrose, Alberta. About 45 minutes or so away from Edmonton.


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## hummingbird (Dec 30, 2011)

oh thats too bad. Too far for me. I live in Ontario. I'd bring all those bettas to you if i could!


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

:lol: Yeah and it is 50.00 to ship bettas to me, from Ontario (found this out!) a bit expensive lol.

but hey, now I know another person who lives in canada :O


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## hummingbird (Dec 30, 2011)

How would that be accomplished anyways? Wouldn't they get hurt along the way? How many could someone ship to you?


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## mardi (Nov 22, 2011)

I'm no expert but I would have gravitated towards the Maracyn as well. 

I know they're in exceptional care, and hope you'll continue to update on their progress. 

Sending a ton of good, healing wishes your way for the new little ones!


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## BettaMommy531rip (Dec 29, 2011)

That is great! Hey, have you ever had a sorority before (a betta one that is)? I'm hoping to start one up, I made a list of all my supplies, so any pointers?


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Yes I do have a sorority  when she is bigger and aaalll healthy I will add her to the tank.

pointers: the bigger the tank the better. STUFF that tank FULL of live and fabric/silk plants, and hidey holes. You should have 4 or more females, in my opinion, to avoid any bullying against one individual.

And hummingbird, to ship bettas, you put them in a bag, and that bag into another bag. Heat packs (LFS stores) will be needed, along with cushioning such as: bubble wrap, styrofoam peanuts. If I can find the thread...there was a thread on how to ship bettas safely.
I don't know if the number of fish matters too much... For instance, there is a breeder in Ontario, she said it would be 50.00 shipping to me, and then however much for the fish... I'd get 2 females (was, but now I am not), and the shipping would be the same.

And thank you mardi!!


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## hummingbird (Dec 30, 2011)

Wouldn't they get killed during shipping though Sena?


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Well, that is why it costs so much to ship  it's for express shipping, which takes 2 days usually. The heat packs, keep them alive and warm. And usually on boxes with live fish it usually should say "FRAGILE: LIVE FISH" on the box.


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## hummingbird (Dec 30, 2011)

oh neat. Will think ab out it someday. Where should i ship should i choose to one day?


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

I'll private message you my address  we'll have to make sure I am home, after you ship them so I can be there.


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## hummingbird (Dec 30, 2011)

ok. Message me then. I'll wait. Thanks


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

no problem  sent a message!

also, if you wanted take a look: reptileandfishcanada.com This is the breeder I was talking about. A very nice person, doesn't rip you off. I know you get bettas for free, but her bettas range from 2-40 dollars, and are either Canada bred or Thailand imports. Doesn't hurt to look :lol: (so says the one who looked at bettas and bought some)


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

Sena, 

I messaged Sakura. She usually gets on later in the evening. I listed your thread and hopefully she'll take a look. Good luck!

I had a horrible experience in the pet store today that will haunt me for a long time. You think you've seen abuse as bad as it gets, and then you see worse. I had to return my rescue that didn't make it and was looking to see if there were any that could maybe be brought back. To my horror, all 10 mainly male VTs were very sick/dying or dead. A range of diseases and nothing that looked to have a chance at living. I feel terribly guilty that I didn't bring any home. But I'm still dealing with a sick cat (improving), Mags, all my little ones and what had just happened with Xav. I literally feel sick because of what happened to them and because I couldn't do anything. My rescue is pretty full these days with 15.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Oh I know! I've seen everything except velvet in that store. Or, I did see velvet and just did not know what it was o.o I've seen advanced stage of dropsy, ich, SBD, fin rot (to body rot), cotton mouth, etc. It's..just....ick!!


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## Tikibirds (May 26, 2011)

I didn't read all of this - got to the part with the math explanation and just went...HUH?

To me it kinda of sounds like columnaris based off the drawing.

Does it resemble this - same fish


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

nope. nothing like columnaris. Just a hole, no other disfigurement, discoloration, no fluff on/in mouth, nor on any other part of her body.
just in the hole. I wanted to guess rot to the point it ate away at her body...

It's defined against her "ugly" brown color, as just...white fuzz o.o; I did the..interesting math way... and gave her the medication. I'll be doing complete water changes, and use it for the 5 days as Maracyn 2 says to.


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

Sena, I'm sorry I wasn't on yesterday. I skimmed through much of this but from what I understand, the little girl has a hole in her side with fuzz? :shock: Poor baby! 

Sometimes when they get open wounds or ulcers, they get a fungal growth called saprolegnia on it. It could be this or it could be columnaris (as a secondary infection from having fin rot). As always, worse case scenario is TB but I doubt it's that. Does she look strong enough to take medication? If she does, then for treating saprolegnia, a medication with malachite green is recommended. Keeping her in at least 1 tsp of AQ salt per gallon will also help. Saprolegnia can do extensive damage to the tissue itself so getting rid of it will help her ulcer to heal over. I'm hesitant to add an antiobiotic to treat her ulcer because she's so tiny and weak, I don't want to overload her system. In this case, I hope the salt will help until she can get rid of the sapro. 

I'm really glad you rescued them and I'm glad the male is doing so much better. When you said he was STIFF, I was worried like, maybe he was uhm . . . dead. Whew!


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Well, I had used Maracyn 2, she took it well. Still active, and eats well...v -looks closer- Actually looks better too. Not as pale, and more responsive. I don't have malachite green  nor will this store. Even if I don't have it for her, I'll look it up and order it for future uses. Always good to have this that and those on hand :lol:

And yeah, I think he was stiff because 1. couldn't move in that dirty bowl and 2. the bowl was cold. I can gaurantee it would have been below room temp. Now, he is sitting comfortabley above room temp.

And no. seriously. this is tripping me out. He now has MORE color, and HE LOOKS EXACTLY LIKE GHENGIS. -looks back and forth-


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

An update: I took her out in a little bowl, and with a magnifying glass (I need one for her) I inspected her. The hole is not as fuzzy (yay?), there are two little bumps however. Where the hole is, going towards her head is a small barely noticeable bump, then equal distance away is another small barely noticeable bump that both have a little fuzzy appearance to it. If I can get a drawing of it for ya I will.

also the lifted up areas around the hole have a tinge of red


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

So I borrowed my friend's camera. Not only does it lack a focusing feature, it also sucks. But, better than ipod. -.- why cant I just have a good, working camera :lol:

But, now you can see the fuzzy hole where the dorsal fin should be. first pic you can see the one-two bumps with fuzz a LITTLE bit... but not well. And, as you can tell, she is in pathetic shape and has a very red ammonia burn. She also, is quite thin and terribly small for what I assume her age should be 6-9 months. She is smaller than Rose, and Rose is permanently stunted.


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## tpocicat (Aug 8, 2011)

Oh that poor little thing. It looks as if what you're doing is helping, sorry I'm no fish doctor, but I think you're a saint for trying to save such sick fish!


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Thanks  I hope she gets better. oh my gosh she is SOOO small :-( I may even go back, tomorrow, to get the other female who is smaller....barely a half inch. and so pathetic too....


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

She's so tiny! Okay, if she's doing well in the Maracyn 2, then continue with that. If the wound is closed, hopefully the saprolegnia goes away. Also, there is a possibility it's not even sapro, but excess slime coat built up around it. It's hard to tell without a microscope and a skin scraping. What a little fighter she is, though.


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

Wow! Poor Sarah is in bad shape, but she's got a wonderful person taking care of her and doing everything they can for her. I really hope she improves. That would make for one of the best come back stories I can think of  She looks worse than Mags when I first got her and I hadn't seen a case of rot that severe. I'm happy to hear that she made it through the night and doesn't appear to be any worse. Good luck Sena! You're an awesome person for taking on her case-she looks like she's worth it!


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Very tiny! Actually, I am making a video for youtube. let me upload it, and tell me what you think: warning, graphic. ALL the fish I have had that needed help, are on there. Including her. Including Maine. 
And thatnks  She's worth the fight if she is willing to fight.


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

Definitely! Animal abuse is tragic. I'm happy to hear of other people in the world trying to fight the good fight. One of my favorite quotes is "My mission is to rescue. My hope is that one day I won't have to".


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PEfUybr9SQg&feature=youtu.be

:-( the pictures of Maine still hurt..... I have in there "Love us for our beauty. Forgive us for our pain."


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Oh and to prove how vain some people are... I got a thumbs down already on the video. Why? Because I guess they hate fish -shrugs- I don't care. :lol:


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

Oh Sena, that was an amazing video. Such a powerful message that these little fish had for us. What you're doing is amazing and you know what, if someone wants to give your video a thumbs down, I give them a finger up. Guess which finger.


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

Good one Sakura! I know which finger & I'd be giving it to that person too.

I watched the video Sena & gave you a thumbs up & a positive comment. Great job-keep spreading the message!


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: nice Sakura xDD

And thanks!!


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## mardi (Nov 22, 2011)

I wanted to go hug my tanks after watching that video, Sena. So very powerful, and I <3 the part you included about "I'm so happy here, I made a bubble nest". It reminded me of how I felt after seeing the first bubble nest Remedio built after I brought him home, made me feel like I was doing something so right. 

So glad to hear Sarah is getting better! Keep doing what you're doing, and I'm going to continue sending well wishes your way. I hope you don't mind, but I would like to share your video on my FB, I hope those on my friends list, with bettas, will see it and take better care of their Betta's.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Thanks! and go ahead  It's public... I'll allow anyone to use it as they please, as long as it is not claimed as theirs of course :lol:
-sigh- I fixed the info. Trying to point out it is NOT aimed at "breeders". Just... Maine's breeder always sends sickly fish. I've never had a fish live passed 3 since this breeder sends these fish to the store.

I'm sorry in advance if the video offends anyone, or if I cannot word things properly. It's me. I don't word things properly, I don't say things properly. All I EVER do is F*** things up, and it's apparent in my post under betta art about my video. I WAS so proud of the video, only to be treated like I am a complete ass.

This is my Rescue Program. The one thing I WON'T screw up. and the one thing I won't let others wreck for me. And right now... I'm done with arguments, getting bashed, when all I've tried to do is get BETTER during the time I've been here :-(

So, sorry, again. I'll just be staying to my threads, and pm.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Update: Not only has Juniper made a lovely little nest, he is active, acts like the food snatching Ghengis, and getting super colors in.... 

Little Sarah is more active now (without be persuading her  ), and THIS time she ate a whooole pellet. She's finally pooped (1/2 tsp epsom salt to the rescue!) and is more responsive then ever. She does have some troubles turning, but the "hole" is the spot where her body bends. And, it no longer looks fuzzy, the edges are not so crispy black, and it is closing up nicely. She gets her 100% water change each day, and she will be kept on Maracyn 3 more days (inlcuding today) to ensure a full recovery. Her fins are still edged with black, but what's left of them are no longer clamped.

THIS just proves what good care can be to a little fish. Even when she is in 1.5 gallons of water


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

I'm SO happy to hear that they both are on the road to recovery!!! Maybe not fully out of the woods yet, but hopefully at least past the critical point. 2 more lives saved due to the wonderful care they have been receiving. I wound up the the store today and brought home 2 more girls with pretty bad rot, not nearly as bad as Sarah was. They could benefit from some clean water changes, heat and some good food. They both have eaten the medicated food and seem to be alert and responsive. I'm so excited for you & your new rescues-great job and keep me posted! Reading this made my day


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

That's good your girls now will have great care!

fast question. can I feed butterworms to them? I need something nutritional, tasty, and possibly live/frozen for the girl(s) (getting the other girl today). They are so malnutritioned... also, they are about the size of a 2 month old and they are about 6 months old :| so they need all the nutrition they can get.

I dont want to feed flakes for that reason, and the pellets I have I used as a part of the other betta's diets of FDB and pellets (plus occassional good stuff if I can find it) but these gals need fat :lol:


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## tpocicat (Aug 8, 2011)

I loved your video. It was the truth, even though some people would rather not face it. I've seen my share of dead and dying bettas. I think what you do is wonderful. Don't let the jerks out there get to you.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Thanks  Because of people like that I do what I do. I am who I am and that's who I'll be. If they don't like it, they can shove their attitudes where the sun don't shine because nobody cares anymore. I'm at a point where I don't care anymore. These are well cared for fish, the site is a work in progress, I have people waiting for bettas (geesh not March yet!), and some people already offering bettas, help, and spreading the word. Persistance  I'd rather be able to influence 10 people, vs sit back and watch 20 people lose their pets, flush their fish, etc.

(if anyone gets offended reading that simply don't reply -shrug-)

Anyways, yeah, I'm going to get her little sister. And maybe butterworms? mealworms? hmm... :lol:


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

*No food, but bettas xD*

Here is the story. 

I walked to the store, with my jacket unzipped (and I was only wearing a tank top underneath!) because it was so flippin' warm outside. When I get to the store, I look for foods firstly. smaller pellets? nope. blackworms? nope. bloodworms? nope. mealworms? dead. butterworms? expensive! tubifex? EXPENSIVE!

So, I took a look around. "huh someone must have gotten that weird colored betta" I thought, because the 15-20 he had to himself was empty. I continue around, they don't have many...healthy fish (dead, gasping, ich, ammonia spikes). 

I look at the bettas. Wow! The males I was going to take before are gone  guess they found homes! And hmm.. the little female is there (snatched her). hmm...the dalmation is still there. And.. hey. Wait. the betta from the tank is now in a bowl... I looked closer and how my heart sunk :-( Little guy has a lump in the same spot Spartan's tumor was. An internal tumor, I thought, this little fellow had. I moved his bowl, and he moved, and the bump shifted  Unlike anything I've seen this has shifted. Hm. I grabbed him too, and hesitated at the dalmation (darn betta bug  )... ... ...

And so now I introduce to you:
*Suzi*, who has little to no fins left and is so itty bitty I may have to feed her baby fish food.
*Conan*: the funny colored "possibly has a tumor" betta.
*Unnamed*: the light, pale orange dalmation with darker orange spots


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

You sound just like me! I went in for one & left with two! There was another boy that I was interested in, but I needed to make sure I had enough room for the girls (they were worse off than the male). Poor Suzi & Conan! They're in your good hands though now. A tumor-bummer  

I had never heard of butterworms before, so I looked them up and they do have a good amount of protein, calcium and fat. I've never done live foods for mine-I don't think I could chop them up. All of the good frozen foods are expensive, so I would guess the live would be more? I have TONS of baby fish food pellets (my babies love them) that I will probably never go through. I'd be happy to send them to you, but I've never sent anything internationally before. If you're interested, PM me. I'm getting ready to head out for an early dinner and then to the studio-it's ballet technique night. Have you tried NLS baby pellets? We use those too.

And it's hard to believe that your girls are so tiny! Sadly, I can speculate at the cause. My approximately 6-8 week old babies are that size! Good luck and keep me posted! I'll be out tonight, but check when I get home and after I've tended to Jack. He'll be mad that his mom's out again tonight.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

:lol: Actually, another poster was nice enough to send me some pellets for these little ladies!!! Thanks for the offer though  my gosh am I ever coming across nice people on here more and more.
And cool.. now I know butterworms would be good to have in the future.

Conan is right now interested in his new surroundings (while being in the bag) and since I got home, his colors have come more apparent  He's a pale pink body, with pale blue and a medium reddish pink fins.
Suzi just is casually gliding around :lol:
and the dal is just...layin' there o.o


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

terrible pictures I am very very sorry x.x Couldnt get one of Conan, but got one of the dal and Suzi. As you can tell, Suzi is... Tiny. In 1.5 gallons of water. :|


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

What the heck is that in the first pic??? That looks like a tadpole, not a betta! Is Suzi really that small? Seriously, someone wanted to sell a betta that small? *facepalm* Next we'll be selling kittens before their eyes are open. Sena, I'm so glad you rescued those fish, they need it. 

For both of your girls, I actually recommend frozen baby brine shrimp fed with an eyedropper. You don't even need to really squeeze any out into the water. Just put the tip in and just enough BBS will float off. BBS is what most breeders of any kind of fish recommend for growing fry so frozen BBS would be the next best choice. I'm not sure I'd feed live worms of any sort to these guys because of the risk of parasites. 

Keep up the good work, Sena!


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

We lack BBS here.  A poster kindly sent me some good food for these little ladies, it should arrive in a week or so  right now, I'm trying to get Sarah to eat her pellets, and Suzi ate her little bloodworm when I wasn't looking.

Also, I measured them (took a while...)....Sarah is JUST barely an inch. Suzi..... is 3/4 an inch.... THAT is a pathetic size. I literally thought the bowl was empty, last time. Until I tapped it, and a little tail zoomed around 

I'll start AQ tomorrow on Suzi - pretty sure I don't want to overload stress x.x


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

I can't believe Suzi is that small. She's lucky some pet store employee didn't dump her out thinking her cup was empty. 

Bummer on the BBS. But really, any nutrition right now is better than what they had before you got them. And yay for the kind poster sending food!

Sarah is doing much better than I ever thought a fish with a hole in her back would. You're doing a great job with her.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Just to show how lovely clean water and good food does: the hole is now almost closed up  I might even lean off the Maracyn early, because I did not expect her to be healing up so fast, so well. 
And yeah x.x she is way too small. (god forbid she turns out to be a male who really is only 2 months x.x :lol: )


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

Suzi is so tiny! She looks smaller than my smallest baby! Sid & Kanani are about the same size. Kalani's growth has taken off. Awesome job in the measuring department! I can't get mine to stay still for a second, so I guesstimate  All of your newbies are good hands! Good job on the rescues  

And Sakura-kittens w/their eyes still closed is pretty accurate! They are so fragile. 

With the good TLC you're giving them Sena, they'll do great. How's Sarah tonight?


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

I didn't see the prior post-yay!!! Sarah's doing better  Happy dance!!


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

:lol: yep she is doing better. 

I was thinking, I should write down each betta's names, approx. age (I'll give them a month for age-wise), previous conditions, etc. before I forget :lol:


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

That's a good idea! I have my daily log of water changes, food or med changes and I make note of the day & where I got the new fish from. Some people think I'm a little (okay a lot) OCD, but I like to think I'm just very organized. I love tracking the babies this way too. And Mags. So I can see how much progress we're making.

I'm so happy everyone is doing better!! Great news! TLC & good care triumphs again


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

:lol: I actually have OCD (to a point) as well as being clusterphobic with people o.o;; but hey. just means I'm not a partier...that and the fish are always in clean water, as needed.


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## Luimeril (Dec 29, 2010)

you should get some live bbs eggs. :V your girls will ADORE them. Chappy sure did! she'd get all excited when she'd see the betta cup of orange stuff. order them offline, if you gotta. they're way easy to hatch, too. i hatched mine in a tea pitcher with a bubbler, and the light from one of those triangle one gallons beside them. xD


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

:lol: okay, I'll look for some  thanks.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

So an update:
Juniper likes to nom on fingers -.- Meanie.
Suzi is gliding casually around her whoooole 1.5 gallons of water (anymore and I'd nevr find her!)
Sarah is now bumped to 2 gallons, but no higher as I KNOW she'll just be a jumper -.- she is very jumpy, and I may add a plant or something to make her feel more secure.
Conan is not an early riser.... but has settled right in.
Dally however is such a jumpy little boy 

And the great update: There is a nice person giving me a 2 gallon, a couple 5 gallons, and a 10 gallon, and gravel and rocks, for 40.00  (is going to need to assemble a table of some sorts, or get my table back from the old place)


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

Diagnosed OCD here. >.> Although I just write the place and date, color, type, and gender of my bettas. Also date of death and cause if known. I get OCD about other things but strangely not about recording every detail of my bettas. Well . . . I used to, when I had just one. I even typed up a sheet to record the results of my daily water testing. Then 1 grew to many and it got to be too much work. I'm a lazy OCD, haha.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

:lol: I know what you mean


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

LOL!! I love "lazy OCD"! Funniest thing I'll probably hear today  Diagnosed ADD & OCD on my end. Thankfully the OCD is there to help the ADD or I'd forget a lot more than I already do!


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

:lol: :lol:

well, an update  Little Suzi loves her plant, an Sarah is mellow, with a lot of willingness to come to me for food!!!

(on a side note, I've gotten a guinea )


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

Guinea pig? Cute! I've never had one, but wanted to at one point. I'm happy to hear that everyone is recovering nicely!


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Sadly, one rescue (Riddle) ended up with the same disease that killed Maine. 

Except it took him faster, however since he was blue I expected the worse, and it actually happened :-( The disease came overnight, as yesterday he was actually looking better than he had ever looked, with fuller fins with a more silvery shine to them...then today I see his fins all shredded by what looked like fin rot - however, fin rot does not spread that fast... It took a hold of his body, over half, by tonight at 9:00pm where I've euthanised him with clove oil. 

I know some people read it wrong when I said a breeder "bred" the disease... But it IS apparent, that most the blues have been attacked from this breeder's line. I have no idea how this disease is coming more apparent, from bettas in this particular store, from this particular quantity breeder, and though the breeder may not KNOW what has been bred into his lines...

but it seems to have been that these blue bettas (all known cases here in my town are blue  ) are personally deemed sickly, sadly :-( Hopefully, my Shadow does not have the same problem. He, is my last blue male.


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

Sena, did you happen to get a picture of Riddle? This does sound like the mystery disease again.  It's vicious. It basically does kill within hours.

Since it seems that so far only blue bettas are targeted by this disease, I have to conclude that there is a gene or something that causes it. I'll have to go back through and see what the tail types are of all the victims.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Both mine were VT. And no, I didn't and couldn't. :-( Basically, when I fed everyone, I noticed he would not eat. he saw the food, swam by the food, wouldn't eat it. I thought that was peculiar, so I pull him closer to me, flashlight and all checked him out to see he basically has strips for fins. Right to the body. WORSE than I have EVER seen before on any betta. His body had gone grey, not his dark steel blue... I did NO treatment, except clean water with tap water conditioner. 3 gallon, heated 77. no signs before hand. Gills, healthy pink. D:

I swear to God Shadow you dare get it I'm not even trying anymore -.- I have no idea how to cure it. I could use teh Furan 2, or Maracyn 2 to try to kick it's ass but I know it wouldn't work ><

I'm swearing off of blue bettas -.- Mister was lucky. He was from a different pet store and I even met the guy who bred them. THOSE were healthy fish ;-( Side note: my irridescent blue females are not affected, have had rarely any problems (minor ich at first), and are by far the healthiest of ALL my bettas.


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

Basically, because it moves so fast, there's no real way to treat it. Supposedly antiobiotics that treat gram negative bacteria, such as Maracyn II, would be effective but the problem is the fish dies well before the medicine has time to kick in.  I only have one blue betta and I'd be devastated if anything happened to him. The other two are more teal than blue.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Hmm... Is it dangerous to up the dose of Maracyn? probably... But... As this fish did die under 24, fish like that are not able to survive... However, if Shadow happens to get it, I hope he is like Maine. Maine survived 3 days! And thn I put him down. If I get one that lasts THAT long, maybe there is some hope.

Also, to avoid anyone bashing me, I DID go through all possibilities. Anything sprayed near him? No. Anything fall in? No. Temperature 77. Cleaning? twice a week, basically to get yucky stuff up. 50% once, and 100% once. Conditioner is the same as always. He's never fallen on the floor... or anything. I don't put my hand in. If my hand is ever in (cleaning) my hands are previously cleaned basically for 2 minutes, hot water to ensure nothing that can kill him survives x)

Do you think I could tell the store manager about this? Mention that there is something wrong with the bettas? maybe (doubtful but WORTH A SHOT) he could contact his supplier, and even be able to warn them of what is showing up more and more in his blue bettas. So far, this store, only blue. No females, just males. I'll show him pictures, and give report of the 3 descriptive ones, my two and my co-worker, and Maine's pictures. May not do anything, BUT if the breeder WANTS to care, and have people actually WANT to buy the bettas, then I think he/she should care


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

I would talk to the store manager and ask him to keep an eye out for signs of this disease. Tell him to be on the lookout for a strange graphite color that moves rapidly up from the fins to the encompass the body within hours, and that blue bettas are susceptible. Ask him, if does ever have a case, to keep the body so it can be sent somewhere for testing. He can then pass all that information on to the breeder. It seems almost as if there is something in the genes of blue bettas that makes them weak against whatever this is.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Sure! Will do!  good news both girls are doing wonderful, and so are all males. Looks like my Honey is getting a cold. I may bring her to the store (if it is warm), or leave her home and ask the store about it :| I got her yesterday. and she's been in a warm climate, dry place, etc -.-


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

Poor thing. That's not good if they're selling sick guinea pigs. The store should definitely know about that. I hope Honey feels better and doesn't get any worse.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Actually, diagnostic says....she is allergic to pine  so I trashed the pine stuff they gave me, gave her a towel, and cannot find hypoallergenic bedding right now -.- this town is so lame.

On a good note, Juniper no longer looks like Ghengis. as the body and the cool purple red color is there, the "clear" part of the fins that Ghengis has, is BLUE on Juniper  looks so cool
Sarah is growing BIG and FAST 
Suzi has more movement, and is more alert. All are eating wonderfully. ^^


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

Yay for Sarah! How is the hole on her back?

You know, I read in a book at the pet store that some hamsters are allergic to pine and cedar shavings. I never thought about guinea pigs too. I'm glad she's not coming down with a cold.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Actuall pretty good. still a little spot open, but not much. She will be permanently scarred/deformed however because of this injury.

And yeah just need some saline for her eye and Honey will be aaalll good


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

I hope Sarah's dorsal grows back. Sometimes when the rot touches the body, the fin won't grow again. But at least it's a fin she can probably get along without if it doesn't.

I like your new siggy. That's the way to do it! Spread the word that the mods are here to help us.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

:lol: thanks. I'm tired of seeing people get accused and offended. I loved how those people felt offended when I said what I said. and I meant every word of it. And I don't care anymore. They aren't god, they aren't king, heck they aren't even president. I have zero problem with learning, but when someone is basically shoving information down your throat because they hate you it gets stupid. :lol:


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Update: Sarah seems to be growing nicely, but I do notice she may have a deformed spine from the injury. she is often in an angle.
However, Suzi doesn't seem to be growing too much, and her longest fins so far are the ventral fins.


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

I'm happy to hear that they are doing well! 

In other news, Mags took a really bad turn for the worse. She started tail biting yesterday and by the time I got home from work, her entire tail is gone! I had to move her into shallow water with AQ salt. She had been doing so well and then all of a sudden total badness-HELP!


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

Great, now I have to start a new mystery disease thread. *mumbles about new members starting off on wrong foot* Sena, it's okay, I understand. Those who have seen the disease first hand understand that it moves so fast, medicating is nearly futile. And until we have a necropsy to identify the disease, it will be a mystery or unknown disease.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Hope Mags gets better!!! 

and well, what was it they said it could be? it originated in species like trout, and salmon. Somehow to goldies (cold water fish as well) and some how makes it to tropical fish like bettas? Plus, not only is it barely researched enough to call it by any name to completely confirm. I can legitimately give all details other than a full biopsy, meaning I'd need to know what the insides of a healthy fish looked like, to compare to a dead one.

I'm actually wondering... Will Maracyn 2 damage Shadow, if I were to dose him, even though he "may or may not have it"? I won't, unless completely certain it won't damage him in any way. Because if he carries the virus, the disease, if it can be stopped with Maracyn - you cannot really stop it after it hits unless you have a fish who can last as long as Maine did (barely any can)... Better yet wish I could send a blue betta from here, to someone who can watch him, and study him, and if the betta sent got it - could figure it out better than I ever could o.o (and to any MIS-READING PROBLEMS I AM NOT DOSING MY BETTA FISH)


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

:/ Maracyn II is a fairly strong med. The thing is, I'm not sure it would hurt him per se but if you medicate too often, then the fish builds up a resistance and the medicine stops being as effective. How is Shadow acting? Any lethargy? How do his fins look? Be very alert for that graphite color that seems to signal the start of the disease.

It's too bad I'm across the border or I'd offer to take him for you and keep an eye on him.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Only problem, is he could be like Maine. The night I came home, I fed all bettas - and Maine. of course it was later at night, so everyone was snoozing, until they realized "foooood!!!" I check everyone over, each day and night for: discoloration, fins, scales, eyes, gills, belly, lips. This ensures I catch ALL diseases before, or during the early stages, where it is easy to treat. 

Nothing was wrong with Maine - full fins, showing them proudly - his lovely deep blue with red highlights - jumped for food, ate his food, strutted around then settled down for a snooze. Like always.. I wake to his fins having a "singed" look, ich powdering him... There was literally, no...change... Riddle, always had bad looking fins. Healthy though, however, I may think ICH could be a part of it... As ICH appeared on Maine during the virus attack, ICH was present BEFORE the attack on poor Riddle. However, the appearance was slightly different, but did the same thing - and left the same results: a euthanised fish with healthy pink gills, a destroyed body and fins.

So if Shadow gets hit with it, he better be like Maine and pull through at LEAST three days, as I will dose the max of maracyn 2 on him, and try to beat the living daylights out of this pesky tissue eating bacteria  I DON'T WANT MY FISH TO DIE D:

If anything, right now I'll start documenting him, through his entire life, just to ensure complete understanding and maybe catch it.


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

I don't know how many meds are available to you but you might want to consider Tetracycline over Maracyn II, as it is more powerful. And even better than Tetracycline is Kanamycin (aka Seachem Kanaplex). Problem is Kanaplex is hard to find. But if you can find Tetracycline, keep that on hand. I'll cross my fingers that Shadow escapes the disease.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

I'll look those up now, and even pre-order, as a precaution. he WAS supposed to be a black betta, but then POOF blue and red  I wanted to avoid all blues. Even greens, which are blue/greens. Because no one really knows how terrible I felt, thinking I couldn't save my Maine... I literally cried holding the cup that I had him in, during euthanasia :-( And it still hurts to see the photos, and the transition from beautiful, to ill, to dead.


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

*hugs* It's never easy to lose a betta, but to lose him so rapidly must have hurt the most of all.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

It did....especially when he was the strongest, fastest, healthiest betta I had... and right now Shadow is the same way and it feels like re-living Maine :-( right down to his obsession with flaring at the black box of the filter >< and he too is blue and red. I'm so terrified he could fall into that disease. So I found kanaplex online, and for like 11.00 I bought it. Not risking it.


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

That's how I'm going to feel about Mags. She's really not well Sena. I think her will to live is gone. In a matter of not even 18 hours, her condition just went downhill so fast. Here's Mags now...


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

What do you have her on? what meds? her backend, and what is left of her tail looks "raw" aka no scales, or scraped down scales... Her gills from here look a little red too - if you are using AQ salt, I might say you need heavier medications and skip the salt....


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

Right now, she's on 2 teaspoons AQ salt, higher heat and dechlor w/stress coat. By the time I got home from work and saw how she was (not at all like this when I left this morning), the stores had closed. If she pulls through the night, Sakura suggested tetracycline. I'll hit up Petsmart first thing in the morning. Her back end is red, but what's left of it does have scales. I removed her gravel so she couldn't hurt herself further. I lowered her water level since she really can't swim/surface. Poor thing, I don't know how much more she can take. There's also the option of taking her to my vet tomorrow & having her put down if she's really suffering.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Poor thing! The red is probably Septicemia, in my own guess - So tetracycline definitely would be something to use (thanks to Sakura ), even if it isn't what I said... Poor baby!!!


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

Sakura & I have been chatting on the Coffeehouse thread & may have come to the conclusion that she is too far gone. Her back end is literally rotting away-FAST. I think we're now at the quality of life stage. Even if she battles through this, would she ever be able to regain what she has lost and lead a happy enough life? I'm not sure it's fair for me to put her through this anymore. It just happened so fast & came out of nowhere.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

My goodness! The poor thing  you did give her a good fight though, and you gave her a good home! THAT'S what matters


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

Thanks  At least I know she was happy, warm & loved for the last almost 4 weeks. Much better than dying in a cold, filthy cup. Even though this outcome doesn't look good, I'm not sorry I tried & would do it again (even knowing what the outcome would be). Tomorrow morning won't come soon enough. I don't know if my vet will even do it. Can't bring myself to do it & know I'm not making her suffer more. They're used to seeing me with my big cat (who thankfully is doing better). I really thought she was on the road to recovery and then this just blindsided me. And I'm worried about it spreading to my 2 new girls with rot too. I feel like I've taken every safety precaution, but those pesky microbes and suppressed immune systems.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

I know what you mean. I have the rescues, and each time I do a water change it's sterilization all the time x.x


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

I'm obsessed with infectious disease in people & if I were younger & had more money, I'd be in med school specializing in Virology & Epidemiology or even just broad spectrum Infectious Disease. I've even bleached my hands up to my elbows tonight (with a good rinse after-still burns though-I have extremely sensitive skin). I have to do the girls' water changes and I'll probably use disposable plastic gloves just to be on the safe side.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

I'm allergic to stuff like bleach. I worked in a deli...sooo many times did I have a closed up throat, had a HUGE 3rd degree chemical burn, etc -.-

Oh and on another note. say hello to new and improved (drawing does her no justice) Zebra, who is 1.5 inches or so, used to be JUST over an inch. I just had a freak out, since I had fed my girls, just never took a good close look... and well... I flash a light into the dark void that is their 29 gallon tank and THEY...ALL....GREW....HUGE... O_O I dunno who slipped them steroids, but their fins also developed  THAT is NOT a VT.


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

Looks like a combtail, which can happen when a veiltail and a crowntail are bred. Cute!


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

o_o perhaps? =D lol. They are very wide too - not like a regular betta, unless they are growing into a "regular betta" stage  took them long enough :lol: -checks my records- it says here... approximate age... is... 16 months. And it took THIS long, to get from meak little "size of Sarah" to this...giant...thing o.o; lol. If they get bigger I'm going to be scared :lol:


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

Wow! Good growth & she sounds pretty! 

I've probably got some minor chemical burns going on, not too bad. Not like with nuts. I'm allergic to anything with nuts. By touch alone, I don't even have to ingest it. Of course if I do, it's bad. Add asthma to the mix & I'm a mess. I hope to one day move to a city with less allergy activity. Right now I live on anti-histamines and asthma meds (3 kinds).


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

We have dumb doctors. I have asthma (hey, MY TWIN HAS IT TOO) and a serious injury, but the docs say "no no you're fine". An injury on my wrist, damaged nerves. So, anything like a chemical burn is better off healing by itself. Which, you cannot tell I had a burn  (aloe vera, loooove it)

Also, that is good growth. SCARY good growth. Ima accuse my boyfriend of supplying steroids to my fish :lol:


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

You should see Ty! I wish everyone could see him in person! He's almost 4 inches long & quite the chunker. He's a "King" according to Petco. At what stage would he be considered a giant? I think he's still growing & will need an even bigger tank! I must like my pets big-Jack & Ty!


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

He is a giant technically, aftr exceeding 2.5 inches =D HE IS BIG  -oooh, aaah-  And Madame was a giant. So if these girls are related, they technically carry a giant gene...


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

I agree. I try not to do much for burns except more natural approaches, since almost everything irritates my skin. Asthma got worse as I got older. Aging is quite the bummer-I turn 30 2 weeks from tomorrow. And I didn't know you had a twin-cool! I also worked in Ortho, so I hope your injury heals okay. In case you couldn't tell, I'm way into medicine. One of my favorite books is "The Fatal Strain". Non-fiction about influenza (mainly avian) and how it can mutate. Scary, but interesting read. I also loved reading about USAMRIID, WHO & the CDC.


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

Wow-that's cool that he's technically a giant! Quite the personality on him too. Maybe your girls will be big. That would be cool. I haven't seen the stores trying to sell the females that are "Kings" (Queens?). I guess trying to keep the market ripe. I haven't seen one in the stores since the summer though.


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

I dunno, but the females they sell at my Wal-Mart are always gargantuan. I've never been able to figure out if they were "king" girls or just full-grown big girls. Should be fun to see how your girls turn out, Sena.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

You are sure an interesting person =D

also, put your hands together for the wonders that is my ipod camera.... (no seriously. the camera on these things suck. big time.)

Why did it show up green? NO idea.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

And yet another spam of pictures...okay not really. but these are the before pictures, of when they were SMALLER. see the body difference  I do. one pic has Madame.


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

Wow! They are good size girls! I'm so used to seeing them be so small.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

*more pics xDDDD*

I just...can't wrap my head around it o.o those were my "little" girls. :shock: they are really meaty now... D: -confused- WHO SWAPPED MY FISH?!!


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

Definitely look like eggy combtails to me. Aww, eggy. They're growing up already. *sniff*


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

:lol: :lol: Yeah...well..If I wanted to breed them (these females seem to be terribly hardy) NOW would be a good time O_O they are "full grown" now lol! And eggy. holy... lol. However El Dorado would be the only wanna-breed and that tail biter didn't wanna last time, and he just...isn't a breeder I guess. Otherwise.... -looks at Dally- the dalmation would be the only other choice :lol:


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

So Mags made it through the night & I began to call vets this morning to see about having her put down. Not one within a 25 mile radius would agree to do it. She's now in "hospice" care since according to one of the receptionists I spoke with (most laughed at me & I don't know if I buy into what she said) said that it's considered animal cruelty in my county & illegal. My hands are tied. The infection seems to not be progressing as fast with the high AQ levels & I did a water change today. Bummer of a day


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

How about getting clove oil? pharmacies might have it. Get that, put a couple drops in... have her in a 1 gallon, couple drops, she should get "quieter", calmer. Add a couple more drops after 10-15 minutes. she should get slower still, and if she stops moving, but still breathing, you can add the final dose which will kill her gently, without hurting her. Since she is weak she probably won't put up much of a fight. THIS is legal, lethal, and most of all...gentle  I'm sorry for you!


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

When using clove oil, it's important to finish up with a hard liquor like vodka. Or so I've read and been told. I just don't have the guts to use clove oil, even though I bought some. My vet clinic is 24hr so I'd probably still go running out there at 2 AM begging them to put my fish down.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Sometimes you don't need vodka, or other alcohols, with a strong enough dose. If you remember to wait 15-30 minutes after the gills stop moving to confirm they actually passed away... I'm allergic to clove oil :lol: but I don't have the guts to smash my fish or torture them via freezing method.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Update:

I may need to start Sarah on AQ salt as there is no improvement in her fins, the are still lined with the burned black edges, and are not growing back. However, she now comes to me for food rather than freaking out, she's grown a little, and is more active.

As for Suzi, AQ salt will be on her agenda as well as her burned fins are not recovering either. I guess they are both to a point where their fins are not regenerating properly, and are in need of a little boost. She's grown a bit more too, thankfully.


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

Definitely stay on top of it. I had Mags on the AQ treatment before and I wish I would have kept her on longer, because not that long after she stopped, we started having problems again. My 2 new girls will be staying on it for awhile. I think Mags still had a weak immune system that allowed her to get it back in a bad way.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Yeah that is what I am wondering of these two girlies - their immune systems must be too weak to heal themselves. So I'll be starting them on a small dose, then up it each day to avoid overwhelming them.


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

I had to put Mags down tonight  New lesions opened up on her body (after she had been doing a little better). I just couldn't watch anymore. She tried & fought so hard up until the very end. I'm relieved she is no longer suffering & I feel like I've upheld my medical promise in a different way to "first do no harm".


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Aww! :-( I am sorry to hear that! But you did try your hardest to get her better!!


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

Thanks. I at least know there was absolutely nothing else I could have done. As long as she had been doing better, I would work with her. But tonight was too much for her. I wouldn't change having her either, even knowing how it would end. Even though we lost this small battle, there are greater ones still ahead. She is part of why I do what I do.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Good  I know how hard it was with Admiral!! He was pretty thin, and wasn't eating for 2 weeks :-( Then he began to get better....and then died without a sign


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

Tough night. Not sure how I'll sleep. I've never taken a life before. The guilt over it is less than I thought, since there wasn't an alternative. But to top it all off, I think I'm getting a sinus infection. I've now got the meds if needed for the fishies. I'm pitching her QT and anything she was in or I used with her so as not to spread disease. She'll get a permanent place to rest tomorrow in our garden. No "burial at sea" for her. She was a great fish & I'm happy to have had her if only for a little while


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

well....think of it this way (although when I had to do the same for Maine, Spartan and Riddle.... it didn't really help...)...you stopped her suffering...


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

That's what is getting me through the night. Jack's been a really good boy tonight. He's barely bothered me to feed him (not that his appetite is off). Just being his momma's sweet boy. At least so far I've been able to help him cheat death. There was a good possibility that he wouldn't make it over Christmas. He's doing well (fingers crossed) now. Hopefully my other 2 & your girls with rot go on to lead long & healthy lives


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Uh oh! Maybe uh oh? :shock: well I am confused. Okay, so little Sarah came up for food, and I looked her over. One pectoral fin is completely pinkish red, along with the tip of the opposite ventral fin  hopefully this is just her color coming in.... in....an odd way....
However, Suzi seems to poop a heck of a lot...  proper color as it should be, just... lots :lol:


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

With Mags, whatever aggressive infection this was came on FAST. Faster than anything I've ever seen in animals or humans. And I've worked in medical surroundings for over 10 years. Now I'm studying. I honestly thought Mags had pinkish/purple coming in on her fins. It wasn't until they practically fell off that it got RED and inflamed. Hopefully it's just her coloring and not the start of something else. It also started on her tail. 

And Bentley is a BIG pooper. Normal looking, just a lot of it. I carefully monitor his diet (he's Ry's fish & I can't let anything happen to him) and he just goes a lot.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

:lol: yeah I'm very... cautious. Especially since I only have ONE blue male betta left, and THAT disease starts without a warning or a sign... And it happens overnight! If it were during the day, perhaps I'd be able to catch certain signs... but it's kind of hard :lol: so I bought kanaplex, and hopefully it gets here before he gets the disease (IF he gets the disease...).

As for Sarah I sure hope it is coloring  overall it's an even coloring, rather than streaks or spotting. but if it is coloring...cool :lol: a red betta.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Update: to make treatment easier (AQ salt) for the fins, I've put both Sarah and Suzi together in my one 20 gallon tank (old one), with it being filled halfway. Tomorrow is the start of treatment, seeing that the fins won't regenerate. I am also curious (and slightly concerned) regarding Sarah's red/pink/orange splotch on her one pectoral fin... Is there ANY possible illness to cause it, or will it just be coloring?
Anyways, Suzi, is following her big sister around, and they both looked at each other, so close their mouths almost touched :lol: They are following each other, and won't let the other out of sight! It's rather cute.

Also, this gives me a chance to watch how they swim. For the most part, Suzi swims fine. Sarah however, seems to "tilt"... meaning rather than remaining straight, she tends to lean right, swimming at an odd angle (even while swimming straight forward). Plus she often bends her body into a sharper C, bending at the area where the hole is barely seen. She just might end up being a special-care betta.


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

Mags was a lot like Sarah. Even before she got really bad, she never swam right. If she would have made it & not gotten sick again, it would have been really interesting to see how she would have been able to swim. She had a little betta hammock leaf that she would rest on. I figures she'd never have a tall tank and would have special needs. I just remembered that I had bought a whole special tank set up for her and now she'll never get to use it. I know someone will put it to good use, but bummer  I'm sure Sarah & Suzi will both do great! I know you watch your fish like a hawk & if you see anything, you'll be able to attack it. Hopefully it's just coloring. Mags' pec fins were the last thing to really get eaten away. 

Bridg & Siob both seem to be doing pretty good. B has a lot of fin regrowth & S has a little. Neither are as bad as Mags was, but I'm still holding my breath.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Well, that's good to know! And yeah if they make it through, Sarah will have to be in a shallow tank. Actually, both girls have a blue tinge to their fins...all fins...so I am thinking that is NOT coloring... which it doesn't look like any normal coloring for a disease (most are red, black, brown, etc... this is orangey )


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

That's interesting, orange. Hmm. (closing my left eye and squinting-which is what I do when I REALLY have to think). I never got to see what Mags would have looked like. She kept her stripes & "natural" coloring. B & S both have their coloring. B is red & S is Cambodian style with the light body & light red fins. I am going to have to think what orange could be. I hear my alarm clock-Jack-apparently he wants mom back with him. Or food


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

lol!!

And I can post a couple pics (did in the disease section anyways)... I've never seen something like it. and even my girls NEVER colored up, until they were healthy, with live plants, AND were in a group.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Update: she seems to not use the colored fin as much anymore, I'm going to put her immediately in a 1 gallon floating, and treat her with Maracyn 2.


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

Probably a good idea. Better to treat if this is the early stages of something than to wait until it's too late. Still have never seen anything quite like that. keep me posted! And good luck!


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

I know...it's...unusual. But since she is clamping that fin and no other fin, I am doing it now... I don't want to wait and see. And I will keep you posted 

edit: Did a 100% water change, and used Furan 2 instead. same properties, just from API rather than maracyn. Hopefully she gets better!!!


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

I hope so too! It's hard to get attached to them & then lose them. My rescues especially. Those that need the extra care, I seem to bond with more. Losing Mags has been tough & it's a few days later. I keep trying to focus on the positive and take excellent care of who I have left.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Well you tried  Many people wouldn`t try....
I`ve even asked on yahooanswers, there is one answer, that says fin rot causes odd growth coloration...


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

When fins grow back, they don't always grow in the exact same color so maybe that is what is happening with Sarah?


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

'cept THAT fin was untouched. o.o;; that's what's curiously strange. but, since she isn't healing anyways Furan 2 can be used for fin rot, which if it IS something not supposed to be there, it'll take care of that too.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Update: Sarah is more active now, the color remains... But there is no decline in health. She is staying on Furan 2 for the fin rot anyways. Also, it is hard finding Suzi in a 20 gallon filled with 1/3 water  

Also, I revised my video and reworded it so it doesn't sound like I blame the breeder. Because I didn't. I blamed the fact that there was uncareful choices causing 3 blue betta deaths (that are known), and 2/3 were healthy, the third (Riddle) finally was healthy. (considering he/she has got to have been breeding bettas for what.... 5+ years now? Making a rookie mistake as a betta supplier...?)

Anyways, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q_ad7cACRhw&feature=youtu.be There we go.. I took great care of my fish, and still do, and will continue to do so. Plus, I have people waiting for adoption days (March... Maybe earlier!!)

And I will add. Some people may not know... But I DID blame myself for Maine. I thought maybe I did something wrong. But the water changes were on a schedule, water temperature was decent (I up'd it when he got sick), I did assume fin rot at first but then I panicked as fin rot doesnt go THAT fast... and that was when I posted on here about it.


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

I'm happy to hear that she has been doing good. I have been so busy with trying to get ready for the party, clean tanks, throw the party last night & getting ready for school that I hadn't been on in a few days. I'm back now!


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

:lol: welcome back!!!

and she's getting big!!  If her fins grow back, during February I'll add her into the sorority, and see how it goes. 

Also, revised version http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q_ad7cACRhw ... I am FREAKING TRYING. And people are just rude. So, comments have to be approved. Last comment (ignored) said I should stop blaming stores for MY bad care. :| -smh-


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

Thanks! It was weird to be away for a few days (and not be out of town). That's something I just realized I won't be able to do for awhile without gettiing sitters for the fishies. Can't take them with me to Ann Arbor.

I'll check out the revised version tomorrow. I'm sure it's good  Try not to listen to the rude & ignorant people out there. You take awesome care of your fish & want the best for them 

I'm beat from the last 2 days, so it's time for an early bed time. Need to get used to that again-school starts Tuesday 

BTW, my guests were super impressed with the fish & I have 3 people to adopt some of the babies when they are older and stronger. Good homes and educated owners make me happy! They'll be my first adoptions!

Have a good night!


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Oh nice job!!!! =D Even non-fish people can be amused, or interested once they see a properly cared for fishy


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Sarah is now willing to come to my fingers for food, Suzi refuses to eat after I pulled her from the 20 galloned filled 1/3 up... But I had to pull her for immediate heavy duty treatment because the fin rot is so aggressive it refuses to go away in top conditions, and has left fuzzies on her faceplates...

However I am also going to the store today, to talk to the manager if he is not there.

REFRAIN ME FROM GETTING ANOTHER BETTA!!! :lol: unless there are females. then PLOP (after quarantine) sorority tank >.>


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

I remember really aggressive rot. Good luck with Suzi. If it reaches the body, or moves SUPER fast-watch out. That's so cute about Sarah 

I was amazed at the reaction the bettas got. Hopefully it's help show that they are cool pets, but you have to give them the care they need. People were amazed at how I'm keeping so many & how I balance it all. I start back to school tomorrow, so hopefully things stay smooth.

Good luck if you get another. So many of the stores in my area are low in betta stock. Wonder what happened? I almost bought a double tail female the other day, but since she looked healthy enough I decided to wait.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

I passed off a white mix betta for Honey my guinea pig :lol: went back...he was still there. I carried him around for a while (he isn't very responsive, not to tapping, not to another betta, just...sits there...breathing....) and this one guy buying baby jewel cichlids, stopped, backtracked, looked at me, looked at the bowl "Is that a WHITE betta?!"
me: "yup."
him: "huh - that's different. I've never seen one all white."

So, I shall post his picture! His name is Jekyll. He has a pink tinge beneath the white, and a couple spots on his fins =D However, looking closer he had fuz on fins and body, with slight fin deterioration.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

*Sarah's acting up??*

Okay, she isn't on meds anymore, and although she is eating, swimming, and do everything else normal... She suddenly goes into spasmatic dashes right for the side of her quarantine?! All you hear is the CLUNK when she hits it! I have the water lowered because I'm afraid she'll jump out next x.x There is no gasping or anything, no changes physically... But she has repeatedly slammed herself into the side!!! :shock: any reason behind this??


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Anyways, another update. Suzi will NOT grow. She is still 3/4 of an inch - a very, very sad size for a girl who should be at LEAST 6 months by now. Sarah is doing fine, and not throwing herself around anymore x.x Her dorsal is TRYING to regenerate, but it gets blackened before it can grow anymore! I may have to have her on AQ salt for a good 10-14 days max. poor thing!

Not sure what to do for Suzi's stunted problem.


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## blueridge (Jul 1, 2011)

Thanks for sharing this! I absolutely loved this whole thread! Good luck with your girls!


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

:lol: thanks!  It's still a struggle with these two girls, but well worth it to me...especially seeing how my other females turned out.


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## blueridge (Jul 1, 2011)

No problem. I love stories like these!


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

That's good =D I love doing this. It's something that not many people do, and it's available to me without worrying about space/food/vets (for instance, like dogs.)


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## blueridge (Jul 1, 2011)

Ain't that the truth! Plus it seems to be a whole lot cheaper too to keep them and treat them back to health.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Yeah it would be xD well, Conan was bought as a "Not sure but there is a lump on his side" and it ended up just being his natural shape. In the store it looked bigger - maybe the bowl distorted him? idk lol.


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## blueridge (Jul 1, 2011)

I would probably go with either a) the bowl distorted it or b) you making a better environment for him made things better.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

I dunno lol. All I know is he bites HARD  meanie... :lol: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dKzgkbP4-dI


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

I'm glad to hear that they are doing well. B&S are getting some new fin growth, so that makes me happy.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Well, still haven't figured out what sent Sarah into her throwing mood before  lol.


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

Has she stopped?


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

For now she has (thank god)


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

Yay!! I've been trying to keep up with everything and it's been hard. I've been really sick and today they finally said I have pneumonia. YUCK! It could be weeks before I'm better & I still have to go to school. Thankfully I only go on Tuesdays & Thursdays right now.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

gossipgirl1031 said:


> Yay!! I've been trying to keep up with everything and it's been hard. I've been really sick and today they finally said I have pneumonia. YUCK! It could be weeks before I'm better & I still have to go to school. Thankfully I only go on Tuesdays & Thursdays right now.


 
wow!! hopefully you get better! :O
And is it just me, or is this site sooooo slow? everything else is fast and works fine for me... Just...this site...


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## gossipgirl1031 (Dec 7, 2011)

Thanks! One day at a time. I have been noticing some slowness on this site too.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

lol well, then it was not just me :3


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