# Is size really a issue?



## Flapmon (Mar 21, 2013)

I hate it. I really hate it. I'm a fellow betta owner with 6 little beauties of my own, they're in bowls. YES, bowls. Those things that many of you despise like mad. I understand the size limit when it comes to bowls or those odd shaped ones that don't give the fish enough room are horrible, but unlike those my fish have enough space to do as many circles as they'd like without hitting their tail or becoming stressed about it. I have a need to explain myself, not just for everyone's satisfaction but for my own. My fish are happy, they're heated, they might not be filtered but they're cleaned twice a week. They make bubble nests and they wiggle at me when I come past. As if I'd do anything to make them uncomfortable. I'm just so frustrated to be judged when someone has a giant so and so gallon tank and they look down on me as if I'm doing a crime when half of them were pulled from plastic cups and glass squares where melafix was added everyday. 

My fish are my fish, if I needed advice on their homes I would have asked for advice. I know what I'm doing and I have previously been on here before to ask for advice about DIVIDERS, it just makes me sad.


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## Skyewillow (Dec 28, 2012)

the only reason that I personally hate bowls is because I can't see my fishies properly!

I know all too well about not having a ton of space to put tanks. I'm going through that issue personally, since all of my fish are crammed into our tiny bedroom. lol

Whatever works for you and your fish, as long as they're clean, healthy and happy, it doesn't matter.


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## Flapmon (Mar 21, 2013)

Skyewillow said:


> the only reason that I personally hate bowls is because I can't see my fishies properly!
> 
> I know all too well about not having a ton of space to put tanks. I'm going through that issue personally, since all of my fish are crammed into our tiny bedroom. lol
> 
> Whatever works for you and your fish, as long as they're clean, healthy and happy, it doesn't matter.


Thank you. ;D
I mean yes, I'll be upgrading but I don't like feeling as if I'm being judged. The bowls they're in aren't tiny either and the only other issue is they're not filtered but like I said? I clean them twice a week.


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## Agent13 (Apr 23, 2013)

Flapmon said:


> Thank you. ;D
> I mean yes, I'll be upgrading but I don't like feeling as if I'm being judged. The bowls they're in aren't tiny either and the only other issue is they're not filtered but like I said? I clean them twice a week.


Who judged you??? Glad I missed that! Two of mine were in beautiful candle votives left over (never used for anything) from work(as an event planner I end up with weird leftover stuff lol). They held a bit over 2 gallons and I kept the pristine and clean and while in this honestly my Betta's were very happy. 
i upgraded, but honestly more because I wanted to decorate more and was limited with the votive haha.. I can't help but decorate obsessively...It's my job and my passion. Ignore people judging unless they know you and your fish personally! If they're happy then that all that matters.


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## Flapmon (Mar 21, 2013)

Agent13 said:


> Who judged you??? Glad I missed that! Two of mine were in beautiful candle votives left over (never used for anything) from work(as an event planner I end up with weird leftover stuff lol). They held a bit over 2 gallons and I kept the pristine and clean and while in this honestly my Betta's were very happy.
> i upgraded, but honestly more because I wanted to decorate more and was limited with the votive haha.. I can't help but decorate obsessively...It's my job and my passion. Ignore people judging unless they know you and your fish personally! If they're happy then that all that matters.


It was more of a suggestion/question as to if I'm moving them into a bigger tank as they need the space and what not. I do ignore them most of the time, it's just hard when someone else asks for help and mentions they're in a bowl. Some people crack it. Another thing I see is when they mention they don't have much money and then huzzah, the question comes up of,"Why would you own it if you can't afford it?" 

They're happy and they're weird. I'm kinda happy to see I'm not the only one who has bowls for them. 

How's your new rescue doing by the way?


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## Fenghuang (Dec 28, 2012)

I could care less whether someone keeps their betta in a bowl or a tank. What I am a stickler about is providing fish with adequate care (proper temperature, clean water, correct food, appropriate size container _for their size requirements_, etc.). It's when people stick tropical fish in a vase without heater or only remember to change the water every months that get my hackles up. It's when comet goldfish more suited for a pond get placed in a bowl or a pleco gets placed in a 5 gallon tank that I absolutely will call you on it. 

If you can still meet the needs of your fish and give them the best quality of life they can get, go ahead and do whatever you want.


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## shellieca (Jul 12, 2012)

Unfortunately NOT everyone who keeps their Bettas in "small" homes takes good care of them & when we respond to a post we only have what is immediately in that post to guide us in our response. We can't control the tone in which someone reads our post so there are times when the person reading the post takes offense where none was intended. We do not know the experience level of most posters so we tend to go with the person having little to no experience. I have learned to ignore the nasty people & not take offense to what they post. Sorry you felt attacked, that is typically not what is intended.


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## Flapmon (Mar 21, 2013)

Fenghuang said:


> I could care less whether someone keeps their betta in a bowl or a tank. What I am a stickler about is providing fish with adequate care (proper temperature, clean water, correct food, appropriate size container _for their size requirements_, etc.). It's when people stick tropical fish in a vase without heater or only remember to change the water every months that get my hackles up. It's when comet goldfish more suited for a pond get placed in a bowl or a pleco gets placed in a 5 gallon tank that I absolutely will call you on it.
> 
> If you can still meet the needs of your fish and give them the best quality of life they can get, go ahead and do whatever you want.


My fish are heated in an odd way since there's no point setting up a giant tank, but you're right. Horrible environments for the betta's make me cringe especially since I know they CAN correct this but choose against it. One of my friends, does this constantly and recently lost a Cambodian girl after not knowing how to care for it, I shun the pet store workers who sell these fish with false information which leads to their fall.


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## Flapmon (Mar 21, 2013)

shellieca said:


> Sorry you felt attacked, that is typically not what is intended.


I don't mean to sound as if I'm attacking everyone else. I know there are members on here who do their best to help someone succeed in giving their betta's the preferred lifestyle. Some advice I have taken which is why I feel more knowledgeable and confident about my betta's health.


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## isochronism (Nov 24, 2012)

My only issue with small containers is that when doing %100 water changes, the fish is being removed each time. Otherwise, they certainly are WAY better off than in the store cups for "who knows how long"... 
and those water changes and feedings "who knows how little"
I have two Bettas, each in a Fluval Spec II. Some feel that is not adequate.


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## Laki (Aug 24, 2011)

You can clean smaller tanks with a turkey baster without removing the fish. 

Bowls are totally fine, some people are sticklers for the shape of the fish's home but honestly, with enough space and proper cleaning and heat and stuff they're totally fine.


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## Agent13 (Apr 23, 2013)

Fenghuang said:


> It's when comet goldfish more suited for a pond get placed in a bowl or a pleco gets placed in a 5 gallon tank that I absolutely will call you on it.


My Mako shark is happy in his 5 gallon.. don't judge!! lol


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## MattsBettas (Dec 18, 2012)

IMO a betta should never be permanently (nothing wrong with 0.5g jars that a breeder keeps them in for a few weeks) housed in anything under one gallon... The params are unstable, the temperature fluctuates easily, and the betta doesn't have much room to swim around... If you have ever seen a betta in a ten gallon (no, mine don't get ten gallons to themselves, but I have watched them in one) you know how active and fast they really can be. I keep all of my males in heated and (for the most part) filtered tanks that are divided, and each male gets 2.5 gallons or more. That being said, there is absolutely nothing wrong with a bowl as long as it is large enough and heated, I just don't like them because they distort my view of the fish!


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## Agent13 (Apr 23, 2013)

Flapmon said:


> They're happy and they're weird. I'm kinda happy to see I'm not the only one who has bowls for them.
> 
> How's your new rescue doing by the way?


He seems good. Still dosing with maracyn 2 ( day3!) and the fish dude looked it up and said give him epsom salt baths for 10-15 minutes with a close eye on him for 3 days. He had his first bath today and did fine for 10 minutes but was agitated after that so I put him back in his tank. Can't wait to see him healthy! but at least he is happy


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## Kithy (Nov 21, 2012)

The only issue with size that people have is proper care.

Smaller tanks require more water changes which are more work if you have multiple tanks and a lot of the people that come to this forum that keep their bettas in small tanks don't do those changes or don't have heated tanks. 

Most of the keepers here are all about the same though; they care more about your fish's health than your feelings. And sometimes it's hard to remember that not all who ask questions are idiots. But a few of the posts in the emergencies area are keepers who are not intentionally negligent but ignorant of proper care. And when a keeper sees this multiple times in a day or week it's easy to pass the same judgement onto someone who is fairly experienced in proper care but is merely asking a question or having an issue.

Some of the time when there is a sick fish in a small tank it seems it's usually an issue of improper water changes so suggesting a bigger tank is easy because well, if you only have time for one change in the week then a bigger tank will keep the ammonia spread out better.

Anyway. I always say the bigger the better as far as fish tanks. You CAN have too big a tank with bettas since some are startled by large, open areas and really do prefer smaller tanks. Most of us understand that each fish IS an individual with it's own preferences. Some love big tanks and some are really freaked out by it. 

The only reason I suggest bigger tanks is it's less frequent changes. For myself, I have two tanks, five fish, two dogs and a 3 year old kiddo so the bigger the tank the less fish work I have to do. But I have kept my CT in a small tank (heated, ofc) and while I really didn't want to move him to the 10g I found I wasn't able to keep up with the 3 changes a week the tank needed. 

When I post to someone with fish in smaller tanks and those fish are having health or behavior issues, that's when I'll suggest a bigger tank. I try to do it nicely though. If you have lots of small tanks for your bettas and they're healthy, heated and happy, I really don't say anything about it. There's nothing to say, right? They're doing fine so you're doing something right as a keeper! 

But in cases where a small tank is obviously over stocked or generally incompatible fish are being kept together I will warn. 

The best thing you can do is just ignore hurtful posts. Like I said, most people posting here with advice are here for the fish, not you. Sometimes their advice isn't worded with your feelings in mind but their hearts are in the right place.


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## Agent13 (Apr 23, 2013)

MattsBettas said:


> IMO a betta should never be permanently (nothing wrong with 0.5g jars that a breeder keeps them in for a few weeks) housed in anything under one gallon... The params are unstable, the temperature fluctuates easily, and the betta doesn't have much room to swim around... If you have ever seen a betta in a ten gallon (no, mine don't get ten gallons to themselves, but I have watched them in one) you know how active and fast they really can be. I keep all of my males in heated and (for the most part) filtered tanks that are divided, and each male gets 2.5 gallons or more. That being said, there is absolutely nothing wrong with a bowl as long as it is large enough and heated, I just don't like them because they distort my view of the fish!


They get all weird in 10 gallons. I finally gave my 10 gallon boy a roomie (Corydora) and now he swears up and down he is a catfish bottom feeder! lol. 10 gallons and more can lead to identity crisis :dunno: (but I love his identity issue..is that wrong?? lol)


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## MattsBettas (Dec 18, 2012)

Seeing that bettas have 5000+ gallons to swim around in the wild, I don't think a ten gallon tank will do any harm


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## Kithy (Nov 21, 2012)

MattsBettas said:


> Seeing that bettas have 5000+ gallons to swim around in the wild, I don't think a ten gallon tank will do any harm


:rofl:
10g is definitely fun for watching them swim around and play!


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## Rosewynn (Apr 9, 2013)

While I own 3Gs even _I_ don't appriciate it on here when people try to subtly hint that you're being cruel if your fish isn't in a 3G. But maybe it's just me but I have seen this happening less and less with more importance being put on how often it's cleaned and making sure it's heated properly instead.

My only exception or where I would suggest larger tanks is if you're keeping like a giant in a .5G tank or if you have a chronic tail biter and are asking, "My fish is in a .5G tank and keeps biting his tail, please help me stop him but don't suggest he needs a larger tank." and refuse to try to aquire a larger tank in the future yet will pop up with their 5 new fish they bought where they could have spent the money on a low cost larger tank instead. Those kind of threads just drive me batty but I guess that's one of my own pet peeves.


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## LittleBettaFish (Oct 2, 2010)

I doubt wild bettas would utilise all that space. My wild bettas are lazy. Mostly they just sit and watch from under the leaf litter or find some crevice and hide there. I think if I had a 1 gallon tank with some leaves they would be happy haha. 

I _personally_ prefer to see pet bettas kept in tanks around the 20L mark. Having multiple *pet* bettas in small bowls because you don't have space seems like buying lots of dogs even though all you have are crates. 

Objectively, I do not have an issue with members keeping their bettas in smaller tanks. Provided that these bowls are heated to an appropriate temperature at all times and the water quality is good. 

The only issue with smaller tanks is that you have to be very consistent with your maintenance. Particularly if the tank is uncycled. You have a lot less leeway for things like skipped water changes because it is such a small volume of water.


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## MattsBettas (Dec 18, 2012)

> I personally prefer to see pet bettas kept in tanks around the 20L mark. Having multiple pet bettas in small bowls because you don't have space seems like buying lots of dogs even though all you have are crates.


+1

Lbf you are right, its not like they will use all that space, they will likely stake out their own little section and stay close-ish. But, the have a lot of room to swim in if they want to.


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## Agent13 (Apr 23, 2013)

MattsBettas said:


> Seeing that bettas have 5000+ gallons to swim around in the wild, I don't think a ten gallon tank will do any harm


:hmm:....5,000g. OMG don't give me idea's! I would love to see one of mine in a wall of fish tank to himself well decorated! He may begin to think he was a whale. You're giving me to many ideas MattsBettas! lol


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## Kithy (Nov 21, 2012)

I've entertained the idea of making my 55 into some kind of betta haven o___o It's kind of deep though so I'm not sure if I would only fill it half way or something like that.


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## Flapmon (Mar 21, 2013)

Agent13 said:


> He seems good. Still dosing with maracyn 2 ( day3!) and the fish dude looked it up and said give him epsom salt baths for 10-15 minutes with a close eye on him for 3 days. He had his first bath today and did fine for 10 minutes but was agitated after that so I put him back in his tank. Can't wait to see him healthy! but at least he is happy


That is great to hear! I'm sure he'll be better soon. He's such a gorgeous fish I'm so jealous! ;o 



MattsBettas said:


> IMO a betta should never be permanently (nothing wrong with 0.5g jars that a breeder keeps them in for a few weeks) housed in anything under one gallon...


3 of my betta's came from the 0.5 jars from my pet shop and were treated daily with melafix, my 2 girls were in a bigger tank that sold live plants with multiple females and my 1 boy was in a plastic cup. The bowls they're in now are 1 gallon so I might have downgraded 2 but I upgraded the rest and soon their space will change to 4 gallons and the girls will have 3 gallon. No idea where all that goes into play. << 



Kithy said:


> Most people posting here with advice are here for the fish, not you. Sometimes their advice isn't worded with your feelings in mind but their hearts are in the right place.


I know you're right, I know most betta carers here are dedicated and to hear that a fish is mistreated from ignorance multiple times just makes them madder and I know their hearts are in the right place but for me to see this just makes it better, you're telling me your opinion calmly. Not questioning their homes and giving me advice along the way.



Laki said:


> You can clean smaller tanks with a turkey baster without removing the fish.
> 
> Bowls are totally fine, some people are sticklers for the shape of the fish's home but honestly, with enough space and proper cleaning and heat and stuff they're totally fine.


Heard about those turkey basters, but my fish are used to sitting in their plastic containers until their water is clean. We purposely bought containers that would hold them and their tails rather then something where they struggle to swim in.


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## Flapmon (Mar 21, 2013)

LittleBettaFish said:


> I _personally_ prefer to see pet bettas kept in tanks around the 20L mark. Having multiple *pet* bettas in small bowls because you don't have space seems like buying lots of dogs even though all you have are crates.


Mine are in multiple bowls because why not? << I'd prefer to be a hoarder of fish rather then a hoarder of dogs.


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## Laki (Aug 24, 2011)

Hoarding anything is a bad idea and subject to psychological inquiry. Hoarding generally has deeper meanings and should never be ignored.


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## Skyewillow (Dec 28, 2012)

Kithy said:


> And sometimes it's hard to remember that not all who ask questions are idiots.


I have a BIG problem with this statement. People shouldn't assume that someone who asks questions is an idiot. How many of us started out taking the petstore's word for everything, and got the horrible little tanks that "never need changed"? Probably more of us than we care to admit.

So by jumping the gun and treating people like they're stupid, we just deter people from asking questions! I know too many people who are trying to find alternate places to ask for advice because they'll be judged for their 1 gallon tank, or their male/female divided tank, or something else that is less than "perfect".

People with experience are in a position of _*teaching*_ others with less experience, and I know a lot of parents who would be down in the office if their child's teacher talked to them the way some people on here talk to each other. Making someone feel bad for a mistake is counterproductive. Not everyone lets their waterchanges slide just because they don't talk about them every time they do them.

I do agree when there are people who post repeatedly about the horrible conditions of their fish, and then go buy more, and more, instead of taking the offered advice on how to keep their fish healthy.

the difference between hoarding and not:
If you cannot properly care for the amount of animals that you have financially, or with proper husbandry, and still insist on getting more.

I've seen animal hoarding first hand, a horse, pigs, and about 20 rabbits were starved to death, the dogs would go a week without food, about 4 days in, the owner would start rooting through the cupboards for white rice to feed them. There were flies and maggots all year long inside the house. It's definitely no laughing matter, and having 10 bettas in bowls (for example) is no comparison if they're clean and well fed.

I still have nightmares about it.

*This is not aimed at anyone in particular, just the idea that some people let passion get in the way of compassion. We're all here for better care for our fish, and it would be better if we all tried to temper our feelings when posting on threads asking for help.*


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## Flapmon (Mar 21, 2013)

Laki said:


> Hoarding anything is a bad idea and subject to psychological inquiry. Hoarding generally has deeper meanings and should never be ignored.


It was thrown out there to a response that was made, I'm not a hoarder. It's like me telling someone they're a hoarder because they have a sorority.


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## ao (Feb 29, 2012)

Ive done only small tanks, some so small (but temporary) it will make 99% of BF cringe ^_^
My advice, keep it clean, warm.... give them good swimming space~ that's it :3
the point about doing laps around a bowl is a very good one, mice use wheels to satisfy their need for activity, i believe the shape of a bowl allows the betta to do the same. That said, I highly dislike bowls due to the distortion


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## Kithy (Nov 21, 2012)

Skyewillow said:


> I have a BIG problem with this statement. People shouldn't assume that someone who asks questions is an idiot. How many of us started out taking the petstore's word for everything, and got the horrible little tanks that "never need changed"? Probably more of us than we care to admit.
> 
> So by jumping the gun and treating people like they're stupid, we just deter people from asking questions! I know too many people who are trying to find alternate places to ask for advice because they'll be judged for their 1 gallon tank, or their male/female divided tank, or something else that is less than "perfect".
> 
> ...


Oh no, I agree with you. I've had the same kind of thing directed at me when I post. I just nod, smile and say yes, I'm aware. A lot of people sometimes just assume that you don't know what you're doing which must be why you're posting.


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## Skyewillow (Dec 28, 2012)

I'm glad that you didn't think it was directed at you, I just wanted to address the attitude that passion is better than compassion with new keepers. It tends to scare them away!

The way I see it is this: you're not in my house, you don't know our routines and schedules, kindly take your misguided ranting elsewhere, because you're preaching at the choir. lol ;-)

now that doesn't mean I never have questions though. :-D


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## Flapmon (Mar 21, 2013)

Misguided ranting? <<


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## Rosewynn (Apr 9, 2013)

I take back my original statement. I just saw some lecture a user on here about their 1 gallon :roll:. I was hoping we were kind of past that. I guess not.


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## Agent13 (Apr 23, 2013)

Rosewynn said:


> I take back my original statement. I just saw some lecture a user on here about their 1 gallon :roll:. I was hoping we were kind of past that. I guess not.


We can't change everyone...some people just assume assume assume.

But your avi looks so much like my newest rescue!! so pretty!


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## Flapmon (Mar 21, 2013)

Le sigh.


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## Rosewynn (Apr 9, 2013)

Agent13 said:


> We can't change everyone...some people just assume assume assume.
> 
> But your avi looks so much like my newest rescue!! so pretty!


True. Do you think it might be paranoia that I think they did it to spite me? :lol:

Thanks! Is he from PetCo by any chance? I have been seeing a lot of purple EEs there lately. It makes me happy because I think they're one of my favorite colors.


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## Laki (Aug 24, 2011)

How it works is newer members come on and are told a pile of info from people who keep bettas for a lot longer. Completely changes their point of view, those members change everything wrong about their set-up and routines and feel obliged to join the train in telling even newer members what they're doing "wrong". They do it in such a way, though, which gets misconstrued over the internet. Then you have a hoarde of these members who believe whole heartedly in the cause enough to not let up on the poor individual. It seems like these groups are all attacking but they just don't have forum skills haha Take it all with a grain of salt.


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## BlackStripes (May 4, 2013)

Flapmon said:


> My fish are happy, they're heated, they might not be filtered but they're cleaned twice a week. They make bubble nests and they wiggle at me when I come past. As if I'd do anything to make them uncomfortable. I'm just so frustrated to be judged when someone has a giant so and so gallon tank and they look down on me as if I'm doing a crime when half of them were pulled from plastic cups and glass squares where melafix was added everyday.
> 
> My fish are my fish, if I needed advice on their homes I would have asked for advice.


I don't know a whole lot about Betta's as I am new to the hobby. I do study a lot and look at patterns. From what I've noticed is a bowl that is too small from above can restrict a Betta's breathing, but if it has a large opening and there is space for them to move and be happy(and heated, of course), then I don't see where there's a problem. You seem to be taking good care of your little friends, and you clearly feel they are happy. In saying that, whoever told you that you were in the wrong doesn't know your fish like you do, and don't see the living conditions that you do.​


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## Stone (Jan 6, 2013)

One of my bettas is in a 1.5 gallon tank, omg I know the poor fish, he is in this tiny tank that's a npt with a ghost shrimp as a roomate a whisper i3 filter a 25 watt heater, he is totally abused the poor fish, he shows me how abused he is by blowing bubble nests constantly and by being next to me on a shelf lamp, out of all of my tanks his probably stays the cleanest, the water quality is the best, it is always crystal clean and tests at zero-zero-zero, I know the poor fish he needs at least a 2.5 or 3 gallon tank, rolls eyes, now to be serious as long as the fish has room to swim around they will be fine with a smaller tank you just have to be willing to do more water changes and pay better attention to the water conditions this fish is perfectly happy in his 1.5 gallon tank he literally is right beside me and seems to love the fact that he is the "chosen one" were as all the other fish are much further away from me , Now and then I get that creepy someone is looking at me feeling and yep you guessed it I look over at him and there he is staring at me.


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## sareena79 (Sep 10, 2012)

I have done both. my 1st betta (Sushi, SIP) was in a 2g bowl. he had a pothos plant and a moss ball. the bowl was heated but unfiltered. I did 100% WC's every monday. he bubble-nested like none other but was pretty lazy, mostly just laying in his plants all day and only flaring when I went right up to his bowl....my current fish (Chum) is in a 5g filtered/heated tank. hes definitely more active than Sushi (but I attribute alot of that to his age as hes only 5mo) but he has only bubble nested one time in a month and has NEVER flared. and Im really having a hard time with the cycle in his tank. It's quite frustrating. part of me wants to just put him back in the 2g bowl and be done with it. but dont worry Im not...having done both I say that either one works as long as u are willing to stay on top of the WC's needed for your particular set up


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## Skyewillow (Dec 28, 2012)

Stone said:


> he shows me how abused he is by blowing bubble nests constantly


I've seen bubble nests in filthy cups. They're not much of an indication of health or happiness, just instinct.


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## Kithy (Nov 21, 2012)

Skyewillow said:


> I've seen bubble nests in filthy cups. They're not much of an indication of health or happiness, just instinct.


The only thing that can be taken from bubble nests is a really, really sick fish probably won't waste energy blowing a nest. But you're absolutely correct; bubble nests are no indication of anything. My CT blows HUGE ones while my VT blows none. Both are happy and healthy and spoiled :3


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## bniebetta (Feb 26, 2013)

Don't feel judged  Many of us have felt the same way. The only reason many of us feel so passionate about tank size is from personal experience. We want everyone who owns a betta to experience the benefits of having them in a larger container. Personally, I do not like to bag on people for having smaller tanks or even bowls, because I have been there. There were times where all I could afford was a 1.5 gallon setup and felt very embarrassed about it here on the forum. Don't be. We as forum members need to trust that each individual owner knows what is best for their pet and has considered the risks and benefits of each kind of care. I trust that you know what you are doing. 

The only thing I will say on the bowl matter is that I firmly believe that if we as human beings are going to take an animal as a pet, we must do everything we can to simulate ideal conditions in the wild. As someone has already stated, there would be no point in adopting many dogs in need if they were simply going to be crated,. Dogs need a lot of room to play, run, and carry out canine habits. Even if they had the best care, food, and grooming possible, they would still not be able to reach their full potential in a crate. I believe that fish are no different. We need to do our best to simulate the space and environment that bettas are able to thrive in, which most people here consider to be 2.5g. *However,* as I stated before, *this is the entire responsibility of the owner, who will be completely accountable for it.* And like someone else said, sometimes things get misconstrued online. For example (I hope mattsbettas does not mind me using this example), when I was new on the forum I was extremely excited. About everything. I was very happy about being knowledgeable and enthused about something for the first time in a long time, and this sometimes meant enthusiastically commenting on posts even if I was in a hurry and had not read it thoroughly, or did not have any experience on the matter. At some point I commented on a thread and matt pointed out that my comment was pretty much pointless given the circumstances of the situation at hand. He did so in a very neutral way, but I could have taken offense to it if I wanted to. Now I really actually consider him a friend even though we rarely interact directly, and I value his opinion and advice. Had I gotten offended at him or anyone else who could have been misinterpreted because of the online barrier, I would have lost a lot of friendship opportunities.

I guess my point in this ramble is just to let you know that no one here is against you, and any advice people give you (no matter how annoying it is) is what they honestly feel will make you and your betta 100% happy. There is 100% chance that they could be wrong, but they do mean the best. D


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## Skyewillow (Dec 28, 2012)

Just like parenting, there's a lot of "right" ways to keep pets, there's also a lot of wrong ways.

A lot of people would be upset if they were told that they weren't parenting properly, because the child has a small bedroom. And a lot of the people here take fishkeeping just as seriously as others take parenting. So it's easy to get offended. lol


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## ao (Feb 29, 2012)

We really cant change everybody, as every individual is different. Most people act in the interest of the fish... according to how they kept theirs, and what worked for them. criticism of small tanks will always happen, no matter what. I've come to realize that a lot of people simply repeat what they read. for example one argument against small tanks is that you cant heat a 1 gallon properly/ it's hard to heat properly. Im not sure wherher they are simply regurgitating information. Its always good to stop and ask yourself before you post: 
is this really true?
are there many existing examples that will back up my comment? 
were those in the examples using the correct equipment? 
have I tried this before myself? 

I've kept many many jars under 1 gallon, and I've never had a failed heating issue with generic 25-50w adjustable heaters. This really goes to show that there is a lot of misinformation out there that is being passed around. I didnt have money for proper tanks when I started off~ I didn't even have a heater. lol. But may be because of that I figure out how to keep up with water quality issues in small tanks.
The only reason I dont support less than 1 gallons is the restricted swiming space...
Size is also very dependant on the personality of the fish.


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## Stone (Jan 6, 2013)

tank size other than the fish being able to swim around has very little to do with it, if you have a one gallon tank and do water changes and test the water and do all the things you are suppose to do everything will be fine, if you have a 10 gallon tank and do not do water changes or test the water or get a cycle established you are going to have a dead fish sooner or later, it's about the level of care given and how seriously you take it, a big tank does not equal happy healthy fish


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## Kithy (Nov 21, 2012)

When it comes to the internet... well, it's really difficult to understand the tone that was intended. If I say "don't you think that's a bit too small?" in person in a slightly sarcastic tone, you'd definitely get it. Even if I said it in a concerning tone you'd be able to tell from how my voice sounded. Over the internet things like that just don't transfer well into text. So I think the fault lies equal on both sides.

Someone might say to me on a forum "don't you think your goldfish will outgrow that tank? that's really cruel." I have a couple of ways I can respond to it.

"No, my fish are perfectly fine in their tank"
"Yes, I am saving to upgrade, thank you for your concern."
"What would you suggest?"
"THEY ARE MY FISH MIND YOUR OWN BUSINESS THAT ISN'T EVEN THE ISSUE HERE"
*Ignore*

The first option will likely get data thrown at you, possibly with resources. If you honestly believe that your fish are fine then I think you can look at their sources and side of the discussion (or argument if it has come that far) objectively. You don't really have anything to lose here; you're possibly learning more information that you didn't know before and you're learning a new perspective.

Option two basically says "I understand your issue and agree with it but here is why I have not done so". You are engaging the individual to look at it from your perspective with your reasoning that seems pretty logical to you. Be warned, not everyone is going to see your logic.

Option three is actively engaging the other person(s) in helping you to better the subject matter. From there you may be able to see options you were not aware of beforehand. 

Four will basically end in either them leaving you alone or more than likely a return flame of "you're a horrible person, etc etc". This isn't really advised however. You can use option one or two to say the exact same thing but politely.

And the final option is sometimes the best one. You're not engaging them at all which, if they are a "troll" is the exact opposite of what they want. If they ARE a troll and you DO engage them, regardless of how you do it, you will be giving them exactly what they want. Logic and reasoning do not matter to trolls, they only want to "rustle a few jimmies". Depriving them of the ability to do so is the best thing. NEVER feed a troll. They laugh at your reasoning. 

For all you logical people out there on the forums I challenge you to this:
If someone approaches you anywhere with a "tone" or what you think is a degrading or superior tone either ignore them or be polite. Even if they call you every name in the book still be polite. Even laugh. Nothing angers someone likes this more than when you don't react negatively. It's incredibly hard, believe me. I know what I'm saying sounds virtually impossible. I play online MMOs; I know what dealing with people who want nothing more than to make you feel bad or ignorant is like. I've dealt with them in every way; the ways I have suggested to you all here and the ways I have said to avoid.

For everyone else, those of us who are sometimes prone to making the comments many have complained about (we've all done it!!) try very hard to remember a few things. The person you're talking to is an actual person with actual feelings. The anonymity of the internet makes it easy to disconnect with the fact there is a human being on the other side. Try very hard to keep this in mind when wording things.

The wonderful thing about forums and the internet in general is you can look over what you have said before you say it. If something slips out of your mouth in person you can never take those words back. But you have the option to re-read everything you have said before hitting "post reply". Do so. Read it. Imagine how someone might take what you're saying. Try to remember some people are more sensitive than you are and it can really hurt their feelings. If you hurt someone's feelings they are less likely to even look at your advice.

tl;dr
Ignore trolls. Keep a polite and positive attitude. Don't be rude. READ YOUR POSTS BEFORE POSTING.


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## jadaBlu (Feb 14, 2013)

I am glad your fish are in a clean warm enviroment. While I have not kept fish specifically in bowls. I have used 1 gallon and bigger sterilite containers and critter keepers for fish that were in bad shape and were better off there than dying at the store. Improvement for most was fast. They didn't get heaters right away but a warm 76 degree room. Better than 70 degrees, and sick at the pet store. 

I also keep some of my fish in this:

http://www.walmart.com/ip/Anchor-Hocking-Heritage-Hill-2-Gal-Jar-with-Lid/16486707

I had space limitations. I intended for it to be temporary. However, some of my fish are small or just not very active will be fine there and will stay. I now have lots of 5 gallons and a rack but I can get them in my area for $10. Not everyone can find a five gallon tank or even a 2 gallon for $10. Happy fish are fish that are taken care of. 

Most often I see bowl owners getting a hard time in fish emergencies.
Not everyone is lucky enough to find a site like this before buying a fish and if they find it once their fish is sick remember the kind of advice pet stores typically give people when they buy a betta. It's not accurate, nor is it helpful. However, we can be nice and helpful once they get here.


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## Skyewillow (Dec 28, 2012)

Jada, we don't heat either, all of my tanks read out at 78 degrees. It's HOT in our room from the computer and the TV believe it or not.


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## Agent13 (Apr 23, 2013)

Rosewynn said:


> True. Do you think it might be paranoia that I think they did it to spite me? :lol:
> 
> Thanks! Is he from PetCo by any chance? I have been seeing a lot of purple EEs there lately. It makes me happy because I think they're one of my favorite colors.


Yes! Petco gave him to me along with a 2.5 minibow to save him because he has popeye pretty bad. He was light pink when I brought him home but he started turning a purplish pink yesterday. I LOVE his colors. Such pretty and sweet little dude. Actually pretty quirky but that makes him an even better fit for my family


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## Agent13 (Apr 23, 2013)

Also going to add here... The main reasons I have upgraded my Bettas to 4-10 gallon filtered tanks... TO BE TOTALLY HONEST.. Is because I go on vacation a lot for 1-2 weeks at a time and I don't trust any of my fish sitters (nor would I expect) tem to do the proper water changed for the rediculous amount of aquatic family members that I have. Therefor a cycled tank allows them to come over feed them then one or 2 small water changes if it's longer then a week. And another huge reason is I really really REALLY love to decorate. They were all happy before and they are all happy now. But more importantly *I* am more happy now :tongue:. Endless decorating space and can travel with less worry:welldone:

So keep those fish happy no matter how you keep them ...and don't forget to do it in a way that suits you and makes you happy too!


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## Flapmon (Mar 21, 2013)

To be reading ALL of these posts makes me feel good. Like I said, it's as if you all have an understanding. You give advice without judging and that's what I like to see. Yes my fish are in bowls and it won't be a permanent fixture because we're upgrading soon like I've said earlier (I'm pretty sure I even gave size details). It's just sad when that one person asks for help and because its been heard before? The owners feelings get thrown out of the window. I understand they're like our children which is another reason to why I would not compare them to dogs. They have different needs to what dogs do and since I own a big dog? I know his needs are completely different. I know someone was trying to make an example but it just doesn't match. Or? Saying that its like having multiple dogs but in cages because I have a small bowl? Psh. (I know it wasn't directed at me but I'll still take offense). 

Bottom line? I take care of my betta's to the best that I can, I may not be rich. I may not have them in an environment big enough to let them race around but they're happy. They might get sick and I come here for advice but just because I ask questions doesn't mean I'm an idiot, it doesn't mean they got that sickness in a small bowl. I've seen betta owners with large tanks and they still fall with diseases or disorders. I think we should all be seen as equal because we're trying to relate and learn and better ourselves for our animals happiness. I know I've learned a lot since becoming a member and I treasure that. It makes me feel good to be able to help others and not judge them for their mistakes because of false information their fish is sold with. 

I may get angry sometimes because the person never takes the advice and wonders why their betta's die, but that doesn't mean I take it out on the next person and judge their betta's living situation. 

I'm sorry to rant, I'm sorry if I offend but like everyone who posted I also have an opinion. Size is NOT a matter unless its too small, there's the option of upgrading but never the option to downgrade and that is only if you decide to choose a 0.5 jar to call your betta's home. << ...

I think that's it.


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## Kithy (Nov 21, 2012)

It's really tough to be in a place like this :X But we're all human!


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## Corsica (Apr 1, 2013)

I started out with 1 gallon tanks and have upgraded everyone to at least 2 gallons. Everyone is doing well and I still have room in my kitchen!


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## Flapmon (Mar 21, 2013)

corsica said:


> i started out with 1 gallon tanks and have upgraded everyone to at least 2 gallons. Everyone is doing well and i still have room in my kitchen!



yay for kitchen space!


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## Corsica (Apr 1, 2013)

Kitchen space plus they need proper heater space so they are all in 2+ gallons now. Works out well and I am faithful with their care.


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## JohnLaFawnDuh (May 8, 2013)

I have almost all of my bettas in bowls. Except one thats in a 10 gallon tank with other community fishes. I clean my bettas water twice a week and they love it. They always make bubble nests and are very active when I approach them. I get people who says they need bigger tanks, but heck my bettas are doing fine in those little bowls I dont really care what people thinks about where i have my bettas in. My bettas are healthy and energetic and they like where they are right now which is in bowls or small tanks.


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