# Huge pop-eye [emergency]



## SillyCone (May 7, 2011)

OMG I'm desperate!

Housing 
What size is your tank? 3g
What temperature is your tank? 20-23 stable (internal heater in my room )
Does your tank have a filter? yes
Does your tank have an air stone or other type of aeration?no
Is your tank heated? no, having trouble finding a mini-heater for him here.. 
What tank mates does your betta fish live with? 3 annubia plants (?) and I put one of the snails with him... maybe last couple of days...

Food
What type of food do you feed your betta fish? Mini granules / bloodworms
How often do you feed your betta fish? mini granules in the morning and bloodworms in the evening (as a snacK)

Maintenance 
How often do you perform a water change? every 2 days
What percentage of the water do you change when you perform a water change? 50-100%
What type of additives do you add to the water when you perform a water change? Tap water conditioner

Water Parameters:
Have you tested your water? If so, what are the following parameters?


(from the old aquarium he was in..)
Ammonia: 0
Nitrite: 0.5
Nitrate: 10
pH: 7.5
Hardness: 500+ (hard)
Alkalinity: 

Symptoms and Treatment
How has your betta fish's appearance changed? I noticed yesterday slightly swallowed so I put the medicine and went to sleep because I was tired... Today it got like that (photo)
How has your betta fish's behavior changed? He ate like a pig yesterday like usual... Today he is refusing to eat and he is just floating on the top of the tank.. I think he lost some colour as well.
When did you start noticing the symptoms? Yesterday.
Have you started treating your fish? If so, how? Yes, Myxazin, is a bactericide I have... I put double the dosage today >_>! (The bottle says to put the dosage 1-2 times a day on the tank.. so I made a 100% and put the double the dosage, cus yesterday I put the normal one.
Does your fish have any history of being ill? Yeah, when I got him he had some gooey stuff around him and some fin-rot, which all recovered well.
How old is your fish (approximately)? 1.5year maybe.

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Guys, I changed his water Sunday.. I swear he didn't have anything.. Yesterday I noticed his eyes slightly bigger so I put the medicine... today got like this.. I think his eye will burst open or something... this is the weirdest thing that ever happened to me.. :C

I feel like I fail at keeping his water clean or I got something wrong.. I have Fillet for like 4 months now... He never had anything like this.


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## SillyCone (May 7, 2011)

my mother advised me to put some vinegar on his water (?) I'm not really sure if that could work... All I know I ran out of aquarium salt, I can get some but just on the evening, when my neighbour returns. =/


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## BettaFishRule (Jan 4, 2011)

Ohhhhh myyy . I have seen cases but not that bad i dont think it will pop but try searching cures for popeye for betta fish? I hope you can find something


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## SillyCone (May 7, 2011)

it's getting worse by the hour... I never saw anything like this... If I could have a guess I'd say the infection started around 15 hours ago... This is so strange... His eye is getting even bigger now... He barely moves now.. I wonder if this is like a super-mutation of the bacteria... That somehow is super resistant to the bactericide.. As I said I never saw anything like this... I fear he will die before the sun sets today =/


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## ANHEL123 (Jul 21, 2010)

If u want to treat with medications I treated that before with TETRACYCLINE API mixed together with Fungas Eliminator by Jungle. Someone on the forum recommended to me long time ago and it helped.

But here is what Oldfishlady recommendations about Pop-eye.

Qt-or small container-first 3 days Epsom salt 1tsp/gall then increase on the Epsom salt 2tsp/gall on day 4-8 along with 100% daily water changes-water temp 76*.

Use 1 gall jug and pre mix Epsom salt for right dosage.

Sorry Oldfishlady that i am using ur advice.


Feed high protein diet. U know u can feed them with mosquito larva. 

I don't know how to feed with mosquito,but i feed my bettas with tiny tiny...pieces of the cooked shrimp.

Good luck.


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## SillyCone (May 7, 2011)

He's not eating though... But I will put him on epsom.. Epsom is what I don't miss.. I have a huge sack here =/

But I'm not sure that will help much, this bacteria is consuming him way too fast... well lemme change his water and mixture.. brb


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## Tisia (Mar 15, 2011)

poor guy :/ I think usually epsom salt is recommended with popeye since it helps with swelling, like 2 tsp a gallon, you get it from pharmacies if you don't have any


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## Tisia (Mar 15, 2011)

oi, I'm slow this morning


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## DarkMoon17 (Apr 16, 2011)

With such a serious infection, you should combine the epsom with medication. Epsom will help with swelling but it doesn't really fight off infections. You need an anti bacterial mixed with a anti fungal.
I have found that the Tetracycline/Jungle Fungus Eliminator mixture works very well. He might lose his eye though.

For long term health you should be keeping him at 25-26* C, 20-30* C is only 68-73* F. WAY too cold.
Do not use vinegar with fish....


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## SillyCone (May 7, 2011)

is no WAY too cold, is cold yes, but at a safe range still, it should be at 25 I know, but I can't turn my room into a sauna, specially with the other tank already heated. Finding a good 25w small heater here is being hard, I could buy a 100w that probably would fit there, but I'm not sure about buying a 100w for a 3g is a good idea.


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## DarkMoon17 (Apr 16, 2011)

20*C is WAY too cold, considering that 18*C would be potentially fatal for a betta long term, IMO two degrees more isn't much better. He can't feel comfortable. Do you have a thermometer in his tank? Water is always 3-4 degrees cooler than the temperature of the room. Aside from medications, a new heater would be a really important purchase when possible. The infection probably got so bad so quickly because cold temps lower their immune system.

In a pinch you could float him in the heated tank. You have to QT him to treat him anyway and warmer temps will boost him immune system. Generally, for bacterial/fungal infections you want the temp to be around 76*F (24.4*C) so his immune system is supported while it is still too cold for the bacteria/fungus to take off (they like warmer temps).


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## SillyCone (May 7, 2011)

not really no, yes I have a thermometer and he was used to live in 10-15c with his old owners for around 6 months... Tell me about cold water -__-'

(and at a 1.5L "tank")


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## DarkMoon17 (Apr 16, 2011)

Was he kept outside or something?

Regardless of his old set up, he needs warm water or his immune system won't be able to fight off infections like this one.


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## SillyCone (May 7, 2011)

I'm afraid if I float him up on the heated tank he might jump to their tank, because it's a female sonority.. Besides, if he does jump he can spread the infection to them, I'm not willing to get that chance.. I will turn their heater off and increase my room heater for 30ish degrees... I think I will go for that combo mixture you said, I could go and buy the heater as well but the way it is going I'm not 100% sure he will survive today.

And I know is slightly cold, but I'm afraid of buying a bad heater or one that will melt the plastic on it. >_>! But we will see, if he gets better today I will buy the 100w regardless.

Also sorry if I sound a bit stubborn or rude I'm kinda nervous, he's getting weaker and weaker, that bacteria is* NOT *normal, I'm serious about it. Never saw such a strong infection... it hasn't been 24 hours since the start and he is already "dying" =/.

I think I can live with another pet without 1 eye (my dog lost an eye as well lol... But I don't live with her anymore, she is with my best irl friend anyway )

Ah and no, he was kept inside on their apt, but it was winter here, and we can get up to -10c easily.. =/


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## ANHEL123 (Jul 21, 2010)

SillyCone start him on Epsom salt with 100% daily water changes until u buy TETRACYCLINE API which u can buy i am sure in any store. Fungus Eliminator by Jungle unfortunately not every store has it. U can order it 888-373-8686.

Also u can substitute TETRACICLINE with MARACYN 1 mixed with MARACYN 2.


I think if it that severe may be u do need 2tsp/gall to start. And if u Qt him it really easy and fast to change the water. Just per-mix it for correct dosage.


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## SillyCone (May 7, 2011)

ANHEL123 said:


> SillyCone start him on Epsom salt with 100% daily water changes until u buy TETRACYCLINE API which u can buy i am sure in any store. Fungus Eliminator by Jungle unfortunately not every store has it. U can order it 888-373-8686.
> 
> Also u can substitute TETRACICLINE with MARACYN 1 mixed with MARACYN 2.




Sorry I live in the UK but I will try to find it anything that can substitute it if anything, my LFS has a guy who is an expert on fighters, I will go there in like a half an hour.


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## DarkMoon17 (Apr 16, 2011)

Ok since you might not have the same brands- the active ingredients you need to look for are: Tetracycline, sodium chloride, and nitrofurazone. It is ok if there are other ingredients too, but those are the major ones. 

Popeye is not contagious. Since your girls should have strong immune systems (b/c heated and clean tank) they should not be susceptible but I understand if you are not comfortable with that. You can float him with something that has a lid. It is not normally deadly unless it goes untreated. It most likely hit him so hard because he has no immune system to fight it off.

I've never had a problem with a heater melting plastic... just don't let it touch the sides if you are concerned.


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## SillyCone (May 7, 2011)

my heater (on the other aquarium) kinda I forgot to turn it off when I was making the water change... It burnt my hand and melted it's surpport plastic... <_<! It never worked the same way again.. It's working, but its like I put 30c to make it stays at 26. lol...

But thanks again, I noted everything here, also turned the heaters on.. I'm off to the LFS.. Btw before I go, I remember they had an essence from idk leaves from tea or something.. I remember OFL saying about it for treatments.. but I can't remember much (dang is sounds so vague now...) but it was quite expensive.. should I buy it as well?


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## DarkMoon17 (Apr 16, 2011)

Oh, ya tannins. They might sell "Blackwater" treatment or Indian Almond leave extract... That would help therapeutically but would not heal him by itself. The eye looks really bad and if he is lethargic and ect... it wouldn't hurt to get some if you can. 

yaaaa, careful with heaters... That's happened to me too during a water change but it was glass so the glass cracked. It's pretty dangerous.


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## SillyCone (May 7, 2011)

bought an overpriced 25w heater and 2 medications... didn't find ones with those ingredients I'm afraid..

Methylene Blue (effective agains fungal & bacterial) 2.44%

Disease Clear (effective against fungal & bacterial) (Silver Proteinate - 0.151%)


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## SillyCone (May 7, 2011)

aaand tge methylene blue is expired since may of last year.... I have to go tomorrow change it because I didn't see.. I already put it on the aquarium... maybe it will work still..


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## DarkMoon17 (Apr 16, 2011)

I'm not familiar with the second med, so I'd use the Methylene Blue. Don't mix them... I'm not sure how they will mix.


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## ANHEL123 (Jul 21, 2010)

I don't know them either. I really recommending Epsom salt instead of using the medications u don't know about. I know Oldfishlady treated with Epsom salt. The post i put it actually from her post about her treating Pop-eye .Sand her PM she will help. 

Did u try to find MARACYN 1 & 2 ?

I feel bad if u can't find it . I have it at home it would take 3 days to delivery. U can start with Epsom salt and u can ordered those med's on line.


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## SillyCone (May 7, 2011)

the epsom salt is just to remove the swelling, and it's already on the tank, about the medications... They are from trustworthy brands, I was reading about them, I'd say I will go for it since I already bought instead of waiting for an online delivery...

I think the eye is not getting any more bigger, which maybe is a good sign... I don't have any hope of him being able to see from it again, but he is cooping so far so good, at the rate it was going he was suppose to be dead already, really. I will go tomorrow morning change the expired medication and use it on him with the epsom salt.. I will keep posting on news.. Which I hope it will be good ones. =/

And no, I didn't find them, I did find Melafix though... Kinda expensive as well. But I didn't buy in the end.


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## youlovegnats (Feb 23, 2011)

huurrrmmm... 
My bf's betta had a severe case like this. It took 3 weeks to get rid of (and she ended up loosing her eye) >.<; 
We did the AQ salt and the maracyn meds combined and it still took that long to get rid of. :/ 
We also brought the temp. up to 82F to help fight the infection.


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## SillyCone (May 7, 2011)

did it appeared in less than 12 hours as big as this as well?


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## youlovegnats (Feb 23, 2011)

Yup! Like before it happened, nothing. She was perfectly fine and then BAM! POPEYE-STRAVOGANZA! O__o; It was so weird.


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## SillyCone (May 7, 2011)

Dang... At least you ease my soul-pain knowing I'm not the only one having this weird nightmare... Also in a way is good to know even though it took almost a month it "healed" even though it compromised it's eye... Which I don't bother really... I just want my poor Fillet to be healthy again, with 2 or 1 eye. 

And I like pirates


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## youlovegnats (Feb 23, 2011)

Hahaha! Yeah she can only see on one side, but she's swimming around now like nothing ever happened. 
Betta eye-patches!


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## DarkMoon17 (Apr 16, 2011)

You aren't going to mix medications correct? For now, treat with one med and epsom salt to reduce the swelling. Once the swelling has gone down you can switch the Aq. Salt. 

Aq. Salt is the normal treatment for popeye but should not be used when the swelling is so bad. Using Aq. Salt will make the swelling worse and could very well make the eye come out.


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## SillyCone (May 7, 2011)

yeah don't worry. I think I will order the AQ salt online since my LFS don't have any... or go to another LFS not sure, since the swelling will take some time to get better anyway.. But yeah the disease clear looks more as an small cases medication not a bad scenario like this one..

Oh snap..

*I just noticed his face is swelling as well and the face is clamping.. this is totally a bad sign... should I make another water change and increase the epsom salt before I go to bed? =/

also his water stinks :C*


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## FuulieQ (Jan 10, 2010)

I would do that, especially if the water stinks. That's a cure sign of a bad thing.


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## SillyCone (May 7, 2011)

even though the last water change was like 5-6 hours ago? =/


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## youlovegnats (Feb 23, 2011)

DUDE!! HIS FACE IS PINECONING!!! O___o;


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## vaygirl (Sep 10, 2009)

With an infection there's probably swelling all in that area, pus and whatnot. He might be getting an abscess. I'd get my hands on a broad spectrum antibiotic, like mentioned above. Good luck with him! I hope he pulls through.


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## DarkMoon17 (Apr 16, 2011)

He needs anti-bacterial meds asap! Continue the epsom salt but increase it to 2tsp/gal. Is there any way you can increase the temp to 82-84*F? Changing his water twice per day might help...

You _need_ at least one of these active ingredients: Tetracycline, Metronidazole, Erythromycin
Mixing it with an anti-fungal med containing nitrofurazone, furazolidone, potassium dichromate, methylene blue, and/or acriflavine will help too...


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## ANHEL123 (Jul 21, 2010)

Hi how is your betta?


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## MikiMaki (Jun 23, 2011)

Bulging eyes are a symptom of Dropsy, and with his pine coning scales on his face that seems to be the matter. Antibiotics a.s.a.p. I'm not familiar with OTC ones, when we see it in the clinic we do baytril injections and instruct on giving the cleanest best possible conditions for the fish to help control the infection. I hope you can help him pull through!


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## DarkMoon17 (Apr 16, 2011)

Ya, you would need a vet to give the baytril shot... Oral Metronidazole, Epsom Salt, clean water, and Tetracycline (or Terramycin) would help if you could get them... How's he doing?


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## DarkMoon17 (Apr 16, 2011)

Oops, no Metro. Epsom salt, clean water, and Tetracycline (or Terramycin) would help if you could get them... Any updates on his condition?


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## SillyCone (May 7, 2011)

lol someone bumped my thread. xD!

Fillet is doing fine... being better every day with a extreme slow recovery... Stupid mutant pop-eye.. '

Anyway... As I was saying to NeilD, I had to put one of my females on QT inside his QT bowl... he is going mad in love with her.. making bubblenests and staying beside her.. but she can't dare to look away or he gets mad.. lol... he can't see well on his ill eye, that's easy to notice, not sure he will be totally blind but he indeed already lost partially of his sight... let's just way and see.. and no salt, just epsom and methylene blue... lots of medication got banned here in the UK due to Health And Safety for some reason and I think Tetrasomething got in that too.


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## kathstew (Feb 23, 2011)

SillyCone said:


> lol someone bumped my thread. xD!
> 
> Fillet is doing fine... being better every day with a extreme slow recovery... Stupid mutant pop-eye.. '
> 
> Anyway... As I was saying to NeilD, I had to put one of my females on QT inside his QT bowl... he is going mad in love with her.. making bubblenests and staying beside her.. but she can't dare to look away or he gets mad.. lol... he can't see well on his ill eye, that's easy to notice, not sure he will be totally blind but he indeed already lost partially of his sight... let's just way and see.. and no salt, just epsom and methylene blue... lots of medication got banned here in the UK due to Health And Safety for some reason and I think Tetrasomething got in that too.


They are both inside the bowl together? Is there anything dividing them?


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## DarkMoon17 (Apr 16, 2011)

SillyCone said:


> lol someone bumped my thread. xD!
> 
> Fillet is doing fine... being better every day with a extreme slow recovery... Stupid mutant pop-eye.. '
> 
> Anyway... As I was saying to NeilD, I had to put one of my females on QT inside his QT bowl... he is going mad in love with her.. making bubblenests and staying beside her.. but she can't dare to look away or he gets mad.. lol... he can't see well on his ill eye, that's easy to notice, not sure he will be totally blind but he indeed already lost partially of his sight... let's just way and see.. and no salt, just epsom and methylene blue... lots of medication got banned here in the UK due to Health And Safety for some reason and I think Tetrasomething got in that too.


That's great, I've been pretty worried about your boy with how serious his eye looked! It might take awhile for his eye to look normal again. He could regain sight, you never know. But it is good to know that Methylene blue is effective against these cases of "mutant" popeye. It's interesting that the UK has banned so many meds considering the UK uses animal Frontline (flea control) on convicts to control fleas and other "bugs" in jails lol


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## SillyCone (May 7, 2011)

lol yah... this country is weird indeed lol! XD

I could take a photo of him with updates but only later on, I'm really busy lately.. and no she was in a 1L qt tank while he was in a 1.5G gallon... pot.. lol! I moved her back to her aquarium after 2 days treatment with myxazin.. It looks like finrot but at the same time looks like a weird natural colour... Looks more like fin-rot but she is fine now... I will let it see, if it starts eating her fins then I will do a proper 7-10days treatment. 

But yeah, I will post pics later. xD

oh and he started eating again like 3 days ago !


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## CrowntailTwitchy57 (Jun 25, 2011)

don't use vinager on the fish! (unless he is cooked and battered...)


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