# Pineapple Butterfly OHM x Mustard Gas HM



## babystarz (Aug 3, 2012)

My daddy arrived today! I'm curious as to how my potential pairing stacks up?

Here's dad:

















And I have two female siblings as moms: (all these pics are of the same female)


























The only concern I have is that the girls are HUGE. Daddy is bigger because of his fins, but I know that the size of the girls could make embracing difficult.


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## lelei (Apr 30, 2012)

OMg,, that OHM is sooo gorgeous..Wow, from AB?? they will have some beautiful babies
He's a male, he will figure out how to make that work..lol")


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## babystarz (Aug 3, 2012)

lelei said:


> OMg,, that OHM is sooo gorgeous..Wow, from AB?? they will have some beautiful babies
> He's a male, he will figure out how to make that work..lol")


Haha! Here's hoping his manly instincts take care of everything  The females are from AB, the male is actually from eBay. Those pics are from the seller. She's partnered with a Thai breeder who sends the fish to her.

Daddy is settling in well to my 6 gal Zen tank, I had to kick my tiny turquoise girl out of there and she's not happy with temporarily being in the fry net in her sister's tank  But she seriously didn't need all 6 gallons to herself XD

Daddy did have some tail biting going on but I sprang for overnight shipping so he didn't have time to seriously rip himself up. And his color was still good so he should be happy and healthy very soon. I put a fresh IAL in his tank too


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## lelei (Apr 30, 2012)

_Sounds like your well on your way..ooh, la la..gonna be some happy fishies in there soon..hahaha..I hope all goes well..1st breeding attempt? _


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## babystarz (Aug 3, 2012)

Yep, this will be my very first spawn if all goes well  I've been doing lots of research and gathering equipment together, I have several cultures of fry food either already here or on the way plus BBS eggs and a hatchery/decapper. The only thing I'm really waiting on now is the sponge filter for the breeding tank. Then once that is all set up I will start conditioning everyone ^^

I also ave a 20gal Long growout tank planted in substrate, and 120 32oz mason jars for juvenile males. Still need to get some shelving put in for those but I have a little time for that.


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## lelei (Apr 30, 2012)

babystarz said:


> Yep, this will be my very first spawn if all goes well  I've been doing lots of research and gathering equipment together, I have several cultures of fry food either already here or on the way plus BBS eggs and a hatchery/decapper. The only thing I'm really waiting on now is the sponge filter for the breeding tank. Then once that is all set up I will start conditioning everyone ^^
> 
> I also ave a 20gal Long growout tank planted in substrate, and 120 32oz mason jars for juvenile males. Still need to get some shelving put in for those but I have a little time for that.


Oh, wow..there is a lot involved, how does one go about it, it's just tooooooooo complicated for me..I hope it goes well for you, will you be selling them here, or on AB? I love, love that OHM, he is gorgeous..the combo of the 2 will be soo purdy;-)


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

Wow. The male is so nice!


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## babystarz (Aug 3, 2012)

lelei said:


> Oh, wow..there is a lot involved, how does one go about it, it's just tooooooooo complicated for me..I hope it goes well for you, will you be selling them here, or on AB? I love, love that OHM, he is gorgeous..the combo of the 2 will be soo purdy;-)


Reading, and asking lots of questions seems to be the best way to figure out every detail, that and being sure to plan well ahead!

I will definitely be offering some of the babies here, since people here have been so helpful and I know they'll go to good homes. I may also put some on AB depending on how they turn out  I know that since this is my first time the surviving spawn might not be terribly numerous, but then again I could end up with hundreds 




Mo said:


> Wow. The male is so nice!


Thanks Mo  Since my name as a breeder means nothing at this point, I wanted to start out with stock that speaks for itself to give the babies a great chance at finding homes.


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## finnfinnfriend (Feb 3, 2012)

The male looks awesome! Idk about that female though... Her topline doesnt look to good... But maybe thats just the camera angle??


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## babystarz (Aug 3, 2012)

finnfinnfriend said:


> The male looks awesome! Idk about that female though... Her topline doesnt look to good... But maybe thats just the camera angle??


Possibly, what are you noticing about it? I'm still learning about form.


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

I don't know what the real term is but there's definitely something going on badly with her topline


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## RandyTheBettaFish (Jul 11, 2012)

I absolutly love the male but I agree something is odd about her topline it just looks off kinda.


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

Most if that spawn looked funky. Lol, the top lines weren't very nice from any of them that I saw from that seller.. I know where you bought them from Babystarz. The seller was selling them on AB


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## finnfinnfriend (Feb 3, 2012)

Well, see how she is kinda lumpy on top between her nose and dorsal fin? It should be smooth and slightly curved.... I think


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

Let me find an example of a good top line on a female


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

This is a female with a good top line. Ignore the nip on her dorsal fin.. She got in a fight with her sis


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## babystarz (Aug 3, 2012)

Yep yep they were from AB. Do you guys know the likelihood of her passing it on? I mean, what percentage of the fry could inherit hers instead of their dad's? I am planning to breed the babies to each other or the dad so hopefully it would be bred out of successive generations if I select for good toplines.

Edit: Yeah I do see the difference... the good topline curves down a little toward the mouth and my female does not have that, she's almost rounded over that area.


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## tpocicat (Aug 8, 2011)

I'd say you have a 50-50 chance of the babies getting that top line from their mother, of course I don't know what the rest of the spawn she came out of looks like, that could increase or decrease the percentage.


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## babystarz (Aug 3, 2012)

I did choose these females for their beautiful color and robustness overall, so form is a secondary consideration. But I don't want it to be so poor in their offspring that it distracts from good color and fins. I guess as long as there will be _some_ babies who inherit their Dad's topline (and fins for the males) that's all I would need to breed another generation.


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## tpocicat (Aug 8, 2011)

You never know, you may get lucky and have more with a good top line, or like me with my first spawn when I got all females with no ventrals! Just the luck of the (genetic) draw.


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## vilmarisv (Apr 17, 2010)

You male is very nice but that female should raise big red flags. 
Not only is her topline "bumpy" but her scales are not uniform. 
She even looks sickly to me... how long have you had her?
What other female you have for him?


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## Junglist (Feb 23, 2012)

That female looks really old. Are you sure that's not the mother or grandmother?


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## tpocicat (Aug 8, 2011)

It might just be the picture that makes her look that way.


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## babystarz (Aug 3, 2012)

She's 7 months old, according to the breeder. I've had them both for 2 and a half months and they've been doing very well, quite healthy. They're nearly identical, I would say Gwen has a deeper blue iridescence layer than Shimmer. They do have the iridescence to their scales so that may be throwing things off a bit?

vilmarisv, I don't understand what you mean when you mention scale uniformity? Do you mean the size of the scales?

Maybe I should pop into the Betta shop tomorrow and see if they have any mustard halfmoon females in their new shipment.


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## VictorP (Jun 5, 2012)

I would definitely consider getting another female.


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## vilmarisv (Apr 17, 2010)

The scales should be perfectly aligned and smooth looking. Your female has some issues in this area. She has great coloring but the overal form is not good. I'm sorry it sounds so critical but a good breeder shoud've offered this fish as a cull that needs a home and not sold her as a breeder female.


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## indjo (Jun 6, 2010)

hmmm.... for some reason I can't see any pictures except for Mo's.


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## babystarz (Aug 3, 2012)

vilmarisv said:


> The scales should be perfectly aligned and smooth looking. Your female has some issues in this area. She has great coloring but the overal form is not good. I'm sorry it sounds so critical but a good breeder shoud've offered this fish as a cull that needs a home and not sold her as a breeder female.


No, it's ok, I would _much_ rather know this information now as opposed to later. I understand that good animal husbandry means that it's not a good idea to breed individuals with problems they could pass on. So thank you for being honest about this female. I agree that the breeder should not have advertised her as breeding quality.

I'm getting up early tomorrow (today) to get some errands done. I'll have time to swing by the shop and look at the new shipment and ask for the store owner's advice. He's really knowledgeable about breeding stock and I know he can help me pick out a female with excellent qualities. I just hope he has one who is mustard gas or pineapple in coloring.


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## vilmarisv (Apr 17, 2010)

I don't usually do this but I'm going to post an example for you of a good female below. 
Notice the smooth topline, even scales, sharp 180 caudal, full & tall dorsal, and the tight anal fin. She has no gaps between fins and the edges her her fins have uniform reductions between rays. 
Good luck with your search... I hope you find a nice female!
Oh, and if you find a white or yellow with good form it will be a good match for your boy too!


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## babystarz (Aug 3, 2012)

Thanks vilmarisv, I appreciate all the help. I'm understanding much more about form now. I feel like I need to invest in an LED flashlight to examine my fish with, I'm sure they'll be thrilled 

I have good news too! Tony just happened to have one pineapple female in Wednesday's shipment and no one had scooped her up yesterday  As always he was super helpful. The female has way better body form than Gwen & Shimmer and size-wise she is a much better match for my male. Her fins are her weak point, especially her little dorsal. But I realize I can't have _everything_ be perfect and I think daddy will more than compensate in the fin department  They are the exact same shade in body coloring and both have some lovely iridescence on their bodies, so it looks like I will have lots and lots of pretty pineapple babies ^^

She's already getting comfortable in her tank, and she's not hiding in a corner all pale like shipped fish. It's nice to have a local betta shop to buy from because I don't have to worry about fish getting stressed out from shipping. I did take her along to my appointment to pick up 120 mason jars and carried the bag she was in around because I was worried about leaving it in the car XD The whole appointment took 5 minutes though and then I was on the way home, so it wasn't a big deal.


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