# Plans on breeding



## SweetnSpicy (Sep 3, 2009)

Well, I plan on breeding my Marble HMs after the holidays, when I have a little more money and a week off haha. But, I have some questions first.

*1.* What type of sponge filter do you reccomend, like the brand and ect?

*2.* Are sterilite plastic bins fish-safe? I have read that some use plastic bins (mine being about 15gal give or take) but it would kill me if I used it and it wasn't safe.


Also, are the following items good, and do I need anything else?

-BBS, I have plenty, and my LPS sells them
-Java Moss, as well as many other live and fake plants
-Meds, for after breeding
-TONS of mason jars and containers, all are about 1gal
-Styrofoam cups
-IAL

I am getting a heater and sponge filter hopefully for Christmas, and if not I will buy one before I plan on breeding. 

Also, will I get all marbles from them? She has a lot more blue and red to her now, and he is a darker, navy blue.

















I think I have most of what I need to know, but one can never research enough!

Thanks!,
-SnS


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## rubyfire (Dec 10, 2009)

thats right about research 

everything sounds good with items. 
idk bout if all of the fry will be marble but look likes it.
(btw they are beautiful fish )

Good Luck!


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## DragonFish (Mar 31, 2009)

Sounds like you got everything to me! Best of luck! 

Oh, but for the meds make sure its not Bettafix or Melafix or anything like that....I've read so horrible things about what that stuff does to the labyrinth organ. In fact, Aquarium salt and warm water should probably be enough, unless one or both of them are seriously beat up.

I'm pretty sure plastic bins are fish-safe, I've heard of people using them, though maybe wait for someone else to comment first, just to make sure xD

Sorry, I'm not too good with genetics D: Though not all fry will be marble I think...just like not all will be HM probably. Though your pair is gorgeous! I look forward to seeing the outcome!


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

It looks to me like you are pretty much set. Your fish are beautiful! Did you get them from Aquabid?


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## SweetnSpicy (Sep 3, 2009)

@ rubyfire- Thanks so much! I hope I have luck breeding, too 

@ DragonFish - I heard that too, I will see if my LPS has something better, Maybe Hikari Betta Revive? I do add some aquarium salt with water changes and stuff, so I am covered there. Thanks, neither can I! 

@ dramaqueen - Thanks! Yes, I did get them from Aquabid, I would have loved to get another pair from him also, the breeder has such beautiful fish!

Thanks for y'alls imput! I FAIL at genetics, of any kind really, so it was a lot of help!


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

I thought so! They look like Aquabid fish.


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## SweetnSpicy (Sep 3, 2009)

Haha, I guess they do. I know I would have NEVER found marbles that compared to them here.


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## DragonFish (Mar 31, 2009)

Hmmm, never heard of Betta Revive before, maybe do a little googling on it before getting it xD Though, I probably wouldn't medicate unless its absolutely necessary...like they're REALLY torn up, missing scales, ext.

Haha, I'm actually fascinated with genetics xDD I love it. I just can't find any really good info about betta genetics on the net, which really stinks >_<;


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## SweetnSpicy (Sep 3, 2009)

Yeah, but from running a 23 horse farm with my mom for a while makes me want to have meds on stock. Horses get into some trouble! haha

Last year we learned about genetics a little, I kinda understood, but I need to draw a punnett(sp) square every time now! A friend of mine said Betta genetics are VERY hard to learn, and she is amazing at genetics, so I figured I would shy away from them for a while xD

-Scampers off to google-


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## doggyhog (Apr 30, 2009)

Sounds like you've got everything you need!!!

I use bins ALL the time. Never had a problem. I've heard some breeders that actually prefer them because they don't cause the bettas to get distracted. LOL some just want food so much that they will get distracted from what they are supposed to do!

I've heard that Methelyene (didn't spell that right...) blue is a good medicine. 

Good luck!!!


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## doggyhog (Apr 30, 2009)

BTW, your pair is STUNNING!!!!


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## Lethbridge (Nov 8, 2009)

*plans on breeding*

Well there are so many sponge filters out there this is just mostly preference. I use the sponge filter by Elite (type elite sponge filter into google, its the one with the double sponge), i use this one because it has two sponges which gives me double the surface area to grow benificial bacteria, but i do add a gang valve to it to control the flow when breeding, but this sponge filter pulls what through the sponge and up the tube and it lands back into the water which also helps with aeration.Many people use plastic containers to breed it it cheaper, however it is alittle more difficult to keep track of all your fry and when doing water changes etc, you cant really get a good view of what you are sucking up as with a tank you can see everything you are doing. but yes they will be safe and you shouldnt have any problems with them.Yes it looks like you have everything you need but i would like to comment on a few things, first, make sure you have enough bbs cysts for quite some time because they will need food constantly or they will die, also what do you plan to feed for the first few days? or just bbs from the start? second, another good plant that you can use is java fern it requires very little to no light and the females love them for hiding i put about four large plants in one 10 gallon breeding tank, also the male can anchor his nest to this aswell. Third, as for the meds, someone said that melafix is bad for the bettas? i have not heard of this however i have used it in previous spawns without anything going wrong, HOWEVER i have switched to another product since last spawning because alought melafix or permafix works fine it was just not strong enough to kill fungus on fry, where as melafix works great for larger bettas without harming plants, ecosystem etc. The product i use now is called maroxy it works great and i have not had a problem with it at all, i dose a fry tank everyother day when they are young and it helps keep disease down. I would recommend this not only because it works but also because it will not harm your young/old fry. Now about the styrofoam cup, id like to suggest something else, you can use the styrofoam cup and yes it does work, but what i have found while using it is that the fry get stuck to the top or sides of the cup and they dry out and die, like if they are under the cup and a bubble pops sometimes they get stuck to the top of the cup and die. what i found to work great was a piece of bubble wrap cut into a square these works great and keeps the fry safe, also i say that you had ial, i would say use this as an anchor because this most closely mimics the natural habitat of the betta, not only that but the ial will also help keep fungus and other disease at bay for young fry, so i personally would use that. I currently cant get ahold of ial without shipping cost me $50 for a 0.13 cent leaf however i do use blackwater extract with the bubble wrap square. You will more than likely get all marbles, unless the have different genes, i would ask the breeder out bought it from what the parents were and what kind of genes these two old, that will help you determine what kind of fry you will get. but typically you will get 90%+ marbles. your right about the research there are always new techniques coming out and things that you dont know, its a never ending things. Hope some of this helps

Oh also i forgot, your pair looks amazing. and i hope everything goes well with your spawn.


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## SweetnSpicy (Sep 3, 2009)

@ doggyhog - Plastic bins are a go then! Thanks, I love my marbles too :3

@ Lethbridge - Okay, so I will check my LPS and Semi-local FS for Elite sponge filters, they seem pretty nice. I was thinking on using BBS from the start, but if there is something else I can use that is better for them I will try to get it. I can go and pick up another few packs from them before I breed to be prepared. I have a few Java Ferns, but they are rather small, like really small. But hopefully my Banana Lilies would have grown more to have sorta the same effect, they are growing like crazy! I also can check for Maroxy, because I do not really like using Melafix and ect.. We have to have bubble wrap somewhere, so I will use that if it would be better. IAL would also be used. I will check with the breeder to see what their parents were, and their genes. Thank you so much


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## Lethbridge (Nov 8, 2009)

Well im not saying you have to use anything i said before i am just telling you what i use and what works for me! Brine shrimp are good from the start however some of the fry may be too small to eat the bbs, though if you go with the san fransisco bay brand brine shrimp eggs they are much smaller than most eggs and the babies will be able to eat them from the start. Banana lilies are a great plant for bettas! Maroxy works for me, and i do not like to use chemicals! i only use them when i am breeding bettas. IAL is very useful and will help the bubble nest stick together better as well as prevent fungus and other disease from forming. Like i said before you dont have to use the bw but it does work and i like it better


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## SweetnSpicy (Sep 3, 2009)

It is okay, I like to try what works best for others, maybe it will do the same for me :3

I do have San Fransicso Bay Brand and another type, but I can use the SFBB first, and the others later on when they are bigger. If I find any Maroxy I will add some, but if not, then just IAL and a little Melafix maybe. Thanks again!


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## Lethbridge (Nov 8, 2009)

SweetnSpicy said:


> It is okay, I like to try what works best for others, maybe it will do the same for me :3
> 
> I do have San Fransicso Bay Brand and another type, but I can use the SFBB first, and the others later on when they are bigger. If I find any Maroxy I will add some, but if not, then just IAL and a little Melafix maybe. Thanks again!


Maybe who knows! Okay the SFBB will be best to start and then you can use the others later on. IAL is an all around general purpose healer i recommend that regardless! Your bettas will thank you for using it, maroxy is quite useful but i only use it every other day for the first week, then the fry have got over the biggest period where they can get a disease, so if you keep up water changes then you should not have problem!


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## SweetnSpicy (Sep 3, 2009)

Okay, Every other day for the first week, got it! I do keep IAL in my imports tank at all times, because I heard they are more fragile than Petco's and Walmarts fish haha. I also heard you should change the water everyday, but not 100%, like 10% to 20%, because the fry produce hormones that slow their growth. Is that true?

Also, as a proud fish parent, Thai, my male on the first page, made his first bubble nest today! Only a small one, that doesn't even compare to my sister's fish's nests, but still a nice one. Just felt like sharing :3


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## Lethbridge (Nov 8, 2009)

Yes IAL is very useful with all bettas not only imports!! Yes i usually do about 20% a day to keep the water clean as well as to remove the hormones. Well thats good! Hopefully he wil continue to make even bigger bubble nests


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## SweetnSpicy (Sep 3, 2009)

I love IAL, my Betta's love it, it is a wonderful thing haha. Hopefully he will, his current one is only about the size of a silver dollar at most.


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## loppy656 (Jul 31, 2009)

I love your pair! The babbys will be soo cute!

Where do you find marble bettas any way?


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## Lethbridge (Nov 8, 2009)

Well a bubble nest is better than no bubble nest thats for sure!


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## lilyrazen (Oct 25, 2009)

@Loppy, those two are aquabid fish, but sometimes you can find them at the store, like how I had to have Heidi!!


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## SweetnSpicy (Sep 3, 2009)

@ Lethbridge - Yeah, I am so proud of him! haha. He hadn't added onto it, so I guess it will stay that size :3

@ Loppy656 - Yuppers, Aquabids they are. There are no nice marbles here, which are my favorite color on bettas, so I had to order them. Thanks!


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

I can't wait for you to breed them. Their fry will be beautiful!!


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## SweetnSpicy (Sep 3, 2009)

Me either! Haha, thanks  

So far all I need is about $30 more to buy a heater and a sponge filter, and tons of BBS off of amazon.com, so after the holidays I will try to do some extra work. Or use Christmas money lol.

Also, what do you guys think of Atisons Betta Starter? I have heard mixed reviews, and don't want to waste my money on it if it doesn't work.


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## Lethbridge (Nov 8, 2009)

Well i have never personally used it however i have read that it is not the best and kinda useless sorry i couldnt be more help


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## SweetnSpicy (Sep 3, 2009)

I took it off, and added more BBS because I want to have more than I need haha. You have been so much help already!


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## Lethbridge (Nov 8, 2009)

Well thats a good strategy you can never have enough food. I like to help people when they breed and i do have quite a bit of experience as well so that helps


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## SweetnSpicy (Sep 3, 2009)

Totally, I would hate to run out! The bbs I already have is filling up my fridge, so what would another 2 bottles be? I hope after this first spawn, if things go well, I will be able to spawn again, and have more experience! Would a 20gal be good to breed in, also? Just fill it 4-6in like you would a 10gal? I got one for Christmas, and my other tank I got will be a sorority eventually, so I pretty much have an empty tank, and I would rather use that then the plastic bin haha.


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

A 20 gallon would be perfect IMO. It would give the fry plenty of room to grow and be easier to keep clean.


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## SweetnSpicy (Sep 3, 2009)

Awesome! Gives me a better reason to go to the pet store now! I have to check around for sponge filters and such haha.


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## Lethbridge (Nov 8, 2009)

Well thats good, the first spawn is always to hardest


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## k stiles (Aug 29, 2009)

yes it is, and one of your first ?'s, the fry should be marble, unless the parents have other color genes in their cromosones, otherwise IDK, expiriment around, oh and Mr. V is back so he might give an explination about genetics


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## SweetnSpicy (Sep 3, 2009)

@ Lethbridge - things usually come with experience, so I figured it would be harder the first time.

@ k stiles - I would like to know their Genetics, but it would be pretty cool to get a surprise spawn I guess. He is back, I saw him around this board :3 Maybe, lol.

Also, as an update I guess, I cannot get the sponge filters until at least December 31st, and the extra BBS until January 6th, as told by Amazon.com. So I have to maybe try to spawn on a weekend now, unless they come earlier, before break ends.


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

Don't be surprised if it doesn't work the first time.


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## SweetnSpicy (Sep 3, 2009)

Yeah, but if it doesn't, I will re-condition them and try again. I am praying that all goes well, though xD


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## SweetnSpicy (Sep 3, 2009)

I have another question, haha. Can you not keep a filter in the fry tank for the first week, and then add it? I was researching on different methods of breeding, and saw this {http://www.iaza.com/work/091227C/Betta_snipping_copy45570.png} from this site { http://www.najrickbettas.com/breeding_bettas.htm }

And I figured if it would be okay to do tat I would spawn sooner, because my Filters still have to ship here. I have enough BBS to last a while, or until my order comes, but I do NOT want to screw this up haha. My girl, who still has no name, is so stripped, and she looks so cute with her big, round belly ;D


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

Maybe you can add one after they become free swimming. I've read that having one will disturb the nest. MrVampire and Lethbridge can tell you what they do.


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## SweetnSpicy (Sep 3, 2009)

Alrighty, thanks dq! You are such great help 

They should come about the time they would be free swimming, give or take a day I guess.


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

You're welcome!


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## MrVampire181 (May 12, 2009)

Genetics: Marbles will come up with whatever color they darn well choose. There's an article on bettysplendens about it (I'll post the link).

Filter: I didn't use one this most recent time but I did use a gentle bubbler. So whatever you want to do. 

Link: http://bettysplendens.com/articles/page.imp?articleid=1114


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## SweetnSpicy (Sep 3, 2009)

Thanks for the link! It makes a lot more sense now, haha. So, just a mixed bunch, huh?

I do have a few airstones, will those work? i guess I will just go as I said before, add the filter when they are all free swimming, and/or a week old. I will add Thai today, so tomorrow maybe they can get down to business haha. 

Thanks for your help Mr. V!


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## Lethbridge (Nov 8, 2009)

Good luck with the breeding process


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## SweetnSpicy (Sep 3, 2009)

Haha, thanks! They are in there now, he is busy building a bubble nest, and she is fat, with stripes. It is so funny, he goes to flare at her, and when she flares back, he does a look, which seems to say "Wha??"


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## Lethbridge (Nov 8, 2009)

I guess he doesnt like getting challenged


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## SweetnSpicy (Sep 3, 2009)

No, I guess not. He seems to be more of a "manly man" haha. Hopefully he will be done with his nest later tonight, so I will let her out before "lights out" time. Thank you so much for all of your help and everything!


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## Lethbridge (Nov 8, 2009)

you release her then turn the lights out?


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

Good luck!! Keep us posted!!


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## SweetnSpicy (Sep 3, 2009)

@ Lethbridge - I have read that people do that, but I probably won't sleep til at least 2am because I am a night person, so their light is on now haha. 

@ dramaqueen - THanks! I will!

She is out now, and he is showing off to her, and trying to get her by the nest. There is some nipping, but nothing that bad, and they seem to alternate who is chasing who. She goes up there on her own, but doesn't get in the "position" to spawn. He also keeps adding to the nest, then shows off to her, and tries to bring her over haha. I guess she isn't ready, but hopefully will be soon!


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

Some nipping and chasing is normal. Hopefully, it will happen tonight.


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## SweetnSpicy (Sep 3, 2009)

I separated them, because he was chasing her for more than 15min, and they got some pretty good bites in. He has a few tares in his caudal fin, and she had a few bite marks. I do not want to risk loosing one of them, so they are in different tanks getting a dose of TLC at the moment. maybe I could retry in a week or two? I do not want to rush things. I hope I did the right thing >.<


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

Yes, you did. If the nipping and chasing gets too violent where someone is really getting hurt then its a good idea to separate them. Maybe let him work more on his nest and try again in a day or two. Let's see what Lethbridge and MrV say.


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## SweetnSpicy (Sep 3, 2009)

Yeah, I figured that was the thing to do. He isn't working on his nest now, he is swimming in the Java moss jungle in the tank haha. Maybe he will later. I could do that, I have nothing to do AT ALL because of winter break. School seems sorta fun now, haha.

On the up side, my 25gal's Nitrate, Nitrite, PH, and alkalinity have stabilized, and my dad has off tomorrow, so maybe a trip to petco, and I could start my sorority. They have awesome yellows at the petco a few towns over.


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

Oooh, a yellow female! That would be pretty!!


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## SweetnSpicy (Sep 3, 2009)

I am a sucker for Marbles and yellows 

They had a yellow female, I was guessing a delta (wasn't labeled), last time I went, but that was over a month ago, so I am sure she is gone now. Maybe I will get lucky, and find a few nice ones haha!


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

I hope you'll find some really pretty ones.


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## SweetnSpicy (Sep 3, 2009)

Me too, hehe!

Thanks so much for all of your help, and I greatly appreciate it


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

You're welcome! And we want to see pics of your new girls when you get them.


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## SweetnSpicy (Sep 3, 2009)

Alrighty haha. Hopefully I can get my dad to take me tomorrow, or I will see if my mom can take me Wednesday or Thursday. I hate not being old enough to drive


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## Lethbridge (Nov 8, 2009)

Okay so usually i would tell you to condition them totally seperated from each other, but in your case i would start all over and condition them side by side for a few days then remove the female from him for about a week, then reintroduce the female beside him and continue to condition for a few more days then remove them from each others sight for a few days then. then i would but the male into the breeding tank and let him explore for a day, the the very next day put the female in a hurricane globe or whatever you are using and then let her sit in there one day then the next day release her into the tank, and hopefully spawning will occur. The conditioning method i shared with you will get the male and female introduced to each other more so there will be less nipping and chasing.


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## SweetnSpicy (Sep 3, 2009)

Alright, but wouldn't that be very stressful on the female? Could I put their tanks next to each other, but put something between them so they cannot see each other?

Thank you so much! I will put her by him tonight!


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## Lethbridge (Nov 8, 2009)

ya i didnt mean move the female, but what ever container you have her in and yes just put there two tanks together that would be perfect, sorry if i wasnt clear


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## SweetnSpicy (Sep 3, 2009)

You where perfectly clear! I knew you meant to keep her in the container, but I thought you meant to move the whole container itself. That will work great, I have extra space now that my sorority is set up


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## Lethbridge (Nov 8, 2009)

Well thats good! Is your avatar betta a halfmoon, or a delta tail? I loe the white lace around the blue, looks good!


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## SweetnSpicy (Sep 3, 2009)

He is a HM when he is fully flared, but doesn't tend to flare much haha. Thanks! Hi is a looker! I love your avatar as well! Is he a VT?


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## Lethbridge (Nov 8, 2009)

You just get him at a pet store? So you have a tame male then! Ya he is a vt, not my favourite but my other bettas are hard to take pics of, i love my black melano male, but he does not like to be photographed! Oh well i guess


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## SweetnSpicy (Sep 3, 2009)

No, he was an import from Thailand, haha. Hence the name  A little feisty guy he is. He is still pretty, though! Yellows are my favorite, so are marbles. Black melanos are really nice, he sounds beautiful! too bad he doesn't like to get his picture taken!


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## Lethbridge (Nov 8, 2009)

oh okay! Very nice, tailand orders for me cost over $100 in shipping, but i work at pet store as manager and i do all my ordering through them so i get the box price, saves on shipping! Ya hopefully once i have my betta barracks up and running it will be easier to get pics


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## SweetnSpicy (Sep 3, 2009)

Haha, It must be great to get box price on stuff. It cost about $100 total, but that was with shipping and everything. I hope you get your barracks up soon, I can't wait for pics


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## Lethbridge (Nov 8, 2009)

ya its better than paying full shipping prices. Well my barracks cant be setup until i get the beanie boxes from the states which will take a bit, or so they have told me


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## SweetnSpicy (Sep 3, 2009)

Like beanie babies? You can't find them here at all, so I guess it would be quite hard to get a hold of a large amount haha.

I guess as an update, my stuff came, and I think I have enough BBS to last a while, and I am using your method of conditioning, they are starting to show some interest in each other, they tend to hang around the side of the tanks that are by each others. Hopefully it will work, and I have 3 days off 2 weeks from now, So maybe I can try again that weekend


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## Lethbridge (Nov 8, 2009)

yes like beanie baby boxes, and no you cant get them in canada so i have to get them from the states. And they only ship in 12's to canada so i have to pay alot of shipping costs but i need it! Well your conditioning should go well. Hope it all works out for you and yes it is better when you have some time off


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