# ammonia burn treatment time



## vivien (Aug 8, 2012)

so i know my betta has ammonia burn and ive been doing water changes, and have started doing 100% with stress coat and aq salt for the past 2 days, but it looks like its still getting worse! how long til i notice a difference?
before then i just did water changes for a few days (50% 75% and 100%) and did 2 days of mela fixtil i read not too
also because im using stress caot i dont need a separate conditioner right? because it does both

Housing 
What size is your tank? 12 L 3.17ga
What temperature is your tank? 25degC
Does your tank have a filter?yes on low 50 cycles per hour
Does your tank have an air stone or other type of aeration? no
Is your tank heated? yes
What tank mates does your betta fish live with?none since cory died from ammonia spike

Food
What type of food do you feed your betta fish? aqua one betta pellets (je wont eat anything else ive tried)
How often do you feed your betta fish? daily sometimes offering him more than once depending on how much he ate

Maintenance (will be from recovery onwards, before this trouble i only had it set up a few weeks with no water changes)
How often do you perform a water change?weekly
What percentage of the water do you change when you perform a water change?50%
What type of additives do you add to the water when you perform a water change?stress coat, and biobooster and conditioning salts

Water Parameters:
Have you tested your water? If so, what are the following parameters?

Ammonia:0
Nitrite:0
Nitrate:0
pH:7 changing as im doing daily water changes but i lower when nessesary
Hardness:~100
Alkalinity: uhh? isnt that the same as ph..

Symptoms and Treatment
How has your betta fish's appearance changed? yes fins looking more shredded and colour changing
How has your betta fish's behavior changed? became happier without the cory, but has tonnes of personality still
When did you start noticing the symptoms?when the cory died about a week ago
Have you started treating your fish? If so, how?yes
stated above
Does your fish have any history of being ill?unsure as he is relatively new
How old is your fish (approximately)?unsure
picture is from about a week ago, but fins are looking worse


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## vivien (Aug 8, 2012)

him now


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## vivien (Aug 8, 2012)

and when i put him in his tank after his water change today he went crazy headbutting the side trying to escape :/ he hasnt done that before. i hope he was just surprised by the cold cause the heater hadnt done much yet, ill have to next time use warm water when i set it ack up


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## Oldfishlady (Mar 1, 2010)

Are you sure he isn't biting his tail...Its hard for me to tell by the pic-but it almost looks like he has white edges on the tips of his fins.

What do you mean by ammonia burns or do you mean fin rot???

Some-_not all_-of the Long fin males can have fin and stress issues with water movement/filters IMO/E.

What I would recommend you try-turn off or remove the filter all together and start a fresh/dechlorinated water and tannin treatment. 

IMO/E-filters are optional with this species and this could be the cause of stress and that in turn could be causing neurotic behavior and biting-then the open wound the source of a secondary infection-plus along with that and stress..... can compromise the immune response. 

Then I would start a clean/dechlorinated, tannin water treatment-along with good nutrition and see if this will help.

Tannins-either IAL (_Indian almond leaf_) 1 large crushed/gal or what I use-naturally dried and fallen from the tree Oak leaf about 20 crushed/gal.
The tannins have antibacterial/fungal properties, can help toughen fins/scales over time, ease stress and can lower pH with long term use. Since these are a natural product you can't overdose them.

I would premix some tannin stained water in a 1gal jug of dechlorinated water to use for 50% water changes daily for 2 days-Then 50% every other day for 4 days-Then twice weekly to maintain water quality in a 3gal unfiltered tank without live plants of 1-50% water only and 1-100% weekly.

With any 100% water changes-be sure and properly acclimate to both the temp and chemistry by adding small amounts of the fresh tank water to the holding cup over 10-15min or to tolerance-Net or allow him to swim out of the holding container into the tank with the least amount of the holding container water you can. Have a little extra dechlorinated like temp water on hand to top off the tank if needed.

Nutrition-good quality varied diet fed in small frequent meals. If you have access to any live mosquito larva offer several rinsed a couple of times a day to boost protein/nutrition to support the immune response and to promote healing.

At any point he has a change in behavior or symptoms-he may need a full treatment...

Keep us post...Lovely fella by the way...


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## vivien (Aug 8, 2012)

i think its fin rot from the ammonia spike. The white edges went there when i nought him, they went white the started to become ripped off, i have never seen him bite his tail so im unsure how to tell if it would be that. Are there any easy to tell symptoms if its tailbiting not fin rot?

Ill try turning off the filter, but somewhere i read the current needs to be 4-6 cycles an hour which is why i thought it was okay seeing he 
doesnt get pushed around any more

Im getting so many conflicting opnions by what ive read, somewhere on this site it said to do the salt water treatment im doing for not more than 10 days, youve said something else. 
I think ill comtinue this treatment and if it doesnt nothing ill try yours.
How long should it take before a noticable affect has taken place? So i dont waste time on usless treatments

the membranes on his fins are becoming tranparent so im afraid hes going to loose them too.

I just want hime to be happy!


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## Oldfishlady (Mar 1, 2010)

The reason you get so much conflicting info- is because there are a lot of ways to properly care for a Betta and treat them for that matter. Lots of different opinions based on a persons personal experience....In some cases, not really a right or wrong answer....

White and/or clear edges can mean new growth or a sign of healing-
IMO by your pic it doesn't look like fin rot-since he is otherwise acting okay, eating and responding to you-I wouldn't worry-but observe, maintain water quality, temp and nutrition.


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## vivien (Aug 8, 2012)

okay then! thats good to hear, o you have any idea of how to maintain a varied diet when he wont eat normal sized pellets he likes really tiny ones, so he wont even eat the freeze dried blood worms


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

Freeze dried should only be as a treat anyways. Can you find some frozen bloodworms? Those are hard to resist. How big are the normal pellets? Sometimes they are much too big for bettas.


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## Phaydra (Nov 20, 2012)

Try frozen blood worms and frozen brine shrimp.

Edit Sena beat me to it


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

hehehe :3


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## vivien (Aug 8, 2012)

normal were about 2mm his are about half a mm. and i know that which is why i thought he'd eat them! i even tried to crush the worms a bit but nothing. so im not sure if hes just a fussy pain in the butt or what?! and i havent tried frozen yet and im worried ill over feed and have another ammonia spike, so im waiting until im sure my method of cleaning his tank it correct


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## Phaydra (Nov 20, 2012)

If he is fussy or you want to feed him some without over feeding I have soaked pellets in the water from thawed frozen foods. Red is my problem child and when I first got him he turned his nose up at anything that wasn't a pellet. After a few feedings of soaked pellets he took to the frozen foods.


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## Sena Hansler (Aug 24, 2011)

You can also use garlic juice to entice mr picky to eat


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## Phaydra (Nov 20, 2012)

Sena Hansler said:


> You can also use garlic juice to entice mr picky to eat


Unless he's so picky he turns his nose up at garlic. hehe Sena is right though most fish love the smell of garlic. Try it all and see what works best for your little problem child.


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## vivien (Aug 8, 2012)

great idea! will try that soon, ive had the filter off since this morning, and hes flaring a bit more giving me a chance to see his fins properly and i think they are doing better than i thought!  so happy 

by over feed you just mean feeding him more than he'll eat right? i always thought they dont over eats like dogs will haha


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## Phaydra (Nov 20, 2012)

They will over eat like a dog. Plus all that extra foods they don't eat sinks and raises ammonia levels. Generally you don't feed them food like worms and shrimp enough to make too big a mess. It's just a suggestion if he turns out to be super picky. He may take to frozen food like a duck(fish) to water


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## vivien (Aug 8, 2012)

i use a syringe to clean out anything uneat since that cause an ammonia spike before. it sure as hell is not happening again.

and wow i thought they didnt okay then, how to i know when he has eaten enough and just being a pig?


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## Phaydra (Nov 20, 2012)

I am in the firm belief all Bettas have a pig in their family tree. A fish's eye is as big as their stomach. I feed my Bettas Hikari pellets because they are small. I recommend 2 in the morning, 2 at lunch, and 2 at dinner time. If you buy a larger pellet type like TetraBetta I only feed those 1 in the morning, 1 at lunch and 1 at night. If you see your boy starting to getting a potbelly cut back. As they get older or less active too you may want to cut back. Red is 3 and is down to 1 pellet per meal of the Hikari. He naps a lot so burns less calories.


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## vivien (Aug 8, 2012)

how big are those, because mine are tiny like 1/2 - 1 mm diamitior and he eats loads, the packet says as much as he eats in a few mins without left overs. he might eat 20-30 a day, i clearly need to cut back


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## Phaydra (Nov 20, 2012)

Wow lol he is a little piggy. 

Hikari pellet


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## vivien (Aug 8, 2012)

yeah thats about the size of the ones he refuses to eat put ill work it out so its the same size portion of what you just recommended thanks! 
yes he is! i cannot for the life of me remember where i heard they dont over eat, which sucks because ive just started working at a pet shop and told someone that just yesterday :? whoops


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## Phaydra (Nov 20, 2012)

You live and learn. If he's eating the larger pellets just feed him 2 to 3 a day. I recommend Hikari though. It will cost you more but my boys are more active then went I was feeding them other pellets.


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## vivien (Aug 8, 2012)

he may not be over eating, and ill try but he wont eat anything large, and the size difference is huge!


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## Phaydra (Nov 20, 2012)

You can try New Life Spectrum Small Fish Formula. It may be what you are using but it's the same size as those small pellets you have. That size I would try 4-5 a feeding about 12 to 15 a day. They are .5mm in size


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## vivien (Aug 8, 2012)

i feed him aquaone pellets, and ill start trying to give him variety now i know how.


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