# New add't to the family "Oranda's"



## bettalover06 (Mar 19, 2012)

I got 4 new Oranda's for my birthday. Up to now still shock and actually stress about it. I love the goldfish but stress since I honestly I am not familiar with how to care for goldfish, yet alone Oranda's. :---( I did some research about how to care for it, but still need some guidance. I dont want to give them away, so I'm trying my best to care for them the best way I know how, base on research of course. I have 4 of them in 10G tank with filter (since they do produce so much waste), no heater (since they need to be between 60-70), airbubble (to create more oxygen), and gravels; some decors plastic plants. So far, they said 1 goldfish should be on 10G, so I have four = 40G :shock::shock::shock:, when should I consider upgrading the tank, or is their a way I can have them in 10G and just do 2 - 3 water change, with water conditioner. They are no longer than 1" just babies. I know for a fact that when they get bigger they need more room, can I postponed this for another 6month to a year. Just really compress in space, and money is tight. Please help. Thanks alot for all the responses.


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## Micho (Aug 22, 2011)

What kind of goldfish?

Goldfish creates so much waste and need huge tanks to house one, most common goldfish would be comet ones do I'm just going to go with that kind. Comet goldfish become huge fish, around a foot or so I believe. Meaning you'll have to get a 100g+ tank or even bigger for all four of them. 

You'll have to re-home then if you're not able to get a bigger tank, they're just babies and being in such a small tank will stunt their growth.


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## Crowntailed (Apr 19, 2012)

Micho said:


> What kind of goldfish?


 http://animal-world.com/encyclo/fresh/goldfish/RedcapOranda.php


They can get over 7 inches (most only get 6-7 but...) I would get the 40g sooner then later because they do produce so much waste and because there just isn't any room in a 10gal for them. You should get atleast a 40g tank, bigger would be better but a 40 will do if you dont have the money for a larger one.


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## djembekah (Feb 13, 2012)

i think they said Orandas. do Orandas need as much space as comets?


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## Crowntailed (Apr 19, 2012)

I would say no they dont need as big of a tank because they are not as big swimmers as comets are and there a little smaller then comets. But they still need a large tank because they still get 6-7inches.


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## wolfiegreen (Jan 23, 2012)

I've been. Looking into goldfish for myself for 2 telescopes I was going with a 30 gallon but with your 4 you need around a 60 gallon for when there full grown. http://www.rafflesgold.com/forums/index.php?act=idx check out this site you may be able ask some questions on here


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## MoonShadow (Feb 29, 2012)

From what I understand you should have 20G for 1 full grown goldie and 10G fro each additional goldie, so you really need a 55-60 gallon tank.


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## Bombalurina (Oct 10, 2011)

+1 to everybody. You need to upgrade them sooner rather than later. As you know, they create a heck of a lot of waste, and even with lots of water changes you aren't going to be able to keep the water clean enough. This will stunt their growth. 

Look on your local classifieds, craigslist or whatever, for a second-hand 55 gallon. You are going to need a very powerful filter, too. I would also suggest getting a heater - orandas, from memory, like to have their water at about 68.


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## thekoimaiden (Oct 19, 2011)

Everyone is right. You need an upgrade and _fast_ to prevent stunting. Young goldfish in a proper environment grow very fast and will reach 6+ inches in a year. For 4 oranda, you are going to want a 55+ gal tank. A 40 gal tank will not be sufficient as oranda are some of the larger fancy goldfish and have the potential to be 10 inches long. Ten gallons per fish is minimum with goldfish as is heavy filtration. Your first move will be to get a larger filter. The Aquaclear 70's are great for goldfish as they provide a lot of room for the beneficial bacteria. On a 55 gallon you will need two of these. I highly suggest a 75 gallon and canister filter as this is going to be the best setup for your oranda. Your next move is going to be doing daily 50% water changes on this tank. As this is going to hamper your cycle, I suggest cycling a filter in a bucket with pure ammonia. Cycling - the first 30 days This is an excellent article about goldfish and cycling. This site is also an invaluable resource as it contains quite a few goldfish experts including numerous breeders with decades of experience.

And I would actually suggest getting a heater as fancy goldfish do best at temperatures between 70F and 80F. They also don't like rapid temp changes which a small tank like a 10 gal has the potential to do. If your house temp is pretty steady this time of the year, then you don't need to get one yet. The first thing you need to do is get a powerful filter and a large tank.


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## bettalover06 (Mar 19, 2012)

Thank you all for taking the time to respond, and for some suggestion. I wish I have enough room in my room to put that size of a tank. Will for now, Will just get another filter unitil then, wish me luck ^_^


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## Bombalurina (Oct 10, 2011)

You could get a big plastic storage tub.  They come in lots of large sizes and can be tucked discreetly away in places. Alternatively, if it's warm enough where you are, a kiddy pool outdoors would do the job.


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## bettalover06 (Mar 19, 2012)

UPDATE! I recently brought 30G tank for my 4 Orandas today  But that only thing is it doesnt have light. How important is it for my tank to have light? The tank is in my room which I keep well lit at night, but I do turn it off when I sleep at night. Would having the light off harm my goldies? However, it does have everything else such as submersable heater, thermometer, gravel, some plastic decor, and Bio Wheel power filter penguin 200. I'm supper excited about this upgrading tank situation. I truely feel less panicky about caring for them. ^_______^


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## thekoimaiden (Oct 19, 2011)

The 30 gal will hold them for a while and should be able to establish a cycle with that filter (I had it on my goldfish tank for a few years), but you're still going to need a larger tank in a few months. As for the light, fish just like humans need a day/night cycle, so they will need a minimum of 8 hours of total darkness. Ambient light from the room is just fine, and is probably better than an overhead light because it won't promote algae. 

The other thing you are missing is a liquid test kit. The API Freshwater Master is best. Since your tank is in the process of cycling, this is a must. It will tell you when your cycle is finished and when your water is toxic to the fish and you need to do a water change.


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## bettalover06 (Mar 19, 2012)

@ thekoimaiden - thanks for that info! But I do have the API test kit already ^_^ for this size of a tank, 50% WC ok? thanks again.


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## thekoimaiden (Oct 19, 2011)

Glad you've got the API test kit. You're going to burning through the ammonia and nitrite ones! 

A 50% water change weekly is minimum with goldfish tanks. Since you are cycling, you're going to be doing them at least twice a week and probably more. Any time the ammonia or nitrite gets above 0.25 ppm do a water change.


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## bettalover06 (Mar 19, 2012)

I had just transfered my 4 orandas to their new home, I had left the water filter run overnight, and my airstones. I wanted to make sure water was well circulated and that everything is working. I notice that my babies seems to be grasping for air more, Im not sure if its because the airpump is not producing more airbubbles, and that they are lacking oxygen  if that is that case. Can anyone suggest a good airbubble product for 30G tank. Thank you ALL ^______^


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## thekoimaiden (Oct 19, 2011)

Gasping for air (also known as piping) is a sign they aren't getting enough oxygen. Since you have a bubbler in there, the water should be oxygenated enough unless it is really hot (higher than 80F). Piping is also a symptom of ammonia poisoning and gill parasites as both of these reduce the ability of the gills to take oxygen. Have you tested the ammonia and nitrite?


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## bettalover06 (Mar 19, 2012)

I forgot to mention that the bubbler I have is for 20G, I got that when I only had 10G. Would this make a difference if I got a much stronger airpump to create more bubbles and hopefully more oxygen, makes sense right? I did test my water this evening. PH 7.5 , Ammonia 0.50ppm, Nitrite 0.25ppm and Nitrate 0ppm. I started this tank Sun. So its only been 2days. Thanks again ^_^


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## thekoimaiden (Oct 19, 2011)

I don't think it makes that big of a difference. I use a pump rated for a 40 gal tank on my 55 gal tank. I don't think it's oxygenation. I'm willing to bet it is that reading of 0.50 ppm ammonia and 0.25 ppm nitrite. With those levels after just two days, you should be doing daily water changes.


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## bettalover06 (Mar 19, 2012)

Thanks Izzy, for all your help. Should I do 50% WC or should I just do 100% WC? I read that on newer water thank, Ammonia are expected to spike up, but should go down after 4-7 weeks to 0ppm, once the tank is cycled and filter begins to have BB (beneficial Bacteria) How true its this? I am planning on getting a much stronger airpump and couple more wall wand. ^___^


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## thekoimaiden (Oct 19, 2011)

Never do a 100% water change on a cycled tank. You can do two 50% water changes in a day if the ammonia is really high, but never a 100%. Removing all of the water will hurt the budding BB colonies. 

The cycling process will cause an ammonia spike in the first few weeks followed by a nitrite spike (which is also harmful to the fish). This total takes about two months. The BB colonies consist of bacterial colonies that take care of ammonia and nitrite. Cycling This article explains the cycles better than I can right now. It is also accompanied by charts.


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## bettalover06 (Mar 19, 2012)

*Oranda's 30G tank*

I've been monitoring my tank which is 4 days old today, by doing water check every other day, as I've read somewhere on this forum. 

My results: 

*As of 5/14* 
pH 7.6 ; Ammonia 0.50ppm ; Nitrite 0.25ppm ; Nitrate 0ppm

*Today: 05/16*
pH 7.6 ; Ammonia 0.50ppm ; Nitrite 0.50ppm ; Nitrate 0ppm 

1) Is this a time to do 50% WC, or monitor for 2 more days?


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## thekoimaiden (Oct 19, 2011)

Time to do a water change immediately!!! Change 50% of the water any time either ammonia or nitrite reads more than 0.25 ppm.


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## bettalover06 (Mar 19, 2012)

Thanks again Izzy for reply. But I was worried so I did 80-90% WC hopefully I did not destroy the BB  I will continue to monitor water. Thanks again for all your help


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## thekoimaiden (Oct 19, 2011)

I love helping people with goldfish! It's no problem for me. Tamyu had a great idea for large water changes. Take out about 90% of the water, fill the tanks, and then remove another 90% of the water. This amounts to roughly a 95% water change. This is basically an emergency measure, like if you find the ammonia or nitrite is at 1 ppm.


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## LeroyTheBetta (Dec 18, 2010)

Hi all... haven't posted for a while here, but just wanted to make a comment about oxygenating the water.

The bubbles from an airstone do not actually oxygenate the water. Oxygen transfer only happens at the surface, so you actually need your water to circulate so that water below the surface reaches the top to pick up oxygen.

What bubbles from an airstone do is sort of push a tiny column of water up to the surface with each bubble. So, it helps the water become oxygenated this way.... sort of circulating it, but the bubbles it makes don't actually add oxygen to the water.

Circulation is the key.  

And good luck with your orandas! I've got 6 goldfish, one is a blue oranda named Mr. Slate ..... he's the baby of the bunch right now, but will outgrow them all!

Julie (I need to redo my siggy line..... so plain signature for now)


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