# The truth about BettaFix medicine?



## Mal72 (Jan 7, 2013)

Hello everyone, I have posted earlier about my 3 y/o VT named Flare. He has been diagnosed with Fin Rot, so I have been taking necessary steps to try and cure him. I moved him from his 5 gallon to a 1 gallon so I could better administer the proper medications. His tank is currently 80 degrees and I have been keeping it very dark (towel around it). I have been giving him 100% water changes every 4-5 days and always check the balances before putting him back in the water (after a 20 minute adjustment). I use regular tap water and put Stress coat in it, as well. I feed my boys and my girl (2-3 New Life Spectrum pellets, twice a day or freeze dried as treats, but I recently got Frozen Brine Shrimp. I am going to try that today since Flare has not eaten anything else for a week. I asked a friend who has a Masters in Marine Biology what I should give him to treat the fin rot and he recommended BettaFix, but said that I should try to feed him first and then treat him. I asked a vet at Petsmart and she said the same, then I looked at reviews on the product and they were mostly positive. But when I came on here, I discovered that one person had used BettaFix and lost their fish. I have called all of the pet stores in my area and none of them carry the proper antibiotics. I understand that I have both Flare's age and his lack of appetite working against me, but I have grown very attached to this fish and want to try to save him. I haven't opened the BettaFix yet, but I don't know what else to do. Please help!!!! 

*He looks so miserable in this picture, but I wanted to show how much his color has faded...


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## callistra (Jun 29, 2010)

Bettafix isn't going to touch this. In a 1g while he is sick I would do 50% every other day and 100% weekly. Some people say even more. The minimum is twice weekly and that's for healthy fish.

I don't know what else to tell you other than the info I have already given on your other thread.. http://www.bettafish.com/showthread.php?t=125246 Which was to stabilize temps, keep clean water, and find antibiotics..


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## Mal72 (Jan 7, 2013)

callistra said:


> Bettafix isn't going to touch this. In a 1g while he is sick I would do 50% every other day and 100% weekly. Some people say even more. The minimum is twice weekly and that's for healthy fish.
> 
> I don't know what else to tell you other than the info I have already given on your other thread.. http://www.bettafish.com/showthread.php?t=125246 Which was to stabilize temps, keep clean water, and find antibiotics..


I don't mean to keep asking and being annoying :/ I asked the local petstores about Kanaplex and they all looked at me like I was crazy. I'm not sure what else I can use--that I don't have to order online; since I don't know how long it would take to get.


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## callistra (Jun 29, 2010)

You're not annoying, I just don't know what else to add 

Where are you located?

Try yellowpages.com and call anything that comes up for "aquarium" "fish" or "pet".


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## Mal72 (Jan 7, 2013)

callistra said:


> You're not annoying, I just don't know what else to add
> 
> Where are you located?
> 
> Try yellowpages.com and call anything that comes up for "aquarium" "fish" or "pet".


I live in Saint Augustine, Florida. I'll be sure to check it out. 

I'm wondering if I should try aquarium salt and then order Kanaplex via Amazon? I'm planning on giving him a 100% water change today and I'm hoping that he will eat some Brine Shrimp.


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## callistra (Jun 29, 2010)

I don't think AQ is going to touch this, but it won't hurt him for a short time.

You can also try Maracyn Plus.. Furan 2 maybe


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## Oldfishlady (Mar 1, 2010)

Sadly, he may be aging out and not a lot can be done-with that said, you don't want to give up too soon either-especially since he has a special place in your heart.

What I would recommend at this point-Epsom salt (_Not aquarium salt_) and heavy tannins-either IAL or naturally dried and fallen from the tree Oak leaf.

I would keep him in the 1gal with half the water removed-no filter or water movement, water temp in the 77-78F range-cover the top with plastic veggie wrap to retain heat/humidity for the labyrinth organ. Add either a crushed IAL or 4-5 crushed Oak leaves to the tank-then using a small cup half full with hot dechlorinated water add 2tsp of Epsom salt to dissolve-_the hot water will make it dissolve faster_-Once dissolved-fill it up with some of the tank water-then over the next 30min add the Epsom salt.

Turn off the light, cover the tank to provide a dim lit quiet location. Offer small amounts of food and remove uneaten. If you have access to live mosquito larva-offer a couple rinse and see if that will stimulate his feeding response.

Premix some treatment water in a 1gal jug of dechlorinated water-Add 3tsp/gal Epsom salt and the tannin source-IAL 1 large crushed/gal or Oak leaf-20 crushed per gallon.
Use this premixed treatment water for 50% water changes every other day to every 3 days-leaving him in the tank for the water changes.

Good luck and keep us posted....


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## Mal72 (Jan 7, 2013)

Oldfishlady said:


> Sadly, he may be aging out and not a lot can be done-with that said, you don't want to give up too soon either-especially since he has a special place in your heart.
> 
> What I would recommend at this point-Epsom salt (_Not aquarium salt_) and heavy tannins-either IAL or naturally dried and fallen from the tree Oak leaf.
> 
> ...


Does it matter what type of Oak Leaves that I use? I have two Black oak trees in my yard.


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## Oldfishlady (Mar 1, 2010)

The only difference between species of tree I have seen-is the color of tannins...I have/use about 6 different species of oak tree- with one being-what we call blackjack oak-not sure it that is the same one you are calling black oak-haven't had any problems with any species.


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## OmegaHaze (Jan 16, 2013)

I recommend fishpharmacy.com I believe that the right address. You talk to a live person who is knowledged in fish and medications and can order the right stuff and have it shipped to your house. its worth a try if you dont want to use the betta fix


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## Mal72 (Jan 7, 2013)

Oldfishlady said:


> The only difference between species of tree I have seen-is the color of tannins...I have/use about 6 different species of oak tree- with one being-what we call blackjack oak-not sure it that is the same one you are calling black oak-haven't had any problems with any species.


 
Black and BlackJack Oak are one and the same--after looking them up. I have a Live Oak in my yard, as well. So you just crush the leaves and put them directly into the water?


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## Oldfishlady (Mar 1, 2010)

When I use Oak leaf tannins for medication-I will use a 1gal jug with dechlorinated water and add 20 more or less-crushed Oak leaves and allow them to steep for at least 30min so they can start releasing the tannins. Then I will do a gradual acclimation with the premixed tannin water.

The longer they steep-the more tannins released-the darker the water-the better the Betta likes it. The tannins can change the water chemistry and especially with a compromised fish-you want to do a slow or gradual acclimation when you first start using them and with larger water changes.

I have found with a compromised Betta in a QT for treatment using premixed treatment water-That 50% daily to every other day is all that is needed to maintain water quality. By using premixed treatment water you have more control and can provide the therapeutic dosage when making partial water changes.

I don't worry about the leaf bit that fall into the water with the Betta-often they will use these leaf bits for cover-to help make them feel more secure in a bare QT container-as well as the microorganism that can sometimes colonize on them-the Betta will pick at them for added nutrition.

I collect-naturally dried and fallen from the tree-Oak leaves-I don't rinse them, but I may shake off any extra debris.
Since Oak leaf tannin are a natural product-you can't overdose them.

To use as a general tonic-you can add them whole to the tank itself, however, when making a large water change-it is best to have the replacement water tanned before use to avoid pH shock-Long term the tannins can lower the pH.

Both IAL(_Indian almond leaf_) and Oak leaf tannins are 99% alike chemically-long term use can toughen fins/scales, contain antibacterial/fungal properties, ease stress and can lower pH.

How is your Betta doing-any changes....


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## Mal72 (Jan 7, 2013)

Oldfishlady said:


> When I use Oak leaf tannins for medication-I will use a 1gal jug with dechlorinated water and add 20 more or less-crushed Oak leaves and allow them to steep for at least 30min so they can start releasing the tannins. Then I will do a gradual acclimation with the premixed tannin water.
> 
> The longer they steep-the more tannins released-the darker the water-the better the Betta likes it. The tannins can change the water chemistry and especially with a compromised fish-you want to do a slow or gradual acclimation when you first start using them and with larger water changes.
> 
> ...


 
Thank you OFL! Omega, I will definitely check out the website, so I can have antiobiotics on standby for the future!

I've been keeping him pretty quiet lately, since I know stress would only make his condition worse. I left him completely alone (obviously checked on him) yesterday to see if he improved. He seems to be a little bit more alert today, than he was yesterday, so I might try feeding him some of the Frozen Brine Shrimp, as Callistra suggested. While feeding him, I'll allow the Oak leaves to seep. My hope is that eating will help him feel better since he has refused all other types of food for the past 7 days. My fingers are still crossed for this old boy, thank you for asking!!!


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## Mal72 (Jan 7, 2013)

Flare ATE everybody. I put him in a small 1/2 container and tried for 1 hour to hand feed him brine shrimp after trying to chum up the water with the 'juices' (yuck!) and he very enthusiastically ate two brine shrimp!!!!! He did not eat anymore, but that was a start! I'm so happy. He actually chased my finger around!!! I have the Oak Leaves seeping and I'm about to change his water, so I hope that he will continue to improve.


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## callistra (Jun 29, 2010)

That's awesome! Very happy to hear 

Let us know how the oak leaves go.. very interested in it.


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## Mal72 (Jan 7, 2013)

callistra said:


> That's awesome! Very happy to hear
> 
> Let us know how the oak leaves go.. very interested in it.


 
I will! Thank you for the suggestion to use frozen brine shrimp! That's the most action I've seen from him since he got older. I have him acclimating in a bag in the water now. The leaves mixture made the water look like a weak tea, but I guess that's okay. And I followed the directions exactly with the Epsom salt. So...fingers crossed. He is actually swimming now in the bag, so the shrimp must've livened him up a bit! :-D

*One of my friends asked me why I didn't just flush him down the toilet and get a new fish. I guess they just don't understand how much I have grown to care about him and how much I want his last days to be as happy as possible. I did take half of their suggestion though....I did get a new fish today. 4 Bettas, 1 dog, no boyfriend. Yeehaw. Lol.


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## Mal72 (Jan 7, 2013)

Unfortunately I do not have good news today. I was encouraged yesterday by his willingness to eat and he was also willing to eat--after some coaxing today. But I noticed his appearance had changed so I move him to a clear cup, so that I could better see his appearance (since the water is pretty dark.) It appears that his scales are slightly raised and his eyes are a bit more bugged out than usual. His stomach is also bloated....It seems that he may have Dropsy now....

What should I do? 

I don't want to think about Clove Oil, but if his organs are failing.....


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## Mal72 (Jan 7, 2013)

Mal72 said:


> Unfortunately I do not have good news today. I was encouraged yesterday by his willingness to eat and he was also willing to eat--after some coaxing today. But I noticed his appearance had changed so I move him to a clear cup, so that I could better see his appearance (since the water is pretty dark.) It appears that his scales are slightly raised and his eyes are a bit more bugged out than usual. His stomach is also bloated....It seems that he may have Dropsy now....
> 
> What should I do?
> 
> I don't want to think about Clove Oil, but if his organs are failing.....


 
I guess I want to know if I should continue with the Epsom Salt/Oak Leaves remedy and for how long? He has his age working against him...I know that.


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## Mal72 (Jan 7, 2013)

Oldfishlady said:


> When I use Oak leaf tannins for medication-I will use a 1gal jug with dechlorinated water and add 20 more or less-crushed Oak leaves and allow them to steep for at least 30min so they can start releasing the tannins. Then I will do a gradual acclimation with the premixed tannin water.
> 
> The longer they steep-the more tannins released-the darker the water-the better the Betta likes it. The tannins can change the water chemistry and especially with a compromised fish-you want to do a slow or gradual acclimation when you first start using them and with larger water changes.
> 
> ...


He's showing signs of Full-blown Dropsy now--pineconing scales and protruding eyes. Not sure if he will be able to pull through because of his age, but I'm going to continue to treat him. I am trying to stay busy by making the NPT for my boys--otherwise I'll just be crying like crazy. Even my mom got emotional when she came over--she knows how much he means to me. The only positive is that he has been eating the brine shrimp over the past few days--after hours of handfeeding.


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## Oldfishlady (Mar 1, 2010)

Dang, sorry she is not getting better, however, sadly, when they age out along with other issue-very little we can do except to make them comfy. The loss of a pet is never easy-but keep your chin up.....


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## Mal72 (Jan 7, 2013)

Oldfishlady said:


> Dang, sorry she is not getting better, however, sadly, when they age out along with other issue-very little we can do except to make them comfy. The loss of a pet is never easy-but keep your chin up.....


Hey Everyone, I just wanted to give you an update. Flare has passed away. I figured after seeing the symptoms of Dropsy, that he would not have lived much longer. In his final hours, I was able to feed him and his tank stayed very warm. He did not show any signs of struggle, so I trust that he went peacefully. It's sad to think that he is dead, but I hated seeing him in pain, too. Never being one to flush a fish down the toilet, I put him in a jar, put his name and years (Date I bought him to day he died) on it, and buried him next to my other pets. I put lilly petals in the grave around him. I just wanted to take a picture of his jar to have...I already went out and bought another one, a halfmoon, but he is not red. I am thinking; however, that I may get a Flare the 2nd one day because he was very special to me. Thank you to everyone for all of their suggestions and sticking with me on this! :-?


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## MattsBettas (Dec 18, 2012)

I have never seen a case of fin rot that aquarium sals can't touch, sorry Callistra. Read this article- http://bettasplendid.weebly.com/fin-rot-101.html


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## MattsBettas (Dec 18, 2012)

Oops! I should probably read every page! Rip flare!


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## callistra (Jun 29, 2010)

I have seen many _many_ cases of fin rot that aquarium salt can't touch. Not all bacteria is highly sensitive to salt. Sorry you haven't heard of bacteria which cannot be destroyed with salt.. Just because you've never heard of it, doesn't mean it doesn't exist. 

Mal72, very sorry for your loss


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## Mal72 (Jan 7, 2013)

callistra said:


> I have seen many _many_ cases of fin rot that aquarium salt can't touch. Not all bacteria is highly sensitive to salt. Sorry you haven't heard of bacteria which cannot be destroyed with salt.. Just because you've never heard of it, doesn't mean it doesn't exist.
> 
> Mal72, very sorry for your loss


Thanks Callistra and Matt, I'm glad he is not suffering anymore, but I am always going to miss him and his cranky little attitude! I am doing pretty well holding myself together today.


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