# 2 for 2 (dead)



## my dead bettas (May 3, 2010)

Here is my story (I'll keep it short)

Went to the local pet store and picked up a small tank, gravel, water treatment, food, heater and food. When I got home (too late), I realized I did everything wrong. I went back and purchased a 5 gallon tank. I treated the water (tap water)and did the whole water temp acclimation (set heater and water was 76-78) with the fish. The fish lasted about 6 hours before he died.

The next day I went to another store and spoke to a few employees and told them my story. They said "you are doing everything right" so we chalked that one up as a sick fish. I bought a few more things (decorations and fake plants), I exchanged the heater for a better one and another fish. He looked very healthy at home but that only lasted a few hours. Soon he was very lethargic and staying on top. When I got home today, he was dead and so where 4 apple snails I bought yesterday. 

I tested the water with some of those strips and everything looks fine (are they not accurate?). 

Water was at 78 degrees... Not sure what to do!

I refuse to buy another fish until this is figured out and my daughters are heartbroken. Please help.

Here are some pictures:


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## Oldfishlady (Mar 1, 2010)

Sorry you are having so much trouble......

What kind of dechlorinator are you using and how much?
Any other additives used

IMO it is something about your water or a contamination of some type for the fish and snails to die that fast

How did you clean everything before you put it all together and how long was it set up before you put livestock in it.

Even with the strips...can you post the numbers for ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, pH if you have them for both your tank water and source water.


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## my dead bettas (May 3, 2010)

Thanks for the quick reply. I'll provide as much info as I have now.

I used Aqueon. it said to use 1 teaspoon per gallon. No other additives were used.

The tank was only set up for a few hours before I added the first fish. A day or so by the time I added the snails and second fish.

I cleaned everything with warm water (no soap).

I'll test the water later today and post a picture of the results.

Thanks again.


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## Kittles (Feb 8, 2010)

I agree with OFL. Something funky is lurking in your water and it's either coming from something in your tank, or from the water source itself. Where do you get your water? You should test your water before and after you condition it to see if it's high in ammonia or anything which your conditioner may or may not mask, or neutralize, or whatever. Maybe it's got some hard metals in it. 

Does your tank have a hood? If not, were any aerosols sprayed near, or over the tank that could have found their way in? 

Lastly, I'm going to assume you washed things before you placed them in the tank - including the gravel. If so, did you wash with soap? That's a no no, right there, because it leaves harmful residue on anything it touches. Hot water only. EDIT - well you've ruled this out, thankfully!

Otherwise, I really don't know. It sounds like you've been doing everything properly. 

EDIT - I'd also like to mention that no, the strips aren't usually too accurate. I'm not sure how the pet stores test customer's water, but they might be able to give a more accurate reading. And for free, usually. If you're going to invest in water testing supplies, I'd go with a liquid testing kit such as the API master kit. They're much more reliable.


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## bettalover2033 (Feb 17, 2010)

well the testing strips are very inaccurate and will basically lie to you. other than that i have no other idea and my advice it just to test the water for pneumonia nitrite nitrate levels at your local pet store...maybe he will do the test for no charge or may be he will ask for a very little amount of pay.


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## Oldfishlady (Mar 1, 2010)

Just trying to rule every thing out here....

Anything on your hand like lotion, soap, perfume etc.....
All items in the tank aquarium items....nothing from around the house or yard
Gravel rinsed well..sometimes this can get contaminated at the shop
Any funny or odd smells
Nothing accidentally fell in the tank
No chemicals close by

You may want to tear the tank down and clean well with vinegar......


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## Mister Sparkle (Apr 13, 2010)

Your table looks very well-polished and dust-free. Any chance you use Pledge on it?


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## my dead bettas (May 3, 2010)

Mister Sparkle said:


> Your table looks very well-polished and dust-free. Any chance you use Pledge on it?


That was before, I was very careful when setting it up (no sprays or anything like that).

Pic of the test strip will be up soon


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## my dead bettas (May 3, 2010)

Sorry for the bad pictures. I should have used a different background.

Before the dip









after 30 seconds



























after 60 seconds


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## Kittles (Feb 8, 2010)

I could be blind, but I don't see any test for ammonia which is probably the most important.


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## FuulieQ (Jan 10, 2010)

Hmm, that's the same kind of test strips that I use. Although I have doubts as to their accuracy. If I were you I'd probably get the liquid tests, although they are expensive it seems like it would be a good investment.


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## Sella (Mar 21, 2010)

Tests strips vary in accuracy for everything except maybe pH.

And the fish were bought from the same store or two different stores?


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## my dead bettas (May 3, 2010)

different stores.

What is cycling and should I do it?

Please let me know.


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## LolaQuigs (Mar 28, 2010)

Cycling is basically breeding beneficial bacteria that will consume the ammonia your fish produce, making the parameters of the tank generally more stable and reducing how often you need to do water changes. Small tanks usually won't hold a cycle but your 5 gallon will be fine. You will, however, need a filter if you don't have one.

Cycling is not a requirement as long as you do very frequent water changes but it is highly recommended. Here is a helpful link that explains cycling more in depth than I can, and tells you how to cycle your tank.


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## Mitsufishi (Jul 1, 2009)

If maybe there is absolutley nothing that was in the water before the first fish, you couldve very well bought a sick fish. Then adding the 2nd and the snails into the same water he couldnt contracted water the other fish had. Maybe?!


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## Zenandra (Nov 14, 2009)

Mitsufishi makes a good point. Did you clean the tank after the first fish passed before adding the new ones? 

Its very possible that there may be something in your water that is bad for the fish that isn't even tested on those strips. Do you have down water or well water? 

I would wash the whole tank, decorations everything with a bleach solution (9 parts water 1 part bleach) then rinse with HOT water. The wash again with vinegar, rinse again with HOT water and then let air dry for a couple days.

Then try again, I would try maybe using some RO water or something, or find another source of water besides wherever you get your water from and see if it makes a difference! 

Good luck!


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## Mitsufishi (Jul 1, 2009)

Mitsufishi said:


> If maybe there is absolutley nothing that was in the water before the first fish, you couldve very well bought a sick fish. Then adding the 2nd and the snails into the same water he couldve contracted whatever the other fish had. Maybe?!


\WHOA Where is the edit button?

^ i fixed the quote!


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## my dead bettas (May 3, 2010)

Thanks for all the tips. I'll try again this weekend.


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## Tomsk (Mar 4, 2010)

Hi,
I was just looking through the various posts on the forum and saw your pics,Do you have a filter for your tank?


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## my dead bettas (May 3, 2010)

Tomsk said:


> Hi,
> I was just looking through the various posts on the forum and saw your pics,Do you have a filter for your tank?


No filter at this time. I have one that I can set up but I thought one was not needed.


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## Kittles (Feb 8, 2010)

One isn't unless you're cycling.


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## MauiFishForever (May 2, 2010)

you should get something to test the ammonia with...


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## my dead bettas (May 3, 2010)

is there a recommended product?


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## my dead bettas (May 3, 2010)

I am trying again. Everything cleaned and this time I purchased an Ammonia test kit.

Just added the water treatment and will wait till tomorrow to add the fish. Wish me luck.


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## Kittles (Feb 8, 2010)

Luck: wished.


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## Heat (May 8, 2010)

Maybe buy fish from another store...???


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## my dead bettas (May 3, 2010)

so my tap water has Ammonia...I'll have to get something to fix that.










Here is the new little guy waiting to go in


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

I would recommend using Prime water conditioner. My tap water has ammonia in it, too and I started using Prime.It neutralizes ammonia.


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## xxabc (Feb 1, 2010)

But it only neutralizes for 24 hours. 

I have ammonia in my tap water too. However, my tank is perfectly cycled and so before the 24 hours is up, all ammonia levels have been brought down to 0ppm and I have nothing to worry about. You, on the other hand (if you decide not to cycle for whatever reason) may either have to 1) do daily water changes using Prime or any conditioner that neutralizes ammonia, or 2) get another source of water that is ammonia-less.


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## SilverCaracal (May 9, 2010)

are you acclimating your bettas? they could be dying from shock of the climate change. you should slowly mix the water u have in ur tank with the water the fish is in right now


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## my dead bettas (May 3, 2010)

I cannot get rid of the ammonia... I have treated the water twice to no avail. I am using Top Fin Ammonia Remover. For now the little guy is still in the Petsmart bowl. I did a water change yesterday (using spring water) and he seems to be doing well. 

I'd hate to do this but I am considering downgrading to a 2.5 gallon tank so I can afford the weekly (bottled) water changes.


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## Kittles (Feb 8, 2010)

I think you should try to cycle the tank you have now! Is it a five or ten gallon? If you're able to do this, you'll be able to neutralize the ammonia in your tap water (it will still show up on your tests, though*) long enough for your cycle to convert it to nitrite which then, in turn, gets converted to nitrate. That would handle your ammonia problem nicely, methinks. There's also Seachem Prime water conditioner that neutralizes ammonia, but I'm not sure how long, or how people use that in uncycled tanks, because eventually it becomes toxic again, right? I have no ammonia in my water, so I really don't know how people get around it :<

*You say it still shows up on your tests after treatment, but that's because even after the ammonia is reduced to ammonium it is still detectable. The difference is that ammonium is not harmful to your fish (I think), but the problem is that it doesn't remain in this state forever and will eventually go back to ammonia (I think).


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## my dead bettas (May 3, 2010)

I have a 5 gallon tank. And yes, my test still finds ammonia present but it may be the ammonium you are talking about. I'd just hate to loose another fish to this. I already lost two (hence my screen name).


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## xxabc (Feb 1, 2010)

I have ammonia in my tap water. I use Seachem Prime to detoxify it for 24 hours. Before the 24 hours are up however, because my tank is cycled, all the ammonia/ammonium levels go to 0. This is why you should cycle the 5 gallon tank. It'll be lovely. 

If you're willing to, just use your tap water and do daily changes (all within 24 hours of each other) with any conditioner that detoxifies ammonia. It should be okay and your tank should be cycling if you carry it out long enough.


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## Titus Flame (May 15, 2010)

I used to have a hex tank that leaked plastic poison or something...over 5 fish met thier death in thier before i tossed it.


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