# What kinds of goldfish do you have?



## PaintingPintos (Dec 27, 2011)

I can't be sure if this is JUST for tropical fish, but I'm sure some of you have some!
I have 2 baby goldfish in a 10 gallon tank, and I'm moving them up to a 30 gallon tank in a couple of months!
I have a MEGAFAT albino Pearlscale goldfish (Thank God I can see into her throat because she got a pea stuck in there once and I had to fish-Heimlich it out xD), named Pearl, and a gorgeous matte-black-turning-gold-belly-colored Black Moor goldfish with a LOT of personality! He's growing at superfast rates... when I bought him it was a pity purchase because it was the same group of Moors and Fantails I had chosed Pearl from 2 months ago and his belly was only 1/4 inch wide and his fins were all nipped! His name is Houston (Houston, we have a problem...)
Tell us about your goldfishies!


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## Fishguy2727 (Dec 22, 2011)

Upgrade now, they need it. Keeping them in a 10 gallon for a week or two while you setup a larger tank is one thing, but not for a couple months. These guys grow very fast and need more space than that already. 

What is your water changes schedule? 
What is the nitrate concentration? 
What are you feeding? 

I have a black moor, ranchu, calico telescope, oranda, and two ryukins right now. I have had many other goldfish over the years.


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## PaintingPintos (Dec 27, 2011)

Fishguy2727 said:


> Upgrade now, they need it. Keeping them in a 10 gallon for a week or two while you setup a larger tank is one thing, but not for a couple months. These guys grow very fast and need more space than that already.
> 
> What is your water changes schedule?
> What is the nitrate concentration?
> ...


 
They seem fine. They're both only 2 inches long and I've done this same thing before and my fish lived 8 years (6 months in a 10 gallon, the rest in a 40 gallon) until I gave them to my aunt who wanted them in her pond. I change 50% of the water every week... the nitrates? God, I have no idea. I have a lot of Anacharis in there, and also some mystery plant that is growing rapidly and I have to keep trimming it. My fish are fine though, I check the ammonia every other day, and I keep it under 1 by using ammonia-clearer when needed. I honestly know a lot about goldfish and they're doing f-i-n-e. I know what I'm doing


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## Fishguy2727 (Dec 22, 2011)

They will look fine for years in low quality water. They should be A LOT larger than that by now, indicating that the water quality is stunting them (amplified by the tank size). These are fish that can live for 20-40 years or more, so even five to ten years doesn't really prove anything. Not even one goldfish should be in a ten gallon, let alone two. I have had some of mine for only 2-3 months now and all are at least tennis ball size for body alone, not even counting fins. So yes, yours are stunted and their tank and care need to be improved. Obviously it is not so bad that it is causing immediate harm (they aren't sick) but it is the long term that we need to focus on. 

The nitrate concentration will tell you if you are doing enough water changes (which is likely not the case) but with live plants that will be skewed because they will remove the nitrate but not all the other things that build up over time (growth inhibiting hormones, dissolved organic compounds, etc.). 

There is obviously way too much waste in that tank if the tank still can't cycle and balance out. If it did you would not ever detect any ammonia. The fact that this is not the case shows that there is something definitely off with the tank and there will be problems sooner or later. 

Please understand that I am saying this for the best interest of the fish. It is not against you for any reason, it is only said in the best interest of the fish.


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## PaintingPintos (Dec 27, 2011)

Fishguy2727 said:


> They will look fine for years in low quality water. They should be A LOT larger than that by now, indicating that the water quality is stunting them (amplified by the tank size). These are fish that can live for 20-40 years or more, so even five to ten years doesn't really prove anything. Not even one goldfish should be in a ten gallon, let alone two. I have had some of mine for only 2-3 months now and all are at least tennis ball size for body alone, not even counting fins. So yes, yours are stunted and their tank and care need to be improved. Obviously it is not so bad that it is causing immediate harm (they aren't sick) but it is the long term that we need to focus on.
> 
> The nitrate concentration will tell you if you are doing enough water changes (which is likely not the case) but with live plants that will be skewed because they will remove the nitrate but not all the other things that build up over time (growth inhibiting hormones, dissolved organic compounds, etc.).
> 
> ...


 I see. O.O I'll heed your warnings and not be stubborn and get a bigger tank, etc


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## PaintingPintos (Dec 27, 2011)

Fishguy2727 said:


> They will look fine for years in low quality water. They should be A LOT larger than that by now, indicating that the water quality is stunting them (amplified by the tank size). These are fish that can live for 20-40 years or more, so even five to ten years doesn't really prove anything. Not even one goldfish should be in a ten gallon, let alone two. I have had some of mine for only 2-3 months now and all are at least tennis ball size for body alone, not even counting fins. So yes, yours are stunted and their tank and care need to be improved. Obviously it is not so bad that it is causing immediate harm (they aren't sick) but it is the long term that we need to focus on.
> 
> The nitrate concentration will tell you if you are doing enough water changes (which is likely not the case) but with live plants that will be skewed because they will remove the nitrate but not all the other things that build up over time (growth inhibiting hormones, dissolved organic compounds, etc.).
> 
> ...


I see what you mean now. I was a lil stubborn if you noticed O.O


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## thekoimaiden (Oct 19, 2011)

Glad to see there are other goldy keepers here. I have a ryukin and a veiltail in a 55 gal. They're about 5 years old. I had some swim bladder problems with both for a while until I switch away from commercial food. I make them gel food now, and they get all kinds of fresh goodies. Oranges and zucchini are their favorites. Spinach and green peas are kinda meh, but they will eat them after a few nibbles. 

I would love to add one more to the mix, but I haven't found the right fish. I'm thinking maybe panda moor or redcap oranda. But I'm still not sold on the whole wan/popeye thing.


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## Fishguy2727 (Dec 22, 2011)

Sometimes stubborn is good. I have learned some of the most important things in this hobby by disagreeing, which requires others to share more information. 

Have you tried New Life Spectrum? It is sinking and since feeding that exclusively I have not had any issues with buoyancy problems. I don't even have to supplement with peas or anything.


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## thekoimaiden (Oct 19, 2011)

I haven't tried NLS, but I want to switch all of my fish (betta, goldies, and loaches) over to their feed eventually. I just live in a one-horse town with only a Petsmart. Hopefully I'll be making a trip to a place that has a) better fish selection and b) better food selection in the near future.


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## Fishguy2727 (Dec 22, 2011)

I would just get it online. It is good to support local places, but if they aren't there it is harder. You can get it from many sources online with great shipping rates.


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## Ridewithme38 (Oct 16, 2011)

I use this stuff to feed my goldfish

GoldfishConnection.com - Pro-Gold

Whats everyone's thoughts on this?


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## thekoimaiden (Oct 19, 2011)

Fishguy2727 said:


> I would just get it online. It is good to support local places, but if they aren't there it is harder. You can get it from many sources online with great shipping rates.


That is going to be my next step if I can't find it at my favorite LFS. It's about 50 minutes away; I'll be going there after I tally up my expensive and gifts from Christmas



Ridewithme38 said:


> I use this stuff to feed my goldfish
> 
> GoldfishConnection.com - Pro-Gold
> 
> Whats everyone's thoughts on this?


That's another commercial food I've heard good things about. If you're not seeing any swim bladder issues or long white stringy poop, then you've got a pretty good staple diet for your fish. Something I learned in dealing with my guys bloatyness is that all goldfish are different. What works for one might not work for another. It's a matter of finding what works for your fish.


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## GreenTea (Jan 31, 2011)

I just have one common goldfish who's 10 years old in a 20 gallon with two platys.


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

I'm not getting any more goldfish or carp-like fish. Too much controversy over how big they get, how fast they get that size etc. I've read things by experts whom I greatly respect saying 20g is fine as a minimum (with bigger is better always being recommended) for egg-bodied goldfish and other people with just as much legitimacy saying no, it's not. Since I don't know who to believe, I'll just uh, walk away from all the pretty goldfish that are oh so tempting. *grabs a ryukin and runs for it*


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## GreenTea (Jan 31, 2011)

Yeah, water quality is always what's important. For my goldfish, my sister got him as a feeder when she was 6, so I guess he's actually 12, and he just ended up living past a few days like we thought he would so we kept him!


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## Fishguy2727 (Dec 22, 2011)

They all get big. Think of all the round-bodied goldfish as long-bodied goldfish who were smashed to be shorter, they can still weigh about the same. 

Most people do consider the 20+10 guide to be the most accurate. 20 gallons for one and an additional 10 gallons for every additional goldfish. They are schoolers though so this really puts them in a 75 as the ideal minimum, housing a school of 6 (which is what my tank is, plus the zebra danios and platies). I wouldn't want to keep one alone. Since they are social/schoolers at the bare minimum they should have one friend. So I would consider the minimum to be 30 for two. 

I think the difference comes from once you see them in larger tanks it is hard to imagine cramming them into a smaller tank. When you see fancy goldfish cruising around a 150 it is hard to imagine cramming them into a 75. When you see them cruising around a 220 it is hard to imagine cramming them into a 220. Bigger is always better, but for fancy goldfish the 20+10 guide seems to be the most accurate if you do adequate water changes.


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

Oh how I wish I had room for that big of a tank. Hey, how many bottles of Prime do you think it would take to dechlorinate a small swimming pool? Just kidding of course, but since no one swims anymore, it's a pity the pool can't be turned into a giant goldfish pond.

Fishguy, what temp do you keep your goldfish? I know danios can withstand pretty cold temps but actually, I didn't think any other fish were really suited to be tankmates for goldfish. I was thinking of trying white cloud minnows with my baby koi but was told he'd eat them. 

And thanks for all the info and the verification on tank size.


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## Fishguy2727 (Dec 22, 2011)

First of all goldfish are not coldwater fish, they are eurythermal meaning they can thrive in a very wide temp range. They are native to the tropics as well as subtropical areas. They are naturalized in almost every body of water all of our other tropical fish come from. 

Second most of the time the temp difference between room temp (goldfish) and tropical is 4-6 degrees F, not a big difference for many fish. 

Third, there are many fish that are considered tropical that are actually from cooler waters. All of the following are fine at room temp: platy, guppy, molly, swordtail, zebra danio and all variants (leopard, blue, gold, glofish, longfin varieties of all of these), white clouds (normal, gold, and longfins), bristlenose pleco, Siamese algae eater, and many more. 

For accurate information on actual wild temp for a species you should check fishbase.org. It is used and maintained by scientists so it is a lot more accurate than the hobbyist sites that just regurgitate what the last hobbyist site said.


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

So a 37g would be okay for 2 fancies? Looking to fill it after my koi is rehomed. Not sure if I'm going with goldies or cichlids.

EDIT: Ah, you posted just before me.

Thank you for all the clarification and info. You're an awesome help.


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## thekoimaiden (Oct 19, 2011)

Sakura8 said:


> Oh how I wish I had room for that big of a tank. Hey, how many bottles of Prime do you think it would take to dechlorinate a small swimming pool? Just kidding of course, but since no one swims anymore, it's a pity the pool can't be turned into a giant goldfish pond.


I've seen it done before! This guy did it and has some nice pictures to go along with it. Erik’s Swimming Pool to Pond Conversion | kilk.com It looks like a huge project, but the results are amazing. Now if you can just convince the rest of the family...


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## Sakura8 (May 12, 2011)

Oh now that is just awesome! It's a Doughboy pool, but round. That's really neat. Don't know if my dad would buy into that or not . . . hmmm.


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## BettaMiah (Sep 12, 2011)

I have a Common Goldie named Beau.


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## Luimeril (Dec 29, 2010)

i had two recently. last year, i picked up what they called a 'babydoll black moor'. she was a black moor, but didn't have the google eyes. cutie. named her Mister Wiggles. had been watching her grow from a cute little gal, to a beautiful young lady at the pet store, and picked her up on a whim one day. then, found out she was a she. xD name stuck, though. made the mistake of listening to pet store employees, who said two could fit in a 10. :T got her a boyfriend, a calico oranda named Swimmy. they were best pals. wish i'd have researched on my own, though. :T


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