# A few questions about raising fry



## Lyssa89 (Dec 16, 2010)

I have a spawn that is about 2 days old now, this is my second time breeding my bettas, the first time my male ended up eating the fry. So I am trying again and I had a few questions:

1. For some reason both times my fry didn't hang in the bubble nest after hatching, will this harm my fry in any way?
2. How early can I safely remove the male so he won't eat the fry this time?
3. Is there any food I can feed my fry initially that doesn't take a month to grow? (I was going to feed BBS but after do some more research I've read that you should feed BBS when the fry are 7-10 days old.)

Thanks!


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## leeb62 (Oct 22, 2010)

If your male betta is going to eat the fry you can remove him as soon as they are done spawning and just put in a airline with a airstone and tie the a knot in the line so that less bubbles is created. The movement stops some eggs from getting fungus. You don't need to lower the water or anything or move the eggs to a different container. You can try hard boil eggs just google that online. The fry doesn't need to stay near the nest but if the male is kept with them he will usually find them and put them back into the nest. They can survive without the nest.


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## Dragonlady (Nov 29, 2010)

Lyssa89 said:


> ....3. Is there any food I can feed my fry initially that doesn't take a month to grow? (I was going to feed BBS but after do some more research I've read that you should feed BBS when the fry are 7-10 days old.)
> 
> Thanks!


If you use egg yolk, be careful to only add a very very small amount or it will pollute the water quickly. Many betta fry are capable of eating just hatched BBS at about 3-4 days old, but some fry will be smaller and need infusoria for the first week. Some breeders use vinegar eels for the first week, but it may lead to missing ventral fins.


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## Lyssa89 (Dec 16, 2010)

Alright cool!

I removed the male, The eggs have hatched already and I have some fry trying to swim around already. I did read about giving them egg, I read you hard boil an egg and mix the yolk with water, should the mix be really watery or thicker than that? Or does it matter? 

Also when do you suggest doing my first water change?


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## Oldfishlady (Mar 1, 2010)

When Betta fry first hatch they will live off their yolk sac for the first 72 hours and will not need any added food and depending on the spawning setup you may or may not have natural live foods in the tank for free range feeding for a few more days to a week or so-once the Betta fry absorb their yolk sac, offering newly hatch BBS that are roughly less than 12 hours of age will supply the needed nutrition to the Betta fry-you need to have at least two hatcheries going 8-12 hours apart to supply the Betta fry with the needed live food and nutrition if BBS is the only live food you plan to feed.....

Depending on your spawning set up and type of food you offer you may not need to make any water changes until the Betta fry are about 2 weeks old-sometimes, not always- you can kill the fry with too much care if feeding live foods-when feeding eggs yolk or processed food that can pollute the water quickly-the fry tank will need more water change just to remove the decaying foods so not to cause problems/health issues.

Monitoring the nitrate levels is a good idea and keep them less than 10ppm-high nitrates can stunt growth and affect immune response and low water volume can cause high levels of stunting hormone that can cause the smaller fry to stop growing so the larger fry can use them for nutrition...natural selection process, however, I encourage this, others do not, my goal is quality not quantity and I start to move larger fry to other tanks at 2 weeks due to rapid growth and development related to good nutrition and water quality in my setups

I spawn Bettas using a more natural method-soil based tank, lot of live active growing plants, common snail, RCS, oak leaf and full to the top with water 10g tank-I don't add any live food until after the first 7-10 days after free swimming stage, no water changes anymore (I did at one time) no filtration, sometimes I remove the male right after spawn if he is a known egg/fry eater, day of hatch or the day after that.... up to one month to 3 months depending on the male-some I even leave the female in to get multi spawn-I have eggs that hatch after being on the floor from spawn day, artificial hatch in a small cup, eggs moved with an eyedropper to another tank with another spawning male to tend to when I have a known egg eater...all with success.....it varies from spawn to spawn and male to male.....

Lots and lots of different methods to spawn, feed, water change...sometimes you have to tweak things as you go and with each male as you find out what they can and/or will do......


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## Lyssa89 (Dec 16, 2010)

Ok, I have another question haha. When the yolk sac is gone will the white spot be completely gone? The fry are about 3 days old now and I still have no horizontal swimmers and everyone still has a yolk sac. Could I be doing something wrong? I'm going to carefully change the water today because I tested it yesterday and my nitrates were really high.

P.S. Thank you guys sooooo much.


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## Oldfishlady (Mar 1, 2010)

What is your nitrate reading-I would be careful making a water change at this stage....what kind of testing products are you using? strips or liquid reagent?
What is your water temp?


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## Lyssa89 (Dec 16, 2010)

I used the strips and the reading was between 160 and 200 ppm. The temp is around 73 F. Should I just add more water because right now I have a 10 gallon filled halfway.


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## Oldfishlady (Mar 1, 2010)

I would get your water temp up slowly to about 79-80F-the cooler the water the slower the fry will develop and cold water can sometimes stunt them if not cause them to die....73 is really too cold......I would slowly add more water to dilute the nitrate-the strip are great for a quick check, however, I wouldn't trust the numbers to be accurate and unless you have some type of filter running the nitrate reading my be from some other cause....have you checked your source water for nitrates...


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## Lyssa89 (Dec 16, 2010)

Okay you are a genius. I tested my source water and the nitrate reading was about 30 ppm. Is that an acceptable reading for source water? If not 
is there a water conditioner or something I can use to bring that level down?

I'm going to switch heaters right now I am using one that can't be adjusted for some reason.


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## Dragonlady (Nov 29, 2010)

A lower water temperature is probably why the betta fry are not free swimming yet. The lower the water temperature, the slower the bettas metabolism tends to be.


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## MrVampire181 (May 12, 2009)

I had a cooler water spawn and it took days for them to hatch and become free swimming...never did that again


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## Oldfishlady (Mar 1, 2010)

Are you using the strips on the source water too, if so that may not be an accurate reading and if you are in the US-I think-not a 100% sure-but 30ppm nitrate in the city water supply is not acceptable-are you city water or well water-this can make a difference too...they do have nitrate removers but I have never used them or know that much about them...live plants can also help with nitrate issues as well, however, you will need to set-up a storage water type system complete with lights and live active growing plants to use for water changes

If you are city water supply-go to your city water web-site and find out what is acceptable nitrate numbers-you can also get other information related to treatment of your source water-sometimes they even have a place that you can ask questions a forum type area-not all of the water supply company offer this but some do

Also, if you have some way to test your water using the liquid reagent testers would give you more accurate numbers for both the tank and source water...some fish shop will test for you for free-but find out their testing methods and get numbers...don't accept "Fine" or "okay"...you want numbers....

I think your biggest problem with the fry at this point is water temp related-I think once you get that fixed you will see a more normal development in them...stable and correct water temp is really important for this species for normal growth and development


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## Lyssa89 (Dec 16, 2010)

I think my fry may have died  I'm going to watch for the tank for movement but I don't have high hopes. 

I was using the strips on our well water. 

Could you give me a more detailed description of your fry tank? I really want to do it the right way next time and I would love to try the soil bottom tank with live plants.


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## Oldfishlady (Mar 1, 2010)

Sorry about your fry..dang...better luck next time......

NPT or natural planted tank soil bases have worked great for me, however, to safely use them for spawning and fry rearing they need to be mature and this can take 3-6 months-you have to have the right lights or supplemented with sunlight, lots and lots of stem plants 70-80% of the floor planted, 10-20% floating plants-adding trumpet snails are helpful as well-once the plants are actively growing and the soil has started its life underwater and is alive.....your ready to go.......do some research, at least a 10g to start, resource for plants and get started....several folks here keep NPT and we would be happy to help......


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## Lyssa89 (Dec 16, 2010)

Cool, I think once I'm done my internship for school and I have more time and money I'll probably go the NPT route. If I decide to breed before then and My well water tests the same with liquid reagent as the strips should I try using spring water instead of my well water?


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## Oldfishlady (Mar 1, 2010)

I would get a liquid reagent type water test products and test your well water-if you live in a farming area, heavy industrial areas- you may be seeing leaching of ferts/chemicals in your water or no rains or lots of rain can sometimes change well water.....

Not all spring water/bottle water are created equal-some can just be filtered tap water that contains chlorine/chloriamine and due to the filtering process it may lack the needed mineral for fish health and/or strong fry growth and development.....and it can get expensive when you need to start making lots of water changes....RO water is good and usually pretty cheap at most fish shop that also deal with saltwater fish-you will need to add some of the lost mineral back with additives however

Honestly-I don't think it is so much of a water problem with your fry as it was water temp related....get a good adjustable heater to maintain proper/stable temp and try again......


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## Lyssa89 (Dec 16, 2010)

Okay, thanks for all of your help!!


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