# Calling all dirted tank owners.



## Galilea (Jan 6, 2015)

I posted this to a different forum, but I thought I would post here too to get more opinions.

I am dirting two 5.5 gallon tanks and I'm having a hard time choosing the proper dirt. I know Miracle Gro Organic potting soil was one that was used by many, but it seems it has been discontinued and amazon is charging more than I want to spend.

I was looking at Miracle Gro Nature's Care Natural and Organic Potting Mix with Water Conserve, but it has perlite which I've read is a pain in the butt in a tank. I was wondering what you guys think of the Miracle Grow Nature's Care Organic raised bed soil?

The label reads:
This product is formulated from (one or more of the following: peat, processed forest products, and/or compost), and (sphagnum peat moss and/or coir), poultry litter, alfalfa meal, kelp meal, and earthworm castings.
Guaranteed analysis:
Total Nitrogen (N) - 0.09%
Available Phosphate (P2O5) - 0.08%
Soluble Potash (K20) - 0.09%
Calcium (Ca) - 0.02%
Derived from poultry litter, alfalfa meal, kelp meal, and earthworm castings.
*This product contains 0.054% slowly available nitrogen (N) from poultry litter, alfalfa meal, and kelp meal.

Any thoughts on if this is safe to use in my tank?
I have hard water (GH of 12 degrees or 140-200ppm, KH of 5 degrees or 50-100 ppm, and a pH of 8.2) the last time I checked so I'm not really worried about the softening effects of the peat moss unless someone has a reason that I should be.


----------



## Kadington (Apr 14, 2016)

I don't really own a dirted tank, technically my co2 tank has 'dirt' but it's really highly processed stuff from fluval. I've ready a lot about dirt tanks as I was considering doing one myself. You want to stick with a organic potting mix soil over any other soil, it will have more the the stuff that aquarium plants need and other planting mixes. Honestlym look up Vigoro organics potting mix. I've heard a lot of good stuff about that one vs some of the other soils out there. I know Aquarpros uses it all the time.

The problem however with using dirt is the fact all soil, because of the nitrogen, cause ammonia spikes. You will have to cycle the tank for longer and you will have to keep a close eye on it after you add fish. Also there is the fact that any disturbance of the substrate will cause the water to fog up quickly. It really can't hurt the fish in most cases but it's unsightly and you won't be able to see into your tank for a good few hours or in larger tanks sometimes a day or two. So don't be someone who has to move a plant and you can't really gravel vac the soil. It'll cause a cloud like before and you'll be sending all that soil down your drain. That is why it's important to cap soil. I'm not telling you this to scare you off soil, but you should really know what you are getting into.


----------



## Galilea (Jan 6, 2015)

Thanks for the suggestion and the warning.

I have CaribSea Tahitian moon sand that I was going to use as a cap. I read that someone also used a soil retainer in-between the dirt and their cap layer, so I thought about doing that too since I'm a college student and move twice a year.


----------



## Rainbo (Nov 23, 2015)

Galilea said:


> Thanks for the suggestion and the warning.
> 
> I have CaribSea Tahitian moon sand that I was going to use as a cap. I read that someone also used a soil retainer in-between the dirt and their cap layer, so I thought about doing that too since I'm a college student and move twice a year.



Since you are moving twice a year I'd skip the dirt. The idea behind a NPT is that you are developing a self sustaining eco-system, Bacteria in the soil breaks down organic material that the plants and livestock produce, and the plants utilize the broken down material, the plants provide oxygen for the fish and food for things like snails and shrimp. When done correctly everything is working in tandem with everything else, and should be nearly self sustaining. If you have to tear it down then you will be destroying the balance, and defeating the purpose of a NPT.


----------



## Galilea (Jan 6, 2015)

Rainbo said:


> Since you are moving twice a year I'd skip the dirt. The idea behind a NPT is that you are developing a self sustaining eco-system, Bacteria in the soil breaks down organic material that the plants and livestock produce, and the plants utilize the broken down material, the plants provide oxygen for the fish and food for things like snails and shrimp. When done correctly everything is working in tandem with everything else, and should be nearly self sustaining. If you have to tear it down then you will be destroying the balance, and defeating the purpose of a NPT.


Ok, this is what I needed to know. I wasn't sure if I could do a NPT or if I would have to wait due to moving. I don't completely tear the tank down when I move, I usually just remove 75% of the water (keeping enough to keep the substrate wet), spray the plants with water and then keep plastic over them so they don't dry out in the move (they remain in the tank as well, I don't pull them up). I never move more than an hour away so everything gets set back up same day. I wasn't sure if that would allow me to keep a NPT or if even doing that would mess everything up.


----------



## sabrinah (Jan 2, 2015)

I have a 20 gallon dirted tank with miracle gro organic choice and a tahitian moon sand cap. I don't recommend it if you'll have to move twice a year, or if you're fond of moving around plants in the tank. With moving the tank you risk the substrate sliding, cracking, etc. and dirt could escape out of the cap, which makes an absolute mess. If you're confident you could make the moves without disturbing the substrate in any way go ahead and try, but be aware that it could easily become a disaster.


----------



## Galilea (Jan 6, 2015)

sabrinah said:


> I have a 20 gallon dirted tank with miracle gro organic choice and a tahitian moon sand cap. I don't recommend it if you'll have to move twice a year, or if you're fond of moving around plants in the tank. With moving the tank you risk the substrate sliding, cracking, etc. and dirt could escape out of the cap, which makes an absolute mess. If you're confident you could make the moves without disturbing the substrate in any way go ahead and try, but be aware that it could easily become a disaster.


You're right! I didn't think about it sliding and breaking the cap. Ok, I'll just stick with the Tahitian moon sand and some silk plants until I get more settled and can do a NPT proper.

I was thinking of getting the finex stingray light for the tank. Do you think I'll have an algae problem if I get that light with no real plants in the tank?


----------



## Rainbo (Nov 23, 2015)

You could use something like this Freshwater Planted Aquarium Care:Eco-Complete Plant Substrate and have plants. It should be fairly easy to move with if you empty as much of the water as possible before the move and cover the plants to keep them from drying out. It won't matter if the substrate gets stirred up a bit since it won't need a cap.

When you get settled after collage, and are done with the moving, you can convert the tanks to soil substrate if you still want to try it.


----------



## Galilea (Jan 6, 2015)

I actually started out with EcoComplete and was having troubles with the leaves of my plants turning yellow and the plants not growing. My water parameters were coming out fine and I was dosing with SeaChem Flourish so I'm not sure what the problem was. Maybe my light (Finnex Planted+ 24/7) was too strong or my water is too hard for the plants to take up nutrients.

My parameters as of last week (before I moved) was:
pH = 8.2
Ammonia = 0ppm
Nitrite = 0ppm
Nitrate = 5.0ppm
Phosphate = 0.25 or 0.5 ppm
KH = 5 degrees or 50-100ppm
GH = 12 degrees or 140-200 ppm

I had a few java fern plantlets, four anubias, a few springs of bacopa, and two amazon swords in there with root tabs and iron rabs since they were in the moon sand. The swords were not dead but they were not looking good and not growing. The anubias had a hole in the leaf and had some yellowing. The java ferns were a really light green and not growing. The bacopa had been in there for months and had not grown at all.
I was also having an algae problem (probably because of the strong light and not enough plants).

I thought that I would have better luck if I put real soil in the tank and got the lower powered Finnex stingray lights.


----------

