# Can my fancy betta make koi offspring?



## Lamb (Jul 9, 2013)

I was wondering if there is a way to breed my fancy dragon boy (Hydrus) to produce koi offspring. Or are fancy betta concidered koi? I'd love to produce the more obvious koi pattern/colors. What kind of female would I need? I currently have a sibling of his that I was planning to breed him to, but I just LOVE the koi and have became a bit obsessed with them and would love to produce some myself. 
Here is the breeders picture of him:
View attachment 173698

Any ideas???


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## Lamb (Jul 9, 2013)

I have several different females, but I can invest in another!


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## sixcards (Jun 11, 2013)

From my understanding you need two koi's to produce koi. But hoping somebody else corrects me if I'm wrong.


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## Lamb (Jul 9, 2013)

Dang. I was looking up what constitutes as fancy, and I guess there are different patterns of fancy which includes the koi pattern... I was hoping I could make some with my fancy guy. I don't know what pattern he would be, I'm guessing just marble? It's hard to categorize him.


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## Fenghuang (Dec 28, 2012)

I don't think your guy constitutes as a fancy betta. From what I see, "fancies" are generally marbles with 3+ colours. Your betta is more like a pineapple butterfly dragon, although the butterfly pattern isn't that clean.


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## Lamb (Jul 9, 2013)

So his cello and black edging doesn't count in his colors?


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## Fenghuang (Dec 28, 2012)

Where's the cello? Do you mean the clear part of his fins? That would be the part of his butterfly pattern. A cellophane is entirely colourless all over. As for the black edging, no, that wouldn't really count into his pattern.


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## Lamb (Jul 9, 2013)

I thought fancies are 3 or more colors. I'm just trying to be clear because I bought him as a fancy... and that he was a orange, marble fancy. I spent a good deal on him, and want to know what to ask the breeder that sold him to me. I was unaware that cello was considered completely clear. 

So clear, black, and orange doesn't count as 3 colors present on him?


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## Fenghuang (Dec 28, 2012)

Imo, a fancy means different things to different people, but all the ones I've seen are multicoloured marbles. He doesn't look like he has three colours to me. 

Here, this was an old thread that discussed fancies: http://www.bettafish.com/showthread.php?t=127782&highlight=Fancy


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## Lamb (Jul 9, 2013)

Thank you! I'm going to bring it up to the breeder. .. he assured me he was show quality and a fancy marble. .. I spent $50 on him and then express shipping since he was a splurge. I hope you're right! Myates did comment that he didn't need much work though I'm terms of form. So at least I have that. .. though I feel a bit crushed.*I guess if he's a nothing like you say then I can experiment with colors.


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## Darth (Nov 19, 2012)

Fancy is a word the breeders use to say "Mutt" it can have anything in the background...Koi are out of the marbles but, if you breed 2 koi you wont get that in F1 you will see Cambodian, butterfly, cellophane and bicolors a sibling cross will give you some, it is usually solids spawned to marble to see anything in F1....depending on the background how the marble gen expresses is trial and error.
The fish you show is a mix, it is a blue and orange dragon..this is the whole problem with mixing fish the breeders are getting away from the important solid lines to breed fish that catch the eye....so...you can see the importance of breeding solids, heck they are worth more now than ever.....If you want to persue Koi, I would get one expressing the pattern and avoid spawning to yellow because it will eliminate the red, avoid spaning to Cambodian or light bodied fish unless you want the black reduced..If I were going to persue Koi, I would get a red female and spawn to a Koi patterned betta Koi as a color is Black, White and usually red...so...you can also use a superblack female because she will also produce a multitude of colors in the F1.
I would not use Dragon in this mix.


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## Lamb (Jul 9, 2013)

Thank you, a bit unfortunate, but thank you both. I'm emailing the breeder now. I was expecting him to be marble (fancy) and paid probably more than I should have. Fortunately I bought him on ebay, so I can open a case if need be.

I do have a red male... though I'm not sure what female to use. A black marble female?

View attachment 173810


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## sixcards (Jun 11, 2013)

@Darth, So at which gen could you breed koi with koi? I want to also produce koi. So, very interested what you think.


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