# My female was barred and ready to breed (i thought) then she just lost her bars, why?



## tmariexo922 (Apr 19, 2009)

I am new at attempting to breed bettas so i'm certain my initial set up wasn't ideal... I have a red female (sasha) and a blue/red crowntail (chico) that have been going at each other thru the breeding box for 3 days. i released the female on day 3 and she instantly barred (plus her fat belly and ovipostor were protruding) and seemed to take interest (stopped running and hung around the nest) after he took a couple nips at her. i thought i was going to have success but, she seemed to lose interest (relay racing against her reflection on the glass) and started darting around tank and soon her bars faded...what could have happened? what does that mean of my female, is she not a good breeding female?


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

Were the bars horizontal or vertical?


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## tmariexo922 (Apr 19, 2009)

yea i guess that would make a huge difference. they were vertical bars.


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

Vertical means that she was ready for breeding. I have no idea why she lost interest.


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## tmariexo922 (Apr 19, 2009)

ok, well thank you anyways for taking the time to reply.


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

No problem. Were they both conditioned before you tried to breed them? What size is your breeding tank?


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## tmariexo922 (Apr 19, 2009)

I'm going to blame it on me because i think i kind of rushed things. Trial and error....i have others that i will try once i get my tank set up correctly. i dont believe i conditioned them properly either...however it is that you do that. i have a 10 gal tank, by the way. and since i've got you. i wanted to put a filtration device in the tank so that when i do have fry i wont risk complications by adding more water. which means i'll have to fill the tank to compensate the filter...does it matter how far from the bottom the nest is? ive been using a styrofoam cup afloat as a nesting medium


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

I have never bred bettas myself but I have a book that tells about it. It says you can use a 10 gallon but a bigger tank is easier to keep clean.Fill it to a depth of 6 inches with dechlorinated water. Condition th male and female separately for 2 weeks, feeding them foods like live blackworms, frozen bloodworms or live brine shrimp. I don't really know anything about filters because I don't use any but I would assume that you could use one turned down low and putting pantyhose or something over the intake to keep the fry from getting sucked in.


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## tmariexo922 (Apr 19, 2009)

im glad you mentioned the pantyhose thing. sounds like a good idea. what does your book say about the female recovering from bites? what ive read says that its not a good idea to remove the female from the warmer breeding tank because her bites might become infected. i dont see any physical damage other than what he did to her fins but in sure he got her elsewhere too. does your book say when she is ok to be moved?
I cant wait to get this breeding thing off the ground...i'll make sure i give detailed info about my trials and errors and more importantly what works.


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

Do you have them seperated now? The book just says that after breeding, to put her back in her own tank, keep her temperature around 80 degrees but doesn't say what to treat her with if she has bite wounds. I have a bottle of BettaFix and it says it can be used for wounds caused by fighting.


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## tmariexo922 (Apr 19, 2009)

they are separated by a breeding box and he seems to not be as interested as he was previously. i rekon as long as the temp is the same she'll be okay but i wonder how long she has to stay @ that temp before i can let the water get back to room temp. im goin to the library tomorrow to see if i have any luck finding good resources.


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

Do you have a separate tank/bowl for her with a heater? I think she'll be ok in the breeding box until you can get her into a heated container of her own.Again, I don't have any personal experience so I don't know if it would be ok to put her in water that is just room temperature or not. Looking it up is a great idea. People on this forum are really big on researching before breeding.


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## tmariexo922 (Apr 19, 2009)

*She was definately ready to breed...*

so...i separated my male and female and concluded it was a failure...i woke up, said g'morning, fed them and to my surprise i notice that my female has now expelled all her eggs in her tank and they are now lying on the bed of her tank....what a tease. haha...maybe i should have left them together one more day, what'd u think??


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

Thats too bad that she released her eggs. I don't know if leaving her in there one more day would make a difference or not. Oh well, you can always try again.


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## Chicklet (Feb 9, 2009)

The Water needs to be set at a constant 80F.
You will need a 10 gallon as the breeding tank and place the female in the middle. 

Betta's natural matting environment is usually in brown water,
There is something in the water called tannins it sets the mating mood,
To get this in your water u can purchase "Indian Almond Leaves", But this can be hard to come by,
So you can use a tea bag to brown the water and to produce the tannins. 

You also want to cut a styrafoam cup in half, from top to bottom not center around and put it on top of the water.
Then tape to the wall to prevent it from floating around the tank, you want it secure, This is to keep the bubble nest in place and make the male feel more secure with his nest.
If your going to use a filter use a sponge one and keep the current very low as to not disturb the nest.

Also to promote matting it sometimes helps to lower the water to about 6-8 inches, Of course this removes the chance of any filter being used.

If nothing happens after a couple of weeks try using another female.

Remember in a Betta's natural environment the water is shallow and still,
the male has to make a bubble nest before you even think of releasing her otherwise your just looking at a death match between the two.

Make sure your female is in a confined area like a vase, chimney, or a bottle and place it in the center of the tank. 
The male needs constant sight of the female, he will strut his stuff and work on his nest, back and forth he will go, 
If you use a divider this won't work so good as she can go to the opposite wall and discourages the male, He needs her up close and personal.

When You see the vertical strips appear on the female and her "pearl" is protruding out of her belly then she's ready.

Make sure there is a hiding place for the female, There is going to ba alot of harassing by the male and she will need a place to retreat and get a break, 
This will go on for hours and you need to sit and watch the entire time or you risk loosing everything... Also make sure your female is much smaller then your male, He needs to be dominate not her, plus he needs to be able to wrap himself around here to release the eggs & spawn.
Be expected of the female to get ripped and nipped alot, Thats totally normal.

If the female *looses her strips *and its been gone for an hour take her out and keep her in the bottle for another 3 days and try again.
You gotta have lots of patients if your gonna try spawning betta's

Once the spawning is complete remove the female promptly as the male will see her as a threat to the nest, If you don't remove her quickly you risk loosing her and the bubble nest getting destroyed...


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## tmariexo922 (Apr 19, 2009)

Thank you, that was very helpful to me. with all that being said...how do i go about water changes and adding water when the fry hatch? 6 in. doesnt seem like enough...i also have live plants and snails in this 10 gal tank. oh and i have a Tetra Whisper In-Tank Filter (with the biobag), if you know anything about filters...will that stir up the water too much, i haven't set it up yet. by the way...how long have you been breeding bettas?


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## Nataku (Feb 22, 2009)

Six inches is how shallow it needs to be when the fry hatch because they are small, and it is difficult for them to get from the bottom of the tank (where they will spend a lot of time lying around for the first week or so) up to the top of the tank to breathe. If the water is too deep they will not be able to make it to the surface without tiring out, so they just won't, their labyrinth organs won't properly develop, and they will die. After around five to six weeks you will be able to start raising the water level back up until the tank is full.
And yes, this doesn't leave much space for the fry until then - hence why a 20 gallon long is often more recommended for breeding. It will still give the fry a lot more room even when the water depth is only six 
inches.

Water changes - verrrryyyyy carefully. And a lot of it with a turkey baster. Baby bettas seem to have some strange fascination with the tip of a suction tube or a turkey baster, so you must be very careful when cleaning the tank, as normally once a fry gets sucked up, you can pretty much write it off as dead, they are generally too traumatized after that to live. Also bear in mind the fry aren't really strong swimmers, so they can't fight against the pull of the suction tube very well.

Can't say I' use those filters, so I have no idea how much flow they create. But you will want as minimal a current as you can get when dealing with the fry, adult bettas don't fare well in a current, baby bettas are even worse.


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## crowntail lover (Apr 25, 2009)

What is the styro foam cup used for??? tp keep the nest together or?


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

The styrofoam cup is used for the male to build his nest under.


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## crowntail lover (Apr 25, 2009)

Thats what I was thinking. 
But my book said nothing about this.....so...
I will still use this


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## crowntail lover (Apr 25, 2009)

Female has bars and pearl. Male has bubble nest under cup....He is harassing and swimming with her...Still havent wrapped around..


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

It may take awhile. Keep watching them.


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## crowntail lover (Apr 25, 2009)

The have wrapped many many times. But she still has her pearl and bars and a swolllen belly of eggs.....


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