# Question about Tetra Safestart



## RoxieStClaire (Aug 24, 2012)

How do I actually use it? The directions on the bottle say to just pour the whole thing in, and it treats up to 15 gallons. That's all well and good, except my tank is only 5 gallons. *So I need to know how much I should be adding*. Does it mean it just starts to be ineffective in a tank bigger than 15 gal. and I should still add in the whole thing anyway, or should I just use 1/3 of the bottle?

After 3 failed attempts at getting a fishless cycle to work, I'm deciding to once again start over but with a fish-in cycle this time, so I don't want to use too much and end up killing my fish. So I guess *I should also ask how long I should wait to add my fish after adding in the Safestart?*


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## sarahspins (Sep 5, 2012)

Add the whole thing. Everything I've ready says that it works best if you use twice as much as the bottle says to use.

I used about a quarter of the larger 8+oz bottle (for 75 gallons) doing a fish-in cycle in my 6.6 gallon tank.. by my math that was enough to treat 18+ gallons and that tank has completed it's cycle in 8 days from adding the SafeStart (reading 0 ammonia two days in a row, 0 nitrites and 5ppm nitrates). I have a 10g tank that got a similar dose and it's almost fully cycled doing a fishless cycle, but it's not heated and I think that slowed it down a bit.


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## RoxieStClaire (Aug 24, 2012)

Ah! Thank you, I went ahead and just dumped the whole thing in there, so I guess I'll try the fishless cycle again since everything I've read about safestart says it cycles quicker that way. Hopefully this will finally work!


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## sarahspins (Sep 5, 2012)

Oh, I should also add that my 6.6 was cycling without extra help for a little over 2 weeks before I added the SafeStart.. I think if you can add it and add a decent amount of ammonia (not over 4ppm) and keep the water warmer than you normally would it will speed up the cycle process a lot


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## RoxieStClaire (Aug 24, 2012)

Ok, got the ammonia to 2.0ppm and I'm not gonna risk adding more right now, so hopefully that will work!


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## Hallyx (Jun 11, 2011)

I'm following this thread with much interest. Please keep it updated.

Aeration is important. Bacteria love oxygen. (airstone, sponge filter, waterfall) Extra warmth is good. Dark, too. 

Using the whole bottle sounds like a good idea for fishless. Ammonia at 2.0ppm sounds right.


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## RoxieStClaire (Aug 24, 2012)

Update: 

I should probably tell everyone what all I did yesterday when I restarted everything. I decided to restart the cycle mostly because I remembered that I tried to do a fish in cycle with Tudor before I noticed he was sick (he was only in there for a day, so I don't think cycling had anything to do with it), and since he died of some unknown cause I didn't want to risk the new fish catching it (no matter how small a chance it may be) so I emptied the tank and disinfected everything with vinegar and swapped out the old filter cartridge and sponge. I should probably mention its a 5 gallon tank.

I added gravel, some live plants, and a moss ball along with the decorations, and set the heater to 82 degrees (I'm not sure how high I can keep the temp with the plants, so I'm starting lower than I would have without plants until I figure out the safe range). I put in 10 drops of Prime, and then I put in about 8-9 drops of pure ammonia. Did a water test for ammonia right away and it came back at 2.0ppm.

Last night I did a water test before bed:

Ammonia: 4.0 ppm (probably rose because it hadn't fully saturated the water when I did the first test)
Nitrite: 0ppm
Nitrate: 0ppm

This afternoon I tested it again:

Ammonia: 2.0ppm
Nitrite: 0ppm
Nitrate: 15-20ppm (it was right in between 10 and 20 on the color chart)

Not sure if I just plain missed the nitrite spike or if its skewed because I used prime (told myself I wasn't going to add any yet, and then found myself adding it anyway out of habit), either way this seems quite promising!


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## RoxieStClaire (Aug 24, 2012)

*Update Day 3*

Did another water test today:

Ammonia: 0.75ppm
Nitrite: 0ppm
Nitrate: 30ppm

Gonna add a few drops of ammonia, but I'm pretty sure I'm getting close now! Can't wait for this thing to finish cycling!


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## Hallyx (Jun 11, 2011)

That's amazing progress for only three days. Do a 50% change if/when the nitrate gets >40ppm.

I wonder why you don't get nitrite readings. Maybe something to do with the Safestart?

Nice job, Roxie. Keep us updated.


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## RoxieStClaire (Aug 24, 2012)

Hallyx said:


> That's amazing progress for only three days. Do a 50% change if/when the nitrate gets >40ppm.
> 
> I wonder why you don't get nitrite readings. Maybe something to do with the Safestart?
> 
> Nice job, Roxie. Keep us updated.


I think maybe the nitrite has more to do with the fact that I put in SeaChem Prime at the very start. I've heard that it can sometimes skew ammonia and nitrite readings because its supposed to convert it to a less toxic but still usable form. Its either that or the fact that the test tube I use for the Nitrite test is... Leaky. If I shake it too hard I end up losing half the sample. I think maybe next test I'll try using the one I have reserved for pH, since I haven't used that one yet and hope its not as leaky.

Then again, I do have a lot of live plants in there for the size of the tank.


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## Hallyx (Jun 11, 2011)

I know Prime converts ammonia into harmless ammonium, but I never heard of it doing anything to nitrites. Maybe someone reading this knows?

Live plants will keep nitrate down. Not much for nitrite. With lots of plants, you may never get >40ppm nitrate. That's good, too.


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## RoxieStClaire (Aug 24, 2012)

Hmmmm. I think maybe before bed I'll try the other test tube to see if its because the sample keeps leaking out when I shake the tube. I can never shake it for the full 30 seconds the instructions say to do without losing most of it, so that might be why I can't get a reading.


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## RoxieStClaire (Aug 24, 2012)

*Day 4*

Yesterday after my water test I added enough ammonia to bring it JUST up to 2.0ppm (3 drops total).

Today's result:
Ammonia: About 1.5ppm
Nitrite: 0ppm
Nitrate: 40ppm

I'm about to do a partial water change and I'm crossing my fingers hoping that won't stall the cycle! I've waited too long for this! I'm also gonna try to bump up the water temp a little to see if that helps keep things on course.


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## Hallyx (Jun 11, 2011)

There is very little bacteria in the water column. Water changes do not measurable effect the cycle.

Not sure what you mean by a leaky test tube. They should all seal air-tight wit the plastic cap.

Do you have an airstone or waterfall-style (HOB) filter?

I'm amazed that you're generating that much nitrate so soon. Sounds like it's working, though. Good you're being cautious about this. New territory for me, too.


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## RoxieStClaire (Aug 24, 2012)

Ah, when I say they're leaky I mean 2 of the caps/tubes that came with the kit seem to be defective, because the caps just won't sit on the tubes right. The other 2 tubes are fine, but the defective ones just get water EVERYWHERE when I try to shake them, and its definitely from the sample because the water level inside will be substantially lower.

I have a waterfall style, and its been left unbaffled while I cycle.

*Day 5*

After taking out about a gallon of water last night, I didn't add anything else like Prime or ammonia, not until I was sure everything was settled again. Today my levels are:

Ammonia: 0.50ppm
Nitrite: 0ppm
Nitrate: 15ppm

I'm wondering what to do now. Should I just wait until the ammonia goes all the way back down to 0 or should I add enough to bring it back up to 2ppm?


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## sarahspins (Sep 5, 2012)

My nitrite spike in my bucket cycle using SafeStart (filter now moved a 55g tank) lasted less than 24 hours.. I was testing morning and evening (and any other time I just couldn't resist).. it was off the charts (not just purple, but almost a dark maroon) as quickly as it was back to reading 0 again.. and it happened VERY fast, one afternoon/evening I had nitrites off the chart and then in the morning they had dropped a lot, and by lunchtime they were 0. If I had stuck to testing once a day I probably would have missed it.


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## Hallyx (Jun 11, 2011)

Good eye, Sarah. I've had nitrire spikes last a couple of days. I'd forgotten that they can be very fast, too.

Yeah, Roxie. I think it's a good idea to see the ammonia go to 0.0ppm. Change out the nitrate (50%) . Then dose 2.0pppm ammonia again and see what you get.


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## RoxieStClaire (Aug 24, 2012)

*Day 6*

I'm getting pretty excited! Just did my tests for today and came back with:

Ammonia: <0.25ppm
Nitrite: 0ppm
Nitrate: ~10ppm

Since the nitrate fell I'm also taking this as a sign my plants aren't dead, which is fantastic news considering I have issues keeping even land plants alive!

I hope the cycle finishes soon. My new betta keeps staring at the tank with a look in his eyes that says simply:


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## Hallyx (Jun 11, 2011)

When you can dose 1.0ppm ammonia and have it go back to 0.0ppm in 24 hours along with 0.0ppm nitrite and measurable nitrate, you're ready to go. 

Like any day now.


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## RoxieStClaire (Aug 24, 2012)

*Day 9*

So after bringing the ammonia back up to 2.0 two days ago it seems my cycle stalled, because the ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate levels haven't budged since then. 

Ammonia: 2.0ppm
Nitrite: 0ppm
Nitrate: ~10ppm

Not sure what's going on but I hope it sorts itself out soon.


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## Hallyx (Jun 11, 2011)

Nuts! Yeah, that can happen.

I just reread this thread. Your water is warm; you have plenty of aeration; sufficient flow; enough ammonia, hmm.....

Try cutting your ammonia back to 1.0ppm. Keep it dark (I know you have plants, but a couple of days won't hurt). Is your filter on high?


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## RoxieStClaire (Aug 24, 2012)

My filter isn't adjustable, unfortunately, so it is whatever it is, and there's not much I can do to increase flow.

Yeah, since I noticed the cycle starting to slow down I've kept the tank wrapped up in a towel to block out light. 

I think I know what caused it to stall, though. I read on someone's fish keeping blog that suddenly adding too much ammonia at once can create a mini-cycle, so it probably happened when I tried to bring the ammonia back up to 2.0ppm. I'll try taking out enough water to bring it back down tomorrow if it hasn't already started cycling again.


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## RoxieStClaire (Aug 24, 2012)

*Day 10*

Woke up this morning, tested my water and... Nothing magically changed overnight, so my ammonia was still at 2.0ppm *head-desk*. I ended up taking out 2 gallons of water to bring the ammonia back down to 1.0ppm. I also added Prime to the added water this time (since the only other thing I can think of that could have possibly stalled the cycle was NOT adding a conditioner to the gallon I added a few days ago. It dawned on me that my city's water is FULL of chlorine and aging it overnight might not have been enough to neutralize it).

My current levels:

Ammonia: 1.0ppm
Nitrite: 0ppm
Nitrate: Somewhere between 0ppm and 5ppm

I... Don't think I'm going to touch this tank again, aside from testing, until the levels start changing again.


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## Hallyx (Jun 11, 2011)

RoxieStClaire said:


> ......the only other thing I can think of that could have possibly stalled the cycle was NOT adding a conditioner


Whoops!



RoxieStClaire said:


> I... Don't think I'm going to touch this tank again, aside from testing, until the levels start changing again.


Yup.

Keep us apprised, Roxie


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