# Seeing Red: BSE Red VT x BSE Red VT



## hrutan (Jun 25, 2014)

Both parents are true dark red, with the black scale edging (BSE) commonly known as "Pineapple." Chili Pepper, the male, is a rescue from Moonshadow's Betta Rescue. The mother, Elizabeth, was procured from a local pet shop last September. Both are VT.

Elizabeth's form has improved as she has aged, and there is no way for sure to know how good Chili Pepper's form is, due to the fin damage he sustained before being rescued. They are both very, very large and in good health after spawning.

Spawn date: Somewhere around May 29.
Hatch date: Somewhere around May 31.

The pair was rather secretive. I can only guess at the exact spawning and hatching dates.


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## hrutan (Jun 25, 2014)

*2.5 Weeks*

Due to some severe problems with my water, I was unwilling to emotionally invest in this spawn until I was sure that they would live. They have survived 2.5 weeks and experienced such phenomenal growth that I now feel confident posting some pictures.

The pair was bred in RO water, remineralized with Seachem Replenish at 1 cap / 5 gallons, with 1 tablespoon / 5 gallons salt added as a general disease preventative.

Spawn size: Roughly 30. Give or take a few.


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## hrutan (Jun 25, 2014)

This guy is probably the largest in the spawn, although they are all pretty big. Note the difference in pigment between him and a nearby sibling.


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## Zhylis (Nov 4, 2014)

Ooooooo, I'm rather in love with both of them. What a delightful red!


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## hrutan (Jun 25, 2014)

It's interesting that dark red is the type favored for IBC shows, and yet black marks, edging, streaks or spots are faulted. This is part of what led to the practice of crossing red to Cambodian to create the "super red." Dark red is _intense_, much more so than the bright Cambodian-based red. This project's goal is to slowly reduce the black edging without taking the shortcut of crossing to a Cambodian based fish. I have been told that the result may remind the viewer of a strawberry.


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## Sadist (Jan 1, 2015)

They look awesome! I've never seen red with the pineapple scale effect. I'm glad the offspring are doing well with your water issues.


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## hrutan (Jun 25, 2014)

I had to stop using tap water completely. The tap water was so bad, it was killing my fish...everything should be better from here on out.


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## Overprotective Fish Lover (Apr 11, 2015)

Subscribing! I love the dark reds. The lighter shades are nice too but the dark is just so rich looking.


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## hrutan (Jun 25, 2014)

Fryzilla is showing color and isn't even three weeks old...


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## BlueInkFish (Jan 13, 2013)

This will be interesting!


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## Greenapp1es (Dec 4, 2014)

LOL - Fryzilla. He is huge compared to his siblings though.


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## hrutan (Jun 25, 2014)

Hannibal would like to know why he is in prison instead of playing "games" with his siblings like he wants to.

I can see both light and dark colored fry in this spawn, although it is unclear whether I am getting light reds, yellows, or surprise oranges. We will see! 3.5 weeks old.


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## BlueInkFish (Jan 13, 2013)

Cute!!! I really like the deep dark red of the father!


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## Nimble (Aug 31, 2014)

I need to get one of those 'prison' cages for my big kids.


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## hrutan (Jun 25, 2014)

A breeder box. I bought it on Amazon...can't remember how much it was. It was intended for a Molly but my Molly girls are MUCH too big for it.


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## Greenapp1es (Dec 4, 2014)

Lol - he looks so sad in his 'prison.'

I'm guessing the name Hannibal was chosen for - somewhat obvious specific reasons?


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## Sadist (Jan 1, 2015)

Wow, he's so much bigger than the rest!


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## hrutan (Jun 25, 2014)

Greenapp1es said:


> Lol - he looks so sad in his 'prison.'
> 
> I'm guessing the name Hannibal was chosen for - somewhat obvious specific reasons?


He is suspected of certain...dietary preferences, so to speak.

Precocious little fish, too. He will already eat beef heart. And anything else he can get down his gullet.


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## bubblesaurus (Nov 13, 2014)

Haha. Good luck with them! Will be following along.


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## hrutan (Jun 25, 2014)

I was on vacation at the IBC convention, and my niece was taking care of all of my fish and critters. She forgot the beef heart on top of the red tank, and it melted and some leaked in, making the water super cloudy. She called me up in a panic, "What do I do, what do I do?!" so I talked her through a couple of water changes. The water was still cloudy when I got home, but it had cleared up by the next day. I'm guessing the mishap triggered a bacterial bloom.

No casualties from that event. I did lose one to starvation - my niece was not comfortable with the BBS hatcheries, and fed them largely golden pearls. That one must not have accepted the dry food. Unfortunate, but since everyone else is large and healthy, it is what it is. The tiniest and weakest will have to be culled anyway...I simply do not have room.

Hannibal was let loose during the chaos and is now at-large. His brothers and sisters were able to catch up to him in his absence, so he is not grossly larger than the rest any more. I can only tell him apart by his color.


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## hrutan (Jun 25, 2014)

Yay, pictures!

I don't think all of these are going to be red. I could be wrong, but I am starting to suspect some yellows and oranges. That would be interesting.

Say hi to Hannibal!


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## BlueInkFish (Jan 13, 2013)

Hi Hannibal! He's a cute lil' fish!


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## Overprotective Fish Lover (Apr 11, 2015)

*cue baby talk* Awwww! Hi Hannibal! You're a cutie aren't you? Yes you are!


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## Nimble (Aug 31, 2014)

He's an adorable little savage.


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## Tealight03 (Nov 15, 2014)

I can't believe how much bigger he is than his siblings. Is he still in fishy jail?


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## hrutan (Jun 25, 2014)

No, his week in solitary confinement let some of his siblings catch up. He's loose and free now, although he is still larger than the rest. I'm trying to leave them as long as possible before I have to jar him.

Every time I notice him, I am blown away by how rich his color is. REALLY looking forward to seeing him all grown up.


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## Zhylis (Nov 4, 2014)

Oh goodness, Hannibal makes me chuckle. Why, yes, this fillet *is* quite succulent and flaky! He's coloring up so nicely too. I know who I'm rooting for


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## hrutan (Jun 25, 2014)

7/7

It took me a while to get this shot. The thing that drives me crazy about taking photos with my phone is that I don't know what my phone is focusing on...


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## Greenapp1es (Dec 4, 2014)

Wow, that shot was worth it! Beautiful photo! Adorable little squirts!


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## Sadist (Jan 1, 2015)

What an awesome picture! The fish look nice and healthy, too.


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## hrutan (Jun 25, 2014)

I had to jar Hannibal this morning. He had eaten too many golden pearls and was floating around the top of the tank with a perturbed expression on his face. Ah, SBD, my old friend. How I haven't missed you...

**singsong voice* *Looks like _someone _needs help with portion control!

It's a little funny and a little sad that if a fish gets SBD and they sink, they look so sad, but if they float, they tend to look annoyed instead.


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## Greenapp1es (Dec 4, 2014)

Your little glutton. Hopefully being jarred and having his food portioned for him gives him a chance to recover.


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## hrutan (Jun 25, 2014)

I hope so. He's quite a character. It should be okay, since I can watch him... he is of appropriate size to get chopped up adult food, and that makes rationing much easier.


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## Overprotective Fish Lover (Apr 11, 2015)

Uh oh. Looks like he's gonna be part fish, part pig...like my Gabriel. Will you just cut down on his food, or will you fast him a bit to let him clear himself out? Hannibal's gotta learn that his stomach isn't as big as he THINKS it is.


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## bubblesaurus (Nov 13, 2014)

Hope he's feeling better! At least he isn't eating his siblings. Or are they all too young to be doing that yet?


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## hrutan (Jun 25, 2014)

He is called Hannibal for a reason, lol.

He was doing better by the time I got home from work, but I put him to bed with no dinner last night, anyway. He is big and old enough to positively be sexed as male, so I am just going to keep him jarred.  it will keep him safe and allow me to watch how much he is eating, anyway.


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## Tealight03 (Nov 15, 2014)

Poor Hannibal.


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## AukWord (Mar 15, 2015)

hrutan said:


> I hope so. He's quite a character. It should be okay, since I can watch him... he is of appropriate size to get chopped up adult food, and that makes rationing much easier.


So, I'm reading, trying to catch up on everyone's spawn logs, and I get this much of your post read, "...he is of appropriate size to get chopped up," and a sudden noise from outside distracts me. 

I go to investigate said noise, all the while thinking, _Man, that Holly is a real hardazz, she doesn't tolerate misbehavior AT ALL from her fry._ :-D


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## Greenapp1es (Dec 4, 2014)

AukWord said:


> So, I'm reading, trying to catch up on everyone's spawn logs, and I get this much of your post read, "...he is of appropriate size to get chopped up," and a sudden noise from outside distracts me.
> 
> I go to investigate said noise, all the while thinking, _Man, that Holly is a real hardazz, she doesn't tolerate misbehavior AT ALL from her fry._ :-D


LOL

:lol:


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## hrutan (Jun 25, 2014)

Indeed. I do not tolerate any tomfoolery from my fishies. Except the angelfish, who is a spoiled brat and can get away with basically anything he wants.

*sighs* on a more unfortunate note, despite having taken microworms off their diet at two weeks of age, I still have fry missing vents.

GRRR.


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## hrutan (Jun 25, 2014)

I just gave them some frozen rotifers...they were intrigued!

Probably better for younger fry.


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## Greenapp1es (Dec 4, 2014)

Daaawwww


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## Nimble (Aug 31, 2014)

Is Hannibal still bobbing?


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## FinnDublynn (Feb 27, 2015)

I am SO AMUSED by these pictures!! And the conversations!! And OMG they're all so cute!!


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## hrutan (Jun 25, 2014)

Hannibal is swimming (mostly) normal.


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## FinnDublynn (Feb 27, 2015)

I have officially decided that baby betta fishies are in my top 10 favorite baby animals lol


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## hrutan (Jun 25, 2014)

A feast!


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## FinnDublynn (Feb 27, 2015)

FEAST!!!
I'M A PIRANHA!! I LIVE IN THE AM-A-ZON!
*Feast type noises*

This dude's jealous....


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## hrutan (Jun 25, 2014)

Whoa LOL!!


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## FinnDublynn (Feb 27, 2015)

It's early for me, I was called into work early but I had 2 hours to get there. I started drinking my Rockstar and I put on my Doterra Oils for the day.. but I'm still sitting on the couch... I've become a monster LOL.


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## hrutan (Jun 25, 2014)

What! Not the cleanup crew!


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## Greenapp1es (Dec 4, 2014)

LOL - In my head I'm seeing lots of little fishy screams of "NOOOO!!!" as they rush to whatever is left before the massive food vacuum arrives.


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## FinnDublynn (Feb 27, 2015)

Greenapp1es said:


> LOL - In my head I'm seeing lots of little fishy screams of "NOOOO!!!" as they rush to whatever is left before the massive food vacuum arrives.



That's exactly what I was thinking, too lol


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## Nimble (Aug 31, 2014)

What was the pink stuff you gave them? Beef heart?


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## hrutan (Jun 25, 2014)

Frozen seafood mix. Pretty much the same theme, but I used shrimp and cod instead of beef heart and fish. The pink color came from a random can of flakes I threw in.


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## hrutan (Jun 25, 2014)

I am not sure what was going on, here. They seemed to be deep in conversation.

The biggest are at a size where I am comfortable jarring them. I have had such a problem with disease earlier this year that even though my water situation has been resolved, I will be more comfortable with them separated. Plus, I hope to send some of these to show, which means their fins need to not get torn up. Better get them out before they start fighting.

One fish in there appears to be deformed and will have to be culled. Another has what LOOKS like pop eye, except it is actually an inflating bubble -in front- of her** eye. Injury, perhaps? I am going to take her out and put her on antibiotics.

**Sex is arbitrarily chosen. I have no idea if she is male or female. Probably male, actually...


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

Nice spawn log! I have two questions though... How to you make that mix and how often do you have to make it? Also, you can show VT's?


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## hrutan (Jun 25, 2014)

VT males can be shown in IBC shows in the Variations class. In fact, the ONLY way new classes are made is by attendance in Variations. So, showing VT is strongly encouraged if you'd like the tail type to gain official recognition as a show class once more. Classes are created or eliminated all the time. CTPK and EE have trial classes due to breeders' diligence.

I make the seafood mix once every few months. It is fairly simple. Mix a half and half of beef liver, or shrimp, or beef heart, or fish, or whatever other ingredients you like (make sure it is at least half seafood). Debone, devein, cut off all fat and she'll fragments and connective tissue so you have only pure meat, cube it, throw it in a food processor (this WILL burn out a blender) and add enough water that it blends into a smooth goop. You can add fish vitamins or spirulina powder. Once it is blended, add some UNFLAVORED gelatin that has been mixed but not yet set, blend some more, let it get to about the consistency of ketchup. Put it in flat plastic baggies or a tiny ice cube tray, stick it in the fridge, and let it set. After it's set, you can freeze it. Feed by dropping small quantities directly in the tank.


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## Mo (Mar 15, 2012)

Oh that's clol I never knew that, haha so I guess EE's are finally making it lol

And thanks a ton! I might try that when I breed because I'm not sure if VE, MW, pellets and Daphnia is enough


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## hrutan (Jun 25, 2014)

They should start accepting the seafood mix at around 6 weeks.


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## Blackstar00 (Apr 21, 2015)

Any updates on the fry?


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## Akkikumar (Aug 8, 2015)

Nice fry's


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## hrutan (Jun 25, 2014)

Sorry, I do have an update and will try to post pictures when I can.

All the fry that are left are jarred. I have around three males and eight females. Have some pics on my phone, which I will upload as soon as I get the chance.


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## savagebeautymnl (Apr 16, 2015)

Fascinating log. Can't wait to see them turn into finned strawberries!


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## hrutan (Jun 25, 2014)

There we go. Sorry for the delay, my life is insane.


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## Greenapp1es (Dec 4, 2014)

Did our buddy Hannibal make it to jarring? He was such a cutie.


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## Akkikumar (Aug 8, 2015)

Wow your fry's gown up very quickly congrats
Can you please share your Feeding and Water changing schedule so that we can follow the same to grow fry's very quickly 
Thanks


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## hrutan (Jun 25, 2014)

Feeding:
Up to 1 week from hatching, vinegar eels + microworms
From 1 week to 2 weeks, microworms + BBS
From 2 weeks to 4 weeks, BBS + Golden Pearls
5 weeks to jarring, Golden Pearls + Beef heart mix

Water change:
Add water only up to 2 weeks.
After that, 20% water change roughly every 3-4 days.

Things I would do different: I have tossed my microworms. They are rubbish, don't use them. Even stopping at 2 weeks of age I had missing ventrals.

Also, don't just test your source water - test ALL the water. Test your cups, test your water tank if you have one, AND test your source water and tanks.

Hannibal made it to jarring and is doing just fine. I think. After his time in the breeder box, his brothers caught up to him in size and they are all indistinguishable from each other, now.


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