# New to forum (Butterfly half moon and solid red halfmoon)



## Algy (Feb 10, 2011)

Hi everyone, Im new to the forum here and I just recently got into Bettas. Ive known about this fish but never really developed such a strong interest to them that I have now? 

Ive had some before in the past when I was like 10 or 13. Something around there and I thought they were cool but never really payed attention to them. Mainly my dad took care of them as well as his other fishes he had (red tail golden Arowana and some salt water fishes).








But recently I went to a local PETSMART with my sister and her bf and saw these things in those tiny cups.. I thought they looked cool looking and when I went home I just couldnt stop thinking about them. So I decided to search around one day on the internet just to see how they looked and realized there were some pretty looking ones out there. I didnt know there were different patterns and tails types. Knowing this I did more research and came to find out that I wanted a halfmoon butterfly and a crowntail cambodian. 

One day I decided.. Yes Im going to go get a Betta fish and take care of it. So I went to PETCO hoping to find the ones I want but come to find out... PETCO doesnt really carry nice ones like I wanted BUT, I was able to stumble across a really good quality IMO solid red halfmoon male. So I didnt take a second to think and just snatched him and gave him a home. Took him home and named him Knuckles... 

























So far I had him since Feb 3, 2011 and I became so found with these fishes that I ended up wanting to find more. So I ended up getting another halfmoon but a butterfly pattern.. here is Sonic..
















I hope to learn more about this fish and would appreciate anyone that can help me out and caring for my fishes.


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## bettafish15 (Oct 3, 2010)

I'm glad you got bitten by the betta bug! Welcome to the forum! We'd be happy to help you take care of your little guys ^^ Firstly, what size tanks are they in, whats the temperature of their tank water, and are their tanks heated? Do you feed them pellets?


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## Algy (Feb 10, 2011)

bettafish15 said:


> I'm glad you got bitten by the betta bug! Welcome to the forum! We'd be happy to help you take care of your little guys ^^ Firstly, what size tanks are they in, whats the temperature of their tank water, and are their tanks heated? Do you feed them pellets?


They both have a 1/2 gallon size tank each. I know its sorta small for them but according to a lot of people, its a relatively okay size tank and they will do fine in it.. Yeah the bigger the better of course. The temperature for the tanks is usually around 72 to 76ish. No I do not have a heater for the tanks but my room usually stays at that level bc I have a heater. Ive been feeding them hakori bio gold fish food, nutrafin flakes, and frozen brine shrimp. I vary it so they can have different things to eat. I change out the water every 2 to 3 days depending on water quality. 

If everyone is wondering why I dont get them bigger tanks? Well bc Im a busy person in Nursing school and I also work daily at an autoshop as a mechanic/state inspector. So I really dont have the time to change out bigger tanks and clean them. While these 1/2 gallons are a lot easier to clean and faster.

Im sure if I keep up with the water changes, feed them correctly, and keep a good temperature then my bettas will do just fine. Ill post up some photos of the tank soon once i get back home.


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## bettafish15 (Oct 3, 2010)

A half gallon is very small, and not really okay for them. At least a gallon would be best >.< In that size tank, you _need_ to change 100% of the water every day. Whereas, if you get a bigger tank, say a 5 or 10 gallon, you only need to do 50% once a week. 
72-76 is too cold, they really *need* a heater...the neccessary temps are 78-83. Cold temperatures really take a toll on their systems.
Gold fish food is *BAD!* They need Betta food! Get them Hikari Betta food, goldfish food is NOT meant for bettas, they are carnivores. Nutrafin flakes arent good either, but they dont cater to bettas needs. Frozen Brine Shrimp is fine, a couple times a week only though. Like I said, its actually _LESS_ maitenance with larger tanks, because water changes are farther apart. You cant skimp on water changes in a half gallon, they will die. You need to do 100% every day. Larger tanks are easier to find heaters for as well. In their current conditions, I dont think your bettas will do "just fine". If you dont have the time to do water changes, weekly or daily, bettas are not for you. I dont mean to offend, but I want whats best for the fish.


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## Algy (Feb 10, 2011)

bettafish15 said:


> A half gallon is very small, and not really okay for them. At least a gallon would be best >.< In that size tank, you _need_ to change 100% of the water every day. Whereas, if you get a bigger tank, say a 5 or 10 gallon, you only need to do 50% once a week.
> 72-76 is too cold, they really *need* a heater...the neccessary temps are 78-83. Cold temperatures really take a toll on their systems.
> Gold fish food is *BAD!* They need Betta food! Get them Hikari Betta food, goldfish food is NOT meant for bettas, they are carnivores. Nutrafin flakes arent good either, but they dont cater to bettas needs. Frozen Brine Shrimp is fine, a couple times a week only though. Like I said, its actually _LESS_ maitenance with larger tanks, because water changes are farther apart. You cant skimp on water changes in a half gallon, they will die. You need to do 100% every day. Larger tanks are easier to find heaters for as well. In their current conditions, I dont think your bettas will do "just fine". If you dont have the time to do water changes, weekly or daily, bettas are not for you. I dont mean to offend, but I want whats best for the fish.


Ah I see. I do 100% water changes every 2 to 3 days mostly and feed them like every 2-3 days. Yeah I meant to say Hikari Betta bio gold fish food oops. Couldnt really remember the name so I butchered it. Well I appreciate you knowledge and help but talking to a lot of other people and reading up on these fish. They are known to live in small areas. My dad raised A LOT of Bettas back in the day when he was in Asia and he has a lot of expertise in fish. Not saying you dont know anything but I do see what youre saying. I didnt know Nutrafin flakes are good? Man from what I have read every where Nutrafin flakes are okay for them. I guess it could be personal choice? My fish seems like it and eat it up. Well I guess the reason why I think my smaller tanks are easier to take care of is bc I can do complete water changes real quick and do a sweep on the gravel fast while the bigger tanks require the 50% then 100% =\ I guess what Im trying to say its just more simpler if that makes any sense? Yeah I understand where youre coming from. I would hate to see such beautiful things die bc of me. I really appreciate you knowledge.


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## FuulieQ (Jan 10, 2010)

Wow, that arowana is GORGEOUS. And so are your bettas! You have a good eye for fish.


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## bettafish15 (Oct 3, 2010)

Regardless of how much you feed them, in those size containers, you have to do 100% daily, whereas, in a 5g or bigger, ONLY 50% once a week, no 100%'s. Although feeding them daily and fasting for one day a week is what pretty much everyone does xD

And it is a myth that bettas live in small places, they live in very very wide but shallow rice paddies. Taken from Ultimate Bettas:

"The wild ancestors of today's domesticated Betta splendens yield from rice paddies, swamps, wetlands, and shallow ponds in South East Asia. These bodies of water, though shallow, are quite expansive; _rice paddies typically span many acres._ Male bettas form sizeable territories during breeding season, sometimes as large as a square meter, and are only found in "puddles" during the _dry season_ - a time of year where many bettas will die due to crowding, poor water quality, and inadequate food supply. It is also noteworthy that these bodies of water, though dark from taninns in fallen leaves, are not unclean - plant life provides a sort of natural filtration, and the replenishing of water during the wet season maintains a healthy, clean aquatic environment. The suggestion that bettas or _any_ fish thrive in filthy water is contradictory to logic."

What I'm trying to say is, even though caring for your bettas in half gallon bowls is simpler, if you were looking for a simple pet you should have gotten a rock. Water changes need to be done, there is no way around it. The way I see it, you either empty 100% a day in the bowls you have now, or 50% -using a syphon so its _easier_- in a larger tank only once a week, it does not take long, trust me.


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## Algy (Feb 10, 2011)

bettafish15 said:


> Regardless of how much you feed them, in those size containers, you have to do 100% daily, whereas, in a 5g or bigger, ONLY 50% once a week, no 100%'s. Although feeding them daily and fasting for one day a week is what pretty much everyone does xD
> 
> And it is a myth that bettas live in small places, they live in very very wide but shallow rice paddies. Taken from Ultimate Bettas:
> 
> ...


Okay... Now Im taking offense to what you are saying. A rock? With all do respect, that was a little harsh dont you think? And how would a rock even be a pet? Its not even a living organism. Your sarcasm is offensive.

I just recently returned a 2.5 gallon tank yesterday. The reason for that was bc of the filtration it had and the current it was giving out. Causing my betta not to be able to swim. I know Bettas cant swim in current bc of their long fins. Plus 2.5 was way too big for just one Betta IMHO. I have two of them and having two 2.5 gallons would be too much. Im not trying to raise a shark nor do I have a high maintenance saltwater fish. Yeah I wouldnt mind increasing it to 1 GALLON. But when you look at what they are kept in at the pet stores.. My 1/2 gal looks way better than those lil plastic punch cups. I know that it would be nice to have a bigger tank for them but I just dont see the point for just ONE lil tiny fish. I could say the same thing for you and all other fish lovers. Im sure whatever size tank you have, your fish would probably enjoy larger. But honestly would that make any sense? 

I do 100% water changes every 2 to 3 days but usually I do it every 2 days bc once I see it getting just a lil cloudy. I change it right away bc it bothers me. Everyone just views things differently and do things differently. I find it a lot easier to do 100% water changes with my 1/2 while also cleaning the gravel instead of doing the 50% and 100% change in a bigger tank =\


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## bettafish15 (Oct 3, 2010)

I aploogize for the rock thing, I just dont like it when people want simple pets. Your right, it was kind of harsh.

A 2.5 is perfect for a betta, and you could have just not turned on the filter or removed it. There are also ways to baffle the filter, so that the current is nonexistant. The point for "one tiny lil' fish" in a larger than a 1/2 gallon tank is its happiness. Ammonia builds up in small tanks too quick, which slowly kills them, which is why I mentioned the 100% water changes daily, not just when the water gets cloudy. You cant see the ammonia in the water. I keep my betta in a 14g tank, and hes thrilled. I do water changes of 50% every one to two weeks with a syphon, and it takes me an hour_ tops_ to remove half the water and put fresh water back in. You could divide a 2.5 gallon if you have to, so the fish have 1.5 gallons, which is preferable by far to a 1/2 gallon. in a 2.5g, its 1-50% and 1-100% water change a _week_. I dont know why you think you have to do 50 AND 100% in a larger tank, thats not the case. Only 50% once a week in a filtered 5g+.

I honestly dont mean to offend, and I'm sorry if I do anyway, but I take the long-term health and happiness of the fish over peoples feelings.  I have nothing more to say.


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## Algy (Feb 10, 2011)

bettafish15 said:


> I aploogize for the rock thing, I just dont like it when people want simple pets. Your right, it was kind of harsh.
> 
> A 2.5 is perfect for a betta, and you could have just not turned on the filter or removed it. There are also ways to baffle the filter, so that the current is nonexistant. The point for "one tiny lil' fish" in a larger than a 1/2 gallon tank is its happiness. Ammonia builds up in small tanks too quick, which slowly kills them, which is why I mentioned the 100% water changes daily, not just when the water gets cloudy. You cant see the ammonia in the water. I keep my betta in a 14g tank, and hes thrilled. I do water changes of 50% every one to two weeks with a syphon, and it takes me an hour_ tops_ to remove half the water and put fresh water back in. You could divide a 2.5 gallon if you have to, so the fish have 1.5 gallons, which is preferable by far to a 1/2 gallon. in a 2.5g, its 1-50% and 1-100% water change a _week_. I dont know why you think you have to do 50 AND 100% in a larger tank, thats not the case. Only 50% once a week in a filtered 5g+.
> 
> I honestly dont mean to offend, and I'm sorry if I do anyway, but I take the long-term health and happiness of the fish over peoples feelings.  I have nothing more to say.


Putting the two bettas together is bad in my opinion. They would see each other everyday and that would cause more stress on them. I even read on here with one member having his fish bite of most of his tail due to stress of having a new male betta roommate :/


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## bettafish15 (Oct 3, 2010)

You would make a DIY divider, which means you choose the material, which means that you could choose black mesh, which means the bettas dont see each other  You could even add some thin plants to each side of the divider.


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## Algy (Feb 10, 2011)

How would I baffle the filter so the current isn't so strong? I don't mind upgrading those lil cute fishes into a 1 gallon each with a filter.


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## Algy (Feb 10, 2011)

bettafish15 said:


> You would make a DIY divider, which means you choose the material, which means that you could choose black mesh, which means the bettas dont see each other  You could even add some thin plants to each side of the divider.


I actually bought the 2.5 gal and it came with a divider and ofcourse I put some plants beside te divider but those lil guys still saw each other and started exchanging words


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## bettafish15 (Oct 3, 2010)

You put pantyhose (clean, as clean as possible, never-seen-soap if possible) around the intake, tie it with a thread of some sort, I used nylon twine I think. To baffle to outtake, you put a sponge right over where the water comes out, and secure it with an elastic band ;D


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## bettafish15 (Oct 3, 2010)

Algy said:


> I actually bought the 2.5 gal and it came with a divider and ofcourse I put some plants beside te divider but those lil guys still saw each other and started exchanging words


Ah, yeah, you'd need to get a 2.5g that isnt already divided, so that you could do it yourself and to your liking so they cant see each other


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## Algy (Feb 10, 2011)

Okay I'll just go out get them both a new tank with a filter and try that baffle thing so it won't be like an ocean for them. I was thinking about using my 5 gallon nano cube to store them in but also with that the current is strong  the one reason why I don't wanna use the nana cube is bc it doesn't have the top. My dad misplaced it somewhere and I know those lil guys jump.0


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## bettafish15 (Oct 3, 2010)

Remember when using the sponge to baffle the intake, it has to be an aquarium sponge, like one that okay for aquarium use. They could be labeled as filter media too. No kitchen or cleaning sponges, even brand new, because they have bad chemicals in them D: Baffle helps majorly slowing down current, so you can use any tank really. That 5 gallon nano cube sounds great, just baffle the filter, and to solve the lid problem, keep the water level down about 1.5 to 2 inches from the top, or fill all the way, and cover with saran wrap that has holes poked in it for air.  No need to worry about using the nano tank now!


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## Alex09 (Aug 9, 2010)

Just wanted to say larger tank are _much_ easier to maintain. In my 10 gal I do a 50% water change ONCE a week. takes me 15 minutes at most. A cool idea would be to get a 10 gallon, divide it into 3-4 sections and you can get more bettas  If you dont want that then at least upgrade to 1 gal minimum tanks and get a heater for them. I also have a 1 gallon tank with a tetra preset heater in it (heater cost $15). My betta seems to be happy and he loves his live plants. I clean it 100% 2x a week. It actually requires more maintanance and takes more time than my 10 gal lol. 

I remember reading somewhere that a betta usually only lives around 6 months to a year in small unheated containers. Which is pretty sad considering that they have the potential to live 3-4 years when kept in healthy conditions.


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## Chard56 (Jan 22, 2011)

If you are going to quote from Ultimate Bettas you need to do some real research. The 5 gallon for one Betta they keep trying to cram down your throat is ridiculus. All the younger members on their try so hard to be noble and knowledgeable but, although trying to be helpful and telling someone that they are bad are not the same.75 to 78 degrres is fine for a Betta and do not REPEAT DO NOT need to be kept at 80 or above even if you are trying to breed them.They will breed at the temperature they are kept at. Of coarse they wont do well and the eggs wont hatch at below 74 degrees or above 86. A half gallon is small but I keep over 200 adult males in 1/2 to 2 gallon containers on a daily basis. They do not and again I repeat DO NOT harm themselves flaring at each other. Mine flare at each other off and on all day from the time I get up until I turn off the lights at night. If they get bored flaring at one they can turn around and flare at the neighbor on the other side. I do 100% water changes 2 times a week in the smaller ones and once a week in anything over a gallon. I've been doing this for a long time and have beautiful Bettas. They have been sold to customers (very happy ones at that) on a lot of forums and Aqubid so some of you spouting about things you know little about or have read somewhere need to back off and take a nicer approach to giving information or trying to help someone out!


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## Aluyasha (Sep 2, 2010)

I just want to say. I do not think people should be arguing about care in the sense that only one of us can be right. Some people keep their Bettas in smaller tanks and have great success, while others Bettas die quickly. Same goes for larger tanks.
When it is said that 2.5 gallons is recommended, it is to be taken that more people have success with 2.5 gallons. Everyone's experince is different, just as every Betta is different. Some like small tanks, other like large. Some can live in colder water while some are very picky about temp.
None of us can claim we are right and should not use our experinces as fact. They are just that, OUR experinces.
I am not saying this angerly just so everyone knows. I just want to avoid any unnecessary conflict.
So to the orginal poster. Yes, my Bettas like the tanks they are in (2.5 gals and up). But if you think your Bettas are happy in the 1/2 tanks and they are healthy and all that. Then continue with that, and if later you want larger tanks then go for it.


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## Chard56 (Jan 22, 2011)

I wasn't trying to argue. I was pointing out the fact that giving someone helpful "educated" information and just telling them they are doing everything wrong just because they read it on another forum isn't right. I've gone through all the Betta forums and info sites several times and demonstrated the lack of consistent temperatures and PH levels let alone tank size, breeding methods and feeding, conditioning and fry raising. When somebody says something not right or misinformed I'm going to call them on it. I have been breeding and raising Bettas and other tropical fish for over 40 years and I still am learning new things. I'm not saying I'm 100% right but I've had enough experience to guide someone to give them options to find their own personal way of what works best for them. Besides I thought I was wrong once but I was only mistaken, Ha ha!


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## Algy (Feb 10, 2011)

bettafish15 said:


> You would make a DIY divider, which means you choose the material, which means that you could choose black mesh, which means the bettas dont see each other  You could even add some thin plants to each side of the divider.





Aluyasha said:


> I just want to say. I do not think people should be arguing about care in the sense that only one of us can be right. Some people keep their Bettas in smaller tanks and have great success, while others Bettas die quickly. Same goes for larger tanks.
> When it is said that 2.5 gallons is recommended, it is to be taken that more people have success with 2.5 gallons. Everyone's experince is different, just as every Betta is different. Some like small tanks, other like large. Some can live in colder water while some are very picky about temp.
> None of us can claim we are right and should not use our experinces as fact. They are just that, OUR experinces.
> I am not saying this angerly just so everyone knows. I just want to avoid any unnecessary conflict.
> So to the orginal poster. Yes, my Bettas like the tanks they are in (2.5 gals and up). But if you think your Bettas are happy in the 1/2 tanks and they are healthy and all that. Then continue with that, and if later you want larger tanks then go for it.


That was a really great way to explain and see both side of the media. I see and agree with what you say 100% thank you for not jumping all over me about a 1/2g tank. I believe I'm doing everything right from feeding to daily water changes and upping the temperature to 74 - 78. Also another reason why I don't wanna upgrade to a bigger tank bc I give my bettas fresh water as in drinking water. Not tap water bc I'm worried about the chemicals placed in it. Of course I know there is water conditioner but I just feel more safe with the fresh water plus conditioner.


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## Algy (Feb 10, 2011)

Chard56 said:


> If you are going to quote from Ultimate Bettas you need to do some real research. The 5 gallon for one Betta they keep trying to cram down your throat is ridiculus. All the younger members on their try so hard to be noble and knowledgeable but, although trying to be helpful and telling someone that they are bad are not the same.75 to 78 degrres is fine for a Betta and do not REPEAT DO NOT need to be kept at 80 or above even if you are trying to breed them.They will breed at the temperature they are kept at. Of coarse they wont do well and the eggs wont hatch at below 74 degrees or above 86. A half gallon is small but I keep over 200 adult males in 1/2 to 2 gallon containers on a daily basis. They do not and again I repeat DO NOT harm themselves flaring at each other. Mine flare at each other off and on all day from the time I get up until I turn off the lights at night. If they get bored flaring at one they can turn around and flare at the neighbor on the other side. I do 100% water changes 2 times a week in the smaller ones and once a week in anything over a gallon. I've been doing this for a long time and have beautiful Bettas. They have been sold to customers (very happy ones at that) on a lot of forums and Aqubid so some of you spouting about things you know little about or have read somewhere need to back off and take a nicer approach to giving information or trying to help someone out!


I agree with what you say as well. If other people have success with 1/2 gallon tanks then there shouldn't be a problem with mine. But of course a bigger would be NICER.


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## Algy (Feb 10, 2011)

It's just what works best for the person and as long as the betta is healthy and happy.


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## FuulieQ (Jan 10, 2010)

Personally, I feel as though my fish have been happier in the bigger tanks, but I've also heard of bettas that actually get anxious in anything above a 2gal so I understand. As long as they're healthy, they're not showing symptoms of stress or boredom and the water's clean, it should be okay.

Oh, and also, I found that a really great way to baffle the filter is to tie an extra filter cartridge to the output. That way you're also acclimating your next cartridge for whenever you need to clean the one in the filter, and also it's like super double filtration!


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## MrVampire181 (May 12, 2009)

Tank size dosen't really matter...as long as temperature isn't too low (lower than 70F) and cleanings are done often it dosen't matter. I agree 100% with Chard.


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## bettafish15 (Oct 3, 2010)

Chard56 said:


> If you are going to quote from Ultimate Bettas you need to do some real research. The 5 gallon for one Betta they keep trying to cram down your throat is ridiculus. All the younger members on their try so hard to be noble and knowledgeable but, although trying to be helpful and telling someone that they are bad are not the same.


I quoted from UB because I couldnt remember where the link was on here. I have done real research, and I was not trying to cram a 5 gallon down the OP's throat. I was saying that less water changes would be done in over a 5 gallon. Your mentioning "younger members" implies something rather rude, and I'm offended. Age doesnt matter in betta knowledge. I also was not trying to tell the OP they were bad, I was just looking out for the fish. That is all. I'm not commenting here anymore. I honestly was looking out for the fish. To me, saying that a betta being fine in a half gallon is basically saying "Oh, they're fine in those tiny cups as long as they get water changes every two-three days!" Again, I dont mean to offend. Nothing more to say.


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## Aluyasha (Sep 2, 2010)

Chard56 said:


> I wasn't trying to argue. I was pointing out the fact that giving someone helpful "educated" information and just telling them they are doing everything wrong just because they read it on another forum isn't right. I've gone through all the Betta forums and info sites several times and demonstrated the lack of consistent temperatures and PH levels let alone tank size, breeding methods and feeding, conditioning and fry raising. When somebody says something not right or misinformed I'm going to call them on it. I have been breeding and raising Bettas and other tropical fish for over 40 years and I still am learning new things. I'm not saying I'm 100% right but I've had enough experience to guide someone to give them options to find their own personal way of what works best for them. Besides I thought I was wrong once but I was only mistaken, Ha ha!


I was not going after you. I said that towards arguement in itself.
It is a narural thing to stick to our own experiences. Like anything else, we want a definded difference between right and wrong. But when applying this to living beings. It cannot work. Every person, Betta, dog, horse, ect. Is different and because of this, each one's care is different.
No one is really right. The best we can do when someone asks for advice, is tell them your experince and hope it gives them insight into what their own experince will be.

And to the OP, it is clearly obvious that you care about your fish. I am sure you are giving them the best of care. And if it ever came to it, you would buy them a bigger tank. Little details are not what counts in this discussion, what matters is that when they get sick you treat them, when they are hungry you feed them, and if they are happy in a certain tank then that is what you provide. That is a good owner.
Again, I am not talking to anyone in particular. I just do not want this conversation to spin out of control and possibly hurt someone's feelings.
Good luck with your fish, BTW, they are beautiful!


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## bettafish15 (Oct 3, 2010)

Aluyasha said:


> I was not going after you. I said that towards arguement in itself.
> It is a narural thing to stick to our own experiences. Like anything else, we want a definded difference between right and wrong. But when applying this to living beings. It cannot work. Every person, Betta, dog, horse, ect. Is different and because of this, each one's care is different.
> No one is really right. The best we can do when someone asks for advice, is tell them your experince and hope it gives them insight into what their own experince will be.
> 
> ...


Haha, I was talking to Chard! I get what your saying though ^^


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## Aluyasha (Sep 2, 2010)

However, to Chard. Some of the words you used were kind of offensive. I do not know if you meant them rude or not. But just please make sure not to offend anyone. This form is for people to show love for Bettas, that is all. Age has nothing to do with intellect and just because some of us say things that sound similar does not mean we are just repeating things we do not understand. I doubt any of us in depthly know all thousands of members on here enough to label them. That being said, I am not labeling you either. I just wanted to make sure you are aware of some of the other's perspective of the way your statements sound.


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## JKfish (Apr 8, 2010)

Welcome to the fourm Algy. 

Your fish are absolutely stunning! wow, knuckles so pretty, I can't believe you found him at Petco. Sonic is incredible, is he an aquabid betta? 

IMO, 1/2 gallons are a bit too small. Yes, it's possible to keep them in there, but in smaller tanks ammonia levels swing a lot, which is pretty bad for them, especially if you miss too many days by accident. There are a lot of great members here who can juggle all the water changes sucessfully, but IMO, keeping up with so many water changes can be a bit of a hassle.

Your heating is fine, but you might want to get a heater. 76* is on the lower side comfortable heating as it is, so it wouldn't hurt for them to have slightly higher and more stable temperatures. 

Your feeding is absolutely fine, though somewhere in there I noticed you said you only fed them every few days (if I misread, I apologize). If so, you'll definately want to up to 2-3 pellets twice daily.

tap water is perfectly fine, drinking water often times is too expensive and lacks the nutrients and stuff that tap water has. A good conditioner like Prime will get out most stuff you're worried about.

if you ever decide to do a bigger tank without a top, just lower the water level about two inches below the top  Bettas with larger finnage seem to have a harder time jumping as high as say a plakat. As for the filter, if baffling it doesn't work, just don't use it. of course that means 100% water changes every so often, but in larger tanks, there won't be a need to do as many frequent water changes.


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## Chard56 (Jan 22, 2011)

Now your trying to not make it personal but your left handed comments are not appreciated either. Age had nothing to do with anything but experience speaks for itself. A mediator you are not so I'm done trying to please you when I've already made my point and I think you are the only one taking anything I said as offensive. I never labeled anyone on this forum. The younger members I was speaking of was on another forum and just because they've had a Betta for 6 months they think they know everything. I try to correct their comments when they are wrong and get jumped on for it just like you are trying to do. There is enough misinformation out there without letting someone try to give bad advice.


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## MrVampire181 (May 12, 2009)

My issue is when people think they know everything and they make the experts look bad......


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## Chard56 (Jan 22, 2011)

I'd love to change the subject. So lets get back to showing our Halfmoons!


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## Chard56 (Jan 22, 2011)

MrVampire181 said:


> My issue is when people think they know everything and they make the experts look bad......


 I have an issue with so called "experts and "professionals" giving vague, outdated and misinformed advice. I don't want to step on toes but I calls 'em as I sees 'em and get flak for it.


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## JKfish (Apr 8, 2010)

I say we stay on topic, and if anyone has anything he or she want to say to someone that does not involve Algy, her fish, etc, then say it via pm. Oh, and I completely agree with Mr.Vamp, even though I don't register under the Expert area.


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## MrVampire181 (May 12, 2009)

JKfish said:


> I say we stay on topic, and if anyone has anything he or she want to say to someone that does not involve Algy, her fish, etc, then say it via pm. Oh, and I completely agree with Mr.Vamp, even though I don't register under the Expert area.


 Me neither lol.

But yes HMs are awesome!


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## Aluyasha (Sep 2, 2010)

Honestly I did not mean to offend anyone. I suppose my past posts on here are a failed attempt at me trying to convey what all of us are talking about. It is hard to have conversations through typing, cannot see peoples faces or hear their tones and the like.
So, Again I apologize for my poor word choices. And I also apologize for contributing to the trailing off of the orignal subject.

With that said. I must say, Knuckles is one hansome Betta. I have a soild red VT but he seems to have more dull colouring compaired to your HM (I still love my Abacus though )
So you found them both at a petstore? Lucky you. Quite the find. 
Also, is Sonic really that stunning colbalt blue in person aswell or is that the camera?


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## Alex09 (Aug 9, 2010)

People say 2.5g is the recommended size not just because of the bettas, but because it's easier to maintain for amateur fishkeepers. There is more room for mistakes, less maintance, etc... I have 2 1.5 gals and the fish are doing fine  The cleaning routine can get tiring after a while but it's something that can be done. Breeders dont have the luxury of buying filtered heated gallons for all their fish so they have to make do with what they have. It's perfectly understandable. But for people keeping these fish as pets, you can spend a little, create a nice interactive environment for the fish, have something you can enjoy, and save yourself work down the road. Keep in mind that bettas _are_ resilient fish. What other fish can survive in cups? When I was younger I had a blue VT betta living in a .25 gallon vase with water changes once a week (skipping a change occasionally), and fed every other day. This fish lived with me for almost 2 years. I know better now and strive to give my pets better living conditions. Can't say I'm an expert as I have already had 2 fish die on me. One from parasites and another from unknown reasons. My last 3 fish however seem completely healthy. I still have a long road ahead, but we all gotta start somewhere right?

To the OP and chard: your fish are lovely.

On the topic of HM bettas; this would have to be my dream betta (at least in coloration - not sure if finnage is optimal but I LOVE the translucent finnage) Do breeders breed for this?


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## Aluyasha (Sep 2, 2010)

@Alex09: Wow, that one is indeed gorgeous! I would like one of those!
If you ever get one like that and chose to breed him. I want one of the babies.


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## Aluyasha (Sep 2, 2010)

So are we posting pictures of our HMs too then?
Here is my HM, Caligula:


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## Algy (Feb 10, 2011)

JKfish said:


> I say we stay on topic, and if anyone has anything he or she want to say to someone that does not involve Algy, her fish, etc, then say it via pm. Oh, and I completely agree with Mr.Vamp, even though I don't register under the Expert area.


And his fish HIS. lol Algy is short for Algernon. 

For some reason too, When I was reading the comments. I thought these were from
girls betta owners?? I mean there isn't anything wrong with girls lol but I just thought they sounded like it was coming from females.


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## Aluyasha (Sep 2, 2010)

I am a girl. lol
It is sometimes hard to tell just by peoples words. 
There seems to be an equal number of males and females on this forum.


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## Algy (Feb 10, 2011)

Aluyasha said:


> Honestly I did not mean to offend anyone. I suppose my past posts on here are a failed attempt at me trying to convey what all of us are talking about. It is hard to have conversations through typing, cannot see peoples faces or hear their tones and the like.
> So, Again I apologize for my poor word choices. And I also apologize for contributing to the trailing off of the orignal subject.
> 
> With that said. I must say, Knuckles is one hansome Betta. I have a soild red VT but he seems to have more dull colouring compaired to your HM (I still love my Abacus though )
> ...


Ty for the nice comment. Yeah knuckles was from petco. He was the only one I saw with such great quality compared to the other bettas. I was surprised too when I saw him bc when I went to the other petco and petsmart. I didn't see any good quality bettas. So I made surety grabbed him quick. Sonic is that true blue even without the camera  he's an aquabid fish though from Thailand. I couldn't find a butterfly betta like sonic locally so I just ordered him


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## Aluyasha (Sep 2, 2010)

Maybe Knuckles was sent to Petco by accident?
One person here on the forum found a HM at Wamart by accident once.


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## Algy (Feb 10, 2011)

Aluyasha said:


> Maybe Knuckles was sent to Petco by accident?
> One person here on the forum found a HM at Wamart by accident once.


No I don't think he was sen by accident bc there were other HMs over there. Like 2 or 3 others... But they didntnhave the color quality like Knuckles. Everyone that has seen knuckles have asked me the same question. "did you find him at petco?" lol he is really good quality for petco. I was talking to one of the fish keepers there and they told me there was a betta convention a few days ago that's why they had a lil more betta fishes around. Guess I came at the right time.

Yeah I had a feeling u were a girl just by the sn lol. But by reading these other posts, I thought they were girls... For ex the second post on the thread. No offense but I thought it was a girl. Not sure if they are or not still lol.


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## Chard56 (Jan 22, 2011)

Gorgeous Betta and yes Alex people breed for the clear or Cellophane. I have Blue and White and Green and White Butterfly Halfmoons that some of them have clear where I'd like to have more White showing. Hmmm, maybe I should go with the clear look. No then the White would show up where I wanted the clear, Ha ha!


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## Aluyasha (Sep 2, 2010)

I saw a white Betta with cellophane fins at my lfs the other day. Only problem was that he was all white except for a gray patch right between his eyes.
He probably would have gotten more gray on him over time.


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## Chard56 (Jan 22, 2011)

Aluyasha said:


> So are we posting pictures of our HMs too then?
> Here is my HM, Caligula:


 There is another post for Halfmoons, I hope we aren't spamming someones post. Your Caligula is beautiful but he looks lavender in that photo. I had a Yellow and White BFHM that I have grandchildren from. His children are all Platinum Blue/Red or Red/White BF. I'm hoping the Yellow/White will come back in the F2 spawn. I love that color combo.


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## Algy (Feb 10, 2011)

I do have one question though referring to knuckles... When got him at
The lfs, I immediately took pictures of him.. But recently I notice it look like his caudal tail is having a small case of fin rot?? I'm not too sure if it is or not bc looking back at the photos when I first got him. He already had this "tear" so my question is....

How do u know if ur Berra has fin rot?
What causes fin rot?
What can I do to help my betta?


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## Algy (Feb 10, 2011)

Chard56 said:


> There is another post for Halfmoons, I hope we aren't spamming someones post. Your Caligula is beautiful but he looks lavender in that photo. I had a Yellow and White BFHM that I have grandchildren from. His children are all Platinum Blue/Red or Red/White BF. I'm hoping the Yellow/White will come back in the F2 spawn. I love that color combo.


Oh no by all means keep posting. These are all lovely bettas y'all have. Yeah I agree with u to chard. The yellow/white combo is nice. I was hoping to find a yellow/white Cambodian crown tail and name him Tails. Then I'd have the whole gang.. Sonic, Tails, and Knuckles


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## Aluyasha (Sep 2, 2010)

Fin rot is usually caused by dirty water conditions (Somewhat common among petstore Bettas).
Most Bettas with fin rot will have a dark edging around the missing part of the fin.
Normally, minor fin rot can be treated by adding some Aquarium Salt and keeping the water clean. Same if it is just fin damage.


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## Aluyasha (Sep 2, 2010)

Algy said:


> Oh no by all means keep posting. These are all lovely bettas y'all have. Yeah I agree with u to chard. The yellow/white combo is nice. I was hoping to find a yellow/white Cambodian crown tail and name him Tails. Then I'd have the whole gang.. Sonic, Tails, and Knuckles


 If you wanted to name one Tails. You should get a yellow BTDT. That way, not only he matches Tails' colour pattern, but also has two tail fins.


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## Algy (Feb 10, 2011)

Yeah is very small but it really bothers me. Looking at the photos when I brought him home, he already had that.. Once I noticed it I immediately went out and bought him these drops called betta revive. It prevents protozoan, bacterial, and fungal diseases. All of which can cause fin rot. Ever since I got him I have been changing the water and also adding a lil bit of salt. Hoping that browning will go away an heal


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## Algy (Feb 10, 2011)

Aluyasha said:


> If you wanted to name one Tails. You should get a yellow BTDT. That way, not only he matches Tails' colour pattern, but also has two tail fins.


BT????

Wow I didn't think about that forte double tail thing. I think I just might do that come to think of it. That would be awesome. Great idea thanks!!!!


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## Chard56 (Jan 22, 2011)

Algy said:


> Oh no by all means keep posting. These are all lovely bettas y'all have. Yeah I agree with u to chard. The yellow/white combo is nice. I was hoping to find a yellow/white Cambodian crown tail and name him Tails. Then I'd have the whole gang.. Sonic, Tails, and Knuckles


I have Gold, Copper; Red, Blue and Black Orchid CT's but the one I really wanted to have babies from died in the breeding tank two days before the female died. Couldn't figure out why they died like that but he was a pure White one and I've never found another.







It would have been cool to have white ones and Black ones.


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## Aluyasha (Sep 2, 2010)

Algy said:


> BT????
> 
> Wow I didn't think about that forte double tail thing. I think I just might do that come to think of it. That would be awesome. Great idea thanks!!!!


 BT stands for Butterfly.


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## Aluyasha (Sep 2, 2010)

Chard, that white CT is stunning! Is he the one that died? What a shame.


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## Abby (Jan 13, 2011)

I am gobsmacked at the quality of your fish and im so jealous.
i hope to be able to get some GOOD quality breeders when i set my barracks up.


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## JKfish (Apr 8, 2010)

Oops, sorry Algy, I tend to think most forumers are girls, partially because I am one and also because there seems to be slightly more girls than guys on this forum XD.

also, if you add salt to the tank, make sure you remove all salt after about 10 days of use, overusing salt can hurt a betta's organs and make bacteria etc a lot more resistant to salt.


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## Chard56 (Jan 22, 2011)

Aluyasha said:


> Chard, that white CT is stunning! Is he the one that died? What a shame.


 Yes he died mysteriously and then his potential spawn partner died 2 days later. I suspect an aerosal was sprayed in the vicinity but nobody is admitting to it. I have tanks and shelves everywhere in my bedroom so that won't happen again.


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## MrVampire181 (May 12, 2009)

Aluyasha said:


> BT stands for Butterfly.


 No BF stands for butterfly


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## meganfishfriend4 (Feb 13, 2011)

gfjhhjgfg


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## Chard56 (Jan 22, 2011)

Thanks Mr. Vampire. I was biting my tongue. I'm trying not to be too critical. I had someone on another forum tell me that BT or BTF was the IBC abbreviation for Butterfly and I just let it go. BF is the general abbreviation used by most breeders, sellers and hobbyists.


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## Abby (Jan 13, 2011)

meganfishfriend4 said:


> gfjhhjgfg



:shock: yes someone knows how to mash a keyboard O.O


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## Abby (Jan 13, 2011)

Chard56 said:


> Thanks Mr. Vampire. I was biting my tongue. I'm trying not to be too critical. I had someone on another forum tell me that BT or BTF was the IBC abbreviation for Butterfly and I just let it go. BF is the general abbreviation used by most breeders, sellers and hobbyists.



I thought it was abbreviation of the word eg
BF *B*utter*F*ly
HM *H*alf *M*oon
CT *C*rown *T*ail


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## Chard56 (Jan 22, 2011)

That is correct. I was trying to find an article in bettysplendens on abbreviations but I keep getting an internal error message. If I remember correctly she has a section on that. I might be wrong, er uh I mean mistaken but I'll have a look see around for a chart on them. After all it does get confusing with so many tail and color variations. Here's a good one for you, I have a Red Copper Dragon 8 ray Crowntail Doubletail Plakat or Red/Copper Dragon DDDRCTDTPK. The DR is for Double Ray, DDR 4 or Double Double Ray and DDDR for 8 or Double Double Double Ray, huuuuuuuu inhale big breath, Whew!


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## Aluyasha (Sep 2, 2010)

Oh oops, I meant BF. I got confused for a second because I was also looking at Aquabid while typing on this forum...too many abbreviations on that site.


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## Algy (Feb 10, 2011)

Aluyasha said:


> BT stands for Butterfly.


I thought it was BF?


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## Aluyasha (Sep 2, 2010)

Algy said:


> I thought it was BF?


 I meant BF, sorry.


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## Fawnleaf (Aug 31, 2010)

I don't really have anything useful to say... But I love your little red guy!! He is beautiful!


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## Aluyasha (Sep 2, 2010)

Compliments are always useful.


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## Chard56 (Jan 22, 2011)

Ok, it's BF so let's show off some BF's!


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## Aluyasha (Sep 2, 2010)

My only BF is my HM, Caligula. 
Chard, I love the orange one...or is it yellow? It is just so shiney!
And is that first Betta the same one in your avatar?


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## Chard56 (Jan 22, 2011)

He's Yellow and White. The first one is the father of my avatar.


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## Aluyasha (Sep 2, 2010)

Well all of them are stunning.


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## Algy (Feb 10, 2011)

Just recently purchased this lil guy


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## Aluyasha (Sep 2, 2010)

Beautiful!
Let me guess, his name is Shadow? lol


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## Chard56 (Jan 22, 2011)

Black and Red BF Overhalfmoon Dragon! Very nice one Algy. Here's a Green and Black BFHM. (We keep this post going much longer I'm going to run out of BF pics.)


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## Algy (Feb 10, 2011)

Aluyasha said:


> Beautiful!
> Let me guess, his name is Shadow? lol


Yep I was going to name this one Shadow lol.

Hes a Black Copper/Red Butterfly Halfmoon.


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## Aluyasha (Sep 2, 2010)

Nice. 
I like the Sonic name theme. Mostly because you can actually find Bettas with the same colouring as the characters. 

Chard, green and black combo? Interesting and beautiful.


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## Algy (Feb 10, 2011)

Chard56 said:


> Black and Red BF Overhalfmoon Dragon! Very nice one Algy. Here's a Green and Black BFHM. (We keep this post going much longer I'm going to run out of BF pics.)


That is an awesome looking one chard. You must have a lot of Bettas no?

This makes 3 for me :-D


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